# Water-based ink drying too fast



## Oritron (Feb 26, 2007)

Hi all,

I am using some Permaset supercover ink (it's some rather opaque water based ink) to print tees, and I am having a hard time with the ink drying in the screen.

I don't have any fancy setup, just full contact of a screen sitting on top of a shirt. When I print, everything comes out nicely, but when I go to rinse the screen out, a ton of ink stays behind.

I bought some ink cleanup (tr blend), and thought that might help, but it doesn't take any ink out of a screen, so I poke a needle through parts where it's totally clogged...

What am I doing wrong?

And while I am asking, I also have trouble with my flood stroke. When I pull a bead of ink along, I am trying to press lightly, and the ink just works up the squeegee blade, instead of making a nice coating on the screen (it just coats a few inches). There's a lot of ink on the squeegee, so I don't think I am putting too little, plus I've read that you shouldn't put too much water-based ink on in one go.

I would really appreciate any help! Thanks in advance.


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## instrumental (Dec 28, 2006)

are you using retarder to slow drying in the screen?

are you flooding the screen after each print?e pressure while pulling the squeegee, you can control ink flow easier with the angle of blade rather than pressure


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## Solmu (Aug 15, 2005)

shrodingerskitty said:


> I am using some Permaset supercover ink


Are you in Australia? Because if the weather in your area is anything like the weather we've been having in Melbourne the last few weeks, that's going to be contributing.



shrodingerskitty said:


> What am I doing wrong?


If the print is okay, my best guess is that you're letting the ink dry in the screen. The ink may be a little thick and dried out (which means it will dry in the screen faster), but if so you would be having a lot more trouble getting a good print with it.



shrodingerskitty said:


> And while I am asking, I also have trouble with my flood stroke. When I pull a bead of ink along, I am trying to press lightly, and the ink just works up the squeegee blade


The most common cause I know of for ink driving up the blade is that the squeegee angle is too acute.



shrodingerskitty said:


> (it just coats a few inches). There's a lot of ink on the squeegee, so I don't think I am putting too little


Although again this is something that can happen if your ink is too thick.

What kind of consistency is your ink? It should be like cake mix, rather than like peanut butter (poor analogies, but hopefully get the point across).


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## Oritron (Feb 26, 2007)

Thanks for the tip about the blade angle when flooding, I'll try it with the blade more vertical.

In terms of the dryout, I am not leaving it in the screen very long, and even after just one print, I end up with this clouding of my screen... which I am sure will mean less ink through the next time.

It's the fact that it happens after just one print, as well as the fact that it is new ink (not dried out, it seems to have the right consistency), which makes me concerned. I'm in Canada, and the weather is pretty dry this time of year due to the cold weather, but again, just one print seems to me like it should work.

I am not using any retarder, I will pick some up and try it. Will it make my prints less opaque?

And in the meantime, how should I be using this ink cleanup stuff to wash out this cloudiness from the screen? Am I supposed to soak it for a while, rub it, or what? It might not even be the right application for it (I was thinkink that maybe ink cleanup might be to take ink off equipment, rather than out of screens).

Thanks for the quick responses!


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## Solmu (Aug 15, 2005)

shrodingerskitty said:


> even after just one print, I end up with this clouding of my screen... which I am sure will mean less ink through the next time.


Hmm... unless the ink is actually drying in the screen, it shouldn't be cause for concern between prints. The screen will get stained, which is normal.

So this problem happens immediately after the first print? If so the only two things I can think of are 1) There is no problem, or 2) The ink is defective. There shouldn't really be a problem that early in the process.



shrodingerskitty said:


> And in the meantime, how should I be using this ink cleanup stuff to wash out this cloudiness from the screen?


I've never needed to use anything like that, so I'm not sure. Soap and water usually does the trick.


Sorry that was pretty useless. Hopefully someone will have some better ideas.


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## instrumental (Dec 28, 2006)

when printing waterbase its always good to have a spray bottle full of water handy to spray on the screen when the inkj is starting to dry up, but as long as you are on top of flooding after each print you shouldn't have too much of a problem.


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## Greg Hamrick (Jan 25, 2007)

I agree with Steve. A spray bottle will save you alot of trouble. Just don't soop the screen or let it dry up.



.


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## Oritron (Feb 26, 2007)

instrumental said:


> ... but as long as you are on top of flooding after each print you shouldn't have too much of a problem.



Ahhh, I knew it was something I was doing wrong 

I was definitely not doing that. Hopefully I'll be able to save this screen, my previous ink was more forgiving of my poor technique, but not as nice.

Thanks again everyone!


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## mikiec (Aug 2, 2006)

Just to clarify then, with waterbased inks, you should do a flood AFTER the print?

Thanks for the info BTW, this stuff is priceless!


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## Greg Hamrick (Jan 25, 2007)

Yes, keep a flood over the open area of the screen. The greater amount of ink will dry more slowly than a tiny amount, plus the open area lets air pass through. Thus speeding the drying.


.


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## Byeline666 (Oct 21, 2006)

this just helped me so much.


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## sobord420 (Aug 9, 2007)

Hey there,
I too am about to start using the Permaset aqua brand and am looking forward to my trial by fire (or should I say Waterbase) into the screen print biz.
I have yet to pull my 1st squeegee but I am excited and happy for all this wealth of info on this forum.
Peace
Randall


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## brent (Nov 3, 2006)

Oritron-
Keep in mind that you can't mix retarder base and ink brands, or they won't work right, they might have an opposite and quite negative effect.

Anyone that prints with water-based ink needs to try Matsui brand ink. It's incredible stuff. I love their white. It stretches and doesn't clog easily. Contact Westix at 1-800-741-3887 and ask for a sample of the matsui opaque or super stretch white. Everyone there I've spoken to has been very nice and super informative. I ordered a gallon of the white because I was so impressed and they sent me a sample of the full pantone set. Matsui is revolutionary and every WB printer should try it. I'll never use another white again.


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## Gun1 (Aug 11, 2008)

Hi there,
I'm also about to plunge into water-based screen printing, so this thread has been extremely helpful*
Cheers***


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## INKFREAK (Jul 24, 2008)

One other tip . When I used to have a large run that I couldn't finish in one day or wanted to take a long break, I would wrap the screen in saran wrap and it would keep the ink and screen from drying out or clogging up. Print ,flood always with waterbase,gotta keep that mesh lubed.


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## Gun1 (Aug 11, 2008)

Man, I just reread this thread and having now started printing all this stuff is soooo useful*
Thanks everyone for all the sterling advice*


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## garrison81 (Oct 23, 2008)

So, Permaset makes a retarder but I can only find it in Australia. Anyone have any success with a retarder mixed into Permaset Supercover inks?


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## Granville (Jan 6, 2010)

I've just been playing around with this ink as well and though i'm flooding as i should, and it's not clogging my screen or anything, it still dries extremely quick. after one shirt theres already a nice dry layer on the emulsion areas of my screen. And i live in central florida which is damn humid. I usually spray my screen with silicone spray before i print with water based which i forgot to do with this ink, but i'm also going to try some old speed ball retarder and see what happens. i'll let you all know how that works out.


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## brent (Nov 3, 2006)

Try Matsui brand inks. No opaque waterbased ink is fantastic, but theirs is the best I've tried. You can get it from Westix Online, super guys.


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## foot print (Jun 2, 2010)

The guys at Westix are awesome...!!! 
I so lucky to have them 5 minutes from home..


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## brent (Nov 3, 2006)

Yeah, great guys. They are way far away from me but still worth ordering everything I can from them. They use fedex now and I can get product in three business days usually, from California to Philadelphia. I even had lunch with them when I was out in SoCal. They have been a huge help to me as I've grown my business. I can't recommend them enough.


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## syrockyboy (Sep 19, 2013)

I just mixed speedball retarder and premaset aqua supercover white. it doesnt work well. is it because of the mixing brand ? also if i want to thin the ink should i just add some water to it?


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## brent (Nov 3, 2006)

syrockyboy said:


> I just mixed speedball retarder and premaset aqua supercover white. it doesnt work well. is it because of the mixing brand ? also if i want to thin the ink should i just add some water to it?



You shouldn't mix brands, because they aren't designed to work together like the items in the same brand line would. 

You should use the same retarder as the ink brand instead of just water.


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## Lucratyve (Sep 29, 2013)

instrumental said:


> are you using retarder to slow drying in the screen?
> 
> are you flooding the screen after each print?e pressure while pulling the squeegee, you can control ink flow easier with the angle of blade rather than pressure


Sounds like you might want to switch to a plastisol based ink 
Unless that's what your coustomer request. SCREEN OPENER 
MIGHT HELP UNCLOGGING YOUR SCREEN.


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## Stromboli (May 31, 2016)

Permaset's website recommends lightly misting/spraying the screen with water BEFORE printing, and letting the screen sit for about 10 mins before you start to print. It helps prevent rapid drying of the ink on the screen. I'm very new to screen printing and Permaset Aqua is what i'm learning with. 

When washing screens with semi-dried ink, I've been using Franmar Aqua-Wash, soybean-based product recommended for waterbased inks. So far it's done a great job. I use a few sprays of that on every screen as I'm washing it.


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## NoXid (Apr 4, 2011)

I've learned a few things since first looking at this thread years ago.

*Water:* The ink loses some water to the emulsion and air every time you put it on a screen, so when that "used" ink goes back in the bucket, you may need to add a squirt or two of H2O to compensate. I keep my "working" ink in a separate container so the ink in the original container serves as an accurate reference of what fresh ink looks and feels like. Freshen up the working ink with water and fresh ink as needed.

*SuperCover Squeegee Climb & Uneven Flooding:* This drove me mad when I was first experimenting with opaque WB ink ... in winter ... in my mostly unheated garage/shop.
Keep at least the ink in a heated space--best if squeegees and screens are too. Or there is the direct approach of _keeping_ the shop warm (takes time for ink buckets to warm up, so you can't just flip on the heater an hour before work and expect the ink to be warm). However, heating the air also lowers the relative humidity, so in some climates you may need a humidifier too.

Water can also help with squeegee climb, but not if the real problem is cold ink.


Since my ability to heat my shop is somewhat limited by an exposed concrete foundation and floor (and my inherently tight grip on money), I might build an insulated box with one of those chicken brooder elements/bulbs and a thermostat to keep the ink and squeegees warm all winter long.

Screens have a fairly low thermal mass, so in the depths of winter I might toss the ones I'll be using in my drying box for 10 or 15 minutes of warm up. Don't want to get them "hot," just room temperature.


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