# Colour fades away on black tees after 1 wash - Du Pont ink



## katarzyna (Oct 21, 2012)

Hello,
We have been experiencing problems with printing on colour/black t-shirts receantly - our customers keep coming back saying that colour faded away after 1st wash. White base stays and it's ok but colour just goes away. We're a bit confused about that. We use Du pont inks and pretreatment. Has anyone experienced such a problem?
Greetings
Katarzyna


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## allamerican-aeoon (Aug 14, 2007)

Your printing skill is issue. Not the ink.
Your best choice is consult with who sold you machine first.
Cheers! Inks are on me always.


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## Smalzstein (Jul 22, 2008)

Please post pics, that will help us determine if it's PT or perhaps curing related.

Also what type of shirt?


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## katarzyna (Oct 21, 2012)

Hello 
Thank you for your interest/replies

_Please post pics, that will help us determine if it's PT or perhaps curing related._

Below I attach pics. We thought that it maight be curing problem, because (as you can see on the pics) white base is ok, only colour fades. If speaking about curing we do it rather standard way:
1. First we put pretreatment (DuPont) - then we use roller - then 30sec in heat press (160 Celsius)
2. Printing
3. 3 min in heat press (160 Celsius)

_Your printing skill is issue. Not the ink.
Your best choice is consult with who sold you machine first.
Cheers! Inks are on me always._

We have contacted our dealer in Poland but they said that we should cure a little bit longer. We tried it a bit longer but this didn't solve problem. We have sent them samples and waiting for the reply. What kind of skills do you think might be a problem? Pretreatment putting or sth else?


Problem concerns different garments we printed on. Fex. 
- some time ago we printed 20 hoodies for our client. Colour faded on two of them, rest seems to be ok. Same curing time for 20 hoodies, same garment but different effect.
- we have printed for clients on Fruit of the Loom shirts, also on Gildan and this situation repeated regardless of the type of shirt.

Another thing is that this problem occured only some time ago. Fex. We printed black tees for our client last May and they're still ok. 

We're so cunfused

Thanks a lot one more time for your interest and help.

Greetings

Katarzyna


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## Jinxter (Nov 5, 2012)

Have you checked your heat press temperature is accurate?


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## katarzyna (Oct 21, 2012)

Jinxter said:


> Have you checked your heat press temperature is accurate?


Well... we use Schulze press and the temperature display shows 160C. But maybe we should checked the temperature other way, like oven thermometer to double checked it...


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## GraphixGuys (Jan 16, 2012)

That result looks more like shirt problems. Are you printing on 100% cotton? Looks like the results I get when printing on blended shirts.


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## katarzyna (Oct 21, 2012)

GraphixGuys said:


> That result looks more like shirt problems. Are you printing on 100% cotton? Looks like the results I get when printing on blended shirts.


Yes we print on cotton shirts. This particular print (the one I attached) concerns Gildan t-shirt. But - after our client returned this shirt we have made test printing also on Gildan - ink faded away but not so intense. So same tee and different result. Also as I mentioned - some time ago we printed 20 hoodies - print faded on two of them, rest seems to be ok.


Maybe this is really about our skills but if so which part of the process could we be doing wrong?

I was serious about double checking press temperature with fex oven thermometer - maybe the themperature display on press shows 160C but the press itself is broken...



K.


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## lazographics (Mar 5, 2009)

From the pictures it looks like a heat press issue. Heat press may not be as hot as displayed.


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## Smalzstein (Jul 22, 2008)

I doubt that Shulze press will have temp issues. Did you bought yours from Romanik?

You can rise the temp to 165 - 170 degrees but my guess its the tshirt problem.


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## katarzyna (Oct 21, 2012)

Smalzstein said:


> I doubt that Shulze press will have temp issues. Did you bought yours from Romanik?
> 
> You can rise the temp to 165 - 170 degrees but my guess its the tshirt problem.



Hi Bogusław,
We will try to rise the temp. 
We also thought this might be a t-shirt problem but then - why it hapens on Fruit of the Loom and no Gildan as well? We bought our press from Amatec.

Greetings
Katarzyna


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## Smalzstein (Jul 22, 2008)

Fruit of the Loom and Gildan are the worst to print DTG. Actualy they are worst for everything

About Gildan you can read many horror stories on this forum. FOTL I can say through mine of expierience and couple of my friends who will not touch those shirts with DTG (and some of them are big FOTL distributors).

Quality shirts for DTG in Eastern Europe:

- Adler (my favorite)
- promostars
- harvest
- hanes

For cheaper shirts I recommend Keya, they do very well.

Your form Poland right?


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## katarzyna (Oct 21, 2012)

Smalzstein said:


> Fruit of the Loom and Gildan are the worst to print DTG. Actualy they are worst for everything
> 
> About Gildan you can read many horror stories on this forum. FOTL I can say through mine of expierience and couple of my friends who will not touch those shirts with DTG (and some of them are big FOTL distributors).
> 
> ...



Hi - yes we're from Poland / (hdmd.pl)

We were thinking that this may be connected with shirts but if so why does the white base stay on t-shirt? 

We have already ordered Adler and Promo. Will inform you about the results.

Greetings/Pozdrowienia

Katarzyna


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## ernti (Nov 14, 2012)

Smalzstein said:


> I doubt that Shulze press will have temp issues. Did you bought yours from Romanik?
> 
> You can rise the temp to 165 - 170 degrees but my guess its the tshirt problem.



I checked mine recently,(i too have a shulze press),and when the display showed 160 C,it was actually 153C in the middle,and less in the corners.
I checked with temperature strips from Stahls,and also with a contact thermometer.
No matter how much time you cure,with this temperature,it's never going to be cured.
It's the 3rd year that i use this press,with no problems before,
but recently i noticed colour fading after the first wash on some of the tees that i make for myself.
Not ALL,but the ones i make for me,i don't mind about the cost, and they are the biggest my printer can handle,so there is a LOT of white UB,and of course these were not cured properly.
Some designs didn't have any washability problem,it was the smaller
ones,these with not too much white UB,or the ones with a vintage filter on.With these i could get away,with less temp.that's why the press didn't came up first in my ''to check'' list.
katarzyna did you find what caused the problem?


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## katarzyna (Oct 21, 2012)

ernti said:


> I checked mine recently,(i too have a shulze press),and when the display showed 160 C,it was actually 153C in the middle,and less in the corners.
> I checked with temperature strips from Stahls,and also with a contact thermometer.
> No matter how much time you cure,with this temperature,it's never going to be cured.
> It's the 3rd year that i use this press,with no problems before,
> ...


Hi sorry for responding so late but I was away for some time. 

We took and advice from other DTG printing companies and We resignated from Fruit of the Loom t-shirts. We changed them for Adler (this is a producer that comes from Czech republic) and B&C (these tees we use from only from time to time). Prints on Adler's and B&C tees com out much better - better color and good wahability.

Furthermore we decided to switch from Du Pont inks to Firebird. At the moment we use Firebird's pretreatment and white ink. We still have some colours from Du Pont and we're going to use them until they're gone (we know from the Firebird's distributor and from other users of this forum that Firebird white base ink can be mixed with Du Pont colours).

After traking these steps everything was better, washability improved and then... just yesterday I received a picture of t-shirt from my client (I attached it to te post) - t-shirt washed in 30C on the left side. 

We have never checked the temperature of our heat press (after hearing few opinions that Shulze press cannot be working wrong...). Nevertheless now I know we have to do it. 

But if this is heat press issue - so why some t-shirts comes out to be ok and some not?

I'll let you know when we check te press temperature.

Greetings,
Katarzyna


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## 23spiderman (Jun 26, 2008)

generally speaking, too much PT causes the ink to "peel" off the shirt. undercuring causes the ink to crack/wash out. i don't know anything about Firebird pretreat, but this was the classic case when using DuPont pretreat. you might try using less pretreat, and then do your own wash tests. if your print still looks great after 5 washes, you are most likely ok.


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## katarzyna (Oct 21, 2012)

Press temperature seems to be ok - it is 160 Celsius.


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## equipmentzone (Mar 26, 2008)

katarzyna said:


> Press temperature seems to be ok - it is 160 Celsius.



You are too low. Try at least 168 degrees celcius (335 degrees fahrenheit).

Also make sure that you are getting an accurate reading from your heat platen.

_


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## katarzyna (Oct 21, 2012)

Hi,
It seems that we have solved our washability problem. At the beggining we thought that this might be connected with the temperature of the press so we bought a termometer - it showed that the temperature is al right in every point of the press. We were confused for a while but then (by accident) we discovered that the bottom platen of the press has few cracks and small hollow in one place. We are pretty sure that this is a problem in our case - because of the hollow and cracks we are not able to achieve an accurate pressure in every point of the print. On monday we're being delivered a new bottom platen. Hopefully our problem is solved - I'll let U know when we make wash tests with the new platen.
Greetings,
Katarzyna


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## All Print (Jun 18, 2013)

equipmentzone said:


> You are too low. Try at least 168 degrees celcius (335 degrees fahrenheit).
> 
> Also make sure that you are getting an accurate reading from your heat platen.
> 
> _


Having Some wash issues, maybe you can help.
We use Dupont ink plus Pretreat:

Using Schulze pretreater II settings: spray time 2 - pause time 2
PT. Curing heatpress 30 sec. 165 degrees.
Curing print: Conveyor 167 degrees for 60 sec.
Then heatpressed 120 sec. 167 degrees.
Temp. is checked both times and is accurate.

Washed on normal program 1,5 your at 40 degrees.
Then put in Dryer on normal program.

Results: Sometimes color fading only on Gildan tees.
No color fading on Fruit of the Loom.
Ink flakes on SOME places after 2 washes but only the white ink.
The places where the colored ink covers the white ink, the flaking is less.
Some shirts are still fine after 5 washes, some are not.

What am I doing wrong? To hot washing and drying?
The prints on White tees give me no problems, even with washing on 50 degrees! I cure them for 60 sec. With a conveyor dryer at 165 degrees.

Amy advice?? Anybody?


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## equipmentzone (Mar 26, 2008)

All Print said:


> Having Some wash issues, maybe you can help.
> We use Dupont ink plus Pretreat:
> 
> Using Schulze pretreater II settings: spray time 2 - pause time 2
> ...



Shirt brands and quality can make a big difference in both printing and wash durability. If you search the T-Shirt Forums you will see that many dtg users have had issues with Gildan shirts. If you are only having washing problems with Gildan garments and other brands are fine then just use the other brands only.

_


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## ernti (Nov 14, 2012)

It seems that whenever there is a washability problem in the dtg section of the forums
the name Gildan always is the first one that comes up.


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## equipmentzone (Mar 26, 2008)

ernti said:


> It seems that whenever there is a washability problem in the dtg section of the forums
> the name Gildan always is the first one that comes up.




It seems to also be printability issues, not just washability issues.

If you are not having issues with other shirt brands then stick to those brands.

_


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## ernti (Nov 14, 2012)

equipmentzone said:


> It seems to also be printability issues, not just washability issues.
> 
> If you are not having issues with other shirt brands then stick to those brands.
> 
> _


Right.Also all those fibers sticking right up.
They go everywhere destroying everything.
Printheads,capping station..


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## equipmentzone (Mar 26, 2008)

ernti said:


> Right.Also all those fibers sticking right up.
> They go everywhere destroying everything.
> Printheads,capping station..



When you heat press the pretreatment after spraying it on the garment you should be flattening the fibers to the shirt. If fibers are sticking up it will show as open dots on the final print.

_


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## ernti (Nov 14, 2012)

equipmentzone said:


> When you heat press the pretreatment after spraying it on the garment you should be flattening the fibers to the shirt. If fibers are sticking up it will show as open dots on the final print.
> 
> _


Exactly.But the G6400 soft style ring spun i was using,had so many fibers sticking up even after the drying of the PT,with heavy pressure.
I had to clean around the print head,every 20 or 30 prints.


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## 23spiderman (Jun 26, 2008)

Did the paper stick to your shirt after drying the retreat? Do you flatten the fibers while they are still wet, or take the sprayed shirt straight to the press?


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## Grevling4 (Oct 10, 2013)

I'm having a similar issue in wash test. White tees look fine after a few runs, colors fades after just one wash. No peeling yet.

I've read that my heat press might be wrong - does this mean that it's probably the curing that is wrong? Or could it also be too little pre-treat? The prints look fine before they're washed.

I've done four tests which is currently in the washer -

340 degrees and 360 degrees
3 minutes straight curing and 1 minute hovering, 2 minutes curing then another minute after a while

All four combinations seems to look quite similar a bit earlier than I'd hoped...

EDIT: I'm also drying in a machine. I'm not sure if that has anything to do with anything.


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## NZACO (Jan 21, 2012)

katarzyna said:


> Hi,
> It seems that we have solved our washability problem. At the beggining we thought that this might be connected with the temperature of the press so we bought a termometer - it showed that the temperature is al right in every point of the press. We were confused for a while but then (by accident) we discovered that the bottom platen of the press has few cracks and small hollow in one place. We are pretty sure that this is a problem in our case - because of the hollow and cracks we are not able to achieve an accurate pressure in every point of the print. On monday we're being delivered a new bottom platen. Hopefully our problem is solved - I'll let U know when we make wash tests with the new platen.
> Greetings,
> Katarzyna


Old post but.

Is the problem solved?
Was it temperature, time or pressure?


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## brixen (Jun 27, 2013)

Smalzstein said:


> Fruit of the Loom and Gildan are the worst to print DTG. Actualy they are worst for everything
> 
> About Gildan you can read many horror stories on this forum. FOTL I can say through mine of expierience and couple of my friends who will not touch those shirts with DTG (and some of them are big FOTL distributors).
> 
> ...


Those shirts are not the best quality, I agree,, But they are 100% fine for DTG printing, we print a lot on those shirts, and get good results, and don't have any problems. so don't worry about the shirts. Look at the problem somewhere else..


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