# Film Positive Printer Suggestions?



## Toddsta (Aug 13, 2013)

I was going to buy a Epson 1430 and go the Black Max ink route.... that would give me up to 13" X 17" mylar sheet size to print film positives....

However, chances are good that I will buy some oversized platens for my Vastex 2000 HD press at some point, and I am wondering if there is a good laser, or other alternative that will allow even larger film positive prints at an economical price.

I don't do screen printing 'full time'.... and so don't want to invest a boatload of money into this item..... but I am creative and am wanting to put my money towards the 'right' fit in film pos printer.

I thought I could always print an oversized image in a few different prints and register them together for an 'overall' larger film positive..... but that would interject the possibility of being out of alignment a whisker.... which we all know is critical when registering multi-color prints. So.... I want to do what's right and make sure that I choose the correct film pos solution..... keeping $ constraints in mind.

The Epson 1430 is $299........ is there anything better for twice that which would work well and allow for larger output.... or am a just dreaming?

I see Epson has a sale on their Stylus 3880 17" X 22" for $995. I hate to spend that much.... and am also wondering if a 'laser' solution would be cheaper on consumables, etc.


Thank you for your great advice people!


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## Screen Medics (Feb 23, 2015)

Hey Toddsta,

Regarding your question about a printer for around twice price of the Epson 1430, you can consider a Epson R2000. The Epson R2000 is a 13" wide roll feed printer. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=&sku=767177&gclid=CPi_gdr--MMCFQaTfgodZHAAxQ&is=REG&Q=&A=details

As far as laser printers go, I use a HP N5000 N and it accepts up to 11 x 17 media, I recommend using high quality vellum because of the shrinkage that occurs. I know they are more than your budget but I have included a link below to a comparison on 11 X 17 Laser Printers.
http://www.printershowcase.com/11x17colorlasersunder2500.aspx

Hey Guys, anyone using a R2000 for films?


Thank you,
Marc Wilson
www.ellisonadvertising.com


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

the 1430 are great. Skip the blackmaxx and just get refillables or a CISS. You can get blackmaxx in bulk. If your doing any multi color or halftones skip the laser/vellum idea. Shrinking, mis registration will cause you many headaches. I have my 1430 refurbed directly from Epson for $199 free shipping but I have to pay tax and maybe all Epson sales are taxed. 

You can tile if you want a larger then 13x19. Yes it does take some time to line up. I will put a + sign at each tile to make it easy for lining up. 

IMO if you going to spend this much if considering a 2000 you can always find a 4000 series used for less then 2000 new and have the 17" capabilities. I have found several on eBay and Craigslist working for $300 on up.


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## killerbrew (Jun 14, 2015)

Ok, similar question as the OP.

I've been doing some more reading on the site and find that even as a hobby I'm going to need a printer for the film positives. I initially thought that I was going to be able to use my laser printer but turns out it's not good based on the info above. 
No where near able to go the BlackMaxx price, but I'm thinking of getting the Epson 1430. To start off, is this going to be "good enough" for me to print positives? I know to print with all black inks a RIP is needed. I've read that someone needed to stack a few to get completely opaque. Other than getting all black printing the RIP would only be for halftones, right?

Just as a hobby and possibly to make a little money here and there is there anything else that would be recommended?


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

You don't need a RIP for half tones or to print all black. This is what the Rip companies what you t believe. I am traveling today or I would elaborate.


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## veetwincowboy (Mar 14, 2015)

I have an Epson Artisan 1430 and it does everything that I need it to do. I think that for the price it is a good decision. I am still using cartridges but as my business is growing I see the need to get a ciss for the black ink. Everyone has preferences though.


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## killerbrew (Jun 14, 2015)

I am going to go ahead and get the 1430. One more question. To do film positives, I can use the stock ink or ciss correct? I don't need to get sublimation dye inks unless I want to print and heat press to a shirt. Or am I not reading things right?

Thank you for the help!


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## Printor (Apr 16, 2015)

with your 1430s, before you invest in Black max or anything expensive, Try setting CMYK to 100% and printing with stock inks. The UV in the inks are awesome. If it doesn't look as opaque as you wish, burn anyway. You should be happy. Opaque isn't the key word anymore. UV blocking is what matters.


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## PatWibble (Mar 7, 2014)

killerbrew said:


> I am going to go ahead and get the 1430. One more question. To do film positives, I can use the stock ink or ciss correct? I don't need to get sublimation dye inks unless I want to print and heat press to a shirt. Or am I not reading things right?
> 
> Thank you for the help!


Sounds like you are confusing Dye sub ink with ordinary dye based printer ink.

The two are different things. The 1430 uses Epsons 'Claria' dye based ink as standard. It blocks UV light well, and is is great for printing film.

Inkjet ink comes in two main varieties - pigment based or dye based. Either are ok _provided_ they have a UV filter added at manufacture. I prefer dye based ink because I find it dries on the film virtually instantly, so is less prone to accidental smudges.


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## Printor (Apr 16, 2015)

If you keep your 1430 full color instead of switching to all black, The pigment based inks are better for printing heat transfers as well. will stay vibrant in the wash longer.


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## killerbrew (Jun 14, 2015)

PatWibble said:


> Sounds like you are confusing Dye sub ink with ordinary dye based printer ink.
> 
> The two are different things. The 1430 uses Epsons 'Claria' dye based ink as standard. It blocks UV light well, and is is great for printing film.
> 
> Inkjet ink comes in two main varieties - pigment based or dye based. Either are ok _provided_ they have a UV filter added at manufacture. I prefer dye based ink because I find it dries on the film virtually instantly, so is less prone to accidental smudges.


Yep. Confused for sure. So if I decided to go with sublimation inks later on so that I can do the transfers, I can still use that ink to do film positives as long as it has uv blocker. Or am I still on the short bus with this? Lol.


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## Printor (Apr 16, 2015)

Short bus Dye Sublimation inks are only for doing transfers on white mostly polyester fabric, or hard goods with a special polyester coating. a printer with those inks in it, is dedicated to that ink permanently. The pigment based stock inks are for paper, transparencys, photo paper, and work good on regular transfer/iron on paper. Don't mess with Dye Sublimation inks for now if film is your first priority. Start with stock inks while you research other options. you will be happy with your films.


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## killerbrew (Jun 14, 2015)

Printor said:


> Short bus Dye Sublimation inks are only for doing transfers on white mostly polyester fabric, or hard goods with a special polyester coating. a printer with those inks in it, is dedicated to that ink permanently. The dye based stock inks are for paper, transparencys, photo paper, and work good on regular transfer/iron on paper. Don't mess with Dye Sublimation inks for now if film is your first priority. Start with stock inks while you research other options. you will be happy with your films.


Got it. Thank you.


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## PatWibble (Mar 7, 2014)

Printor said:


> If you keep your 1430 full color instead of switching to all black, The dye based inks are better for printing heat transfers as well. will stay vibrant in the wash longer.


I didn't know that. I thought everyone preferred pigment for transfers. Never used transfers, mainly because my printers use dye ink.

I'll have to give it a try.


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## Printor (Apr 16, 2015)

Aw crap! your right! I transposed my bases when dye sub got put in my head. I'll edit that.


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## PatWibble (Mar 7, 2014)

Printor said:


> Aw crap! your right! I transposed my bases when dye sub got put in my head. I'll edit that.


I was getting excited for a minute there! Too good to be true.


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## killerbrew (Jun 14, 2015)

Printor said:


> Aw crap! your right! I transposed my bases when dye sub got put in my head. I'll edit that.


Lol. Ok so I need pigment ink. Glad I have placed the order yet.


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## Printor (Apr 16, 2015)

sorry A few days ago, I saw a customer in a white shirt I did with HP dye based inks almost 5 years ago and I was surprised how well its held up.


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## killerbrew (Jun 14, 2015)

Ok. One more question. I was about to get the 1430 when I remembered seeing posts about refurbished units at $199. Always wanting to save a buck I checked. None. But there is a refurbished R2000. Is it worth the $50 over new on the 1430 or would I be better off saving the $50 and putting towards a CISS in the future?


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## Printor (Apr 16, 2015)

I Have an R2000 about 2 months old. great film with stock inks. awesome transfers and photos. If you splurge for it keep it full color, overkill for converting to all black. and it can take 13'' roll for extra tall film.


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## killerbrew (Jun 14, 2015)

That's what I want to hear. 

Do you have ciss for it? I think I will want to do that eventually just to save on ink costs.


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## PatWibble (Mar 7, 2014)

Unless you are printing transfers, or vast amounts of film, then refillables are more user friendly than a ciss. You still benefit from cheap ink without all the tubes and ink tanks on the side.


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## Printor (Apr 16, 2015)

killerbrew said:


> That's what I want to hear.
> 
> Do you have ciss for it? I think I will want to do that eventually just to save on ink costs.


No ciss yet. too stoked on it as is right now to go messing with the warranty. I'm trying to pick a new sublimation printer right now, mine died will be an Epson for sure.


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## TedBirmy (Nov 29, 2010)

PowerRIP ScreenPrint and AccuRIP both drive the 1430. Most PowerRIP users get by with just the Epson brand of inks, but both RIPs support all black. You can buy Epson ink for a 1430 at any office supply store on the weekend if you run out. Any RIP will give you better control over the dot shape and density than not having a RIP. Signifcnalty better control. The only printer better than a 1430 right now for 17 inch wide output would be a used 3880 or a used 4880 or purchase the new SureColor P800 which uses the exact same code as a 3880. Many vendors are not pushing the P800 right now because they can not sell custom inks for it yet due to no alternate cartridges that work yet with it. Epson inks in the Sure Color P800 are basically the same inks as the ultrachrome inks used in the 3880. Epson is advertising a denser black at this point for the P800, but is it related to a change in their color tables or a newer ultrachrome ink, Epson has not said


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## Crimson Lizard (May 12, 2017)

I've been reading this thread and am planning on buying the Epson 1430 first thing tomorrow. What is the best substrate for this, transparencies or vellum? Will the 1430 also print 8.5x11? I'm assuming it will.


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## digitizewedo (Nov 2, 2010)

The most affordable option is the Epson 1430 with all black inks.


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## Crimson Lizard (May 12, 2017)

I'm sorry, I wasn't clear - by substrate I meant whether to use a clear transparency for my positive or vellum.


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

Crimson Lizard said:


> I've been reading this thread and am planning on buying the Epson 1430 first thing tomorrow. What is the best substrate for this, transparencies or vellum? Will the 1430 also print 8.5x11? I'm assuming it will.


Substrate "Fixxons films" Just google. Make sure to print correct side and feed 1 at a time unless you get Ditto inkjet film feeder. Then you can load 7-8 sheets at a time. Vellum isn't very friendly with inkjets but can be used. This is more common with Laser printers.

There are plenty of options for the Printer. Best overall printer is the 1430 in the 13x19 and smaller printers. $299-can be found on sale and refurb from Epson. My refurb is going on 5 years. Prints the smallest dot and under a microscope the best formed dots. 6 Cartridges.

WF7110. is probably the most economical. $149 I think $99 reurb. only 4 cartridges 



Almost all the Epson printers work well for films. If your printing enough films, all black and a dedicated printer is best. To use all black one needs to know how set color and printer settings within a graphics program or use a RIP like Filmmaker, or Accurip. for halftone printing either of those RIPs work or a program like Simple Seps Smart RIP. 

I use a 1430 with a all black CISS. I have a WF7620 as my office printer and back up film printer also prints 13x19 but isn't supported by Filmmaker or Accurip so halftones would have to be graphics program conversion or program like Simple Seps. I onw their everything pack and is what I use from color separation to film output.


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