# Has anyone successfully used sublimation vinyl?



## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

Hi. Like most folks using sublimation, the biggest problem I encounter, is not being able to print onto dark coloured fabrics, especially black. Fortunately I also use pressed vinyl for darks, but obviously cannot use full colour images with those.

Some of the suppliers are now offering sublimation vinyls. Has anyone *ACTUALLY* used these yet with any reasonable results? I am looking for something that won't crack, or fall to bits after a few washes.

Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.


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## jimc (Jan 31, 2007)

Will, not come across the sublimation vinyls, which suppliers have them?
Jim


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## badalou (Mar 19, 2006)

never heard of it.. give a web site.


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

Hi. Both are UK web sites. Sawgrass bulk ink system supplier- sublimation imprintables - heat transfer press supplier and The Transfer Press 

From what I understand, the vinyl is printed with sublimation ink, using mirror image. The image is placed down to the fabric. The image is then pressed and the image rises *UP* through the vinyl.

Am not so much interested about hand so much, as the washability of these items. Anyone had any joy with these at all?


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## mystysue (Aug 27, 2006)

Ok.. im still having trouble finding it.. what section is it in on those sites


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

Hi. The direct page links are Sublimation Vinyl material for garment decoration and Sublimation flock for dye sublimation printing


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## curtrnev (May 28, 2007)

Is this what you are talking about? Dark Star dye sublimation paper All out of stock ??


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## curtrnev (May 28, 2007)

Well I guess not


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

Nope. It is the sublimation flock from the tranfer perss site above direct link on my latter post above.


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

Man that sounds garbled. My later posting gives the direct page links on both those sites.

From my understanding, the dark star sublimation paper is not as good?


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## mystysue (Aug 27, 2006)

Ive never used it.. but if the adhesive is good like regular flock there shouldnt be a wash problem.. ..


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## CarlT (May 23, 2007)

I have never tried sublimation vinyl for tshirts...just seems redundant to me. Why buy special vinyl when you can just get oqaque papers and use pigment inks with them.

Now if they made a vinyl that I can sublimate and use to make signs and decals, I am all for that.


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

Hi. My albeit limited attempts at using ordinary opaque transfers always end up with the ink peeling off big style. Only seem to have that problem with the dark, rather than the light though?


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## uncletee (Feb 25, 2007)

we use subliflock from johnson plastics, print and cut it iorns on and will last longer than the shirt. it's great for dark color cotton shirts


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

*Do the colours come out well on the subliflock and is it capable of creating a full colour image?*

*Be nice to think that there is a usable product out there for dark fabrics. Sublimation is a fabulous print method, but I feel a bit like Henry Ford at the moment. "You can have any colour as long as it's white"!!*


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## gorgall (Feb 21, 2006)

Just received some vinyl from the first link it is actually marked on the backing paper "FOREVER SUBLI-DARK TEXTILE TRANSFER *PAPER *FOR SUBLIMATION INKS. Will let you know results when I've tried it.


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

*Hi. Thanks for that. Sure there'll be a lot of folks on here interested in what results you get from this product. It would certainly be a breakthrough if it allows sublimation users to print on cottons and darks.*

*The REAL test will being how it survives a normal 40 degree wash cycle. Despite any guidelines to the contrary, I NEVER turn my garments inside out on the wash cycle, as that's not what folks do in the REAL world. Likewise I also put items in a tumble dryer with other washing when testing out products. If they don't survive that, they won't last long in the hands of the purchaser and you'd ultimately end up will some very upset customers. Not good for future business.!!*


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## CarlT (May 23, 2007)

Gordon...you won't like the hand! If you do, I got a few sheets that I will sell you.


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

It definitely has a thicker hand then some of the other dark transfer paper. For now, the best sublimation transfers are done on light shirts. Hopefully that will change in the future.


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## gorgall (Feb 21, 2006)

Was annoyed to see it listed as vinyl
The only good thing is that I have wanted to try subli dark but did not want to buy a whole box.
Trying it today.


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

*Hi Gordon. I'm not totally sure whether the ordinary inkjet transfers for dark are actually made from some sort of vinyl material?*

*Main difference with these sublimation ones I am assuming, is that the image is laid face down on the material and the sublimation ink rises to the surface? If that is the case, it should have a significant difference on the way that they perform. Would give us sublimation guys the opportunity to offer dark garments if it does.*


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## gorgall (Feb 21, 2006)

Still experimenting, not overly keen on the hand, but it's better than the transfer on my son's "Official" Dr Who pyjamas.


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## mikalopa (Feb 24, 2008)

oh i cant wait to c the results!!!!!!!!!!


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## chonkymonky (Apr 1, 2007)

hey guys...any word on that Forever subli-dark? how does it hold up to washings? i have an order coming up and i really need a good transfer paper for dark shirts..that work well with sublimation inks.


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## scootissimo (Jul 10, 2008)

I know where you are coming from Will, it seems any of us outside the US are way behind the trends in this field, the papers and systems are just not available here which is a real bummer, so we'll pay a fortune getting it into the country, less profits etc.
Maybe someone here should look into becoming a distibutor, it seems to be popular so would sell well.
Good Luck Will,
Sam-Australia


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## gorgall (Feb 21, 2006)

Had a few more goes with the vinyl and come to the conclusion that, as Carl said the hand is terrible.I'm going to give subli flock a try.


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

*That's a real pity Gordon. Looks like we go back to offering white shirts only again.  Perhaps the subli-flock may possibly yield better results?*

*If anyone has managed to find a way to use sublimation with darker fabrics, feel free to share.*


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## chonkymonky (Apr 1, 2007)

gordon...when you say vinyl i assume your reffering to the forever subli-dark samples you were going to try out? you say the hand is terrible..but what about the overall washability? how did it hold up there? did it crack? did the colors fade? my client doesnt care how heavy it feels..but i want to make sure the shirts can be worn more than two or three times.


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## Daniel Slatkin (Jun 25, 2008)

Lets face it almost all black techniques are flawed, In My opinion the hand on this product is very similar in feel to a silkscreen that was also bean done on black. After at least 10 washes the design looks great but it is very important that you follow the pressing/printing instructions. Also if you stretch the design a little each direction after pressing it softens the hand slightly. I have had no cracking or pealing problems When it first comes out of the dryer the print is a little wrinkled but after a couple of minutes up against your body heat it straightens out and looks great. It is not the perfect solution but it is the best I have found so far. I just wish it was available in rolls.


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

*I think that we will have to educate our customers, that white is the 'new' black.  *

*I have tried inkjet transfers for darks, but don't feel comfortable with the longetivity issue, to offer them for sale just yet. The quality isn't even remotely like that of sublimation. Cut vinyl works with simple designs, but the weeding can be laborious if you have a lot of orders to do.*


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## chonkymonky (Apr 1, 2007)

dan..i assume your reffering to the forever subli-dark? does anyone know of a supplier in california that sells this paper?


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## D.Evo. (Mar 31, 2006)

scootissimo said:


> I know where you are coming from Will, it seems any of us outside the US are way behind the trends in this field, the papers and systems are just not available here which is a real bummer, so we'll pay a fortune getting it into the country, less profits etc.
> Maybe someone here should look into becoming a distibutor, it seems to be popular so would sell well.
> Good Luck Will,
> Sam-Australia


Sam, for Australian distributor of sublimatable product for dark/cotton fabric have a look at Velflex : Products - they have sublimation flock. I have some printed samples and they look and feel quite nice (just like regular flock only with full colour print). I must admit, I haven't printed on it myself yet and haven't done a wash test on samples. I'll try to look into it this week and will report with results.


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## scootissimo (Jul 10, 2008)

Hi there, I have used velflex, not washed any full colour yet as only printed shirt logos in black but am about to try a few colour images on a black polo shirt for a mates birthday, will see how it goes.
'GJS Machinery' has some good stock specials from time to time.
Thnx for the message- have a nice day 
sam


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

D.Evo. said:


> .I have some printed samples and they look and feel quite nice (just like regular flock only with full colour print). I must admit, I haven't printed on it myself yet and haven't done a wash test on samples. I'll try to look into it this week and will report with results.


*Do let us know how you get on with the wash tests Tania. This thread has stimulated a lot of interest from folks.*


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## gorgall (Feb 21, 2006)

I've washed a shirt three times and the result is awful, very stiff and almost crinkly, would be okay for a shirt you are only going to wear once.


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

Well that's the UK sourced subli flock idea out of the window Gordon. Looks we we go back to adapting our designs to only utilise white tees.

The only satisfactory method I've actually found for getting graphics onto dark tees using UK based suppliers, is cut vinyl. That is limited to simple designs though.

Apart from using inkjet transfers to get images onto dark tees, I'm all out of ideas. Transfers available in the UK are not too brilliant.


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## vescera (Jul 24, 2007)

We have this sublimation flock here in Europe and I dont like it main because they state wash on 40celzius so it will come of soon or later.


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## gorgall (Feb 21, 2006)

This was the subli dark vinyl, have not tried subli flock yet!


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

*Right.*


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## hechtgirl (Jul 15, 2008)

*Chromoblast*

Does anyone know if Chromoblast ink expires?


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

As this thread was left unfinished, I managed to acquire some subli flock myself, to evaluate its suitability.

The whole purpose to this thread, was to see if there was a way to get full colour images onto a dark fabric using sublimation. Obviously direct sublimation in total non starter, as the image would be totally invisible. The workaround being to sublimate onto light material and then adhere to the garment.

Gordon (gorgall) tried out a vinyl type material (forever subli dark) which turned out to have an unacceptable hand (feel). Thanks to Gordon for his valuable input on that.

The subli flock material is altogether different to transfers. It is a tight pile polyester material with an adhesive backing. The sublimation transfer is brought into contact with the flock and pressed at 200 degrees C, for 30 seconds. The second stage involves removing the backing sheet to expose the adhesive layer, then pressing onto the shirt at 170 degrees C, for 10 seconds to activate the adhesive.

So what are the results like? As you can see from the attached image, the picture is a little fuzzier than with a conventional transfer, but do bear in mind this is printed onto material, not gloss background, so this is to be expected. The subli flock is gentler to the touch than an inkjet transfer, but the hand is a lot more noticeable. Being material used with sublimation ink, it is highly unlikely that it will crack, feel or fade.

Hope this helps someone.


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## brinkr (May 12, 2008)

This something like your looking for Sublimation Vinyl material for garment decoration


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## Alfred Bester (Jul 26, 2013)

Hi y'all 

Okay bare with me here (I'm new around these parts)

I have read through this thread looking for recommendations for where to purchase "Sublimation textile vinyl".

Am I being short sighted or is / was the only place you could get the "vinyl" a company called "Home to Gifts" which appear to have ceased trading?

Are there any other suppliers of this material in the UK?

I have noticed that there seemed to have been some issues with the tactile qualities of this material, but I need something like this for a specific task and how it feels is a secondary concern at this time.

I have noticed (and located) the flock version of this material, however the "Fuzzy" print issue could be a concern as I need to be printing company logos and they might be a little fussy about print quality.

Sorry that was a little long winded.


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## GordonM (May 21, 2012)

Heat Transfer Warehouse and others sell the sub flock material, and a few sell a twill that should ideally be sewn in after pressing. HTW sells it by the yard, so you can get a bit to experiment with. LRi sells theirs by the sheet, and is a little cheaper.

For shirt logos, have you thought about sublimation patches? Outfits like EnMart offer patches of different shapes and sizes, with the embroidered edge already there. You can get them with and without fused backing.

For the sublimation equivalent to solvent ink opaque vinyl, it just doesn't exist, IMO. I've tested several, and the colors aren't as good as you'd expect, and/or the price is outrageous. If you're doing a bunch of shirt logos it may be cheaper to outsource them to someone who will print these using a solvent printer on "proper" heat transfer vinyl.


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## sapience (Sep 25, 2010)

ACP sells the forever paper. They are close to me, so I've seen it in person. They showed me a black shirt that they made and it's beautiful! You need to use a cutter/plotter with the paper which I don't have. The paper is also expensive, but you can sublimate on dark (even black) cotton with the paper. 

Their customer service is the best. I had trouble with a photo slate a few months ago. I brought the one I made up there, & they took a look at it to figure out what I did incorrectly. They printed a new one for me, & allowed me to participate in the process so I learned how to replicate the technique. 

While I was there they showed me the forever paper stuff, the process, etc. I'd give them a call...It'e pretty kewl stuff. 
Supplies - Forever Heat Transfer Paper
*800-741-2551 * 941-637-8551*


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## jfisk3475 (Jan 28, 2011)

We us white twill from Thermoflex.

Sent from my SGH-T679 using T-Shirt Forums


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

jfisk3475 said:


> We us white twill from Thermoflex.
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T679 using T-Shirt Forums


You sublimate on that?


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## jfisk3475 (Jan 28, 2011)

Yes we do. It is a little stiff until you wash it. But it holds the color and it is the only thing we found that works on darks. 

Sent from my SGH-T679 using T-Shirt Forums


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