# Quality Control



## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

Hey guys, im new here but have been browsing for a while now. I have a few questions. 

Info- I am starting out trying not to break the bank so most equipment was ordered based on price and not quality. (I want to test the waters first)
-My printing will be mostly for cell phone cases.

Materials 
-Epson 1430
-CISS w/ Ink (from china)
-3D Heat press 

I set everything up today and printed/transferred my company logo onto a mug for a first time run through.

I am satisfied with the outcome but I really want to know how I can get a sharper image with brighter colors? Is it all in the ink?


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

onyx123 said:


> Hey guys, im new here but have been browsing for a while now. I have a few questions.
> 
> Info- I am starting out trying not to break the bank so most equipment was ordered based on price and not quality. (I want to test the waters first)
> -My printing will be mostly for cell phone cases.
> ...


For accurate colors you will need an ICC sublimation profile for your inks. 

Sharpness comes down to source image, how you handle it in your graphic app, and proper dwell/temp/pressure applied to your substrate.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

mgparrish said:


> For accurate colors you will need an ICC sublimation profile for your inks.
> 
> Sharpness comes down to source image, how you handle it in your graphic app, and proper dwell/temp/pressure applied to your substrate.


Thanks, I will ask my supplier about the ICC profile but I have a feeling they are not going to understand but we'll see. I feel as if higher quality paper would transfer better, maybe sharper and less of a blurred/smeared look. Does this make sense?


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

onyx123 said:


> Thanks, I will ask my supplier about the ICC profile but I have a feeling they are not going to understand but we'll see. I feel as if higher quality paper would transfer better, maybe sharper and less of a blurred/smeared look. Does this make sense?


The ink absorbtion of the paper can be a factor, also, make sure you print on the correct side, the "whitest white" side is the print side.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

mgparrish said:


> The ink absorbtion of the paper can be a factor, also, make sure you print on the correct side, the "whitest white" side is the print side.


Ok thanks so much I did not know that. Could you recommend a good paper? It will be used on plastic mostly. Thanks


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

onyx123 said:


> Ok thanks so much I did not know that. Could you recommend a good paper? It will be used on plastic mostly. Thanks


 
Image Right Premium Sublimation Paper - 8.5" x 14" (100 sheets)


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## GordonM (May 21, 2012)

onyx123 said:


> Could you recommend a good paper? It will be used on plastic mostly.


What kind of plastic are we talking about here? FRP, or some kind of polyester sheet?

Image Right is excellent for fiberglass reinforced plastic. I use it all the time. But polyester sheets will require something with a much higher release. You will also need to fine-tune the time, temperature, and pressure to make everything look right.

Best describe the "plastic" substrate you're printing to.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

GordonM said:


> What kind of plastic are we talking about here? FRP, or some kind of polyester sheet?
> 
> Image Right is excellent for fiberglass reinforced plastic. I use it all the time. But polyester sheets will require something with a much higher release. You will also need to fine-tune the time, temperature, and pressure to make everything look right.
> 
> Best describe the "plastic" substrate you're printing to.


Hi, it is Polycarbonate. Thanks


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

Great now my CISS is driving me crazy. It was working fine yesterday and now today it wont print black. I tried priming and cleaning and still nothing...why would this be happening to only the black?


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## GordonM (May 21, 2012)

onyx123 said:


> Hi, it is Polycarbonate. Thanks


Depending on actual composition and surface of the material, you may need something like this:

Coast Graphic Supply: 95% + Sublimation Transfer Paper 8.5"x11" - 100 Sheets 

This paper is very difficult to work with in Epson desktop printers, as it has a permanent curl that can cause jams, and is slow drying. Black areas of your print may cause streaking and roller tracking.

You may have better luck transferring to a 100% polyester decal material, such as SubliDecal, then applying that to the polycarbonate.

I have personally never had satisfactory results subbing to polycarbonate sheet. The melting point is about 310 degrees F, and the glass transition temperature is around 300. This is a very narrow range in order to achieve good transfer without deforming. The relatively low temperature (for sublimation) means longer press times in order to get good blacks.


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## GordonM (May 21, 2012)

onyx123 said:


> Great now my CISS is driving me crazy. It was working fine yesterday and now today it wont print black. I tried priming and cleaning and still nothing...why would this be happening to only the black?


How are you determining the black channel is out?

You might need to try repriming and cleaning more than once.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

GordonM said:


> How are you determining the black channel is out?
> 
> You might need to try repriming and cleaning more than once.


Never mind, I got it. I did not know I had to change settings from text to photo. Whoops


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

GordonM said:


> Depending on actual composition and surface of the material, you may need something like this:
> 
> Coast Graphic Supply: 95% + Sublimation Transfer Paper 8.5"x11" - 100 Sheets
> 
> ...


I just pressed my first iPhone case, using the jig/mold. It didn't transfer the first time because I didn't think to preheat the jig. Second time I preheat the jig and pressed it 190 c for 5 min. Results were good, a little grainy. Maybe it will be better if I left it longer.


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## GordonM (May 21, 2012)

If you're using those plastic phone covers you'll want to talk with your supplier about the paper they recommend for it. Outfits like Sublicase say you should only use their paper.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

I was messing around with printer preferences, heat temp and timing. 4th try and I just got results that I am more than happy with.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

I am starting to think my ink is whats causing me to not have very sharp resolution images. I purchased about 100ml each of all six colors for about $50. I looked at the brand name sub inks and they appear to be about $140 each for 110ml of each color. How could their be such a drastic price difference?? So it would cost me almost $1000 to purchase all 6 colors?


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## GordonM (May 21, 2012)

What happened between posts 15 and 16? You were getting good results, and next time around, the image isn't sharp.

Pictures would help. If you don't have the post-count yet to include pics in your message, upload them to a picture sharing site (no X-rated ads, please), and folks here can take a look.

As for the price difference, sub inks for small format printers are currently controlled by a single company that enjoys a patent monopoly. Their price is grossly inflated compared to the cost of manufacture. The inks you bought from China skirt the patent. They may or may not be any good. Frankly, they often aren't good, unless you know what you're buying. There are a lot of cheaters out there.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

Well yes, the results were good but then I went to websites that sell the brand name ink and their photos of cases seem to have amazing quality which leads me to believe I am doing something wrong or lacking something.


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## GordonM (May 21, 2012)

You need to post photos of your example work. It's rather pointless to speculate what might be wrong.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

GordonM said:


> You need to post photos of your example work. It's rather pointless to speculate what might be wrong.


No problem, I will post them up a little later in the day.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

Ok here you can see how grainy the pictures came out


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

onyx123 said:


> Ok here you can see how grainy the pictures came out


Are your source images 300 PPI?


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

mgparrish said:


> Are your source images 300 PPI?


AMAZING! I adjusted the PPI (im still a newbie so please forgive) and tried using the side opposite of what I had been using on the transfer paper and WOW the results are stunning! 

-Now just one last hurdle...it seems all black colored sections of the image are banding slightly with horizontal lines. How can I fix this? Seems only to be the black.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

onyx123 said:


> AMAZING! I adjusted the PPI (im still a newbie so please forgive) and tried using the side opposite of what I had been using on the transfer paper and WOW the results are stunning!
> 
> -Now just one last hurdle...it seems all black colored sections of the image are banding slightly with horizontal lines. How can I fix this? Seems only to be the black.


Head cleans and/or correct priming of your carts or CIS.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

mgparrish said:


> Head cleans and/or correct priming of your carts or CIS.


Ok I will try that now. Does it matter that this printer is brand new? I literally just started printing with it two days ago. Could it need head cleaning already?


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

onyx123 said:


> Ok I will try that now. Does it matter that this printer is brand new? I literally just started printing with it two days ago. Could it need head cleaning already?


Banding form head clogs is usually due to printer inactivity, new or otherwise.

Banding from air in the system can also happen on a brand spanking new printer as well unless you are using OEM carts, which are sealed. Check with your supplier for "priming" instructions, this needs to always be done on a new install if using CIS or refillable non-OEM carts.


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## GordonM (May 21, 2012)

Your Epson manual, available online, provides maintenance steps to keep printing at optimal performance. Refer to that for the steps.

Apart from CISS issues, the banding you are seeing could mean you need a cleaning cycle, that your heads need alignment (it's a simple procedure; check the manual), and/or you're printing at too low of a print quality. If you use the Plain Paper setting, try the highest two quality options to see what works best.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

Ok I re primed and now the black ink isn't coming out at all.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

onyx123 said:


> Ok I re primed and now the black ink isn't coming out at all.


Between head cleaning and printing purge files you should be able to clear up ... assuming your are adequately primed. Find the appropriate number of colors to match your printer in zip package. These are pure color bars and can be used to get some inks pushed through the print head and also to help diagnose specific ink channels.

CIS or refills?


http://www.inksupply.com/zip/purge.zip

For sublimation you cannot print at low resolutions, either from the source image being low PPI or the printer print quality set too low either.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

mgparrish said:


> Between head cleaning and printing purge files you should be able to clear up ... assuming your are adequately primed. Find the appropriate number of colors to match your printer in zip package. These are pure color bars and can be used to get some inks pushed through the print head and also to help diagnose specific ink channels.
> 
> CIS or refills?
> 
> ...



Ok so I ran another head cleaning after re priming and the ink is flowing again but still with banding. I am going to run another head clean. My supplier did not provide instructions on how to prime so I have been using youtube videos for reference. Seems like their are a few different methods. Can you recommend the best way to prime?


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

mgparrish said:


> Between head cleaning and printing purge files you should be able to clear up ... assuming your are adequately primed. Find the appropriate number of colors to match your printer in zip package. These are pure color bars and can be used to get some inks pushed through the print head and also to help diagnose specific ink channels.
> 
> CIS or refills?
> 
> ...


Ok it is looking much better after another head cleaning. Thank you so much for the help and quick responses. Why is it that it needs so many head cleanings so often?


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

Ok now the purge test had no banding in the black but when I printed an image, the black parts had banding. Check out the pic,


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

onyx123 said:


> Ok so I ran another head cleaning after re priming and the ink is flowing again but still with banding. I am going to run another head clean. My supplier did not provide instructions on how to prime so I have been using youtube videos for reference. Seems like their are a few different methods. Can you recommend the best way to prime?


Where did you get your system?


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

onyx123 said:


> Ok now the purge test had no banding in the black but when I printed an image, the black parts had banding. Check out the pic,


Suspect you still have air in your system.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

mgparrish said:


> Where did you get your system?


Our good friends over in China lol...Told you I was working on a budget. I just finished talking to them and they couldn't provide an ICC Profile. However.... I messed with the printer settings within photoshop and got the image to print muchhh better. The banding was decreased drastically but the brown background became very red. I am getting close though!


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

onyx123 said:


> Our good friends over in China lol...Told you I was working on a budget. I just finished talking to them and they couldn't provide an ICC Profile. However.... I messed with the printer settings within photoshop and got the image to print muchhh better. The banding was decreased drastically but the brown background became very red. I am getting close though!


The last CIS I had going back several years, I use refillable carts now.

Perhaps you should post a pic of the CIS and maybe someone has a similar one. 

You should at least have had setup and prime instructions from them. Suggest you contact them again on the prime.

There are usually plugs in the air vents and fill those usually are pulled during prime.

Your are also going to have all kinds of color issues without a ICC profile. No one can help you fix that. You are going to have to adjust each and every image piecemeal and at best one big crapshoot doing that.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

mgparrish said:


> The last CIS I had going back several years, I use refillable carts now.
> 
> Perhaps you should post a pic of the CIS and maybe someone has a similar one.
> 
> ...


Ok here's some pics of my CISS. I really think the problem lies within the color settings somewhere, either photoshop and or printer. I have never adjusted colors so I am not too familiar with the info.
















\


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## GordonM (May 21, 2012)

You might try elevating the tanks a bit to see if that helps. Don't go overboard, or you could swamp the inside of your printer with ink.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

onyx123 said:


> Ok here's some pics of my CISS. I really think the problem lies within the color settings somewhere, either photoshop and or printer. I have never adjusted colors so I am not too familiar with the info.


One thing you must understand, you will never ever get accurate color without a ICC sublimation profile.

You have 2 problems and not directly related to each other.

1. Ink delivery issues.
2. No profile.

_Color_ settings won't fix your banding or missing colors.

Other settings such as paper type and resolution can effect ink flow which may cause some banding, but once you get all that straightened out (and any issues related to the CIS) you will still have color issues and you always will until you use inks that have a matched profile.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

GordonM said:


> You might try elevating the tanks a bit to see if that helps. Don't go overboard, or you could swamp the inside of your printer with ink.


I'll give it a shot. The ciss system has molded hooks that allow it to hang on the rim of the printer but I am assuming that would be too high, no?


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

mgparrish said:


> One thing you must understand, you will never ever get accurate color without a ICC sublimation profile.
> 
> You have 2 problems and not directly related to each other.
> 
> ...


But it confuses me that when printing outside of photoshop, the black prints fine but within photoshop it prints with bands.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

onyx123 said:


> But it confuses me that when printing outside of photoshop, the black prints fine but within photoshop it prints with bands.


You need to understand the difference between R0 G0 B0 composite black and "K" black. What program outside of photoshop did you use for the unbanded "black"?


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

mgparrish said:


> You need to understand the difference between R0 G0 B0 composite black and "K" black. What program outside of photoshop did you use for the unbanded "black"?


Yea that's a foreign language to me. I just printed a black purge page straight from the Internet.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

onyx123 said:


> Yea that's a foreign language to me. I just printed a black purge page straight from the Internet.


Mixing the other colors in your printer carts in some mixture you can create a black without using the actual black ink in your printer. 

If you sublimate or do any graphics design you need to research on color management and learn basic color theory. In photoshop colors are numbers.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

mgparrish said:


> Mixing the other colors in your printer carts in some mixture you can create a black without using the actual black ink in your printer.
> 
> If you sublimate or do any graphics design you need to research on color management and learn basic color theory. In photoshop colors are numbers.


Are you referring to the hexidecimal numbers like when coding HTML? Ok so I think I got it, k black is actual black ink while composite black is a mixture of cmy. Photoshop is trying to print k black but the other programs print composite black therefore not ruling out the fact that there is a problem with my black ink flow. 

Anyone know where I can purchase small amounts of ink to test out (from a company that does supply icc profile)?


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

onyx123 said:


> Are you referring to the hexidecimal numbers like when coding HTML?
> 
> *Photoshop can display the numbers in HEX (for web color) or in CMYK or in RGB among other number schemes.*
> 
> ...


I marked up in questions above.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

Ok so how do I go about printing a test sample of k and a sample of composite black?


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## GordonM (May 21, 2012)

When was the last time you did nozzle checks and head alignments from the Maintenance tab? Maybe do another round of these, and if they check out, and given all the repriming and cleaning cycles you've done, that leaves a few culprits, one of which is your CISS not being able to feed ink fast enough. Elevating it, as I mentioned, could help.

Your CISS tanks are designed differently than mine, but I get good results when the average ink level is the same or slightly above as the cartridge ports in the printhead. These are the little orifices you see when you remove the cartridges. Underneath that is the printhead mechanics itself.

When the tanks are too low, the printer will starve for ink. If they are too high, you run the risk of flooding the inside of your printer with ink. There really should be some indication from your supplier on where the tanks should be mounted in relation to the printhead.

I wonder if you wouldn't be better served by going with a proven set of tanks, like those Cobra sells. How much money have you lost with all the time and bad prints you've spent? With someone like Cobra, you can call up the owner and talk to him personally. Can you do that with the tanks you bought? 

You might also opt for refillable cartridges. They're generally easier to use, though they too must be properly primed first time around.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

GordonM said:


> When was the last time you did nozzle checks and head alignments from the Maintenance tab? Maybe do another round of these, and if they check out, and given all the repriming and cleaning cycles you've done, that leaves a few culprits, one of which is your CISS not being able to feed ink fast enough. Elevating it, as I mentioned, could help.
> 
> Your CISS tanks are designed differently than mine, but I get good results when the average ink level is the same or slightly above as the cartridge ports in the printhead. These are the little orifices you see when you remove the cartridges. Underneath that is the printhead mechanics itself.
> 
> ...


You are right, I have invested hours into messing with these. I am going to check out cobra. Thanks


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

GordonM said:


> When was the last time you did nozzle checks and head alignments from the Maintenance tab? Maybe do another round of these, and if they check out, and given all the repriming and cleaning cycles you've done, that leaves a few culprits, one of which is your CISS not being able to feed ink fast enough. Elevating it, as I mentioned, could help.
> 
> Your CISS tanks are designed differently than mine, but I get good results when the average ink level is the same or slightly above as the cartridge ports in the printhead. These are the little orifices you see when you remove the cartridges. Underneath that is the printhead mechanics itself.
> 
> ...


Hey, I raised my tanks and before purchasing a new system i tested some printing using the oem cartridges and they are banding as well. What now?


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

onyx123 said:


> Hey, I raised my tanks and before purchasing a new system i tested some printing using the oem cartridges and they are banding as well. What now?


It's good you kept your OEM carts, they are always handy for trouble shooting. Assuming the carts are reasonably fresh, then those should be deemed "known good".

The factory pulls a very good vacuum when those are made so there should be no air bubble (prime) issues for those and represent an ideal ink transport.

Having said that ... if you are still getting banding then simple head cleaning should clear that up. It is not unusual to have to do a head cleaning or 2 when swapping carts. So clean the heads again then check your nozzles. 

Make sure you are printing at a higher quality in the Epson driver if you are printing graphics. Low resolution printing in the printer driver can cause banding also if you are trying to print graphics, but of course your nozzle check with OEM carts verifies nozzle issues.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

I did research specific to my printer and I have seen a lot of people having this problem with banding. Some people have the problem right out of the box.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

onyx123 said:


> I did research specific to my printer and I have seen a lot of people having this problem with banding. Some people have the problem right out of the box.


Welcome to inkjet printing. There is a head cleaning utility that comes in the printer software for a reason. Even using factory inks.


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## GordonM (May 21, 2012)

onyx123 said:


> Hey, I raised my tanks and before purchasing a new system i tested some printing using the oem cartridges and they are banding as well. What now?


You need to do BOTH cleaning and head alignment on any new printer. (Cleaning happens automatically when you insert new cartridges, as that forces the printer to go through a priming cycle. There is no automatic head alignment on these lower-end consumer printers.)

As Richard (Cobra Inks) suggests, you should also periodically check alignment after a run of print jobs, as well as if you move the printer to a new location.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

GordonM said:


> You need to do BOTH cleaning and head alignment on any new printer. (Cleaning happens automatically when you insert new cartridges, as that forces the printer to go through a priming cycle. There is no automatic head alignment on these lower-end consumer printers.)
> 
> As Richard (Cobra Inks) suggests, you should also periodically check alignment after a run of print jobs, as well as if you move the printer to a new location.


Just to be clear to the OP alignment should really be done once at the beginning when the printer is first and then checked _occasionally_. It shouldn't be done in conjunction with every head clean. You were not implying this but just to make sure he doesn't fall into that practice.


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## onyx123 (Sep 13, 2013)

UPDATE***

I took a shot and purchased a new printer (same epson 1430). Lo and behold, no banding!! I will be returning the first one. You guys have been awesome and I learned a TON from this thread!


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