# Epson WF 7110 versus Ricoh SG400 or Ricoh SG 3100 DN



## kimki1 (Jun 8, 2015)

Have managed to whittle down my printer choices for sublimation printing to either an Epson Artisan 1430 or an Epson WF 7110. Any thoughts? Any strong suggestions? Any Advice? 

Thanks for any and all advice.

Kim


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## jimc (Jan 31, 2007)

The important decision is not so much which Epson printer to use but more to do with which ink you put in it.

For years I used the different current models of the time of Epson printers with Artanium ink and whilst the prints were very good I had a never ending problem with clogged printheads and having to replace the printers on a regular basis.
However I now use one of the professional inks which were previously only available for large format printers.
The difference is truly amazing, using a cheap Epson WF-7110 for the last 9 months I have as yet not had the need to do a single head clean, The black is true black unlike the purple tinged Artanium black and the colours are more vivid.
I buy these inks in 100 ml. bottles at a quarter of the price that I was paying for Artanium.


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## api (Nov 22, 2009)

I have 3 questions:

1) Are you using refillable cartridges or CIS?

2.) How did you get ICC profiles? 

3.) Which professional ink do you use?

Thanks...


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## jimc (Jan 31, 2007)

At the moment I'm using refillable cartridges to see how inks perform, will either keep this printer or possibly another 1500 (1430)
The colours are coming out Quite well without ICC profile but I'm going to have one made shortly when I decide which printer to continue with.

The inks are Inktec Sublinova Smart.


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## api (Nov 22, 2009)

I have a WF 7620 with refillable cartridges and using Cobra ink and Cobra ICC profiles. Everything is fine except the printer doesn't recognize the cartridges as EPSON products. It often stops in the middle of the 13x19 page saying "_Cartridge(s) unrecognized_". I asked help from Richard at Cobra. He answered immediately but he couldn't really help. 

He suggested taking out and reinstalling the cartridge(s). 
I knew this, that's what I did every time, but it is just a painful workaround, not a real solution. It takes time, I have to discard the large, partially printed transfer sheet, I have to start printing from the beginning. It is the pain in the butt and it happens very often.

It seems that the chip in the refillable cartridge is not perfect and the printer recognizes the problem. I am sure EPSON doesn't want us to use non-EPSON inks so the firmware is checking every detail. I can even believe that stopping in the middle of the page if the "_Ink is not genuine EPSON ink_" is intentional. 

Anyway, I have a love-hate relationship with this printer. I am thinking about upgrading to a 24" EPSON T3270. That's why I was interested in your ink and ICC profiles.

Thanks again for the info...


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## bpfohler (Jun 7, 2009)

We use to have an Epson wf1100 w/Artanium inks. We had great luck with it for years until it died. We replaced it with a Wf7610 and Cobra inks, from day one we've had smeared prints and we've never been able to get certain colors to print properly.
We tried and tried to get a royal blue (search the forums and you'll find others) to print and press but we got either purple or denim blue. We sent an email to Cobra and of course they blamed the problem on us.
We're looking for both a new printer and new ink.


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## kimki1 (Jun 8, 2015)

Jim Thanks for the quick reply. I have read that the Artanium inks do not work well with Epson printers. I have ready later in your posts that you use Inktec Sublinova Smart inks. Where do you purchase them? I know they are easily purchased in England, but I am hoping you are living here in North America and know of a local supplier? I have read elsewhere that Inktec Sublinova Inks are great...Any and all direction would be appreciated. 

Kim


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## kimki1 (Jun 8, 2015)

Hey Api. I have been thinking of using a Cobra CIS with Cobra Inks with the Epson WF7110. Now after hearing about your issues with the Epson printer not recognizing your cartridges, I wonder if you think the Epson may have the same problem recognizing the cartridges for the CIS system? Anyone know? Thanks for the information Api. Oh...one more question, I gather that despite the issue of cartridge recognition you must be still satisfied with the Epson printer, am I correct in this assumption?


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## kimki1 (Jun 8, 2015)

BpFohler
Thanks for the information. One question, you mention you were using a WF 1110 did you mean a WF 7110? If so, your information is making me re-think the whole Epson - Cobra ink set up. Much appreciated.
Kim


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

The issue with the WF7110 is due to Epson adding a bit of a "cripple" in their firmware when they detect non-OEM chips, so most chips for_ refillable_ carts have this issue. They are not killing the aftermarket just making it a PITA for you.

Most CIS system are using a different chip, those chips are different and not used (with few exceptions) in a refillable carts.

The thinking in a CIS is that the tanks are external and you you can see into the tanks and see remaining inks. Then if the CIS chips are returning "not empty", but the tanks are getting low, you can see that then refill the tanks as needed.

The problem with refillable carts is that they must be removed from the printer to see the ink levels visually (the only true ink level indication) , so if the chip is showing "not empty" but the carts are getting dry then you run the risk of pushing just air thru the print head and damaging them. As such, most cart vendors won't use CIS chips on refillable carts.

CIS chips typically won't need to be reset as often and also some can all reset at the same time, or even some you can reset whenever. Regular refillable chips often you are soon resetting another cart right after another one needs resetting, till you get them all reset. A real PITA so being able to deal with all 4 carts at once with the CIS chip is nice.

So the issue as described above should mostly be specific to refillable carts, including Cobra.

A few suppliers actually use CIS chips on refillable carts and in the case of the WF7110, 7610, and 7620 the only way to avoid the "low capacity" IC is to use a CIS chip on the cart instead of the normal refillable cart chip.

An example ...

https://store.inkjetcarts.us/4-position-rwtf-epson-252-damper-chip-p6788.aspx

This really is the only workaround for that family of Epson.

Those looking at CIS consult with the vendor to confirm the reset operation, should not be the same as the refillables offered in many cases. So those concerned about what is being reported here with the refillable carts I think should not be so alarmed.


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## jimc (Jan 31, 2007)

kimki1 said:


> Jim Thanks for the quick reply. I have read that the Artanium inks do not work well with Epson printers. I have ready later in your posts that you use Inktec Sublinova Smart inks. Where do you purchase them? I know they are easily purchased in England, but I am hoping you are living here in North America and know of a local supplier? I have read elsewhere that Inktec Sublinova Inks are great...Any and all direction would be appreciated.
> 
> Kim


 As I'm in UK I don't know of US suppliers, however this is a Korean made ink and I would think it would be International.


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## bpfohler (Jun 7, 2009)

kimki1 said:


> BpFohler
> Thanks for the information. One question, you mention you were using a WF 1110 did you mean a WF 7110? If so, your information is making me re-think the whole Epson - Cobra ink set up. Much appreciated.
> Kim


No, our first printer was an Epson WF1100 and we used Artanium ink, it was old but simple and reliable. 
We bought a WF7610 and switched to Cobra ink because of cost and have had clarity problems and color matching problems ever since.
I'm thinking about flushing the system any trying Sawgrass inks again to see if anything improves.


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## kimki1 (Jun 8, 2015)

Mgparrish Thanks for the great info! Really informative... Do you know if the same problem will arise using the Epson Artisan 1350 with a Cobra CIS system? Thanks


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## kimki1 (Jun 8, 2015)

Hey BPFohler, 
Thanks for the quick reply. Now I am definitely rethinking the WF 7100/Cobra ink system. I keep reading about InkTec Sublinova Smart inks being very easy to work with, but most of the users are from England. Have you looked into this product? 
Thanks again
Kim


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## api (Nov 22, 2009)

Hey *kimki1,*

As I mentioned, we have this reset issue with the refillable Cobra cartridges but otherwise we are really satisfied with Cobra Inc.. We had no color issues at all, their ICC profiles were good, the ink is affordable and our sublimated items are very nice. 

The desktop EPSON printer is really inexpensive, and prints nice 13"x19" pages. The ROI (return on investment) of this printer was 1 day (!) in our shop. 

I am thinking about upgrading however because of the following reasons:

1.) With a 24" printer the transfer sheet is always larger than our 16" x 20" heat press. This is very important if you do t-shirts, otherwise the edge of the paper shows on the shirt. Yes, you can start messing with foam, but it is still a PITA. For efficient production the large paper is the solution.

2.) The 24" printer is much faster. Time is money.

3.) It can use roll paper, so no manual paper feeding. (It even has a built in cutter.)

4.) The roll paper can be tacky. That helps avoiding the ghost images.

5.) The ink is even less expensive, comes in a factory filled cartridge, so no issues with the refillable cartridges. 

6.) The printer actually "knows" the true level of the ink, so no false negative error messages.

The problem with the 24" EPSON is that there is no free, readily available ICC profiles. The only exception is the Sawgrass ink but I like to avoid that if I can. It seems to me however that from manufacturing point of view that would be the most convenient solution. The ink price in our products is definitely NOT the most important factor, so I don't want to be "penny wise and pound foolish".

If anybody has different opinions, I would be more than happy to hear that...


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

kimki1 said:


> Mgparrish Thanks for the great info! Really informative... Do you know if the same problem will arise using the Epson Artisan 1350 with a Cobra CIS system? Thanks



I'm not familiar with the Artisan 1350, perhaps you mean the 1430?

Also, I think you missed a few key points in my post.

There should be no issues with any of the 7110/7610/7620 *CIS* systems, or any other CIS systems, this is a _refillable cart issue_ caused by Epson to keep out 3rd party refillable carts. They effectively cause the refillable carts to require resetting more often.

This is not a Cobra issue per se.

The 1430 CIS or refillable carts shouldn't see the 7110/7610/7620 cart issue of causing pre-mature reporting of "empty cart"


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## kimki1 (Jun 8, 2015)

Hey Api,
Thanks again for the quick reply and great information. You have helped settle a number of questions for me, but given your response, I now am curious as to what 24" printer are you leaning towards and would you continue to use Cobra inks with that model. oh...now this may seem terribly hopeless but I am new to this business, " you say, "there is no free ICC profiles." Who would you pay or how would you go about acquiring a set of profiles? Thanks again for your willing to share, hopefully I will be able to pass your kindness on as I acquire my own knowledge base. 
Kim


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## kimki1 (Jun 8, 2015)

Hey Mgparrish,
My goof, I did mean the Artisan 1430 and thanks for taking the time to clear up my misunderstanding of the problems with cartridges as opposed to the trouble free CISS system...don't know how I confused what you clearly stated, my bad.:rooleyes: Thanks again for your quick response. Thanks to this post you have greatly eased my concern about the WF7100 and I think I am now committing to the it with the Cobra ink system. I am so happy the indecision is over!!!!  Will let you know how it all turns out.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

kimki1 said:


> Hey Mgparrish,
> My goof, I did mean the Artisan 1430 and thanks for taking the time to clear up my misunderstanding of the problems with cartridges as opposed to the trouble free CISS system...don't know how I confused what you clearly stated, my bad.:rooleyes: Thanks again for your quick response. Thanks to this post you have greatly eased my concern about the WF7100 and I think I am now committing to the it with the Cobra ink system. I am so happy the indecision is over!!!!  Will let you know how it all turns out.


Be sure and discuss with Cobra on the CIS option and the reset procedure for it, or check the videos on their site. I'm using WF7110 refillable carts myself and not the CIS from Cobra. 

Since I really like refillable carts I'm going to get the carts I posted from the other vendor and just use the Cobra inks. Most vendors don't like to put CIS chips with refillable carts, that one I mentioned does.


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## Ink Soup Jim (Jan 24, 2013)

Years of working with clients who sublimate has taught me to suggest that the printer choice be based on quality and ease of use. The Epson small format printers have been used for years with moderately good results if used on a regular basis and cleaned when needed. Daily printing of squares of color suggested when not using for print jobs.
The Ricoh with auto-cleaning system has changed that need and has improved performance over the Epson small format and have larger capacity cartridges not requiring bulk systems for ink savings. It is important that you choose a printer which is supported with quality cartridges and ink. It is also important to note that in the U.S. and some other countries there are patents which are in effect which limit the types of ink offered and for which printers. The latest Ricoh small format printers which qualify are now sold under the SG label. Luck!


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

Ink Soup Jim said:


> Years of working with clients who sublimate has taught me to suggest that the printer choice be based on quality and ease of use. The Epson small format printers have been used for years with moderately good results if used on a regular basis and cleaned when needed. Daily printing of squares of color suggested when not using for print jobs.
> The Ricoh with auto-cleaning system has changed that need and has improved performance over the Epson small format and have larger capacity cartridges not requiring bulk systems for ink savings. It is important that you choose a printer which is supported with quality cartridges and ink. It is also important to note that in the U.S. and some other countries there are patents which are in effect which limit the types of ink offered and for which printers. The latest Ricoh small format printers which qualify are now sold under the SG label. Luck!


I would also offer that Epson now offers much larger carts (without a CIS) that are substantially larger than Ricoh offers, along with a new released *factory* bulk system.

The non CIS aftermarket cart for the _DESKTOP_ 676 XL are as large as 125 mL fill, so no CIS is needed.

Epson with the "Supertank" class are way way larger than any Ricoh model, so your information is dated. These are for small format printers.

As to the SG '907 patent it is expired, it is the one that was litigated in the past lawsuits. _please don't throw misinformation into this forum as you have a vested interest being you are a SG dealer._ 

Any new SG patents do not apply to _any_ Epson 3rd party vendor inks on the market as all these inks existed long before the newer patents were created.

And those later SG patents are for inks going into their private label Ricoh printers, and not even the original Ricoh models that SG supplied before the current private label models. 

A careful read of their newer patent reveals a method to make the inks able to be printed faster. _ This doesn't mean they have a patent on sublimation inks in general._ It is for a specific thing.

It is not needed to violate ANY SG patent to supply sublimation inks for Epson printers.

SG monopoly is done, get over it and compete fairly and stop scarring forum members with this nonsense.  No one today is forced into being gouged buying SG inks anymore costing nearly $2000 a liter.


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## GordonM (May 21, 2012)

mgparrish said:


> Since I really like refillable carts I'm going to get the carts I posted from the other vendor and just use the Cobra inks.


Mike, When you get these and have had a chance to try them out, please post your findings. I know many of us would like to try out this alternative.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

GordonM said:


> Mike, When you get these and have had a chance to try them out, please post your findings. I know many of us would like to try out this alternative.


Will do, I'm working along with the frequent reset PITA, I might be going to a larger format anyways.


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## api (Nov 22, 2009)

kimki1,

I am thinking about the EPSON T3270 printer. The Sawgrass Sublijet-E 700 ml ink cartridges are available for this printer and the PowerDriver software solves the ICC profile issue. 

Custom ICC profile also an option but my problem is that I would have to learn how to do it correctly and I would need a spectrophotometer. I can also order it (e.g. from Cobra) but I have to print a test image on MY substrate and send it to the company. (The ICC profile is created for my printer, my ink and my substrate.)

I don't want to deal with all this, that's why I am leaning toward the Sawgrass solution. The Sublijet-e is about $450/liter, the Cobra ink is about $200/liter. If the ICC profile and the prefilled ink cartridge would be available from Cobra I would stay with them. Not because of the price difference but because they are correct, nice people...


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

api said:


> kimki1,
> 
> I am thinking about the EPSON T3270 printer. The Sawgrass Sublijet-E 700 ml ink cartridges are available for this printer and the PowerDriver software solves the ICC profile issue.
> 
> ...


For the substantial ink cost savings it would quickly pay for itself to have a custom ICC made with these inks.

Dye Sublimation Ink Epson SureColor T-Series


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## kimki1 (Jun 8, 2015)

Thanks Mike for your help and pointing out/exposing the inherent bias in this last post. Kudos!


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## kimki1 (Jun 8, 2015)

Api, 

Thanks for the explanation. Good luck and let us know how it all works out for you. KiM


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## kimki1 (Jun 8, 2015)

mgparrish said:


> For the substantial ink cost savings it would quickly pay for itself to have a custom ICC made with these inks.
> 
> Dye Sublimation Ink Epson SureColor T-Series


Thanks Mike, I will ask Richard at Cobra for a custom ICC made with these inks.


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## api (Nov 22, 2009)

mgparrish said:


> For the substantial ink cost savings it would quickly pay for itself to have a custom ICC made with these inks.
> 
> Dye Sublimation Ink Epson SureColor T-Series


Are these inks as good as the Cobra, Sawgrass or J-teck?


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

api said:


> Are these inks as good as the Cobra, Sawgrass or J-teck?


I can't vogue for them personally. They don't appear to have profiles.


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## kimki1 (Jun 8, 2015)

Mike,
Another quick question, what paper do you use for sublimating your cups? I will be using Cobra sublimation inks, that has been decided. Thanks again for your assistance. 
Kim


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

kimki1 said:


> Mike,
> Another quick question, what paper do you use for sublimating your cups? I will be using Cobra sublimation inks, that has been decided. Thanks again for your assistance.
> Kim


I'm actually using a paper that was sold by Starline Pacific who is no longer in business. I believe it is just a private label version of a common paper that many vendors private label. 

For hard goods (except back printed glass) I would suggest you use "DyeTrans™ Multi-Purpose Ink Jet" as that is what Cobra offers, along with TexPrint HR for soft goods.

That DyeTrans brand is actually Conde Systems brand name so you can get it at Conde as well.

Coastal has a paper that is also supposed to work well too, but I haven't tried it.

I always recommend that one use what their ink supplier offers (if they offer) at least starting out as you don't want a paper variable to mess up your initial setup getting your color management dialed in. 

After tha,t once you know what you are doing then you can experiment with other papers.


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## kimki1 (Jun 8, 2015)

Thanks Mike for all your advise...Kim


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## Biverson (Oct 20, 2014)

I purchased a refurbed WF7110 from Epson last year and got Cobra's CIS and inks. It was working well at first. I used Beavers TexPrintHR paper but wasn't quite happy with how the black was turning out so I went with Beaver's high-tac paper. HUGE difference on apparel, especially socks. BUT I ran into a problem with the rollers picking up ink when the paper comes out. I had a little trouble with the regular TexprintHR, but more on the high-tac. If you look inside the printer end feed there are little metal rollers that help the paper come out. On full color designs it wasn't to much of an issue, but if there was any white in the design you'd see little track marks. I called Cobra and they said to lessen ink output in my profiles and couldn't offer much support beyond that. I tried everything and still encountered it. Got to the point where I went to take out the rollers and almost had it. Then I cut a cable which I thought was turning the gears - it wasn't. It was a sensor and now the machine gets a constant error on boot-up. :/

Anyone else have the ink pickup issue? I'd pick up another WF7110 but not if I can't print anything without taking up ink.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

Biverson said:


> I purchased a refurbed WF7110 from Epson last year and got Cobra's CIS and inks. It was working well at first. I used Beavers TexPrintHR paper but wasn't quite happy with how the black was turning out so I went with Beaver's high-tac paper. HUGE difference on apparel, especially socks. BUT I ran into a problem with the rollers picking up ink when the paper comes out. I had a little trouble with the regular TexprintHR, but more on the high-tac. If you look inside the printer end feed there are little metal rollers that help the paper come out. On full color designs it wasn't to much of an issue, but if there was any white in the design you'd see little track marks. I called Cobra and they said to lessen ink output in my profiles and couldn't offer much support beyond that. I tried everything and still encountered it. Got to the point where I went to take out the rollers and almost had it. Then I cut a cable which I thought was turning the gears - it wasn't. It was a sensor and now the machine gets a constant error on boot-up. :/
> 
> Anyone else have the ink pickup issue? I'd pick up another WF7110 but not if I can't print anything without taking up ink.


Cobra has a new black and new profiles. You were not the only one with that problem.

It's mentioned on their home page.

.:: Cobra Ink Systems::. This is where the term CIS began


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## Biverson (Oct 20, 2014)

mgparrish said:


> Cobra has a new black and new profiles. You were not the only one with that problem.
> 
> It's mentioned on their home page.
> 
> .:: Cobra Ink Systems::. This is where the term CIS began


I read that. If I remember for me it wasn't just the black it would pick up, but the red too. Most of what I used. I guess I'm still a little hesitant to drop money on the same printer and ink to experience the same thing. But if it's solved it for others is worth a shot?


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

Biverson said:


> I read that. If I remember for me it wasn't just the black it would pick up, but the red too. Most of what I used. I guess I'm still a little hesitant to drop money on the same printer and ink to experience the same thing. But if it's solved it for others is worth a shot?


Call Richard if you doubt it fixes the problem, the new black was not a random act on his part, it's for a reason 

The black is supposed to be denser so you shouldn't need to use the Premium Presentation Matte settings which lays down the ink real heavy. Your red shouldn't need any boost and is dense enough. Not having to use the Premium Presentation Matte setting should fix your pizza wheel problem,_ black or red._

Or the ICC may have been adjusted as well if the black was boosted, but I don't know if that happened.


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## Biverson (Oct 20, 2014)

mgparrish said:


> Call Richard if you doubt it fixes the problem, the new black was not a random act on his part, it's for a reason
> 
> The black is supposed to be denser so you shouldn't need to use the Premium Presentation Matte settings which lays down the ink real heavy. Your red shouldn't need any boost and is dense enough. Not having to use the Premium Presentation Matte setting should fix your pizza wheel problem,_ black or red._
> 
> Or the ICC may have been adjusted as well if the black was boosted, but I don't know if that happened.


I'll give him a call on Monday. I could never get the presentation matte to work for me and went with the Aluminum plate setting with color intent set to saturation. I can see that would prooooobably lay down a lot of ink, but was what I needed. I'd get yellowing with the matte.


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## Ink Soup Jim (Jan 24, 2013)

Wow, I should not take a few days off from visiting the forum. I was answering a question regarding Epson 7110 and the SG series. I do not dispute that other printers may have larger carts and I have no legal basis to comment on patents, however there is no end to opinions. Large format printers certainly have the advantage in liter usage and the prices are well under $200.00 per liter. There is sublimation ink offered from many, many sources, some which are very questionable in regards to quality profiling and support. The key in my mind to the success of sublimation printing and sales of imaged products is quality and support. Quality inks, paper and blank products along with good profiles will eliminate hours time and wasted product. Unlimited support from distribution of these product are invaluable to a startup and should be available to everyone. It is immensely unsatisfying to know that over 80% of trouble calls are from those who are led to purchase from the web by unscrupulous sites that offer great prices questionable quality products with no actual support. This forum is a great source of information, however a phone call or e-mail to your supplier should offer you immediate answers to the specific product you purchased from them.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

Ink Soup Jim said:


> Wow, I should not take a few days off from visiting the forum. I was answering a question regarding Epson 7110 and the SG series. I do not dispute that other printers may have larger carts and I have no legal basis to comment on patents, however there is no end to opinions. Large format printers certainly have the advantage in liter usage and the prices are well under $200.00 per liter. There is sublimation ink offered from many, many sources, some which are very questionable in regards to quality profiling and support. The key in my mind to the success of sublimation printing and sales of imaged products is quality and support. Quality inks, paper and blank products along with good profiles will eliminate hours time and wasted product. Unlimited support from distribution of these product are invaluable to a startup and should be available to everyone. It is immensely unsatisfying to know that over 80% of trouble calls are from those who are led to purchase from the web by unscrupulous sites that offer great prices questionable quality products with no actual support. This forum is a great source of information, however a phone call or e-mail to your supplier should offer you immediate answers to the specific product you purchased from them.


But there are ICC profiles and excellent support outside of Sawgrass. 

You are not a neutral party and have a vested interest in pitching Sawgrass $$$$$ ink. 

At minimum you should be ethical and disclaimer yourself since you are a vendor.

Since you admit you don't have a clue on patents I would suggest you not throw that out there then, especially when it looks like you want to spook others into thinking they are doing something wrong buying inks outside of Sawgrass. Sept 2014 has come and gone.

In 2016 no one needs to be raped by ink vendors anymore on the desktop, and many of us have ICC and support. Pointing to strawmen won't help your argument.


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## Ink Soup Jim (Jan 24, 2013)

Glad to here you are a believer of service and support. 
I personally do not hide anything. I am a dealer and if that is bad, OK. I don't know who you are and that is OK. I sell ink among a few thousand other items for screen printing, sublimation and digital printing. I support what I sell and I do not only sell SG inks. I offer information and ideas which I sometimes have time to share on the forums. Since you obviously are much more astute on all matters I will leave this forum for you to control with brash comments and insulting innuendos. Adios to you and best of luck to all forum members.
Best Regards,

Jim


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