# Stainless Steel Travel Mug Fail Xmas present



## jstreifel (Dec 22, 2015)

I bought my wife a "all in one" heat press and she has been getting orders in left and right. Well just before Christmas, she got an order to make some travel mugs with the marine corp logo. So I bought a Epson WF3640, a CIS from inkpro.com, and some sublimation ink (links below). 

I got the printer out, hooked up the CIS, put in the ink, printed the logo on the special paper, and pressed it for 2 1/2 min at 360 degrees F. We were so excited, only to see that it DIDNT WORK! Super bummed out and not looking forward to telling the client we cannot fulfill her order and that one of the mugs she bought is "brownish".

The best way I can describe it is it looks like a negative off the image we intended to print. When the mug had cooled down, I was able to wipe off the faint negative that was produced after the heat pressing.

Picture below of the mug right after it cooled down and paper was removed.

Not sure if its the ink, the time/temp, or the paper that is causing this to not work. I don't want to let someone down this Christmas if possible. Please help!!

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1Ze8YZvRIOxRWpEQVlac3ByYTg/view?usp=sharing


heat press
http://www.amazon.com/T-shirt-Digital-Machine-Transfer-Sublimation/dp/B00O3EL1HK/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1450761446&sr=8-2&keywords=heat+press+mug+press


sublimation ink
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B014KAJDSK?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00]Amazon.com: OfficeWorld 500ml Sublimation Ink for Epson wf7110 wf3640 xp-420 410 c88: Electronics


sublimation transfer paper

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00LH8D5HE?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00]Amazon.com : CISinksTM A4 Sublimation Ink Transfer Paper Heat Press (50 sheets) For Inkjet Printer 8.25" x 11.75" : Office Products


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## Bigbadjon (Dec 15, 2015)

I'm a total newbie and still just learning this stuff, but can I just ask if the blank mugs were poly coated? Im just as curious as to why this might have happened. Hope you get it worked out


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## hawaiianphatboy (Apr 28, 2008)

I am also pretty new to sublimation, and I did not look at your posted pics. However, I would think that 2.5 minutes at 375 degrees would be to cool and to short of a dwell time. I have done some plastic phone cases, and that took me almost 9 minutes in a press at about 400 degrees. I would try to up your heat and extend your cook time and see what happens. Good luck and Aloha


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## jstreifel (Dec 22, 2015)

I appreciate the responses!

Not sure if it has a poly coat or not. It is one of those 20 oz YETI mugs. They are so popular, every store in Columbus Ohio is sold out of them.

As far as time and temp goes - the recommendation on the paper we bought, says temp between 350 and 375. Time says 90 to 180 seconds. I would be willing to go longer but it's kinda scary when we notice the paper turning brown like it's going to catch on fire...

Anyone else out there with some advice?

I desperately need to find a solution or we are going to let some marines down this Christmas :/


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## jfisk3475 (Jan 28, 2011)

jstreifel said:


> I appreciate the responses!
> 
> Not sure if it has a poly coat or not. It is one of those 20 oz YETI mugs. They are so popular, every store in Columbus Ohio is sold out of them.
> 
> ...


I dont think they are poly coat. Take them to a powder coat company and see if they can add a clear power coat. We get coating done locally.

Sent from my SM-G900T using T-Shirt Forums


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## Mtnview (Nov 5, 2009)

jstreifel said:


> I bought my wife a "all in one" heat press and she has been getting orders in left and right. Well just before Christmas, she got an order to make some travel mugs with the marine corp logo. So I bought a Epson WF3640, a CIS from inkpro.com, and some sublimation ink (links below).
> 
> I got the printer out, hooked up the CIS, put in the ink, printed the logo on the special paper, and pressed it for 2 1/2 min at 360 degrees F. We were so excited, only to see that it DIDNT WORK! Super bummed out and not looking forward to telling the client we cannot fulfill her order and that one of the mugs she bought is "brownish".


Let me get this straight. You tried printing on a customer supplied product without looking into whether or not it was made for sublimation? We normally get customers to sign off on a form acknowledging we are not responsible for any products they bring to us that are damaged in the decoration process. This however sounds like you will need to replace the customer's mug as it sounds like you didn't do your due diligence in what can and can't be sublimated.



jstreifel said:


> Not sure if it has a poly coat or not. It is one of those 20 oz YETI mugs. They are so popular, every store in Columbus Ohio is sold out of them.



I would be willing to bet it is not coated for sublimation. Did you check with YETI before trying to print it? I don't do sublimation but I know you don't just put any product in a press and sublimate it. You may not be looking forward to telling the customer you can't fulfill the order but from reading your initial post on this it sounds like you unpacked the printer, loaded the ink and tried to print a custom job right out of the box. I practiced on my own product when I first started to get things right. I didn't use a customer's product without being familiar with my equipment.


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## mfatty500 (Jan 18, 2010)

What John said, just to lazy to type all of that!


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## jstreifel (Dec 22, 2015)

Mtnview said:


> Let me get this straight. You tried printing on a customer supplied product without looking into whether or not it was made for sublimation? We normally get customers to sign off on a form acknowledging we are not responsible for any products they bring to us that are damaged in the decoration process. This however sounds like you will need to replace the customer's mug as it sounds like you didn't do your due diligence in what can and can't be sublimated.


You got it straight! We are totally new to all of this. In fact this was our first order for sublimation. I don't know what I don't know...ya know?  I haven't read anything anywhere that says on certain things are able to receive sublimation ink. The sublimation paper says it works on all sorts of stuff, not exclusively materials that are able to receive sublimation ink. Oh well, it's a $30 lesson...

Thanks again for the good feedback.

Happy holidays to everyone!


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## mfatty500 (Jan 18, 2010)

Who ever sold you the printer should have explained all the important stuff stuff to you, I would think.....but now you know, good luck to you


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## jstreifel (Dec 22, 2015)

mfatty500 said:


> Who ever sold you the printer should have explained all the important stuff stuff to you, I would think.....but now you know, good luck to you


I'm not an idiot... Lol I dont expect the printer to "explain all the important stuff" but I would have expected the paper or the ink to be a little more specific about what they work with, just like they give suggested heat temp and times for different items. Now that I think about it, why DONT they say it is ONLY compatible with items that are made for sublimation? (Don't answer that, I'm just venting) 

Like I said before, I don't know what I don't know and none of the items I purchased mentioned anything about what "wouldn't" work. The sublimation paper said it works on ceramic mugs, travel mugs, t shirts... Etc.. It didn't say that they need to be special "sublimation" type of mug/tshirt/hat/etc...

I'm sure at one point in your life, you "assumed" something and then realized you were wrong and learned from your mistake.

I understand now what I should have done and having the client sign something that relieves me of any responsibility if things go wrong on an item they supplied.

Again, that is for all the "constructive" feedback! 

Happy holidays!


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## deehoney (Dec 16, 2010)

There is this dyepress gloss that you can apply to the yeti mugs so they accept the dye sub. You have to apply the dyepress first. You can google dyepress for more info.


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## jennGO (Mar 11, 2014)

I think everyone covered the procedural issues but I was just going to add that I wouldn't tell a customer the mug didn't turn out well (unless you know them personally) just tell them that the mug sold out before they ordered and you won't be able to fulfill it...just sounds better I think.


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## Bugmeister (Dec 6, 2015)

jennGO said:


> I think everyone covered the procedural issues but I was just going to add that I wouldn't tell a customer the mug didn't turn out well (unless you know them personally) just tell them that the mug sold out before they ordered and you won't be able to fulfill it...just sounds better I think.


That would work if the customer doesn't supply the mugs, unfortunately that was part of the problem in this situation!

On the bright side, one doesn't have successes without failures, and if we learn lots from our failures we have a better chance of more successes.


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## floridabruce (Nov 14, 2010)

It is true that products have to be dye sub friendly. Dye sub blanks are coated with a special coating to accept the ink. That's the answer in a nutshell. God bless...


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## ParrotPrinting (Feb 23, 2015)

Dee is correct about the DyePress liquid.....I have some ....it doesn't work worth a darn on T-Shirts but honestly I havn't tried it on hard substrates yet however, after you coat the hard substrate it must be "cooked" into the product.....wouldn't recommend it for someone as new as the OP


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## jstreifel (Dec 22, 2015)

Thank you for all the helpful feedback! I was just about to buy some depress liquid but now that you mention it not good for a novice like me, I'm just going to turn the mugs back to the client and move on.


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## mfatty500 (Jan 18, 2010)

I was not calling you an idiot, I was saying that whoever sold you the equipment should have clued you in a bit better, if your not making any mistakes, you're not learning.


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## jfisk3475 (Jan 28, 2011)

jstreifel said:


> Thank you for all the helpful feedback! I was just about to buy some depress liquid but now that you mention it not good for a novice like me, I'm just going to turn the mugs back to the client and move on.


Like I said earlier, find a power coated locally and have them clear coat. It's not that much and you can make your customer happy. 

Sent from my SM-G900T using T-Shirt Forums


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## AngelicEndeavour (Aug 12, 2013)

Can anyone tell me how to find someone that will coat items? I see it's been called "powder" coating and "power" coating -- which is correct? (Damn auto-correct on our devices! LOL!) What would I Google to find someone locally? This is good information, as I want to sub canisters, and the few sources I can find online say they're out of stock until 3/1/16. I will also Google how to coat them myself.

I am new to dye sub too, but I read this forum EVERYDAY. The info that can learned here is tremendous. I also search for information of specific topics that I have questions about, in anticipation of doing something new. I don't think you can expect a manufacturer to specifically state on the transfer paper packaging, that it'll only work on items specifically intended for sublimation. As a newbie, it falls on you to research the parameters of what you can dye sub on and not; there will be enough challenges ahead, even if you get that all right! You need to know what fabrics will work, and which won't too. I did all the reading ahead of time and have been testing different substrates as gifts for Christmas. Each different type of substrate has its own challenges. The easiest so far is aluminum flat ornaments. Porcelain ornaments are not exactly flat, so therein lies the challenge, etc. I would take the time to test and press, press and press some more before taking orders! At least that's what I'm doing. I have been told 100 times to open a shop on Etsy and at some point, when I feel confident in my skills, I will. But right now I'm just enjoying testing new types of substrates. Next will be bottles, cups and bowls.

If I could also offer caution about taking orders with the customer supplying the substrate... Don't do it. First, if you goof up, the customer will know bc you've used more of the item than what was ordered; you may end up short of the item as a result. When you supply the substrate, you can order extra to make sure you'll have enough if an error occurs. Your reputation is then safe. Second, don't forget that you'll be missing a part of your profit on the job bc you're giving up the mark-up on the item, and that can be a lot!


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## jfisk3475 (Jan 28, 2011)

jfisk3475 said:


> Like I said earlier, find a power coated locally and have them clear coat. It's not that much and you can make your customer happy.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900T using T-Shirt Forums


Powder coat. Google powder coating and your zip code. 

Sent from my SM-G900T using T-Shirt Forums


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## jfisk3475 (Jan 28, 2011)

jfisk3475 said:


> Like I said earlier, find a power coated locally and have them clear coat. It's not that much and you can make your customer happy.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900T using T-Shirt Forums


If you want to powder coat you will need a convection oven and a powder coat kit. Find one on JC witney. You can use a small counter top for smalls but if you go big you'll need a full size. Do not use the one you cook in. There are DIY videos online. Not hard just time. 

Sent from my SM-G900T using T-Shirt Forums


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## AngelicEndeavour (Aug 12, 2013)

jfisk3475 said:


> Powder coat. Google powder coating and your zip code.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900T using T-Shirt Forums


Thank you!! Will do!!! Is it the same "powder coating" that is done to car parts to stand up to heat and rust?


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## Bugmeister (Dec 6, 2015)

Yes, the same powder coating. You can buy powder coating kits from Eastwood and other suppliers and these are the ones used by auto hobby enthusiasts to powder coat car parts. The kit is unlikely to have the coatings that you need, though, and doing the coating in a small oven likely wouldn't be practical if you have a quantity of items to do and the setup cost probably won't make sense for limited items. I can't stress enough - don't use your food preparation oven for this!!!

Check your area for powder coating companies and talk to them to see if they can provide the service you need at a reasonable price.

I've noticed some comments from more experienced people suggesting a written understanding with the customer who provides their own substrates, and incorporating a 2% spoilage allowance to account for the inevitable problems. My sense overall is that avoiding customer supplied substrates is a lot smarter, as you give up control over quality, suitability and experience with the material. If things go wrong, the customer won't blame the material, they blame whoever applied the image!


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## mfatty500 (Jan 18, 2010)

By the time it takes you track the proper poly coating that is required for sublimation, having it shipped and the labor of applying(and hoping that you apply it properly) you could have bought the substrates already coated, and printed and collect your money. Why are you making harder than it should be? Work smarter, not harder..just my 2.5 cents worth..


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## jfisk3475 (Jan 28, 2011)

mfatty500 said:


> By the time it takes you track the proper poly coating that is required for sublimation, having it shipped and the labor of applying(and hoping that you apply it properly) you could have bought the substrates already coated, and printed and collect your money. Why are you making harder than it should be? Work smarter, not harder..just my 2.5 cents
> O
> All powder coat is polyester. You can sublimate to it. It's not complicated. Find a powder coat company close to you.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900T using T-Shirt Forums


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## Gabby1218 (Dec 27, 2015)

Hi. I am also new to sublimation. In fact I haven't even received my equipment yet. Lol. But, I did find a ton of useful videos on youtube on how to sublimate on a bunch of different items. Also the steps on how to coat stainless steel, glass, ceramics, even cotton fabric to be able to sublimate it. Check them out. It's very helpful.


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## veetwincowboy (Mar 14, 2015)

Google LRI i think they are in Chicago, i have bought mugs and tiles from them. They coat as well. But a google search of polymer sublimation coatings will show you more alternatives. There is also a company on the internet selling a spray can polymer coating for sublimation. Good luck.


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## deehoney (Dec 16, 2010)

I'm not sure if I can share the link, but I belong to a great Facebook group that is all about sublimation, OKI, and dypress. In this group, someone had used dypress for his Yeti mug and it had come out great. The group is great for beginners, advanced, etc.


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## ParrotPrinting (Feb 23, 2015)

I use spy hunter and reg hunter and they seem to do a good job for me


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## AngelicEndeavour (Aug 12, 2013)

jfisk3475 said:


> Powder coat. Google powder coating and your zip code.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900T using T-Shirt Forums


Thanks so much! 👍🏻


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## freeblazer (Sep 25, 2009)

I'm not sure you can powder coat a Yeti. I think the the powder is baked onto the item. I would think it would melt the Yeti liner. It would need to be done before it is assembled. You would have to find a spray on , air dry to work. Most Yeti, I have seen, are laser engraved using cermark , to make the image black . You might also be able to do UV ink.


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## MungoLarry (Jan 10, 2016)

Good question.


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## jfisk3475 (Jan 28, 2011)

freeblazer said:


> I'm not sure you can powder coat a Yeti. I think the the powder is baked onto the item. I would think it would melt the Yeti liner. It would need to be done before it is assembled. You would have to find a spray on , air dry to work. Most Yeti, I have seen, are laser engraved using cermark , to make the image black . You might also be able to do UV ink.


If he was able to attempt dye sub on the first one and no damage the it can be coated. Oven temp is 400 to coat. 

Sent from my SM-G900T using T-Shirt Forums


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## KPD156 (Feb 23, 2017)

The Yeti and all other tumblers can be safely powder coated. I have coated hundreds of them and they are fine.


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