# Best 2 head entry level machine? Why?



## 3Wide (Nov 23, 2012)

I have been bouncing around on this forum talking to you folks about everything from pricing to digitizing and you all have helped me immensely.

Next step, entry level commercial embroidery machine. I have had many advise me towards and away from this type of machine but I am still thinking that as a start up machine a two head is my best bet. If you all were going to start from scratch again and were going to purchase a two head machine which one would you choose? From who? How many needles? How many accessories? New or certified used? Training?

I know it is a lot of questions but when you are a newbie you must ask many question and hope for patience from your peers.


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## lizziemaxine (Nov 14, 2007)

I have a Barudan single head, 15 needle machine. If I had room I would trade my single head for a two head Barudan, 15 needle machine. Accessories I can't/won't live without are my Hoopmaster and my Mighty Hoops.


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## 3Wide (Nov 23, 2012)

Thanks for your reply. This must not be a topic that people want to weigh in on.


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## Don-ColDesi (Oct 18, 2006)

Hi 3wide,

Based on pricing of commercial embroidery machines I would suggest that you start with a single head standard machine and then let the business tell you when you need to expand and to what level. Some companies will give you a guaranteed trade-in on a single head for up to 5 years out so you would be taking a calculated investment risk by purchasing a single head first. From my experience the main reason folks by a two head is space. A 4 head machine is generally only about 30-40% more expensive than a two head and is twice as productive.

Another factor to consider is that you generally need a single head machine to do samples/sew outs as well as customization (name drops). 

If you would like to have a more in depth conversation regarding your specific situation you can PM me and I can share with you the options that we offer.

Hope this helps,


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## selzler (Apr 4, 2007)

I started with a single head machine. I now have 3 running I don't know if I'll ever buy a machine with more heads. I get so many small orders and this way I can run more then one order at one time or set up all 3 for the same job.


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## Don-ColDesi (Oct 18, 2006)

I hear you Pat, however a 4 head costs less than 3 single heads and a 6 head costs less than 4 single heads. You can get 33-50% more productivity for the same or less money when you start to look at 4 & 6 head machines. It really depends on your business model. 4 heads will do more than 3 heads any day unless your model is for very small or even one off products.


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## 3Wide (Nov 23, 2012)

Don-ColDesi said:


> Hi 3wide,
> 
> Based on pricing of commercial embroidery machines I would suggest that you start with a single head standard machine and then let the business tell you when you need to expand and to what level. Some companies will give you a guaranteed trade-in on a single head for up to 5 years out so you would be taking a calculated investment risk by purchasing a single head first. From my experience the main reason folks by a two head is space. A 4 head machine is generally only about 30-40% more expensive than a two head and is twice as productive.
> 
> ...


Excellent. This is the kind of advice I was looking for and will definately be in touch to visit further. Thanks much.


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## selanac (Jan 8, 2007)

This really doesn't answer what machines is the best. You need to determine what qualifies you question. Speed, cost, customer service, digitizing, text only, how long will it take a technician to get to you? 

A four head machine may cost less then four single heads, but do you have $50,000 to layout? Do you have enough production coming in to pay for it? Can you Sell? Will your spouse kill you for spending that money? Lol. 

SWF has very good machines, technical support and training. However, they don't teach you about the business. You can't just come on this forum and say, how can I grow my business.


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## 3Wide (Nov 23, 2012)

selanac said:


> This really doesn't answer what machines is the best. You need to determine what qualifies you question. Speed, cost, customer service, digitizing, text only, how long will it take a technician to get to you?
> 
> A four head machine may cost less then four single heads, but do you have $50,000 to layout? Do you have enough production coming in to pay for it? Can you Sell? Will your spouse kill you for spending that money? Lol.
> 
> SWF has very good machines, technical support and training. However, they don't teach you about the business. You can't just come on this forum and say, how can I grow my business.


You are right it doesn't but I am hoping we will be headed in that direction..
Point taken on the "how can I grow my business" comment but in previous posts I have chatted at length with many fine folks on this forum and have answered in my own mind many of the questions you posed. Especially digitizing, that baby went on for several pages, but I digress.... I am getting to the point where in order to get started I am looking for input on what people in the industry use and why.

Thanks for taking time to respond, I do appreciate it.


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## selanac (Jan 8, 2007)

It really doesn't matter what they use. It matters what you can afford. If people use a 4 head machine because it gets the job done, that only works for them. If you can't afford that you'll be wasting your time.

If you lease or buy on Time, you'll have to be able to make the payments. Selling isn't something you pick up right away. It takes time. Have you been selling embroidery products in the past? Do you know how to go out and get customers? Can you afford to advertise to bring in enough to make the payments and a salary?

Just trying to help you make the right decision, keeping in mind what you need to do to survive.


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## league33 (Jun 30, 2012)

I started with a 4 head SWF. After 6 months of unresolved problems with that machine and SWF unwilling to replace it, SWF picked it up. I then bought a single head and two head Tajima. Best thing I ever did. For my business flow, I am able to sew two different jobs at the same time. The support from Tajima is great. I would only buy a four head if I was doing volume work. I most shirts I have sewn at one time was 700. I am not sure if a Tajima is considered an entry level machine, but if you can afford it. You will not be sorry.


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## selanac (Jan 8, 2007)

That's correct Susan. None of these machines mentioned are Entry Level.


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## 3Wide (Nov 23, 2012)

selanac said:


> It really doesn't matter what they use. It matters what you can afford. If people use a 4 head machine because it gets the job done, that only works for them. If you can't afford that you'll be wasting your time.
> 
> If you lease or buy on Time, you'll have to be able to make the payments. Selling isn't something you pick up right away. It takes time. Have you been selling embroidery products in the past? Do you know how to go out and get customers? Can you afford to advertise to bring in enough to make the payments and a salary?
> 
> Just trying to help you make the right decision, keeping in mind what you need to do to survive.


I appreciate that, but yes I believe it does matter. Trust me, I have been in the graphics business for several years and if I could go back to the start there are a few pieces of equipment I would change. I have done the numbers, I have a budget set for a machine. I just want to know who likes what and why.


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## 3Wide (Nov 23, 2012)

league33 said:


> I started with a 4 head SWF. After 6 months of unresolved problems with that machine and SWF unwilling to replace it, SWF picked it up. I then bought a single head and two head Tajima. Best thing I ever did. For my business flow, I am able to sew two different jobs at the same time. The support from Tajima is great. I would only buy a four head if I was doing volume work. I most shirts I have sewn at one time was 700. I am not sure if a Tajima is considered an entry level machine, but if you can afford it. You will not be sorry.


Thanks much, I appreciate your help.


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## Don-ColDesi (Oct 18, 2006)

selanac said:


> This really doesn't answer what machines is the best. You need to determine what qualifies you question. Speed, cost, customer service, digitizing, text only, how long will it take a technician to get to you?
> 
> A four head machine may cost less then four single heads, but do you have $50,000 to layout? Do you have enough production coming in to pay for it? Can you Sell? Will your spouse kill you for spending that money? Lol.
> 
> SWF has very good machines, technical support and training. However, they don't teach you about the business. You can't just come on this forum and say, how can I grow my business.


Thanks for the kind words about our machines, service & training. Your estimate on the price of a 4 head is about $18,000 high however.


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## selanac (Jan 8, 2007)

Don, $32,000 is still very high for a guy asking for an entry level. What I'm trying to explain to him is that he still has to get customers to make the payment.


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## Stitches (Oct 2, 2006)

When we started our business from the ground up, we bought a brand new 4 head 15 color Tajima. We got a loan and paid it off in three years. It is worth every penny we spent. As far as entry level goes you should be thinking outside the box. You will out grow an entry level machine and wish like hell that you had gone with the commercial grade right off. Granted more money for one but in the long run it will be a savings. As far as how many heads you want to purchase, that is all up to you. But you must consider that it will take longer to run jobs with a single head as opposed to running on a two, four, six, etc. Lets say you get that 144 piece job and it takes 10min to sew the logo. On a single it will take about 24hrs of sewing time. A two head will take 12hrs a four head will take 6hrs. This doesn't include loading, unloading, thread breaks, and replacing the bobbins. You can see the benefit of a mutli head machine. Another thing to look at is support. This is very important when your machine breaks. You need to know if somebody on the other end of the phone can walk you through a problem or if they can get someone to you in a timely manner to fix your machine. Every day that it is down, you are losing money. Hopefully this may help you in making a decision in purchasing an embroidery machine. Oh, in case I didn't mention it I would go with the Tajima.


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## Don-ColDesi (Oct 18, 2006)

selanac said:


> Don, $32,000 is still very high for a guy asking for an entry level. What I'm trying to explain to him is that he still has to get customers to make the payment.


I hear you Paul. Please note that I am not trying to advise anyone to start off with a 4 head if they do not already have work (or experience). I just wanted to clarify pricing a bit. ColDesi offers a 100% trade-up from a single head to a multi-head for a full year. That gives the end user a chance to "test the waters" and determine exactly what their volume will be. 

Stitches - no doubt that Tajima is a good brand, it is just a decision of what you want to pay for a machine. Based on my knowledge of pricing you could have paid a 4 head SWF off about 8-9 months earlier or paid off a six head in the same amount of time. It is a matter of value for the dollar.


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