# How fast do you run your embroidery machine?



## thutch15

I have a Toyota 9100 that says it will run 1200 spm. My question is should I max it out? Also, what are the deciding factors as to how fast to run my machine. I have been running everything at 750 spm, but I hate that speed knowing the machine will go almost twice that rate. Thanks Troy


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## wcatembroidery

I change my speed based on what I am embroidering on. I too run my machine much slower than max (I run caps somewhere around 630 and flats around 730 - sometimes I slow it down even more). My tech that trained me recommended those speeds to increase the life of the machine although he told me I could go much faster. I can spare a couple extra minutes to keep parts from wearing faster.


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## thutch15

OK that makes sense...I just dont understand why they would create the machine that would go 1200 spm if they say to just run them in the 700 range. It is like having a car that will go 150mph, but the speed limit is only 70.


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## Liberty

Experiment a little with the speed. Don't be concerned about wearing out the machine. If you keep it properly oiled, especially the hook, it will be fine. Remember, the hook is turning at twice the stitch rate so at 1200 SPM, the hook is turning at 2400. Hook oiling is crucial, no matter what speed.

Also, do a little playing around. Setup a sample design with satin stitches of various widths. Something like a 1MM column that becomes 1.5 then 2.0 then 2.5 etc. Listen to the machine run this at 1200 and I'd be willing to bet the machine slows down as the stitches get longer. So in effect, at 1200SPM, on most design it is running much slower. I know our older Toyota 850's did that and so did our melcos and even the newer Tajimas.

Seriously, if your design is right and your substrate properly hooped, most times you can let it rip all out.

Think about this, if you run the machine at 1200, even if it slows itself to 900 on most designs, you are running it 20% faster than at 750. 20% more throughput, 20% more revenue. Over the course of 5 years that's a lot of money... at the very least, you should experiment with it.


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## thutch15

Liberty said:


> Experiment a little with the speed. Don't be concerned about wearing out the machine. If you keep it properly oiled, especially the hook, it will be fine. Remember, the hook is turning at twice the stitch rate so at 1200 SPM, the hook is turning at 2400. Hook oiling is crucial, no matter what speed.
> 
> Also, do a little playing around. Setup a sample design with satin stitches of various widths. Something like a 1MM column that becomes 1.5 then 2.0 then 2.5 etc. Listen to the machine run this at 1200 and I'd be willing to bet the machine slows down as the stitches get longer. So in effect, at 1200SPM, on most design it is running much slower. I know our older Toyota 850's did that and so did our melcos and even the newer Tajimas.
> 
> Seriously, if your design is right and your substrate properly hooped, most times you can let it rip all out.
> 
> Think about this, if you run the machine at 1200, even if it slows itself to 900 on most designs, you are running it 20% faster than at 750. 20% more throughput, 20% more revenue. Over the course of 5 years that's a lot of money... at the very least, you should experiment with it.


Yeah you are right about it adjusting speed. I have seen as it sews even if it is set at 750 it runs at a range.

Thanks


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## skits

750 on all jobs unless the design is small enough that the round finishes on the machine but the next round is not yet framed.....in this case no need running it fast....


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## thutch15

skits said:


> 750 on all jobs unless the design is small enough that the round finishes on the machine but the next round is not yet framed.....in this case no need running it fast....


Thanks skits...why is 750 the magic number?


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## skits

ha ha Ive always run my machines on 750 even after I got new machines which are capable of running upto 1000 but I just feel that my machine's like a car....if you accelerate too much you're wearing it off quicker.....

I run my cap machine at 550 though.... if i speed up a little i start to feel the table shaking too much so I leave it at 550. I think its a good speed for caps to get good registration of design.....


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## LUV DEM TIGERS

I run my Tajima NEO 2 at 900 on flats and 800 on caps. KEEP IT OILED and you are fine.


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## skits

LUV DEM TIGERS said:


> I run my Tajima NEO 2 at 900 on flats and 800 on caps. KEEP IT OILED and you are fine.


do you get accurate registration on outlines on caps at 800?


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## Liberty

How would machine speed effect registration on caps? If it is hooped right and the design is digitized correctly it should not be an issue? I'll be the first to admit that we almost never use our 270 degree frames and part of the reason was inconsistency. With the HoopTech frames we just let them run pretty much flat out, unless like you mentioned we just can't keep them hooped fast enough for the small designs. Even then, we will try to assist with the hooping to keep the machine running. Nothing in the back end is earning money if the needles are not going up and down so if we have to, we'll have two hoopers on one run.


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## Liberty

All this talk about machine speed... I can open the door from my office to the back storage and I can hear the machines running. Right now we're running a 200,000 stitch design on poly fleece and I can tell from my desk she has it running at 1200... purrrrring like a money making kitten... on the smaller machine she's running hats and it too is running well above 750, probably close to 1000 and that may be the machine slowed down for the longer satin stitches in the design.


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## tfalk

You will eventually find out that by running your machine at higher speeds, you get more thread breaks. My 2 Brother PR600's like running at 700-800. My SWF seems to like 750 for tubular items and 600 for hats, above those numbers we get more thread breaks and cases where the thread pulls out when first starting after a cut. The extra speed is more than offset by the time it takes to fix a thread cut.


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## thutch15

Liberty said:


> purrrrring like a money making kitten...


haha...well I am ready for that.


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## lizziemaxine

I run my Barudan at 950 most of the time with no problems.


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## designconcepts

800 at the fastest......usually 650-750.......if one isn't bogged down with work why rush it? If it isn't any harder on the machine to run it at 1000+, then perhaps we should fly down the road in the car at 120mph or maybe forget about shifting up out of 3rd gear....after all, most vehicles have 120mph on the speedometer. 
Just kidding....but I do prefer to keep it below the 800 mark.


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## AndTees

In my experience, the pantograph is what limits the speed for my machine/patterns. No mater what I set the speed, most designs run slow enough to allow the work to move to the next stitch while the head is capable of much more. A few stitch types will go up to the machine limit but the 790 or so I normally run is adequate.


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## LUV DEM TIGERS

designconcepts said:


> If it isn't any harder on the machine to run it at 1000+, then perhaps we should fly down the road in the car at 120mph or maybe forget about shifting up out of 3rd gear....after all, most vehicles have 120mph on the speedometer.



The BIG difference is that you are talking about an electrically powered piece of equipment that generates relatively little heat and in internal combustion engine that generates a lot of heat.


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## LUV DEM TIGERS

tfalk said:


> You will eventually find out that by running your machine at higher speeds, you get more thread breaks. we get more thread breaks and cases where the thread pulls out when first starting after a cut.


On an industrial machine (at least on my Tajima, so I assume you can with others) you can set the thread break sensor to run "x" amount of stitches before the thread break sensor goes off. I changes mine to "10" and it reduced the thread pull outs greatly. 

On the PR-600 and such, they use flat shank so it is a no-brainer to get the needle in correctly, but on an industrial they use round shank. If you get the needle in "perfectly", have a good digitized design and keep it cleaned and oiled, you will not have a lot of thread breaks regardless of the speed.


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## thutch15

LUV DEM TIGERS said:


> On an industrial machine (at least on my Tajima, so I assume you can with others) you can set the thread break sensor to run "x" amount of stitches before the thread break sensor goes off. I changes mine to "10" and it reduced the thread pull outs greatly.
> 
> On the PR-600 and such, they use flat shank so it is a no-brainer to get the needle in correctly, but on an industrial they use round shank. If you get the needle in "perfectly", have a good digitized design and keep it cleaned and oiled, you will not have a lot of thread breaks regardless of the speed.


What is the normal setting...did you increase or decrease to get to 10 on the stitches after thread break. Also can you explain the reasoning. Is it do to the fact that it maybe misses the first 5 stitches, but with it running up to 10 there are more chances for it to catch?


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## LUV DEM TIGERS

thutch15 said:


> What is the normal setting...did you increase or decrease to get to 10 on the stitches after thread break. Also can you explain the reasoning. Is it do to the fact that it maybe misses the first 5 stitches, but with it running up to 10 there are more chances for it to catch?



I think the default on mine was 3. I am not an expert, but lot of times if you have short stitches, the amount of thread used on the first few stitches are not enough to really get the thread sensor wheel to turn so it detects a thread break even though it isn't. So if you set it for "10", you will have 10 up and down motions on your needle before your machine determines whether their is a thread break (which is really just the bobbin not catching the thread). Try changing it and see if you "false" thread breaks on starts don't decrease.


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## Flint54

We run our Tajima 4 head at 700-900 depending upon the design, small stitches or large satin lower speeds, hats @500-900 depending on style, backing, design structure etc.. This keeps the pantograph from real abrupt movement. Our 1 & 2 head machines we keep usually no higher than 1050. We have found that these are the best speeds for our needs. Why run at max warp when a steady cruise will get you there with less noise etc. No need to max everything out. What speed do you use when giving a customer an estimate on a large order?


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## LUV DEM TIGERS

I just got through doing 125 caps, 4400 stitches in each, 3 colors, two of those being metallic and ran it at 950 spm. That baby was humming. NOT A SINGLE THREAD BREAK. The only stoppage was cap changes and bobbin changes.


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## NateKerra

LUV DEM TIGERS said:


> I just got through doing 125 caps, 4400 stitches in each, 3 colors, two of those being metallic and ran it at 950 spm. That baby was humming. NOT A SINGLE THREAD BREAK. The only stoppage was cap changes and bobbin changes.


that's right, I run mine up to 800 spm and it works fine just that I run out of string faster, I like it at that speed I don't go below 600 spm though.


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## LUV DEM TIGERS

I did another 125 caps of the same design with two colors being METALLIC and I turned it up to 1000 SPM. Not a single thread break. Just cap and bobbin changes.


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## vctradingcubao

good for you craig. The faster you finish, the faster you earn anyway.
We run our machines at usually at 800 rpm. The single heads, usually at 850 to 900.
An older 20 head machine, we usually run at 600 rpm only.


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## Liberty

What machine? Most of the machines automatically limit the speed when the cap driver is installed so even though it is set at 1000, is it running at 1000? I'm all for running them as fast as the conditions permit though - way to go.



LUV DEM TIGERS said:


> I did another 125 caps of the same design with two colors being METALLIC and I turned it up to 1000 SPM. Not a single thread break. Just cap and bobbin changes.


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## LUV DEM TIGERS

Liberty said:


> What machine? Most of the machines automatically limit the speed when the cap driver is installed so even though it is set at 1000, is it running at 1000? I'm all for running them as fast as the conditions permit though - way to go.



Tajima Neo-2. I don't set it on the caps settings. I set the machine for flats, install the cap driver, and just rotate my image 180 degrees. I don't know if that affects anything, but that is what I do.


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## Liberty

Not certain about the neos but on our tajimas, it knows when we install the cap drivers. Our Melco EMT's did also. If it is working for you don;t change a thing. Let em fly...

Even when the new machines are set at 1200, they rarely run that fast, slowing for the longer stitches.


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## vctradingcubao

LUV DEM TIGERS said:


> Tajima Neo-2. I don't set it on the caps settings. I set the machine for flats, install the cap driver, and just rotate my image 180 degrees. I don't know if that affects anything, but that is what I do.


Love those Neos. We started with the Neo-1 and now we have 5 of them. Yes, they are very efficient and runs without threadbreaks most of the time. I love them more than our TFMXs'. Can't help but doubt that they are technically Toyotas'.


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## LUV DEM TIGERS

Liberty said:


> Not certain about the neos but on our tajimas, it knows when we install the cap drivers. Our Melco EMT's did also. If it is working for you don;t change a thing. Let em fly...
> 
> Even when the new machines are set at 1200, they rarely run that fast, slowing for the longer stitches.


On my Neo-2, I can set the screen to show either what number stitch the machine is on or the number of stitches per minute. When I set it on 900 or 1000 I can here the machine if it changes speed and it will also show the SPM decrease on the readout, and when I was doing 1000 SPM, it NEVER changed. They were all fill stitches.


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## v8supersurf

Running Happy Six heads and we run at max which is 920 flat and 800 Caps (set for this when caps selected).
Machine automatically slows down depending on stitch length and type. (As said before, the pentagram cannot move fast enough for long stitches and the machine will slow down to suit. 
If we find we are getting looping, pulling, thread breaks or other issues, maybe due to material type, we will slow down to ensure the job quality is maintained.

Hats designs at full speed may not register consistently, so they get turned down to suit. But as said, very important the design is digitised to suit a cap.
Needle breaks on hats tend to be when first starting when needle speed is slow and the needle gets pushed by the hat material on the middle seam, and ends up hitting the needle plate and breaking. Once a good needle speed is up, they power through the seam without problems generally.


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## John Thomson

I run a single head Feiya 1201.......flat out at 1000spm.....it slows itself depending on stitch type and length. but I leave it at full speed and have no problems with it.

john


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## mrblfx

hey Byron
did i hear you say you neo's are technically toyota's
we have a 9000 and i thought it was the other way around
tajima makes the hardware and toyota put the electronics
to it the main difference is needle sequence and front cover


anyway we run out caps at 500-650 and others designs
800-950 depending on the design

jim


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## vctradingcubao

Yes, I think you're right Jim. It's Tajima's hardware and they use Toyota's control panel & electronics. I love our Tajimas, but funny that I like our Neos more than our TFMXs. Even the Neo (Toyota) Control panel is easier to use and boots faster compared to TFMX's Windows CE based OS. Just got me thinking that it might be better to run 3 Neos than a single-4 head Tajima TFMX.
I also like the Neo's slider type speed controller.


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## mrblfx

I could'nt agree more we also love our machine it has been
very good to us. if we buy another one we would go with
the tajima 1501 it has a bigger frame and work area

jim


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## logoadvantage

Machine speed is very different based on the machine brand your using.
Yes all machines claim a MAX speed but on MOST machines you cannot leave your machine on that speed all the time. The Better brands of equipment for the most part have less issues running at top speed.

Much of this is an issue of the machines ability to Slow down and speed up properly.
Some machines JUMP up and down in big spreads which produces poor quality results. 
This is kinda like going down the road in your car and Flooring it and then hitting the brakes and then flooring the gas again. Jumpy Speeds produce Poor Quality just like they would produce a jerky ride in a car.
The better machines look forward in the file as they are running and slow down and speed up in smaller increments so it does not effect the embrodiery nearly as much.
This level of control requires advanced technology and is not seen on the cheaper models.

In my shop the machines are locked at max speed all the time. 
I do not see a need to change them and we are very picky about quality.
If I were getting POOR quality I would slow them down.
I have owned other machines that I could NOT do this so dont thing all machines have this ability

Some of the equipment is also not built well enough to handle sewing at high speeds without making you get a ton of issues in production. Thread Breaks etc. 

If my machines were running fast but creating thread breaks or poor quality then I would slow down the machine.
Efficiency & Quality is the key ! 

So how fast can you run your machine is based on your machine brand, how well it is tuned up and how well you have set up things like Tension on the machine as well.
All of these things effect production from the machine.

Every person will have their own answers to this. From owning many machines brands in the past I have found some have their Sweet Spot that they like a certain speed.
The machines I run now have no issues running at full speed all day and they do slow down when they see in the file that they need to slow down however they do NOT slam on the breaks to turn around and take off at High Speed three stitches later. They EASE down and EASE back up, which is what is needed to produce good quality work.

My single head is locked at 1200 and my Multi Head is locked at 1000.
I dont even like to train my staff how to change the speeds but they figure it out over time.

Rick


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## Buechee

I run mine at about 800 to 900. Sometimes at 700 and very few times at 1000. I try to keep it at 800.


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## logoadvantage

One of my favorite questions to people in this business is 
If your buying a cheaper machine and running slower are you really saving money ?
In my shop I know the answer is hands down NO it cost me more in the long run to not have fast efficient production.

As many here have already indicated by their brands they are not running at what I consider acceptable production speeds. Some were non commercial machines some were just the cheaper commercial models.

The better the machine the less problem it will have running at higher production speeds.

Thread Breaks are often caused by the operators setting up the machine with tensions that are too tight and then at high speeds it causes more issues like thread breaks. I would estimate that around 80% of the machines I see in embroidery shops are set up too tight. Often as soon as they have an issue they crank down on the tension even more which compounds their problems.

Tight tensions also cause registration problems since when the pantorgraph moves the tighter thread is then pulling against the garment harder than it should be. This makes it pull the garment or stretch the garment so the outlines will not line up as well as they should. I have digitized a design before. Ran it in my shop it lined up perfect, sent it out and had them complain about the registration. Its hard to explain to the end user that if I can run it fine then thats either you hooping wrong or your machine is set up wrong. 

Thread Pull Outs and Trim issues are a feature that has nothing to do with Speed, however some machines do this process much better than others. They do stop to make the trim on all machines. 

On most machines the tension will effect the thread trim length as well but thats not true on all brands but it is true on most of them. The process is effected by by when and how the upper thread hook is used and if you have a two stage or three stage trimming process as well as tensions.

The Bottom line is it does not help to speed up your machine if it causes other issues or causes poor quality production. As stated before you have to run your machine at the speed that it will work properly. Some will be faster than others due to the machine quality, technology and other variables as well.

I run my single head at 1200 SPM and my Multi Heads at 1000. I have almost NO thread breaks. Never have trimming issues (Really NEVER) and quality is the most important thing in my shop.

Having said this I could not do that same sort of thing with machines I have owned in the past ! Never could I get them to run that efficient and I have owned quite a few brands thru the years.

Everything effects production ! 
Good Hooping, Use of good needles, thread and even good backing make a difference. Proper digitizing is a major component along with having your machine properly tuned up as well. 

It only takes ONE issue to cause you problems in your production speed and often the quality of the embroidery as well.

I have been in tons of shops that never change a needle unless it breaks. They do simply "Wear Out" and when that happens the embrodiery does not look as clean and the machine does not run as well.
Same goes with the rotary hook ! That is a WEAR item on every machine.

Moral of the story is you get what you pay for when it comes to machines. The better quality machines that cost more often are also the most productive. It also pays off in the long run to use good thread, needles and make sure your machine is well taken care of. 

Confucios Say 
A drop of Oil on your rotary hook every 4 hours of production save you money in the long run !


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## aldenski

Another factor is how long does it take to hoop your goods? Why run the machine faster than your hoop time? Its obvious that slower is better for the machine so run it just a little faster than it takes to get ready for the next load. If its a short run - sew as fast as you can.


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## vctradingcubao

logoadvantage said:


> Confucios Say
> A drop of Oil on your rotary hook every 4 hours of production save you money in the long run !


, got to remind my staff about this...


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## zoom_monster

logoadvantage said:


> I run my single head at 1200 SPM and my Multi Heads at 1000. I have almost NO thread breaks.


Rick, 
On your machines, they slow a bit when doing longer stitch lengths, right? Older multi-head machines (and yes, "cheaper" machines) may not handle the momentum of those faster speeds. Also tension management is more of an "art" at those speeds. For people new at this.... look at the recomendations, your quality, and look for ways to push the envelope. The speed if the machine is but one piece of the production puzzle.

Ian


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## logoadvantage

Yes all machines will slow down. How they slow down is the big difference. 
When they take big steps down and up it produces jumpy looking embroidery. The machine should slow down and speed up with small changes to make the transition smooth

Tensions are easy on some machines harder on others. This has to do alot with how the thread is getting pulled by the take up lever and the timing on the machine as to when that all happens. I dont have an issue and I find it pretty easy to keep ours running well but I have owned machines where tensions were a pain to deal with and that always caused issues.

There are some Tension Guages on the market. I dont use them but it does help newbies that are trying to fine tune their machines. I normally also tell them to start with a new Bobbin Case (Clean) and make sure that the spring is removed from the insides of the bobbin case if your using Pre Wound Bobbins. 

As a note here. Magna Core Bobbins are my bobbin of preference since they run to the very end and they do not get tighter as they get smaller like most bobbins do. There are some others that do pretty good like Coates but I have not seen anything as smooth as a Magna Core. This makes a BIG Difference in the quality of the embroidery if the tension can be smooth.


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## Buechee

I use NEBs bobbins. The plastic they come in are or have beenn better than one that come in the cardboard spools. Is there a wholesaler for NEBs?


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## lizziemaxine

Buechee said:


> I use NEBs bobbins. The plastic they come in are or have beenn better than one that come in the cardboard spools. Is there a wholesaler for NEBs?


I'm not sure where to get NEB but you can get plastic sided bobbins from www.bobbincentral.com
I encourage you to try the Magna-Glide bobbin from Bobbin Central. I like them so much better than the plastic or paper-sided bobbins.
They will send you samples to try the Magna-Glide bobbin.


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## Hale

We have a Tajima late model two head. We run caps at 650, the rest of the time it is set to 885 (max is 1000). We put a large running job in with tatami and satin threads and just started changing the speed as it sews. Where does it sound best? 885 on flats. Above 650 on caps starts to sound different, so that is the number. Yeah, it slows down if it needs to, based on stitch lenght and angle.

Hale
Hogwild Imprints


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