# t-shirt sublimation - help please



## teeshoits (Mar 15, 2008)

Hi,

I'm trying sublimation for the first time, aving previosuly specialised in pressing cut vinyl.

I have purchased subliation paper and t-shirts from xpres. Earlier research gave me the impression that I could use my Epson Injet printer, however my first attempt is not very convincing. I printed a full colour image and it looked ok, put it face down on the t-shirt and pressed at 200 degress C for 50 seconds wit medium pressure. When I removed the paper, the image was still on the paper and not on the t-shirt. Only a yellow ghostly image seems to have transfered.

Were my findings regarding printing with Epson durabrite inks incorrect? Do I have to buy a new printer with bulk feed and sublimation inks? Or is there anything more elementary that anyone can suggest?

This is my first experiment with this process, but I have an order waiting, and would like to try and minimse waste, so if anyone as any insight on this problem I'd be very grateful.

Best Regards,

Alan


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## gemais (Jan 27, 2008)

you have to use sublimation inks. try and get them bulk for home use. I have been using them for nearly two years and so far great. They work out cheaper in the long run, but setting up is pricey.

Gemais


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## enquirer (Feb 3, 2008)

You can use the durabright ink for heat transfer. Buy heat transfer paper. For sublimation you have to use special sublimation ink and it's pretty expensive.


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## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

Sorry Alan... but they are correct...you need sublimation paper AND sublimation ink in a printer that will accept it...today that is C88+ ..now out of production, Epson 1280..also out of production and current models 1400, 1800 and the wide format 4800 series. The replacement for the C88+ is the C120 and sublimation systems are either just out or will be out soon. Also bear in mind when you use sublimation ink, whether sublijet, artainium, rotech or TOG, you will need to use a specific ICC profile for your ink and printer..


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## teeshoits (Mar 15, 2008)

Thanks for the advice everyone. Looks like I'll be investing in a new printer and some ink a little sooner than I intended, but I suppose it's just good incentive to develop that side of the business. 

Cheers

Alan


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## indy99 (Apr 13, 2007)

You will also need shirts that accept sublimation ink like Vapor Apparel or Hane SoftLink.


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## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

dennis is correct...or you can use most anty 100% polyester...you can get a faded look by using a blend as sublimation ink does not stay on cotton fabric strands


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## teeshoits (Mar 15, 2008)

Quick question, someone mentioned that I would be able to produce heat transfers with my current printer, however will these work on the vapor apparel sublimation tees I have already bought? They are the type with cotton feel on the inside and polyester on the outside.

Alan


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## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

You should be able to press onto the polyester....depending on your paper...I would check with your paper vendor to see if it will work on that material


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## teeshoits (Mar 15, 2008)

Cheers - Dorotape claim that their D print transfer paper is suitable for application to polyester so I have ordered a packet. There might be light at the end of the tunnel yet.

I think I will still endeavour to get a better printer with sublimation bulk ink system as I do want to make the best quality product I can, however for this order I think I can make do with transfers as they are just t-shirts to be worn by the cast of a play.

Thanks for all your assistance


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## mrdavid (Sep 14, 2007)

Alan you can keep the Epson Injet printer just change the ink to sublimation bulk ink system


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## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

whether he can use the Epson depends on the model AND the availability of the sublimation ink for that model. there is just a limited number of Epsons that you can get sublimation ink for..

So Alan..what model do you have..if it is C88+ (or equivalent), 1400, 1800, 4800 series, the older 1280 you are good to go and I think there is ink out now for the C120 which replaced the C88


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## enquirer (Feb 3, 2008)

You could save your vapor apparel for when you get the sub dye setup and purchase some additional (much less expensive) Tees for the heat transfer. Heat transfer is good with cotton and 50/50 blends. You can get Tees for 1.50 or so. I'm sure your paying much more for the Vapor. I get the Vapor stuff local but I still pay at least 3 bucks more for it. The JPSS paper comes out really nice for heat transfers on light color shirts. Also less expensive if you mess up a few.


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## teeshoits (Mar 15, 2008)

Hi Charles, 

I use the epson DX 4000, it's one of the all in models with scanner etc. I have seen one bulk ink system here: 

CISS Continuous Ink System for Epson D78 DX4000, DX4050, DX5000, DX5050, DX6000 DX6050 :: Continuous Ink Systems :: iComp

would that do the job if I replaced the ink? At under £30 it seems a bit good to be true.

Alan 



charles95405 said:


> whether he can use the Epson depends on the model AND the availability of the sublimation ink for that model. there is just a limited number of Epsons that you can get sublimation ink for..
> 
> So Alan..what model do you have..if it is C88+ (or equivalent), 1400, 1800, 4800 series, the older 1280 you are good to go and I think there is ink out now for the C120 which replaced the C88


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## Progeny (Jul 28, 2007)

Alan that system is not for sublimation inks. Contact Kevin at subli-nation.co.uk for advice on a bulk system and have a look on the xpres site as well for bulk systems.

I get my transfer paper from xpres and i can't fault it.

Lee


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## brand resistant (Mar 21, 2008)

The reason you can get cheaper t's than Vapor is because it is not you who pays the full price. The real price is payed by the environment and the exploited working poor in sweatshops. I think it's important to consider this when buying blank t's


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## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

Alan....I have never seen a CIS for an all in one printer.. I thought the fact that the scanner on top would not allow the free movement back and forth of the tubes that carry the ink from the storage units to the the print head. So I will have to pass on this one....I would sure like to see how they do that


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## teeshoits (Mar 15, 2008)

Hi All,

Just thought I'd let you know that I succesfully printed those tees. I used dorotape d-print transfer paper with ink from my Epson DX4000 and printed onto white sublimation tees from xpress. The result looked surprisingly good. You can hardly see the outline where I cut round the design and the colours look great. Just got to wait and see how they wash now.

Thanks for all your advice. I think that sublimation may not be ideal for me at the moment as I'd like to be able to offer a wider variety of colours and preferably use the same 100% cotton shirts as I normally use with vinyl.

Onwards with my research.

Alan,


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## darrca (Mar 31, 2008)

I'm trying also trying to do sublimation printing with a DX4000. I have sublimation ink and paper. It does not seem to work. Do I have the wrong ink or is it just impossible with a DX4000?


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## teeshoits (Mar 15, 2008)

Hi Darcca,

From what I've discovered I think that sublimation will not work with the DX4000. 

An alternative to sublimation which may suit your needs is to buy some heat transfer paper. There are many suppliers. Make sure it says inkjet transfer paper as the stuff for laser printers is different again. Also be careful as a lot of papers you will find if you just doa random search on the internet are designed for home application with an iron, and I would suspect, are not as good quality.

If you have your heart set on sublimation you'll probably need a new printer and special ink I believe.

After much research I have ordered a colour laser printer, as this will allow me to print onto the same 100% cotton t-shirts I use when working with vinyl.


Good luck

Alan


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## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

I think it is not that sublimation ink will not work with your printer...just that there is not ink carts with sublimation available..


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## darrca (Mar 31, 2008)

charles95405 said:


> I think it is not that sublimation ink will not work with your printer...just that there is not ink carts with sublimation available..


Thanks for your reply. I purchased empty cartridges and filled them with sublimation ink but I suspect that it may not be the right ink. Or are there different cartridges that have to be used with sublimation ink?


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## gmille39 (Oct 18, 2006)

I'm thinking of adding sublimation to my business offerings. Can anyone show examples of some shirts they pressed using sublimation. Since the ink, or vapor goes right into the shirt, there's no stiffness on large, adult shirts?


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## mrdavid (Sep 14, 2007)

there is no feel and here is one I did it will fade little was done on 50/50 shirt but that is what they wanted here is pic


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## gmille39 (Oct 18, 2006)

mrdavid said:


> there is no feel and here is one I did it will fade little was done on 50/50 shirt but that is what they wanted here is pic


Thanks. I'm going to have to price everything up to see what it's going to take to get it going.


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## chrisqns (Feb 22, 2008)

Hi guys-
I have an Epson CX-5000 all-in-one with a CIS system installed- working perfectly. I started out doing regular heat transfers but I want to also get into dye sublimation. I'm wondering since I have the CIS system, do you think I could add sub ink to the CIS? I have not seen any sub ink offered specifically for this model. But- I have the CIS. Maybe I could just pour the dye into the tank? Any info or suggestions are greatly appreciated.


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## mrdavid (Sep 14, 2007)

it will need to be cleaned but should work fine


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## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

Chris...could you post a photo of the printer and the CIS...? I have never seen an all in one with CIS


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## Christo (Apr 23, 2008)

Hello everyone

I've had many sleepless nights so any help would be appreciated.

I have an Epson CX7300 installed with CISS and sublimation ink (from China) and it is printing fine.

However, I tested the quality of prints on an A4 size paper and found the results to be far from perfect -> Dull colours and "small patchy spot" on all black colours. I'm starting to wonder if it was the problem with - 
1) Sublimation ink quality?
2) Sublimation paper quality? (from China)
3) Printer not supporting sublimation prints?
4) ICC settings? ( I don't really know what this is but a number of people have posted about it)

Please share with me if you come across any similar experience. 

God bless-


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## D.Evo. (Mar 31, 2006)

gmille39 said:


> I'm thinking of adding sublimation to my business offerings. Can anyone show examples of some shirts they pressed using sublimation. Since the ink, or vapor goes right into the shirt, there's no stiffness on large, adult shirts?


Greg, I have a lot of examples of sublimation prints on my website. No matter how big is your print - there is no stiffness/"hand" at all. The design gets DYED into the fabric with dye-sublimation process, so you can't feel anything, but the fabric.


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## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

Christo...first the sublimation ink from China is a copy of the sawgrass/artainium inks and they often do not get it just right...actually it is a patent infringement in all probability and so support from the manufacturer is virtually nonextistant and you are sort of on your own. With sublimation ink it is very important to have the right ICC profile for the ink/program being used. Artainium ink has a different ICC profile than Sublijet which comes from the same company. Also Sublibrite from TOG has it's own ICC profile and if you don't get right, the prints and color will not be what you think you are getting. Sublijet comes with sublijet IQ which installs the profile easily..Artainium and sublibrite are a bit more technical.

To understand more of ICC profiles and what they are go to http://www.color.org/findprofile.xalter


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## gmille39 (Oct 18, 2006)

D.Evo. said:


> Greg, I have a lot of examples of sublimation prints on my website. No matter how big is your print - there is no stiffness/"hand" at all. The design gets DYED into the fabric with dye-sublimation process, so you can't feel anything, but the fabric.


Your design look great. I'm currently getting a vinyl cutter, but I'm going to have to get another printer set up for sublimation. 

Thanks for the examples.


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## gmille39 (Oct 18, 2006)

D.Evo. said:


> Greg, I have a lot of examples of sublimation prints on my website. No matter how big is your print - there is no stiffness/"hand" at all. The design gets DYED into the fabric with dye-sublimation process, so you can't feel anything, but the fabric.


Do you mind telling me what printer, inks, and paper you use. How do you get such large prints?


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## D.Evo. (Mar 31, 2006)

The set up I used to print the shirts you've seen on the website is: Epson 4000 (Artainium Inks), 75gm 17" roll paper and 16" x 24" heat press. We have just "up-sized" to a large format, so I can do "all-over" prints now - very exited!


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## chrisqns (Feb 22, 2008)

charles95405 said:


> Chris...could you post a photo of the printer and the CIS...? I have never seen an all in one with CIS


Here you go Charles.. I think I was able to attach this pic. I bought the CIS on Ebay- around $70. Thanks also to Mad Scientist for answering my question


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## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

Thanks Chris....I guess you have to have the scanner open? or can the scanner be lowered over the tubes?


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## gmille39 (Oct 18, 2006)

D.Evo. said:


> The set up I used to print the shirts you've seen on the website is: Epson 4000 (Artainium Inks), 75gm 17" roll paper and 16" x 24" heat press. We have just "up-sized" to a large format, so I can do "all-over" prints now - very exited!


I'll have to put that on my wish list. I just got a job putting a using Port Authority Dri Mesh 100% Poly tees this would be great for. 

Thanks


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## chrisqns (Feb 22, 2008)

It can be closed- but it isn't perfect either. On occasion the print heads get jammed between the tubes and inner walls. It seems less likely to occur when the scanner is open.


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## mm_ally (Jun 14, 2008)

I'm also using an all-in-one with CISS system. I have a DX5050 Epson with CISS for sublimation. It is working ok, but I still have some problems with finding the right ICC profile. I'm still learning


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

mm_ally said:


> I'm also using an all-in-one with CISS system. I have a DX5050 Epson with CISS for sublimation. It is working ok, but I still have some problems with finding the right ICC profile. I'm still learning


Hi. Try using an ICC profile for another Epson printer, that has the same number of cartridges. 

If that doesn't work, try altering the gamma on your images and altering the colour ratios within the Epson print driver.

Alternatively, there are people on the net that will make a colour profile for you at around $35-$50.

Hope this helps.


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## conde tech (Nov 15, 2007)

You can not use the Epson inks to sublimate. You will need sublimation inks. I recommend the ArTainium inks. Unfortunately, you can not use the printer you currently have. When shopping for a printer think about the long run. What do you want to sublimate? The Epson C120 has replaced the C88. It is good printer for beginners. But, the only draw back is that you can only use 8.5" x 11" or 8.5" x14" sublimation paper. It is a good printer if you want to print name badges, small images for t-shirts, dog tags for humans and dogs, ceramic and glass tiles up to 8" x 8" or 8" x 10," etc. If you want to sublimate larger items such as glass cutting boards and larger tiles such as the 12" x 12, the Epson 1400 is also a good printer for beginners. It will allow you to print up 13' x 19" paper.
When buying sublimation inks for the C120 or 1400, you can either use throw away sublimation carts or a bulk ink system. The Epson 4800 and 4880 are larger and excellent printers. 

You will need sublimation paper. There are three types of sublimation paper.

1. SPP8511, SPP1117, SPP1319, Accuplot---are general all use papers--it can be used for badges, ceramic tiles, mugs (ceramic, glass and stainless steel), some metals, FRP, hard board items.

2. Text Print--mugs, metals, fabrics, mouse pads etc.

3. Jet Col-High Release Paper---I recommend this paper for anything fabric. The paper is called high release because when it comes out of the printer it is extremely wet. I take mine over to the press swing the lid around(DO NOT CLOSE IT) let the paper dry for about 20 seconds then you can immediately use it. When using on cloth the images are rich and really pop out.

You will also need a heat press. If it economically feasible, spring for the 16 x 20 swing away press.

Hope this helps. Please feel free to give me a call.


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

conde tech said:


> You can not use the Epson inks to sublimate. You will need sublimation inks. I recommend the ArTainium inks. Unfortunately, you can not use the printer you currently have.


I must be missing something here. I can't see where anyone has mentioned using anything other than sublimation inks. 

As far as I am aware, you can use any printer with epson printheads for sublimation, as long as it has either refillable cartridges, or a CIS system. Many people use the D92 model extensively, even though it is not supported by Sawgrass. I also know many people that use the 1160 and 1270 models, again not supported by Sawgrass.


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## Olvert Ortega (Oct 26, 2009)

Have you ever heard about NDM inks for sublimation? Why they are so chip compared with the sawgrass or others? In the ebay for Mexico ( deremate.com ) you can get those for great deal.. is that because they are not good enough for the sublimation process?? Some suggestion?


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## jiarby (Feb 8, 2007)

good job dredging up a 2yo thread instead of starting a new one!

Sawgrass hold a U.S. patent for desktop sublimation printer ink.. It is illegal in the US to sell non-sawgrass desktop sublimation ink as a result. 

Letter to TOG customers


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## Olvert Ortega (Oct 26, 2009)

Really sad it is in deed!... Then where is the spirit of competition between companies that makes the prices to go lower in benefit of the users?... what ever.... Thanks for the answer.


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## fooltheimage (Nov 27, 2009)

Is it the same here in Canada that they also have the monopoly of dye sub ink?


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## Lugupa (Jun 15, 2010)

Yes! It is the same! Sawgrass has de monopoly


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## fooltheimage (Nov 27, 2009)

I think we just need to do a lot of homework to look from other place, with todays technology I guess there's a better and more affordable ink from some place.


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## T Industry (Mar 22, 2010)

Hi all,

Ive a Epson d120 can it with a bulksystem also used? Im about to purchase one if it will work on the d120 pls let me know! Ps where is the best place to buy that system btw im from The Netherlands?

Thanks in advance


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## frankdoyal05 (Jan 12, 2009)

Alan, I am currently using an Epson work force 1100 for my sublimation...I bought it on ebay brand new under $140 and the Ciss costed me just $38 and the ink cost $120


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## thcatpp (Aug 31, 2011)

I use both an Epson T50 and 1100 for sublimation - both came highly recommended and both were new this year. The main difference is the price - my T50 is an a4 printer and came loaded with sub ink and bulk system for $aus230 and my 1100, an A3 printer, was $700, with ciss, no ink.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

fooltheimage said:


> I think we just need to do a lot of homework to look from other place, with todays technology I guess there's a better and more affordable ink from some place.


 
.:: Cobra Ink Systems::. This is where the term CIS began


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## YIRI45 (Jun 11, 2014)

I'm having the same problem as Alan, with the exception that I am using a Ricoh sublimation printer and sublimation paper and I get the same yellow spots on the t-shirt but no design. I've tried printing on both sides of the paper (2 separate sheets) to see if I was maybe printing on the wrong side but nothing happens...anyone have any idea why this is happening? TIA


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## socceronly (Jul 22, 2012)

YIRI45 said:


> I'm having the same problem as Alan, with the exception that I am using a Ricoh sublimation printer and sublimation paper and I get the same yellow spots on the t-shirt but no design. I've tried printing on both sides of the paper (2 separate sheets) to see if I was maybe printing on the wrong side but nothing happens...anyone have any idea why this is happening? TIA


You might want to start a new thread. 

This one is 7 years old....


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## YIRI45 (Jun 11, 2014)

Okay here I go again. I have a Ricoh sublimation printer with the sub dye ink and sublimation paper. It prints beautifully but when I try to transfer the print onto a t-shirt it won't transfer, it just leaves a yellow stain. I've tried printing on both sides of the paper thinking I was maybe printing the wrong side but to no avail. TIA


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