# multi layer printing with water based ink



## scg2112 (Dec 7, 2009)

Hey Im just starting a small business doing both custom screen printing and beginning my own line. Right now my set up is somewhat bootleg. Ive been asked to do a multi color print and I was looking into buying a machine, something I anticipate getting just to make my business more professional. however I have been using waterbased inks, Permaset specifically, and I was wondering how helpful a machine would be. will i be able to print all layers of a shirt at once, or will I have to print one layer at a time to let the ink dry. Also will ink dry in the screen as I print other layers

Thanks


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## RichardGreaves (Nov 7, 2006)

*Multi color printing with water based ink*

Textile screen printing is unique in that it can print wet-on-wet, on light garments. If you have to dry in between colors, you have done poorly in pre-press planning and art.

Alas, light colored ink, on dark garments require an ink film on the surface for the best opacity. Under normal circumstances, this can't be done wet-on-wet or without a flash cure.


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## scg2112 (Dec 7, 2009)

Right now im eyeballing, taking into account where the frame matches up to the shirt. for the most part i do it ok but I havent ventured into multi layer prints because eyeballing will be pretty much impossible when I begin to add layers.

This might be a newb question but should I definitely invest in a flask curer?


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## RichardGreaves (Nov 7, 2006)

Flash is a plastisol technique designed to partially gel the ink so it doesn't smear.

Water-based ink doesn't gel, but dry. First you have to evaporate all the water (80%), the heat cure the remaining 20%.

You could use a flash unit to cure your shirts, but infra-red energy doesn't evaporate water well. That's why hair dryers blow hot air, but you do need to cure the dried ink to 320 degrees F just like plastisol.


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## scg2112 (Dec 7, 2009)

thanks what heat curing technique would you recommend with water based?


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## RichardGreaves (Nov 7, 2006)

*300 F heat to cure waterbased ink*

Infra-red gas or electric panel - like a flash cure
Home oven
A real screen printing conveyor dryer
Mom's hand iron 
Heat seal press/transfer press
Paint & strip gun

*Buy the book*
Go to: How To Publishing - How To Publishing
and buy "How To Print T-Shirts for Fun and Profit!" the textile screen printer's primer for more than 30 years.


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## bReed (Nov 21, 2009)

Thanks for the info


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## moe_szys1ak (Jun 16, 2008)

scg2112 said:


> Right now im eyeballing, taking into account where the frame matches up to the shirt. for the most part i do it ok but I havent ventured into multi layer prints because eyeballing will be pretty much impossible when I begin to add layers.
> 
> This might be a newb question but should I definitely invest in a flask curer?


Eyeballing is not really a good idea when printing multiple colors. Eventually you'll find it just takes too much time setting up each color. Investing in a mulit-color press (preferably with micro-registration) is the best way to go to handle multi-color imprints.

Most waterbased inks will dry in your screens if not handled properly. There are ways to avoid this, including flooding your screen after each print, keeping a spray bottle of water on hand to lightly mist the ink if you've let it sit, printing onto test squares in between shirt prints if it takes you a while to get to the next shirt. If you plan on walking away from your press for an extended period of time, wrap the whole thing in plastic wrap to keep the moisture in.

I've heard that Permaset inks dry out pretty quickly compared to the ink I use - Matsui 301 series. Permaset sells an extender base which you can add to your ink to prevent in-screen drying - though it will still eventually dry in your screen if left long enough.

As for a flash dryer, I currently use one with Matsui waterbased inks and they come out just fine. I use it to both flash the ink and for the final cure. With the flash between colors, you just want to heat the ink enough so if u lightly touch it with your finger none of the ink comes up. A forced air flash dryer would be best, though they are pretty expensive.

An economical substitute for a flash dryer is a heat gun - you can probably get them for <$50 at Home Depot or Lowes. There are a lot of threads on here that explain how to use a heat gun and it's pros & cons.

Hope this info helps!


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## scg2112 (Dec 7, 2009)

it did thanks. Im definitely going to get the press


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## RichardGreaves (Nov 7, 2006)

*Flashing water-based ink*



moe_szys1ak said:


> Most waterbased inks will dry in your screens if not handled properly. There are ways to avoid this, including flooding your screen after each print, keeping a spray bottle of water on hand to lightly mist the ink if you've let it sit, printing onto test squares in between shirt prints if it takes you a while to get to the next shirt. If you plan on walking away from your press for an extended period of time, wrap the whole thing in plastic wrap to keep the moisture in.
> 
> I've heard that Permaset inks dry out pretty quickly compared to the ink I use - Matsui 301 series. Permaset sells an extender base which you can add to your ink to prevent in-screen drying - though it will still eventually dry in your screen if left long enough.


As water-based inks are usually 70% to 80% water, I question the claim of using extender (designed to dilute pigment concentration), as a method of slowing evaporation.

Additives to modify drying speed must bond with water to accelerate or retard it's evaporation. Common products like pine oil or alcohol do that and don't effect pigment concentration.

As I wrote in post#4 in February, flashing is for plastisol where nothing evaporates, and if you print or handle water-based ink like plastisol, you're missing the point. 

*Plastisol Rules Do not Apply*
Flashing works very well with plastisol, but the principles of printing an image on dark garments with water-based inks is vastly different compared to "100% solids" plastisol where nothing evaporates.

Water-based inks do not lend themselves to fill in the shirt holes with an ink deposit film because 80% of the ink (water & additives), evaporates and the wet film thickness shrinks and takes on the texture of shirt fabric.

High opacity water-base inks produce a matte, cloth like finish by coloring individual knit threads, not the air space between them- welding them together with a smooth film.

If you have cracking, you've tried to form a film, like plastisol, with an ink that doesn't stretch like plastisol, water-based ink, not so much.

*Experiment*
Experiment with this by printing on a piece of paper (photocopy or butcher paper) and curing it like a transfer. Try a hair dryer, or your oven, or flash panel. Remember that when water-based ink dries, the solids left on the shirt will be less than 20% of the ink you actually printed. With plastisol, nothing evaporates, so there's no shrinkage.









100% wet ink deposit dries into a 20% final deposit

You can peel plastisol off the paper and it will stretch.

Plastisol printers are accustomed to the look of a plastisol print and don't understand the cloth-like look of a water-based print or under-base.

When a print that looks, feels, and breathes like cloth instead of plastic is desired, water-based will always beat plastisol. Granted, there are plenty of soft-hand plastisol methods, but not for solid light colored areas on dark garments.


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## BroJames (Jul 8, 2008)

scg2112 said:


> Right now im eyeballing, taking into account where the frame matches up to the shirt. for the most part i do it ok but I havent ventured into multi layer prints because *eyeballing will be pretty much impossible when I begin to add layers*.
> 
> This might be a newb question but should I definitely invest in a flask curer?





moe_szys1ak said:


> *Eyeballing is not really a good idea when printing multiple colors*. *Eventually you'll find it just takes too much time setting up each color*. Investing in a mulit-color press (preferably with micro-registration) is the best way to go to handle multi-color imprints....
> 
> I've heard that Permaset inks dry out pretty quickly compared to the ink I use - Matsui 301 series. ...
> 
> ...



[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Q1ILjC286M&feature=related[/media]The rotary press you see at one end of the shop is a workhorse 6/6 press with micro-registration. The owner has a large format printer for tarpaulin printing (that cost much more than the workhorse). They are using a line table system now in conjunction with their workhorse rotary but this was how they once printed even CMYK jobs - EYEBALLING

Have you heard of NICK AUTOMATIC? Browse nicolonimor.tk. He or his designs/shirts is better known than most of us. Care to guess how he prints?

Eyeballing is definitely more difficult and more subject to human error but not "pretty much impossible". When I started printing as a hobby that is also how I printed although they are spot color prints. But the EYEBALL method can definitely be done and is still being done by a few. 

As to eyeballing taking much time, depending on the number of shirts and the quality of your rotary, they can be faster than registering your screens. But don't use your frames to align. Use the registration marks you printed on the film positive and is on the screen with your artwork. Cross check with the actual image.

Do I recommend eyeballing? Hell no. Been there, done that, and thank God I'm done with it. But while it is more difficult than systems with mechanical registration guides, it is not really as difficult as it seems - does take discipline and patience though. A good eye and a steady hand also helps.

As to Matsui 301, it dries in days. Other suppliers should have other inks that dries in hours (not minutes) and which should be good enough for leaving on the screen for lunch breaks.

Heat guns are nice to dry a prior layer of ink. It can also be used to cure but is time consuming. I've cured waterbase inks with a 500w halogen a few times just to try it. Suspend the halogen high enough so that it will reach 300F in the amount of time it takes to cure the next shirt. You need a temp gun or a good temp instinct to do so. 

But if you're serious with halogen lamps 4 lamps or 2000w should give a better heat coverage. Whatever non conventional dryer you use, you must be willing to experiment with the temp and time.


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## doskalata (May 16, 2010)

so whats the best method of curing and printing a multi color design with water based inks on a dark garment? 

Discharge under base?


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## RichardGreaves (Nov 7, 2006)

*Best method of curing and printing a multi color design with water based inks on a dark garment*



doskalata said:


> so whats the best method of curing and printing a multi color design with water based inks on a dark garment?
> 
> Discharge under base?


Non-clamshell automatic press that can stop after flooding. 

20 foot gas convection DRYER, (not oven).

Customers art and how it was separated drastically effect how a design will print.

*Water-Based Homework*
http://www.t-shirtforums.com/screen-printing/t114704.html#post673597


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## doskalata (May 16, 2010)

*Re: Best method of curing and printing a multi color design with water based inks on a dark garment*



RichardGreaves said:


> Non-clamshell automatic press that can stop after flooding.
> 
> 20 foot gas convection DRYER, (not oven).
> 
> ...




that, really didnt help... anyone else care to elaborate or add on to greaves last post?


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## RichardGreaves (Nov 7, 2006)

*Re: Best method of curing and printing a multi color design with water based inks on a dark garment*

You asked "whats the best method of curing and printing a multi color design with water based inks on a dark garment?".

I answered your question and listed more than 10 expert web accessible articles on water-based printing.

The Leach & Proctor articles specifically address dark garment printing. The Terry Combs article is called "Getting into Water-Based Inks on Dark Garments".

Perhaps you should rephrase the question. What method isn't working? What help do you really need?


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## doskalata (May 16, 2010)

I apologize wholeheartedly.

what i really meant is that iv always thought that a basic pannel flash dryer would work fine for a small water based operation of short runs. But now i feel as thought i'm being led to belive that these will only work for plastisol inks. 

And what i should have asked is, what is a better option for curing water based inks than a heat gun and my moms iron.

Ive read since my last post that a basic t shirt heat press would work fine?

again, my apologies.


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## RichardGreaves (Nov 7, 2006)

*Curing Water Based Ink with Infra Red panels*

Heat is heat. Your desire to use water-based ink means that every step in the process will take longer- including curing.

There is another recent thread on "Curing Water Based Ink with Infra Red panels", http://www.t-shirtforums.com/screen-printing/t109530.html#post775359


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