# Am I too picky as a boss?



## soCALkid (Aug 16, 2011)

So I've been expanding my business and looking for a few screen printers to handle my steady stream of orders. I have 1 guy who's excellent, very neat, pretty fast and never complains about working overtime etc (he's on my staff full time). The other 4 guys that I've tried out this past month have been either too slow, or too messy (or both). I know that I don't have much patience with applicants but am I being too quick to give up on them and search for another screen printer? Like I said, I've had 4 guys do a trial period in the past month, none of them have passed my standards for a screen printer. I don't know what to do because I can't find anyone else who can print consistently/fairly quickly/ and neatly. Should I just be more patient and try to guide them as much as I can or should I keep searching? Anybody with a similar experience in this business?


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## InkedApparel (Mar 18, 2009)

have you explained to them how you expect them to conduct themselves in your shop?

I would say , dont lower your standards....if they are to slow and messy just starting out ..then they will always be to slow and messy.....keep looking

Inked


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## soCALkid (Aug 16, 2011)

InkedApparel said:


> have you explained to them how you expect them to conduct themselves in your shop?
> 
> I would say , dont lower your standards....if they are to slow and messy just starting out ..then they will always be to slow and messy.....keep looking
> 
> Inked


I've gone over the basics with them. I've given them a few days to improve and it seems as though none of them have improved at all, in fact 2 of them got worse. I just don't know where I can find someone who is a professional screen printer, not just a hobbyist. Everybody I've had try out has experience in other shops. Obviously not very good shops.


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## dottavig (May 2, 2011)

Maybe you shouldn't ask for people with experience from other shops. Look for someone who may not have exp. but has a passion for design or T-shirts, or someone who may have started his own brand or atleast tried to. 

This is someone who would most likely be slow to start but because they have a passion for what they do, would listen to what you had to say and improve. 

When I started doing DTG I was slow and messy as I could be for DTG, but because I loved what I was doing I got better.


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## soCALkid (Aug 16, 2011)

dottavig said:


> Maybe you shouldn't ask for people with experience from other shops. Look for someone who may not have exp. but has a passion for design or T-shirts, or someone who may have started his own brand or atleast tried to.
> 
> This is someone who would most likely be slow to start but because they have a passion for what they do, would listen to what you had to say and improve.
> 
> When I started doing DTG I was slow and messy as I could be for DTG, but because I loved what I was doing I got better.


This actually sounds like a good idea, maybe I made a mistake by requiring 2+ years experience. Maybe I do need someone with very little experience but with a desire to learn, and I know there are a lot of people out there with that. Thanks for the advice, anybody else? Everything is greatly appreciated.


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## AtkinsonConsult (May 2, 2011)

socalKid:

Good luck with your search. If you are truly looking for an experienced printer that's worth more, I would suggest using a headhunter service. I've previously had good experience with finding printing talent from other cities and bringing them in. After an in-depth phone conversation with a recruiter, they would send me resumes and I lined up phone interviews with candidates. I brought in the ones I liked and gave them a paid afternoon to show me how they could run the press and a crew. I've probably hired at least 8-10 printers this way over the years, and it has usually worked out for the best. (people are people after all)

One thing I might add is that you need to be explicit on your expectations. Have a good employee handbook, and even written guidelines for company policies and procedures. Use a production log and track set up time, run time and downtime. My crews have the daily production log on one side, and the schedule of what they need to print on the other side of the paper. Set production goals. Graph and publicize daily totals and averages. Investigate anything that looks out of the ordinary. 

No offense, but sometimes bad employees are the result of bad management. Communication is the key. There should be no question about the expectations. You need to be constantly training, constantly vigil about what's going on on the floor. That doesn't mean you need to necessarily micro-manage, but you need to be in control.

Finally, some of the best printers that I've worked with were at one time just catchers or inkers. They just needed some training and their time up at the plate to take a swing. The answer to your search could be working for you already!

PM me if you want the names of recruiters I've used.

Good luck,

-M


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## soCALkid (Aug 16, 2011)

AtkinsonConsult said:


> socalKid:
> 
> Good luck with your search. If you are truly looking for an experienced printer that's worth more, I would suggest using a headhunter service. I've previously had good experience with finding printing talent from other cities and bringing them in. After an in-depth phone conversation with a recruiter, they would send me resumes and I lined up phone interviews with candidates. I brought in the ones I liked and gave them a paid afternoon to show me how they could run the press and a crew. I've probably hired at least 8-10 printers this way over the years, and it has usually worked out for the best. (people are people after all)
> 
> ...


Thanks for the advice. While I do admit I am NOT the best teacher or instructor, I am expecting a certain amount of knowledge & convertibility around a screen printing shop. Unfortunately I haven't found that yet. I too have noticed that the best screen printers I've had were ones that I trained personally and had no prior experience. Once again I unfortunately don't have that time to spend with a "newbie" as I have a lot of orders to finish per week. This is why I'm asking for advice because I'm really in a predicament, if I don't find someone soon, I'll have to continue working 14+ hours a day, and that's no fun. I do also keep written logs of performance, I do inform the applicants of my "expectations" and I do correct them when I need to, it just seems like that still isn't working with them.


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## AtkinsonConsult (May 2, 2011)

soCalKid:

Sorry, but sometimes there's no instant success or easy answer. It takes hard work and consistent follow up. 

It doesn't do you any good to keep production logs if you aren't using that information as a tool for communication with your printers concerning performance. If you haven't already you need to set daily goals for set up times, run times and downtime. Publish performance metrics daily on a whiteboard. Goals met in black, not met in red. Anything in red, you need to be following up on that day to determine how to increase performance. Is it training? The equipment? The job they just ran?

Goals should be set for each crew, and they may be different. Skill set, training, and equipment will all come into play. My thought is that a seasoned printer should be able to set up a job in an average of five minutes per screen. For a newbie, the goal is ten minutes per screen. Autos should run at least at 400 impression per hour average. Manual printers should print at around 60. DTG should run at 45. These are averages, so you are going to have numbers that are way over or way under depending on the job, stroke length, garment, etc.

PM me if you want a copy of my production log, I'll happily send it to you. It's in English and Spanish.

There's nothing wrong with being dissatisfied with production performance. The key is to DO SOMETHING about it. Communicate, train, eliminate the excuses and variables. Hold people accountable.

Good luck,

-M


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## dottavig (May 2, 2011)

what do you propose to pay a hired printer?

LOL @ 45 DTG prints an hour unless your using something like the new M. I'm on an anajet and just had a back graphic that was full sized on a dark shirts that took 6minutes for JUST printing.


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## soCALkid (Aug 16, 2011)

dottavig said:


> what do you propose to pay a hired printer?
> 
> LOL @ 45 DTG prints an hour unless your using something like the new M. I'm on an anajet and just had a back graphic that was full sized on a dark shirts that took 6minutes for JUST printing.


My long time screen printer makes 13. I'm starting the new guys off at 9 with the offer to be raised to 10 within 6 months (if they last that long). I also don't do DTG prints so I have nothing to worry about there. I mainly do textile printing on athletic uniforms, p.e shirts/shorts/pants etc.


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## AtkinsonConsult (May 2, 2011)

Gino:

I don't use an Anajet so I'm not familiar with that model. However I do have experience with managing production for shops using the Brother 541 and 782, and also at the shop that I work at now we have two Kornit's. Those printers are all capable of an average for 45 an hour easy. Remember the production time expected is based on your staff's skill set, the machine and also the design being produced. The key is to find your average, set expectations and goals and work to achieve them.

It's also important to measure set up time and downtime as those are two production time killers. For set up, do the crews have everything kit packed and ready for them? Shirts, inks, and screens? All they should have do to is set up and take down. For downtime, ideally you should see less than two hours per day being down on a normal 8 hour shift. What causes downtime in your shop? Ripping a screen, artist proof on press, no ink made, confusion on what job to run next, etc.

Smart and efficient shops have everything organized and ready for production in advance. Clear instructions about what's needed are outlined on the job, so the crews just have to execute. Downtime happens, but should be minimal. The key is understanding what's going on and following up on challenges and resolving them so they don't occur again.

Auto press operators are paid based on the work, skill, and ability to perform - coupled by geography of course. The same guy could make more in a large city, than a small town because the overall pay is higher for everyone. Most skilled operators I've seen make about $14 - $18 an hour. It's also not uncommon to pay guys bonuses for really excelling and making great numbers over an extending length of time or some big job. Depends on the shop's wallet and leadership of course.

Good luck,

-M


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## Ylla (May 17, 2011)

...if you cannot find one... make one... 
i understand the frustrations of bosses to fit in a new guy. varying your teaching strategy is a good option. another thing you might want to look into is to give the new guy some sort of responsibility.... something that "he's the boss"... boss of something to inspire him (for instance "tell him, hey Greg, you are in-charge of ink department. if anyone of these guys mess up with your inks or want some of your inks, they need to go through you first. smack them if they mess up your inks"...)

you know what i mean, or something like that...


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## dottavig (May 2, 2011)

2 kornits.....theres your 45 per hour =D


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## AtkinsonConsult (May 2, 2011)

Gino:

Both Brother models are capable of that as an average as well.

-M


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## Riderz Ready (Sep 18, 2008)

soCALkid said:


> My long time screen printer makes 13. I'm starting the new guys off at 9 with the offer to be raised to 10 within 6 months (if they last that long). I also don't do DTG prints so I have nothing to worry about there. I mainly do textile printing on athletic uniforms, p.e shirts/shorts/pants etc.


You have incredibly high expectations for a job paying almost poverty wages. Maybe look to the education system for an "intern" who wants to learn the business to compliment their education. They will be motivated and cheap.


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## soCALkid (Aug 16, 2011)

Riderz Ready said:


> You have incredibly high expectations for a job paying almost poverty wages. Maybe look to the education system for an "intern" who wants to learn the business to compliment their education. They will be motivated and cheap.


How much do you pay your employees? Sorry I can't afford to pay my employees 20+ an hour for a simple screen printing/8 hour a day job. I must be keeping the majority of my employees happy because I've never had any of them complain about the pay.


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## Riderz Ready (Sep 18, 2008)

soCALkid said:


> How much do you pay your employees? Sorry I can't afford to pay my employees 20+ an hour for a simple screen printing/8 hour a day job. I must be keeping the majority of my employees happy because I've never had any of them complain about the pay.


Ever try living on $18K? 

We are a dye sub cut and sew shop and our heat press operators are part time college kids that get paid by the piece. They average $12 - 13 per hour depending how fast they operate. 

If you have full time people making $18,000 they surely are searching want ads everyday.


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## TshirtGuru (Jul 9, 2008)

Riderz Ready said:


> Ever try living on $18K?
> 
> We are a dye sub cut and sew shop and our heat press operators are part time college kids that get paid by the piece. They average $12 - 13 per hour depending how fast they operate.
> 
> If you have full time people making $18,000 they surely are searching want ads everyday.


He's doing what he can. 18k is better than 0k. At least he's employing someone that needs a job!


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## TshirtGuru (Jul 9, 2008)

It doesn't matter how much his employees are getting paid. Regardless of pay, the employees should be doing a good job, otherwise they shouldn't be working. 

I have a newbie I hired a few weeks ago, he gets the states minimum wage starting out. He's neat when he organizes but clumsy. He just dropped a box of shirts on a pile of ink last week. I need to babysit him all day and tell him to do this do that but I feel like I can do it faster if I just did it myself. I realized that I was expecting too much too fast from a newb. Just be patient and they tend to learn as long as they are trying. If they are lazy kick them out. Anyhow I'm in the same boat as you. I wish i could hire an experienced printer that can just do everything from the get go, but it's hard to find. Not only that, it feels like no one else can really care for your business as much as you do. Anyhow, good luck.


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## wonubee (Oct 2, 2007)

Well I guess I'll chime in.

I've loved reading this thread. I mean you get what you pay for. If you're only willing to pay an experienced person a low wage your simply not going to find many people to fill that roll. I've been trying to get a job in the screen printing industry for some time but I run into the whole I can't train a new guy thing. I've been printing in my garage for 2 years so it's not like I'm 100% clueless. I'm willing to start at a low $9 to $10 because I really enjoy screen printing and I want to learn and grow. I've worked in the offset printing industry for 28 years so I know production. But damn if all I can look forward to earning is a lousy $15 an hour after 10 years I say screw that.

It just doesn't seem to be realistic to expect to find good qualified people while at the same time not willing to train anyone. I mean holy crap with wages as low as what you're all talking about I'm amazed that there is any employees at all who are qualified and not so burned out and sick of the low pay for hard work that they haven't moved on. 

I know I'm only looking at this from the employee perspective but man those wages suck big time.


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## soCALkid (Aug 16, 2011)

TshirtGuru said:


> He's doing what he can. 18k is better than 0k. At least he's employing someone that needs a job!



Thanks for response, I'm definitely going to give this new kid a shot, he seems genuinely interested in learning and he is not lazy so that's a good start in my opinion. I guess I have to suck it up and stay positive.


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## soCALkid (Aug 16, 2011)

wonubee said:


> Well I guess I'll chime in.
> 
> I've loved reading this thread. I mean you get what you pay for. If you're only willing to pay an experienced person a low wage your simply not going to find many people to fill that roll. I've been trying to get a job in the screen printing industry for some time but I run into the whole I can't train a new guy thing. I've been printing in my garage for 2 years so it's not like I'm 100% clueless. I'm willing to start at a low $9 to $10 because I really enjoy screen printing and I want to learn and grow. I've worked in the offset printing industry for 28 years so I know production. But damn if all I can look forward to earning is a lousy $15 an hour after 10 years I say screw that.
> 
> ...


The pay starts at 9 but moves up to 10 if I decide to keep them, the only thing I have "new guys" doing are simple 1 color prints, organizing orders, and cleaning up. If that's too hard for the pay then you're in for a giant let down if you do get a job in an actual shop. Good luck in your job search.


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## wonubee (Oct 2, 2007)

Actually my post said I was willing to start at $9 to $10. I understand what entry level pay is. I also understand not paying top dollar for someone you are unsure of. However is after 10 years of experience and hard work all I can look forward to is a lousy $15 dollars an hour, I'll just continue what I'm doing and keep printing in my garage.


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