# Brand new F&M Transfers just flaked away



## Reeko (Apr 10, 2007)

Hey guys...I've been using F&M for my plastisol for a couple years now and I have never had the slightest problem until now. I pressed a two color spot for a job...the same way I've always been doing it...and they didn't last a week with the customer. After they got washed once they started flaking off...half the design is gone. Every single one of the shirts. Have any of you guys run into this problem? I have an infrared thermometer that tells me my press is on the money, and I pressed them for the 325 degrees for 7 seconds as the directions say. I'm telling you I didnt do a thing wrong!! I pre-press'd them to get the moisture out as always. 100% cotton shirts, and 50/50 sweatshirts!

Does anybody have any input on why this has happened? Best I can figure is that I got a bad batch from F&M. Does this happen often?? Like I said before, it's been two years and I never had a problem. I'm now out $770 for this job, and the customer wants me hanged!!

Any tips???

Please help!!


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## Reeko (Apr 10, 2007)

I just took some close up pics so hopefully someone can give me an idea whats happening here....again...I have been printing plastisol from F&M for a couple years now and never had a problem up until now....according to the customer this is after one wash...and I beleive it because he only had the shirt for a couple days.


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## bircanboss (Nov 25, 2009)

Reeko said:


> I just took some close up pics so hopefully someone can give me an idea whats happening here....again...I have been printing plastisol from F&M for a couple years now and never had a problem up until now....according to the customer this is after one wash...and I beleive it because he only had the shirt for a couple days.


Have you played with the presses pressure at all? It could happen with low pressure. Or it could just be a bad batch of transfers. If you have any transfers left over send one back with one of those washed shirts so they can check it out.


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## princessracer (May 31, 2009)

I haven't ordered from them, simply because of all the bad things I've heard about them lately. Apparenly they changed their formula and it hasn't been the same ever since.


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## Reeko (Apr 10, 2007)

The pressure was the same as always. I lock it down with a decent amount of pressure. More on the heavy end. Seems to have been working for the last couple years. 

I still havent heard back from F&M...not a peep.


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## ProArtShirts (May 3, 2010)

I am just getting into the Plastisol heat transfers and was going to order from F&M. Interested to see how this works out. Sorry about your problems, that really sucks.


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## wormil (Jan 7, 2008)

Reeko said:


> After they got washed once they started flaking off...half the design is gone. Every single one of the shirts. Have any of you guys run into this problem?


Yes but not with F&M, with another transfer company. In my case I'm sure the ink was over cured. There really isn't anything you can do at this point, the shirts are already printed. Ask for them back, re-order transfers and reprint them. Donate the misprints to charity and take a tax deduction. Make sure you get your money back from F&M. You may or may not want to re-order from F&M. It sucks but sometimes you take losses in business.


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## Reeko (Apr 10, 2007)

Thanks for the info Rick! Can I ask you who you get your prints from? I have trusted F&M from day one of opening my doors, now I have a couple big orders I need to put through and I can't afford to be replacing everything. Also, judging from the pics I posted, can you make heads or tails from what exactly happened?

oh yeah...F&M STILL hasent gotten back to me...I've called a couple times and nothing...


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## wormil (Jan 7, 2008)

Yeah, they have never been very good at communication although I've never had any trouble with their transfers and never had any arrive late. I only stopped using them because I heard about the glue lines around their transfers which they apparently have under control. To be honest I've shopped around a bit and I've yet to find a place that I'm 100% satisfied with or that has produced transfers that are 100% reliable. I've been using Howard lately but I've had trouble with the ink melting and filling in details. The thing I like about Howard is they generally cut the transfers pretty straight and square; everyone else seems to cut them willy-nilly and I either have to retrim them or spend forever lining them up. The transfers I mentioned earlier that flaked came from Silver Mountain but I've had others from Silver Mountain that turned out perfect. Honestly the only company whose transfers have been 100% reliable for me (so far) is F&M. I was going to switch back to them but they never responded to my emails. I found a place here in North Carolina that does transfers but the account rep was at a show when I called and I'm not set up with them yet. I'm told they're very good though.


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## ProArtShirts (May 3, 2010)

I was looking at getting into transfers but after so many comments about poor customer service and product quality I don't think I will. I'm looking at screen printing and Tagless Threads right now to supply my shirts. 

I've done a lot of research into DTG, screenprinting, and the Plastisol heat transfer business and the heat transfer business by far has the most complaints about product and customer service.

In mu y opinion if a business shows up that can provide a good product and good customer service then the others will be in trouble or out of business.


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## chobay (Aug 4, 2009)

I switched from F&M to Transfer Express.. Not as plasticky, softer hand.


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## Reeko (Apr 10, 2007)

Thanks again Rick! I will be very curious as to how you make out with that other company. If you could keep me posted I would greatly appreciate it.

Just another update to my escapade here...It has been a week and F&M still haven't made any attempt to look into this problem. I also spent an hour with the tech support for my press...we went through the calibration and everything is running AOK... I guess that means I'm out the $770 on this job.... 

I find it discouraging that F&M doesen't seem to care about the customers that have been coming back to them for years, even if I'm not considered a huge customer to them. I always make it a point to treat my smaller clients with the same regard as my bigger ones. One batch of prints to them is peanuts...but to me its the cost of prints, the shirts and hooded sweathshirts that are destroyed now and the time...not to mention the fact that now everyone that sees these shirts, including the customer, think that I am the worst t-shirt printed in town....reputation is EVERYTHING for us. Just like someone else posted here...(and I'm sorry I forgot who you were) "If a customer likes their shirts they will tell two people, if they don't like them they will tell twenty people!"


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## trendlogo (Oct 16, 2007)

Who is your sales rep at F&M? I have had occassional issues, but I don't think I have ever not received a reply from the sales dept, (other departments, but not the sales department).


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## Reeko (Apr 10, 2007)

Funny you should say that...that is true. My sales rep is very nice and responds quickly. Apparently there is another department that handles the returns and print issues. Those are the people that were supposed to get back to me. Every time I call I'm told I will be sent instructions from that department with mailing instructions on where to mail the printed shirts that self destructed as well as any left over prints. So, I can place as many orders as I want, but getting the issue resolved is another story it seems.


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## wormil (Jan 7, 2008)

Reeko said:


> Thanks again Rick! I will be very curious as to how you make out with that other company. If you could keep me posted I would greatly appreciate it.
> 
> Just another update to my escapade here...It has been a week and F&M still haven't made any attempt to look into this problem.


Are you calling or relying on email? They suck at answering emails. _[edit: nevermind, I took too long to post this and you already answered]_

I sent an order to the new company and they shipped it out the same day. The price ended up being a bit more than Howard because they charge extra for transfers going on 100% polyester but I'm hoping to make up the difference with lower shipping costs and faster turnaround plus their regular transfers look to be less expensive although I haven't worked up the prices yet. There was also a discrepancy between the prices given over the phone and the price list they sent me. Once I press the transfers I'll do a write up on them.

[edit2: Above I said they were slightly more than Howard but that isn't true. I forgot I doubled the order so they are effectively about half the price of Howard. Also I just pressed them and they were perfect.]


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## Reeko (Apr 10, 2007)

Thats good to hear Rick. If you get a chance I'd love to see a write up about them!

Also, here is a question to you....have you tried any cad-cut transfers from transfer express or anywhere else for that matter? I talked to them today for the first time(customer service was incredibly friendly), as i have been looking to have prints made for a job that I just created for a customer. The image has a lot of fine detail with many colors and shading. They recomended cad-cut transfers, but they are incredibly expensive($10 a print). I actually have a roll of the material at the shop which I had my buddy print out on from his Roland versacamm. When I pressed it, it felt pretty thick to me, especially after washing and drying the shirt. It was pretty comparable thicknesswise to the F&M "freedom" process prints in my opinion. Have you found anyone that can do full color shading prints that have a soft hand and can be put on dark shirts? Quality is the key though! I sell mostly to construction type busineses that work their shirts to death, but want intricate designs on them. But all in all, none of them like the thick patch feel since they are wearing them out in the sun all day long. Any recomendations??


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## wormil (Jan 7, 2008)

Reeko said:


> Have you found anyone that can do full color shading prints that have a soft hand and can be put on dark shirts?


I haven't tried Cad-cuts specifically but all the full color transfers I've tried, both plastisol and versacam, had a heavy hand and were sweaty and uncomfortable in warm weather. 

The best solution I'm aware of is discharge printing where you actually bleach out the shirt dye before printing.


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## Nick Horvath (Feb 26, 2010)

Reeko said:


> Thats good to hear Rick. If you get a chance I'd love to see a write up about them!
> 
> Also, here is a question to you....have you tried any cad-cut transfers from transfer express or anywhere else for that matter? I talked to them today for the first time(customer service was incredibly friendly), as i have been looking to have prints made for a job that I just created for a customer. The image has a lot of fine detail with many colors and shading. They recomended cad-cut transfers, but they are incredibly expensive($10 a print). I actually have a roll of the material at the shop which I had my buddy print out on from his Roland versacamm. When I pressed it, it felt pretty thick to me, especially after washing and drying the shirt. It was pretty comparable thicknesswise to the F&M "freedom" process prints in my opinion. Have you found anyone that can do full color shading prints that have a soft hand and can be put on dark shirts? Quality is the key though! I sell mostly to construction type busineses that work their shirts to death, but want intricate designs on them. But all in all, none of them like the thick patch feel since they are wearing them out in the sun all day long. Any recomendations??


The Cad Printz Opaque is a very thin material with an extremely soft hand. The only downside to it is that it does not do a real good job at blocking dye migration on dark colorered polyesters. For the darker polyesters, I would recommend Express Print.


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## Reeko (Apr 10, 2007)

Thanks for the info Nick! 

Still havent heard back from the F&M department that was supposed to be looking into this...been a week and a half now!


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