# Problems with Subli Slate



## sapience (Sep 25, 2010)

Okay...I followed the vendor's instructions for Subli Slate and it looks like crap. I did the face up, heat conductive rubber, 400 degrees @ 9 minutes, med/heavy pressure. It looks faded.

So...I searched on the net, found some posts in here....I tried the face down method...same pressure, same temp & time. It's improved, but still doesn't look good. The blacks look faded...it just looks awful.

I'm going to try and insert an image/pic of the 2nd one. If any of you know what I'm doing wrong, I'd appreciate the advice & input. I really can't afford to waste substrates like this....it sucks 

SamplePhotoSlateDebiHartzell.jpg photo by rdmsapience | Photobucket


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## freebird1963 (Jan 21, 2007)

I did one and had some bad results too. Looks like flames on the one side of mine. Going back I reread the instructions and said for the size I had orderd to use a felt pad which I hadn't.


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## GordonM (May 21, 2012)

Thick glass, heavier ceramics, and sheet rock really need to be heated through. If you try to sub with the transfer on top, the thickness of the material will keep absorbing the heat. The dyes will exhaust before the substrate can come to the proper temperature.

I'd always transfer image side down. You should also pre-heat the slate. The slate draws off a LOT of heat, and your press may have trouble coming back up to temperature quickly. Pre-heat enough so that the slate is very warm to the touch, but not so hot that sublimation begins simply by placing the paper on it.

You need good pressure, so the layering, bottom-to-top, I'd suggest (and have used), is:

1/2 nomex pad
blow-out paper (protects the pad)
transfer, facing up
slate, imaging side facing down
conductive rubber (green, not red, orange, or other color) pad

The rubber pad protects the top platen from scratching. You want to get that pad hot-hot-hot before the actual pressing. So hot it singes your fingers if you don't wear heat gloves.


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## dim116 (Nov 27, 2006)

Ive been doing mine face up & have turned out perfect each time.

Teflon on bottom - sheet of paper - slate - transfer taped on face down on slate - green pad on top.
heat for 8 min. med/heavy pressure.


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## bboch7 (Aug 10, 2011)

Agree with Dim116. Only thing I would question is what paper are you using? We run Johnson Plastics paper for everything but were having problems with the slates. My Conde rep had me try the Textprint XP (We use an Epson if you use a Richo you will want the Textprint R) after the paper switch all of our slate troubles went away.


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## ajspin (Apr 10, 2008)

I had some things come out like that last week. I was using too much pressure and heat too high. Here are instrucions from coastal website - they are usually spot on.. Note time...
Position product face up in heat press
Cover with Heat Pad 
*Temperature:* 400 F 
*Time:* 250 seconds 
*Pressure:* Medium 
Remove paper *immediately*


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## GordonM (May 21, 2012)

You always have to question instructions where there is one time for all sizes, and the sizes differ greatly as they do with SubliSlate. Unless your heat press has near instant recovery time, larger slate will take longer to heat up properly. You're taking a piece of rock at room temperature to 400 degrees, a typical increase of 330 degrees. The bigger the rock, the more energy that's required to do that.

As SubliSlate isn't cheap, best thing to do is call the company you bought it from and ask for the exact times for the size you got. In the case of Conde's instructions, they give varying times based on size. They also strongly suggest not to use the DyeTrans paper, which has a lower transfer.


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## sapience (Sep 25, 2010)

thanks for all the advice, etc. I took both ruined slates and drove up to the supplier. They graciously took the time to trouble shoot and also printed a new one while I watched. I now know what went wrong. ACP Technologies....great company


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## GordonM (May 21, 2012)

sapience said:


> I now know what went wrong.


For the benefit of others would you care to share what the problem was?


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## sapience (Sep 25, 2010)

the 1st one was over sublimated...too much time...2nd one was under sublimated...too little time

small one works best 5 X 7 rectangle...teflon, slate face up, template face down, 1/8" green conductive rubber. 9 minutes @ 400 degrees.

Also a problem using Tex print paper for Ricoh. We used QC-Pro instead. I was told by the owners of ACP that they have been using that paper for 10+ years & that it always works with every substate, that the paper is from Japan, & hasn't been altered in all the years they've been making it.


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## GordonM (May 21, 2012)

sapience said:


> small one works best 5 X 7 rectangle...teflon, slate face up, template face down, 1/8" green conductive rubber. 9 minutes @ 400 degrees.


That's the time and temperature you said you used, so I'm a bit confused.

In the end, it sounds like it might have been the paper. TexPrint for Ricoh has to be faster drying. I wonder if that affects its release.

For what it's worth, if you ever try the face down method, dwell times need to be about doubled, just as they are with ceramic tile. Or you can sometimes get by with just 1.5 times if the rock is pre-heated first.


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## SaB (May 15, 2007)

My newest video about slates.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bRPjOBeLpU0&feature=youtube_gdata_player


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## sapience (Sep 25, 2010)

video isn't working


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## dim116 (Nov 27, 2006)

Works fine for me.


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## sapience (Sep 25, 2010)

finally loaded for me....great video  thanks so much for posting...really appreciate it... was surprised about the silicone sheet instead of heat conductive rubber....does the silicone work with glass, ceramic, sandstone tiles as well? Would love to hear more about this option as the heat conductive rubber is soooo expensive...


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## GordonM (May 21, 2012)

I wouldn't use a standard silicone sheet unless you've run a thermometer test to be sure it's transferring enough heat. There are MANY kinds, thicknesses, and hardnesses of silicone sheet, and the thicker/harder ones are effectively insulators that will ruin your transfers. Paul is using what appears to be a fairly thin and soft one, and he recommends pre-heating it. Those would be three requirements to avoid ruining your blanks.

Greed pad is expensive because it contains tiny bits of ground-up ceramic. It's not just a sheet of silicone. The ceramic transfers the heat, rather than acting as an insulator, which is what silicone is. The idea behind the pad is that it creates a conforming interface between the hard platen and the irregular surface of the slate.

You can save some money if you look for green pad under its technical name, thermal transfer interface material, or TIM. Laird is among the sellers of this into industry. I don't know what their minimum order requirements are.


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## SaB (May 15, 2007)

This is stamdard baking sheet. Its ok to us in high temperatures. It does work with glass and tiles. Also i use it.with some mugs.

I only recommend to preheat it when doing slates.


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## helix-2000 (Nov 6, 2007)

I just started doing the slates and so far no problems encountered with the transfers. I did have issues trying to use the recommended templates so I no longer use templates.


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## dim116 (Nov 27, 2006)

I didn't know there were templates for the slates. Post the link please.
I just made up my own templates.


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## helix-2000 (Nov 6, 2007)

I got the slate from Conde Systems and they have the templates. If you are a memeber of partnertnet then you can access them.


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## mom2maddy (Jul 6, 2012)

sapience said:


> thanks for all the advice, etc. I took both ruined slates and drove up to the supplier. They graciously took the time to trouble shoot and also printed a new one while I watched. I now know what went wrong. ACP Technologies....great company


I bought my equipment from ACP Technologies as well. My first try at sublimation was the photo slates. They came out awful and I about threw in the towel on sublimation as well. It was determined that it was probably my heat press so I bought a new one. Still had the same issues. I traded the new (top of the line) heat press in for another. Still only got OK results on slates. I even went there to have them help me trouble shoot. None of my slates came out like the example they have on display, and I was not given a reason for that.

I bought some slates from Conde and followed someone else's instructions, and they came out beautiful every time (and I've done seven of them). I don't know if it was that the quality of the slates was better from Conde (even though I was told that they all get their slates from the same manufacturer) or the new instructions, but it made all of the difference in the world! 

I now do them face down at 400 degrees for 8 minutes for the 7.8" square slates. First, I put down Nomex pad, plain paper, slate imaging side faced down with transfer taped to it, and plain paper. I use medium/heavy pressure. 

I'm curious as to what ACP said your issue was?


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