# VersaCamm Or DTG



## dan1942 (Jul 1, 2007)

Hi everyone,
Ok I trying to figure out the best way to get a professional looking print on t-shirts and apparel of all different Colors (black to white). I currently own a 
Roland Verscamm which I have made shirts with the ColorPrint Material which the image quality was great but I was just not happy with the plastic feel it had and I thought it may be assumed by a customer as being cheep. So I started to look at all the DTG machines which I really like but the black shirts with the white inks seems to start to fall apart after a few washes where the heat transfer lasts for a very long time. 
So I am unsure what I should do I am about to purchase a DTG machine probably the HM-1 Kiosk or another one coming on the market in a few weeks. Or should I just use the verscamm, I just want it to look like it is a quality shirt. 
I appreciate all your opinions and advice


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## dan1942 (Jul 1, 2007)

Also I have some samples here from both the DTG HM-1 and the Flexi-Jet. After the second wash it appears both of the shirts Printed on a black shirt with white inks on each machine seem to start to fall apart meaning slight cracking, flaking, loss of color. Should this be lasting a little longer then 2 washes? They washed in cold water and dryed in low heat. The White shirts on both machines look good the HM-1 looks a lot better in my opinion. 
I have no problem buying this machine within the next week but I hope 2 washes is not the life span with white inks.
Thanks again!!


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## vctradingcubao (Nov 15, 2006)

IMHO, the DTG will give you more professional looking results than a versacamm.


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## mikew (Jun 24, 2007)

We were faced with a similar choice recently. We opted for a Brother GT-541 rather than a VeraCamm. The main reason is that from what we've seen a DTG machine will produce a higher quality product than a VersaCamm. And do it faster and easier.
So if you can afford it and you want to focus on apparel then go with a DTG. Good luck!


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## treadhead (Jul 26, 2006)

dan1942 said:


> Also I have some samples here from both the DTG HM-1 and the Flexi-Jet. After the second wash it appears both of the shirts Printed on a black shirt with white inks on each machine seem to start to fall apart meaning slight cracking, flaking, loss of color. Should this be lasting a little longer then 2 washes? They washed in cold water and dryed in low heat. The White shirts on both machines look good the HM-1 looks a lot better in my opinion.
> I have no problem buying this machine within the next week but I hope 2 washes is not the life span with white inks.
> Thanks again!!


Dan,

You would think that samples sent out by dealers would be good. But, they should hold up much longer than 2 washes if the pretreatment / curing was done correctly (which again you would expect to be ok from a dealer).

There is a super thin material for the Versacamm that makes the prints feel better that you may want to look into. I think it's called Opaque Solutions for darker shirts (which is better but still not great) but I can't remember the other. Imprintables Warehouse carries it so Josh can probably give you more details.

The Versacamm is going to be more versitile (imo) allowing you to do signs and window decals as well. But, for shirts alone, I would still think the DTG is going to be your best bet.


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## dan1942 (Jul 1, 2007)

Thanks for the info! 

*@ treadhead* so these DTG machines with the white ink should last longer then 2 washes? What machine do you currently own? 

I do think the DTG looks more professional then the heat transfer material from the verscamm but it just needs to hold up for more then 2 washes for $17,995. I just paid off my Vesacamm this month so I have no problem getting the machine it just needs to work. 

Does everyone else here have similar results with the white inks??


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## JoshEllsworth (Dec 14, 2005)

Versacamm for the variety of things that the material can go on (more than just t-shirts). 

However, when comparing for t-shirts specifically. The Versacamm has better color vibrancy after laundering whereas the DTG has a softer feel but fades quicker. 

It also depends on your market: the Versacamm does very well in the athletic market whereas the DTG seems to thrive in the fashion market (primarily due to the actual feel of the finished good)


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## sunnydayz (Jun 22, 2007)

Hi,
I went to the mesa distributor for the DTG hm1 kiosk and got samples from them on light colored and dark colored shirts, It was nice going there because I got to see how they set it up on the computer and to see the printing process in detail. I brought them home and washed them several times and the samples still look great, in fact my husband likes them so much he wears them all the time haha. It made my mind up to buy the hm1. I do think that if the pretreatment is not done properly, then the result would be bad. Is there a distributor near you that you can go to thier company and watch the process and then take them home and wash to see what happens? I know it helped me a great deal to do that .
Bobbie


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## dan1942 (Jul 1, 2007)

Here are some pictures of the results I am looking at after 2 washes. Again both machines (HM-1 and the Flexi-Jet) prior to washing looked great and the HM-1 looked really really good.

The first ones are 2 examples of the DTG HM-1 after 2 washes




















Now here is the Flexi- Jet after 2 washes


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## sunnydayz (Jun 22, 2007)

I know when I went to the mesa distributor in anahiem, one time they did a shirt and the paper they used to put over the pretreatment before pressing stuck a little which lifted the fibers some, and that caused the print after washing to have little specks of black fabric showing through, so maybe that could be a problem with the shirt as far as seeing little specks through the ink. I think alot of times that is what makes them look faded, is that the fibers shift from washing some and cause this.
Bobbie


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## DMS (Jan 28, 2007)

This is a hoy issue. I think that the materials you use on the versacamm determine the final result. Maybe some of you can share their experience.
An other point that comes to this subject is the output ratio of DTG vs Versacamm, I heard that DTG is rather slow.


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## vctradingcubao (Nov 15, 2006)

DMS said:


> .....I heard that DTG is rather slow.


I had the same impression also. On dark shirts, you will pretreat, print, then heat press.


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## treadhead (Jul 26, 2006)

DMS said:


> This is a hoy issue. I think that the materials you use on the versacamm determine the final result. Maybe some of you can share their experience.
> An other point that comes to this subject is the output ratio of DTG vs Versacamm, I heard that DTG is rather slow.


Yes...when doing white ink on black shirts...it is a very slow process. You may get 10 shirts per hour depending on the size of your design.

But, if done properly...the shirts hold up well but do experience some fade as Josh pointed. And, the colors on the Versacamm will be more vibrant than the DTG also as Josh mentioned. 

Josh: What is that material you guys sell for t-shirts on the Versacamm. It is real thin.

By the way...I have the T-Jet II that I have been "living the learning curve" on!!


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## vctradingcubao (Nov 15, 2006)

I talked to our local distributor, he admitted that for our local market, printing white ink on dark shirts would be very expensive. He said that at the moment, we should be content on doing white shirts for profitability untill Dupont lowers their white ink price (which according to him will be soon, since Dupont is already building its white ink factory). Right now though, I'm pretty much satisfied, both cost & quality wise, with doing the white shirts on our laser transfers. So, I'll have to defer my purchase of a DTG at the moment.


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## discmann (Sep 3, 2007)

hi,
could you please let me know the price of colorprint? do you buy 75cm x 25m?
thanks
ilias


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## Gunslinger (Aug 3, 2007)

The problem with samples from the direct-to-garment manufacturers is that the staffs aren't up-to-date to the working methods of correctly producing a great print on dark shirts. Even the samples I have heard coming from the T-Jets (I own a T-Jet 3) ... great, vibrant, long-lasting prints on darks is possible, if you do em right. However, it is a slow process and it will reduce your profit margin.


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## Mabuzi (Jul 3, 2007)

DTG is great for fashion and will give that faded look. Print and cut is better for longer lasting prints especially logos.
I challenge any DTG printer to send me a printed logo on a black t-shirt to wash test! I have had Kornit, DTG kiosk and Mimaki prints and they all faded that the customers complained.
DTG is great on white t-shirts for full colour and dark t-shirts for fashion. What has put me off so far is the ink costs, time taken for each shirt to print and down time on the machines. I do realise that the operator and there maintenance regime is important. 
Saying that I am looking at an ANAJET sprint next week! Can anybody give the low down on this product?


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## sawdust (May 13, 2009)

Hi mate just check out the forum on the Anajet not good for after sales is the general opinion. I have the Text jet great kit but hard learning curve. cost for ink is expensive and is not fast way of printing all said I love it and will keep going till I get it right.


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## Stitch-Up (May 26, 2007)

I went for the Neoflex and travelled from the UK to FESPA in Munich to learn hands on and collect my machine.

I too feel a big learning curve coming on but I'm more than happy with my decision expecially having seen the Neoflex churning out one shirt after another all day long


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## 102557 (Mar 6, 2010)

check this out...

http://www.t-shirtforums.com/diy-dtg/t120740.html


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## vlcnmstr (Jan 5, 2007)

i know it's an older thread, but wondering about CURRENT differences between DTG and a machine like versa camm? part of my concern is the down time on the dtg, the fact that a machine here would sit a week or two between jobs (i have a full time day job). dtg supposedly has way more maintenance if it sits. and for the jobs i would do, the "retro" look of a transfer that shows vs the hand of dtg is fine. any input?


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## Stitch-Up (May 26, 2007)

Wow! A very old thread indeed 

I would reckon you should consider 'subbing out' your printing until you increase orders.

We have full-time day jobs and own both Versacamm and DTG.

I would say the Versacamm is okay for the smaller left breast logo and decals. DTG can print amazing quality with superb fading to the shirt colour. Yes, maintenance is king.

DTG & Versacamm both have their positives in the garment decoration marketplace. DTG can generally handle any print and the 'feel' is soft to the hand. The versacamm prints on a heat fuseable vinyl, great for small artwork but horrible for anything larger - like a slab of cold plastic on the shirt.

Just my view.

John


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## equipmentzone (Mar 26, 2008)

vlcnmstr said:


> i know it's an older thread, but wondering about CURRENT differences between DTG and a machine like versa camm? part of my concern is the down time on the dtg, the fact that a machine here would sit a week or two between jobs (i have a full time day job). dtg supposedly has way more maintenance if it sits. and for the jobs i would do, the "retro" look of a transfer that shows vs the hand of dtg is fine. any input?




Wow indeed. You resurrected a thread from 2007 and 2010. There have been substantial improvements in the dtg printer field since that time. As you mentioned, dtg printing will give you the look of a screen print with a very soft hand. The other process will give you more of a heavy transfer look. If your main concern on a dtg printer is possible issues if you let it just sit for a week or more you may want to read some of the user reviews of the Epson F2000 on the forums.
_


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## parkst23 (Sep 4, 2008)

I have a Anajet MP10i and my prints last a log time just as long as you use pretreatment on both lights and darks. I am also a screen printer and all of our shop shirts are printed using the DTG printer. I know equipmentzone is a seller but he is telling the truth. There has been great improvements in this field. Versacam printers are nice. I have one. I would never use it for printing shirts. The material that you have to use is expensive and there is no way to compete with a screen printer or someone with a DTG. The quality, feel, and longevity of the print will be better from a screen printer that uses a dtg or screen prints it. I have had all of these printers in my shop and have been using them for about 15 years now.


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## vlcnmstr (Jan 5, 2007)

i have seen all three at the ISS shows, screen printing won't serve the range of what i need to do nor is it right for the market i am looking at (smaller runs and full color prints) nor do i have anywhere near the space for screen printing.. i was looking at the versacamm (or that type of machine) for space and cost considerations.. i love the look of DTG but it too may be too restrictive in range (like the idea of doing stickers, labels, bumperstickers, cling, and the regular vinyl cutting). if money were no object, i'd get both. the last time i saw dtg, the whites and printing for dark shirts was just not there and too much "crap" to do to get a print. i will have to go to the ISS this january and ask questions and see what's new.


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## nickster (Sep 7, 2014)

DTG all the way!


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