# Ghosting images on Swing away press



## Cjoe Design (Jun 3, 2008)

I seem to have periodical ghosting when sublimenting. I tape my transfers to the t-shirts and I use teflon pillows to reduce the suction and allthough that helps, it has not eliminated the problem. I never once had this problem with my old 15X15 clamshell press, but now with my upgraded 16X20 swingaway by Geo Knight I do get this problem. It is to the point where I am pushing the Ash colored shirts because It masks any imperfections. I think this is possibly the problem because when I release the and raise the platen I am not pulling it up perfectly straight which was never a concern with the Clamshell.
Does anyone know if there is any trick or gadget you can use to ensure that the platon does not start to swing just ever so slightly whil raising of your print? I'ts getting to be sweatshirt season and every misprint is going to cost me triple.

Thanks,
Cory


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

Hi Cory. I only use swingaway presses for sublimation and have never had any problems. 

Not quite sure why you are taping your transfers to the tees? My method is to align the tee, lay protective teflon sheet on top of the transfer and press. When time is up, ease the initial pressure off then lift straight up and swing away the platen. Perfect results every time.

Only thing I can assume, is that you've got so used to clam presses, you just need to adapt your technique to swingaways.


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## BRC (Mar 27, 2007)

Cory

Instead of taping the transfer you might try using the adhesive spray such as Wilflex. What happens is when you raise the press the suction lifts the transfer slightly then releases it back onto the shirt. The 16 X 20 probably has a little more suction. Just a light spray should solve the problem.


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## SignzPlus (Sep 4, 2008)

Think BRC is on the right path ... good luck!
Juice


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

I have never used Wilflex, so not totally sure what it is. I would have assumed that any type of spray adhesive would create a physical barrier between the transfer and the garment fabric? Sublimation ink requires direct contact with polyester for the molecules to be able to migrate into the pores of the fabric. 

Does the Wilfex evaporate when heat is applied, or would the transfer still be stuck to the shirt when the press is opened? Just curious..?


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## Cjoe Design (Jun 3, 2008)

I have the wilflex spraywhich I use for mousepads koozies and other items but it's kind of a pain using in my office. I use the Tee-Squareit to align my shirts which means once everything is aligned I slide the design under the tool and tape it. It's a pretty cool tool and I would hate to have to abanden it. Using Willflex would not allow me to slide the transfer under The Tee-Squareit so I use the tape instead. Also, If you put the transfer down crooked with the spray you can't really nudge it straight.

Any word on a attachment or gadget for the press that would keep the press perfectly straight (not allowing platen to swing right) until it was raised up to the top or at least a an inch or so.


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

Cjoe Design said:


> Any word on a attachment or gadget for the press that would keep the press perfectly straight (not allowing platen to swing right) until it was raised up to the top or at least a an inch or so.


If your upper platen is swinging out like that, it would indicate that your press is not sitting level. You can remedy this with the adjustable feet. My swingaway presses sit on cut up mouse mats to keep them totally stable.

Still not sure why you using tape though. The weight of the transfer paper is enough to hold it into place.


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## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

if you lift the press...any kind...too quickly, the transfer will shift a bit..and then back down..it still has enough heat to make the second 'ghost' image...open slowly and you will not get the ghost look


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## wilfredo torres (Jan 7, 2008)

i would try applying pressure opposite to the swing as i lift


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## Cjoe Design (Jun 3, 2008)

Applying oppisite pressure does do the trick but when I am doing a bunch of prints sometimes I don't press left and I can actually see my platen shift right


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## bbgocats (May 22, 2008)

I've use the thermal tape on the back of the transfers and/or the Wilflex to pull the transfer directly off. I wasted about 5 shirts the first time I did subs and figured it out very quickly.


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## Cjoe Design (Jun 3, 2008)

I just got a small ghost after using tape on all 4 sides and I let up real slow. Tomorrow I am going to build a little spray booth so that I can go back to using the Willflex. My reason for abandoning the spray was because I work out of my office on the second floor of my house and it is a pain going down to the garage to spray each transfer when you are doing even a small shirt run. I picked up a cardboard box which I am going to convert to a spray booth and see if I can prep the tranfers in my office without having to go through the whole house.

Has anyone else made a makeshift spray booth to accomidate spraying in your house?


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## milabix (Apr 18, 2008)

Have you tried pressing without the tape? The tape might have a tendency to curl a little after you heat it up and cause the paper to shift.
You might also have the press set up to apply too much pressure making it difficult to control when you open it and causing the unit to "jump" a bit. Ease off the pressure to the point where you can open it without jerking it.
Finally check your paper or fabric for shrinkage. measure the paper before and after you press it (both length and width) and do the same with the fabric. If they do, the shrinkage is the likely cause for the ghosting.

If you set up your press correctly and your fabric or paper don't shrink you shouldn't need neither tape nor sprays.

Milabix


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## conde tech (Nov 15, 2007)

If you don't have Pro Spray or another adhesive spray....place 5 sheets of paper on the back of your transfer. I would eliminate the teflon sheet. It can trap moisture and steam underneath.


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## Cjoe Design (Jun 3, 2008)

I am going to eliminate the teflon sheet from the bottom platon. That is the one difference I made when switching to the new press. I used the teflon so that if any ink penetrated through the shirt, I could just wipe the teflon. On my old 15X15 press I used to tape regular oversized paper over the bottom pad. The paper was probably around 100lb. That always did the trick but I had to change the paper often. What is the best way to protect the bottom if you don't use teflon?

I don't believe it is the pressure because I use a teflon pillow inbetween the shirt so I don't get the press lines.


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## conde tech (Nov 15, 2007)

Keep the telfon on press....but, don't put it on TOP of the shirt..after you trun transfer face down on shrt


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## BRC (Mar 27, 2007)

Why don't you try backing off the pressure and leaving out the pillow, instead us a sheet of blowout paper? If you were getting ink onto the paper on the bottom platen then you must not have had the pillow in the middle before, correct? When you release the press the pillow is inflating and moving the transfer enough to cause the ghosting would be my guess.


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## Cjoe Design (Jun 3, 2008)

I don't get ant blowout with shirts, I don't use very much pressure the teflon is just in case. Tiles are usually the worst for me as far as blowing through the paper.

OK maybe I am not getting ghosting, could it be some sort of shift? I ask because last night I did some tests. I did extra spray on the transfer paper. It was just a test so I sprayed it real good. This sucker wasn't going to move. In fact I had to peel it off it was so adhered. my first test was perfect. I did two more tests and my last test had a shadow again. I know the image did not move.
I also waited several minutes before peeling to eliminate that variable.

I did not have this problem with my smaller 15X15 clamshell. Not once no matter how reckless I was. Now I have to be super careful while doing shirts and it is still a crap shoot. I am to the point where I will not do any orders except for grey short sleeve t-shirts. That way if it ghosts to the point that I do not want to sell it I haven't lost the cost of the more expensive clothing.


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## BRC (Mar 27, 2007)

Are you prepressing the shirts?


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## uncletee (Feb 25, 2007)

pro spray is the way to go, when you lift your press your design won't move, we always cover with a large teflon sheet. good luck


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## Cjoe Design (Jun 3, 2008)

I am pre-pressing the shirt for 10 seconds and I am pro spraying. The transfer is not moving. I just went back and looked at the used Transfer sheets and you can totally see the double image on the transfer sheet as well. Does this point to anything.

I left the Teflon fitted cover on the bottom platon but covered it with butcher paper to eliminate the slippery effect. Should I remove it completely? Is the teflon somehow sending the heat back up causing this double image? I just don't get it

Confused,

Cory Hamilton
Cjoe Design


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## BRC (Mar 27, 2007)

If you can see the double image on the paper I would guess that either you are getting it from the printer or that you are getting blow out from too much ink or not enough pressure. Sometimes the ink will blow out of the boundaries causing it to leave an image where it isn't supposed to. Does the pillow have any wrinkles where the pressure would be less than even? Does it always occur in the same place on the pillow or the same place in the image? What are the printer settings? Have you checked the press for flatness?


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## cprvh (Jan 23, 2006)

As Terry mentioned, you must either be printing it or the dyes are coming from the upper platen. Check your files. Test your press with nothing more than a piece of white scrap in it...no transfer paper...nothing. See if your scrap picks up any color.


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## Cjoe Design (Jun 3, 2008)

My press is spotless. I am very anal about that. Plus, It's a perfect double image not blow out. I did a dozen tees last night that had a baseball swish logo that included a small spot with there # on it. One of the shirts that I know did not move had a perfect drop shadowon the number. It actually looked good so I let it slide, but it wasn't intentional. This double image happens when I use my 1280 with Artanium inks or from my 4880 with Sublijet. I have used different profiles, Powerdrivers and the like. It's definately something in the setup of the press. I still have not tried removing the teflon on the bottom platon since nobody seemed to think that was an issue and I really like the protection it gives my rubber pad but I think I will try that tonight. That does seem to be the one thing that is different from my smaller press.

Could it be a temperature problem? Too hot maybe? Should I lower the temp from 400 to 390 or something?

The most frustrting thing is that this is the DK 16X20 press which is very popular and although everyone has been very helpful, I can't believe I am the only one that gets this problem. It's not the Press either because I actually had this replaced with another of the same model. My last one had a digital defect but before it was replaced I had the same ghosting problem.


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## BRC (Mar 27, 2007)

Since it happens with 2 different printers the problem is probably in the pressing. Since it is a "perfect double image" I hate to tell you this but it has to be moving in some manner. Either the shirts are shrinking or the pillow is causing some movement. The first thing I would do is to get rid of the pillow, not the teflon on the bottom of the press. The only sensible explanation seems to be either expansion or contraction while pressing. Which all leads back to the pillow. Even if you used it with the other press. The straight up action of the swing away is different than that of the clamshell allowing for expansion when released.


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## milabix (Apr 18, 2008)

Cory,

what you are going through is quite common as we all come across some stumbling block that makes no sense every now and then. In my experience when I get stuck on a problem that doesn't make sense and can't seem to solve it is because I am focusing on the wrong part of the process or I have changed something without any doubt in my mind that it could cause an unwanted result.

Try to approach the problem from a logical stand point. The only way you can get a double image is by either a shift between paper and fabric or by printing it. The heat press cannot do this on it's own unless the two platens move on their own while pressing... As you said no one seems to be having the same issue with this press so focusing on the press might be counter productive.

If I where you I would forget everything I did so far and start from scratch. Go back to when you where using the old press and set up your new press exactly the same way. If the old press had a teflon sheet on the bottom use the sheet, if it didn't don't. The same goes for pillows, paper etc... Use the same paper you where using befoe. If you purchased new paper recently make sure it is exactly the same as the one you ordered for years. the same goes for the t-shirts and tape. basically eliminate all variables so that you are left with the press ebing the only new part of the process.

Then select an image that doesn't have too many graphics on it, I would use 4 squares (one for each color, CMYK) that overlap in the center.

Finally press. If the ghosting appears while using the same exact settings on the press before you change anything try to go back in time and look at every aspect of the process and try to remember if along with he press there was anything else you changes (even if it seems irrelevant such as moving to a different room or different table). Basically assume that the press is working perfectly and look for another possible cause. 

If the problem persists start looking at the settings on the press, but don't add anything to the process such as additional sheets of paper or pillows. If your sistem worked before it must work now as long as all settigns are the same. Finally post an image of a shirt and the paper we might see something you don't...

Milabix...


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## Cjoe Design (Jun 3, 2008)

You know, I tried everything and did not eliminate the ghosting problem on a regular basis.

Last week I got an order for doing sublimation on a bunch of expensive Hockey Jerseys. My business is doing pretty good so I decided to buy another smaller press. I purchased the 15X15 Mighty press. I always missed my smaller press for it's portability so if nothing else I would have a press to do some events.

Well, The mighty press works great, No matter how reckless I am at opening or closing the press the print always comes out crisp and clean edges for a perfect print.

The Geo Knight 16X20 swing is just too finicky for doing sublimation on shirts. It works great on tiles and other hard substrates, It ican't just be my press because I exchanged it once before thinking something in the mechanism was out of line.

I don't recommend the Geo Knight 16x20 for sublimation, but I will probably need to buy another 16X20 press within a year.

What should I get??


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## jge (Oct 7, 2008)

We have a Geoknight 16 x 20 as well as a 20 x 25 (a really big press).

We don't use teflon on the base nor a teflon pillow. 
We use plain paper or silicone paper. 

No issue - no double image - nothing - and we do thousands of shirts sometimes............


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## Cjoe Design (Jun 3, 2008)

I ended up buying a 15X15 Mighty press which has never given me a ghost image yet. This led me to call DK directly and thank them for my GIANT PAPER WEIGHT. They did finally get down to thee problem and it works fine now. According to them the DK20S creates a significant amount of vaacum compared to other presses so you have to just crack the press open slightly, wait one second and then open very slowly the rest of the way. Also They had me bolt my removable platen to the press (Making it a pain to switch). So now I have an extra press for backup.

Allthough I solved the problem, it is amazing that my new clamshell press doesnt' ghost no matter how I press and The DK20s has to be babied. 

I occasionally have someone help on big orders and I will only put them on the clamshell. I can't afford having anyone transfer on the DK20S.

I guess this is only a problem with Sublimation


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## JYA (Jun 2, 2008)

I noticed the vacuum problem with my Hotronix Swinger, however, using a "tacky" paper that I purchase from Advanced Color Solutions, I haven't had any problems.


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## Moo Spot Prints (Jul 16, 2006)

You can't defy the laws of physics. Your clamshell did not produce the same amount of lift on the paper because of the way it opened -- like a clamshell.

Swing aways (especially the large ones) will produce significant suction. My 20x25 can lift the lower platen by the vacuum effect alone and it's _heavy_!

Your best bet is to use an adhesive spray and try to limit the amount of contact area. Less surface area means less suction. Restricting the air flow on the release so that it opens up slower should also help.


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## Jennjewel (Jan 18, 2009)

I know this thread is old, but I've been SUPER frustrated with ghosting. I'm actually using the Knight jet press...the smallest one for "hobby" use. I decided that it would help me decide if sublimation was right for me. Well anyway, it's the swing away, and no matter what I've tried as this thread has discussed, I was getting ghosting. It was so frustrating, that I had to walk away and research more. I wondered if everyone was settling for this ghosting look.....and now, I realize it's this Knight swing away press. I would be a whole lot on it. I'll be betting that mighty press. Thank you for the help!


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## conde tech (Nov 15, 2007)

Are you using ProSpray or heat tape?


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## Riderz Ready (Sep 18, 2008)

In working in a busy production environment we do not have the time to be able to spray or tape items. What we have found that works really well is not to close and "lock" the lid to the point it clamps all the way down. We lower the top to what we consider the sweet spot which is after you feel presure of the top meeting the bottom to continue to press down till you are about laf way to closed and locked. You still have to raise the top straight up but we have virtually eliminated any ghosting without sprays or tape.


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## Cjoe Design (Jun 3, 2008)

Jen, don't give up on sublimation, give the clamshell a try when working with apparel. It solved all my ghosting issues. Your Geo Knight swingaway is still good for all other transfers, vinyl, inkjet, plastisol etc.

I still own my Geo Knight 16X20 press and use it the most. But when it comes to sublimating on shirts, I use my Mighty Press Clamshell


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## Jennjewel (Jan 18, 2009)

I just got my spray from conde yesterday, and it does help with the ghosting, but I still get it just enough where I won't deliver the goods to the customer because it's not the best looking. If I REALLY slowly pull up on the press latch and raise it so slow it barely moves, it works...but I also found another thing that helps. My fabric pieces are slightly slick...and they're only 8 by 11.5, and so after getting irritated, I took some tshirt material that also came from Conde and I did a pic on that. NO ghosting...not a tad. I realize it's how finicky my fabric is and the parchment paper I use under it and over it (I'm a novice, yes) is causing it to shift JUST enough in spots when I raise the press. I'm also wondering if it's because my press has a bare metal heat plate??? If I had one with teflon, would that work better???? I don't give up too easy....but one of my customers emailed me today and said she ironed over one of my pieces, and it made the ink "run" and get on her ironing board. DUH...why didn't I think about that issue if they heated the ink up again, that it might do this. Do I need to just tell people they can't iron over my images??? Thanks for any advice. It's awesome to have people that speak my language.


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## freebird1963 (Jan 21, 2007)

I have a hix 15x15 swingman press.
I have the teflon protector on the bottom.
I tried the spray and found it to be a hassle so I taped my sub transfers down. Piece on each corner diagonal. Sometimes teflon on top sometimes not. 
I use the teflon pillow to stop the blow through.
I have not had any ghosting issues (now that being said..).
I would say I don't always lift slowly either. Sometimes I space off and rip it open. Even had a a few transfers fall back down on when removing. No ghosting.
Sometimes I prepress the shirts sometimes I don't.

Now I also don't press at 400 either. I have been pressing at 360-370 F for 55 seconds. I use a DK temp probe to get the press into that range. 

When I was pressing at higher temps things just didn't seem to be as good.

Good luck
Mark


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## uncletee (Feb 25, 2007)

we just use a small spray of pro spray from conde, It won't hurt your design and we swear by it.


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