# Hi guys, have a question about paying the graphic designer flat rate fees and royalties



## ArtistGal (Jan 3, 2016)

So currently I'm doing my first graphic illustration work for a clothing company, for their first t-shirt collection which is small, 5 shirts.
The client is going to pay me a flat rate fee of $500 all together for the 5 shirts, so $100 for each design on the shirts.

I was advised from people around me to ask for a % from their sales. So I'm wondering, how much % should I ask for?

She really loves my work and I'll be designing for 3 more t-shirt collections somewhere around this yr and a possible tote bag collection. 

Thank you


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## David09 (Oct 2, 2015)

i think 15% is a good percentage all over profit


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## JosephRegan90 (Dec 26, 2015)

i think 20% is better


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## ArtistGal (Jan 3, 2016)

Thanks guys 

Hopefully she agrees *fingers crossed* ^^


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## Kenneth59 (Sep 28, 2013)

ArtistGal said:


> So currently I'm doing my first graphic illustration work for a clothing company, for their first t-shirt collection which is small, 5 shirts.
> The client is going to pay me a flat rate fee of $500 all together for the 5 shirts, so $100 for each design on the shirts.
> 
> I was advised from people around me to ask for a % from their sales. So I'm wondering, how much % should I ask for?
> ...


This is your FIRST graphic illustration work for a clothing company and already you want a percentage of the sales? Guess you can ask for it but with no track record I am betting it will be hard to get a percentage of the sales this time around, maybe i'm wrong.


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## ryanmontgomery (Mar 7, 2014)

Hi, I just want to confirm something. Do you want paid plus a percentage or just the percentage?


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## ArtistGal (Jan 3, 2016)

Kenneth59 said:


> This is your FIRST graphic illustration work for a clothing company and already you want a percentage of the sales? Guess you can ask for it but with no track record I am betting it will be hard to get a percentage of the sales this time around, maybe i'm wrong.


Well I was advised to ask for royalties along with the flat rate fee. What if the t-shirts sell? I think it's fair to get my %


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## ArtistGal (Jan 3, 2016)

ryanmontgomery said:


> Hi, I just want to confirm something. Do you want paid plus a percentage or just the percentage?


She's going to pay me a flat rate fee, but I'm also wondering to ask if I can get a %


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## ryanmontgomery (Mar 7, 2014)

Personally I think you are being greedy. You want two bites of the cake, your client is taking all the risk by paying you for a design that may not sell. I pay my designers the odd time I use them and if the designs sell I hire them again but I won't give them a cut.

I'm based in Northern Ireland so maybe we do things differently here.


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## GTP30 (Dec 18, 2015)

ryanmontgomery said:


> Personally I think you are being greedy. You want two bites of the cake, your client is taking all the risk by paying you for a design that may not sell. I pay my designers the odd time I use them and if the designs sell I hire them again but I won't give them a cut.
> 
> I'm based in Northern Ireland so maybe we do things differently here.


IMHO that is the way it should be done. The client pays you to design it and then you're done getting paid. If you want to get a percentage then I'd say you should at least discount the design fee in exchange for X percentage of sales. 
In the end it's your effort/work and time so if you want the flat fee and a percentage go for it, just don't be surprised if the client goes somewhere else next time.


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## ArtistGal (Jan 3, 2016)

ryanmontgomery said:


> Personally I think you are being greedy. You want two bites of the cake, your client is taking all the risk by paying you for a design that may not sell. I pay my designers the odd time I use them and if the designs sell I hire them again but I won't give them a cut.
> 
> I'm based in Northern Ireland so maybe we do things differently here.



I'm not being greedy what so ever, that was my LAST intention. 
It's not like I'm demanding a %, I haven't said anything to my client yet, because I'm not sure, that's why I came here. 
If she doesn't agree then fine, at least I asked, and I won't wonder, I guess I should then ask for a higher flat fee.

And artists work so hard for clothing companies, we're pretty much slaves, there's nothing wrong with giving them a bit credit. You're not an artist nor designer, you should put yourself in the shoes of one and see how it feels.


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## ArtistGal (Jan 3, 2016)

GTP30 said:


> IMHO that is the way it should be done. The client pays you to design it and then you're done getting paid. If you want to get a percentage then I'd say you should at least discount the design fee in exchange for X percentage of sales.
> In the end it's your effort/work and time so if you want the flat fee and a percentage go for it, just don't be surprised if the client goes somewhere else next time.


But, she's the one who said, she'll pay me 100$ for each shirt, and I was happy and excited I got the job, that I accepted her offer. 
I'm a fair person and I'm willing to negotiate with her, she said she's a flexible person, so she may agree.


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## brandonlaura (Dec 26, 2015)

I think 25% is perfect because your skills are included in it


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## Kenneth59 (Sep 28, 2013)

ArtistGal said:


> But, she's the one who said, she'll pay me 100$ for each shirt, and I was happy and excited I got the job, that I accepted her offer.
> I'm a fair person and I'm willing to negotiate with her, she said she's a flexible person, so she may agree.


so you were happy to even get the job for $100 a shirt, then why try to renegotiate now?


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## Printor (Apr 16, 2015)

You have already made the deal. When some one tries to change the terms of a deal they made with me, after the deal is done, I will never do biz with them again. I will also pass that info on to anyone interested in a reference. The professional thing to do, would be to learn from this and improve your negotiation skills for later. Don't get yourself blackballed from the industry. Social media can ruin you overnight now.


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## ArtistGal (Jan 3, 2016)

Kenneth59 said:


> so you were happy to even get the job for $100 a shirt, then why try to renegotiate now?


Because at the time, I quickly accepted the job and pay, I mean I love the job, I rather be doing freelance art work than having a regular job. I'm a recent grad, so I really wanted job experience in the creative field. So when I got the job offer, I took and I was really happy and still am, and I was fine with the flat rate fee. But, when I started telling my family, friends and former illustration teachers, they all told me to get paid by the flat rate fee and the royalties, so that's when I started to re-think things. I'm actually really shy to bring this up with my client. I guess, maybe, I should see how the 1st collection goes, and then for the next the next collection, I should do things differently.


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## ArtistGal (Jan 3, 2016)

Printor said:


> You have already made the deal. When some one tries to change the terms of a deal they made with me, after the deal is done, I will never do biz with them again. I will also pass that info on to anyone interested in a reference. The professional thing to do, would be to learn from this and improve your negotiation skills for later. Don't get yourself blackballed from the industry. Social media can ruin you overnight now.


I understand. I have a question, since, she wants me to design for her other t-shirt collections, plus tote bags, can I offer new negotiations? Since it will be all new projects?


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## ryanmontgomery (Mar 7, 2014)

ArtistGal said:


> I'm not being greedy what so ever, that was my LAST intention.
> It's not like I'm demanding a %, I haven't said anything to my client yet, because I'm not sure, that's why I came here.
> If she doesn't agree then fine, at least I asked, and I won't wonder, I guess I should then ask for a higher flat fee.
> 
> And artists work so hard for clothing companies, we're pretty much slaves, there's nothing wrong with giving them a bit credit. You're not an artist nor designer, you should put yourself in the shoes of one and see how it feels.


I'm a professional photographer so I don't have to put myself into an artists shoes, I've worn them full time 6 days a week for over ten years. I also think you misunderstand the meaning of slavery.


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## vizualbyte (Jun 26, 2008)

Theres too many issues with royalty payments. First is trust issue. There would be no way for artists/designers to really know what sold and what didn't. Then theres the accounting factor involved. Unless its a big agency and royalty is part of their business model, I wouldn't do it. How are you supposed to know if one of your shirt designs sell a year later? The logistics of keeping accounting of all these things isn't worth the time and effort.

$100 per design doesn't seem much unless your style is simplistic and you can continuously churn out 2-4 designs per day.

Since you have stated you are a recent graduate and happy for any work, i guess this is a good starting point but i would advise against trying to get commission as most of that is hope wishing for sales.

Try to figure out what your rate is if someone hires you for freelance work. I usually mark up my rate 30% normal rate if i know they plan to resell my designs. You are handing over your creative content and sometimes thats pretty valuable.

If your style is very popular and many people want to work with you, consider licensing out your designs. That way you keep the copyright and you give them the license to print out your designs for a number of runs or time limit.


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## Tonya6232 (Jan 3, 2016)

I say if you already sealed the deal don't renegotiate. might lose the entire contract right along with destroying your name or company


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## Printor (Apr 16, 2015)

ArtistGal said:


> I understand. I have a question, since, she wants me to design for her other t-shirt collections, plus tote bags, can I offer new negotiations? Since it will be all new projects?


 If she asks you for more art, it will be because she is OK with the product quality/price combo. She will not be exited about paying more. Only you know this clients personality. Sales is a very delicate art form. Push a tiny bit to hard, you make nothing. Don't push hard enough, you only make a little. Gotta push juuuuust enough without plummeting over the edge. I think most of us gave away a lot of free or cheap artwork in the beginning. Building a good, expensive looking portfolio faster, should help you command more $ sooner. I wish I made a lot more $ off my artwork than I do, But I'm a printer, and make most of my money off the printing. Most of the printers I know got into printing because they got tired of watching everyone else making money off their artwork over and over. There is a 99.99% chance this clients "LINE" is not going to go anywhere. So $500 bucks Up front was probably a good thing compared to a percentage of nothing. In this biz, I rarely see someone get paid for the piece, + residuals later.


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## Kenneth59 (Sep 28, 2013)

ArtistGal said:


> Because at the time, I quickly accepted the job and pay, I mean I love the job, I rather be doing freelance art work than having a regular job. I'm a recent grad, so I really wanted job experience in the creative field. So when I got the job offer, I took and I was really happy and still am, and I was fine with the flat rate fee. But, when I started telling my family, friends and former illustration teachers, they all told me to get paid by the flat rate fee and the royalties, so that's when I started to re-think things. I'm actually really shy to bring this up with my client. I guess, maybe, I should see how the 1st collection goes, and then for the next the next collection, I should do things differently.


so use this as a learning experience, like someone said above, i would never do business with someone that accepted a deal then tried to renegotiate it as we went along. Ive had that happen numerous times over the years and i dont tolerate that, a deal is a deal. So rack this up as your learning experience and try negotiating a flat fee plus percentage next time because if you dont and approach them about a percentage it very well could p them off.


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## CutEdgeEmb (May 12, 2008)

ArtistGal said:


> So currently I'm doing my first graphic illustration work for a clothing company, for their first t-shirt collection which is small, 5 shirts.
> The client is going to pay me a flat rate fee of $500 all together for the 5 shirts, so $100 for each design on the shirts.
> 
> I was advised from people around me to ask for a % from their sales. So I'm wondering, how much % should I ask for?
> ...


If my graphic designer wanted a cut of the sales after getting paid a flat rate for a job, my reply would be thank you for your past work...and I would move on and find another designer. I pay per item created and would be offended if I was asked for a cut of the pie -- it seems like you want to double dip.


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## scottlance (Jan 15, 2016)

I think as a designer ya thats tough but the payout I've had to do for a decent design that im taking a risk whether it will sell or not is around the 400-700 price range. T-shirt companies really don't profit a whole lot in sales you have to sell a shirt and design at least 500 times to make it worth doing. 

A thought to consider putting yourself in the business owners shoes is this they have to pay someone to print that design and they also have to pay to order the shirts unless they have some type of product that they can sell for a high price and make 10-20 off a shirt profit it would be difficult for me as a business owner justifying paying someone to make my t-shirt designs that wants 25% commission that is literally impossible they would make little to no money unless your talking about having a big enough audience to sell over 5,000 shirts to put it in a even bigger perspective in order for a business to even make an average salary if lets say they profit $5 a shirt they would have to sell 500 shirts a month to make 30,000 a year. 

Then you add in that 15-25% request you want on top of that and I just don't see how that would even be possible. You may want to look into 99 designs and become a designer for them and you enter contest and get a cut if your design wins over the person looking for a new design. Yess it must be difficult to be a designer but get your name out there create great designs then offer a steeper price but i don't personally know many designers that are able to get a percentage or royalties on top of that. I know i wouldn't do it but if you strike that type of deal you better hang onto it best of luck to you. ~Scott


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## trickinsid (May 17, 2014)

I would say you did pretty good on what you were paid for your work. I agree with what has been said - I wouldn't come back and ask for royalties. Lesson learned, but I think you did good anyway. You can't get that kind of deal on 99designs....ha. In the future, figure out the details and what you want / need from the transaction and go from there. Again - I think you got a pretty good deal to begin with.


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## Comicsans (Nov 7, 2012)

Yeah dont change the original deal. Going forward you can change it up. Yet if the business is not set up for royalties it is probably best to get a flat rate. 

If someone only wants to use designers that charge a flat rate, that is perfectly fine. I only use flat rate designers. If someone wants royalties, I move right along. It is how the market works. If I can find someone to do the design for less that is what I am going to do. 

It is perfectly fine for op to try to negotiate for the most money out of each design. Whether that is a higher flat rate or royalties, will probably take some experimentation


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