# My Solution for Emulsion that won't come out:



## nativeera (Jun 4, 2009)

Okay I don't know if this is major to you all or not: 

Here is my experience and here is my solution for Emulsion that seems to not want to wash out:


1st:
Trying to wash off emulsion after applying Reclaimer but letting the Reclaimer dry onto the emulsion too long causing the emulsion to harden and so difficult to remove or (Thinking it isn't possible to remove hardened emulsion).

2nd:
Trying many other solvents or house hold items:
(I've tried Ink Thinner, Applying more and more Reclaimer, even letting the Reclaimer set for a while and constantly spraying on layers and layers of Reclaimer, Applying Reclaimer and Power Washing it out, Applying Oops - All Purpose Remover and Cleaner, Applying Oops - Amazing Remover)
Those are a few options I tried: Failed:

Finally:
I applied Clorox - Toilet Bowl Cleaner with Bleach. Reason: I thought if I used just bleach by itself, it might eat through all of the mesh as well. So I toned it a bit down. 

By letting it set for about 1 hr and 20 minutes, the Clorox Toilet Bowl Cleaner Thinned out the hardened emulsion and I was able to finally wash out the screen clean. And it even washed out where there a particles in between each space, so it was pure clean.

(Note: This Screen has been sitting for about 2 Months before I found a solution)

Also

I used up the soy solvent that is used for washing out ink, so I used 100% Vegetable Cooking Oil!!!!! It Worked!!!!




Please note That, 
If you have some other of resolving this in your own way, please post it up as I did. It would be helpful to us all!! Because sometimes I think that there are secrets that printers don't want everyone to know, I may be wrong though.

Thank You and I hope this helps you as well.

Peace


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## A Perfect Pixel (Jul 4, 2008)

I found sometimes just blasting the hard to remove emulsion spots with extremely hot water will sometimes get them out too


wait a minute... did you just say you cleaned ink out of a screen with Vegetable Oil?

Was it Plastisol or Water Based Ink?


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## nativeera (Jun 4, 2009)

A Perfect Pixel said:


> I found sometimes just blasting the hard to remove emulsion spots with extremely hot water will sometimes get them out too
> 
> 
> wait a minute... did you just say you cleaned ink out of a screen with Vegetable Oil?
> ...



Believe it or not, it is Plastisol Ink!!! I have never used Water Based Ink, but I would like to!!


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## INKFREAK (Jul 24, 2008)

No conspiracy,Long time screenprinters that do screens every day dont let the reclaimer dry on the screens. I will blow off phone calls if I have chemicals on the mesh.
First,clean the ink out of your screen using a waterbased solvent.Like a citrus based cleaner,wash off with water.Now most emulsions are mostly water.So the citrus/water rinse acts as a wetting agent for the reclaimer.
Next,spray a proper reclaimer front and back.scrub it around and wait a minute or two.Then rinse with a powerwasher.Do not walk away,take phone calls or space out.
No secerts,just work and a powerwasher and no nasty household chemicals.
Degrease and dry,call it a day ,have a beer and coat them in the morning.


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## Solmu (Aug 15, 2005)

I agree with inkfreak; there is no conspiracy, there are no secrets. It's just that professionals act professionally, so there aren't a bunch of tips on how to do things half-assed.


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## nativeera (Jun 4, 2009)

Solmu said:


> I agree with inkfreak; there is no conspiracy, there are no secrets. It's just that professionals act professionally, so there aren't a bunch of tips on how to do things half-assed.


Sorry but this doesn't help.

_"Please note That, 
If you have some other of resolving this in your own way, please post it up as I did. It would be helpful to us all!! Because *sometimes I think* that there are secrets that printers don't want everyone to know, *I may be wrong though*."_


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## Solmu (Aug 15, 2005)

nativeera said:


> Sorry but this doesn't help.


It would if we could convince you you were wrong. But telling a paranoid person they're paranoid does little to aid their paranoia.

You can resolve things your own way, or you can resolve them right. Our helpful advice is that you should resolve them right.

You can choose to follow that, or not. Others who also choose not to follow that might have some "helpful" specific home remedies to recommend to you, and can post them in this thread.

But the relevant recommendation that I choose to contribute to this thread is that you're barking up the wrong tree, and that you're wasting your time. You could help yourself by not doing that.


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## nativeera (Jun 4, 2009)

Solmu said:


> It would if we could convince you you were wrong. But telling a paranoid person they're paranoid does little to aid their paranoia.
> 
> You can resolve things your own way, or you can resolve them right. Our helpful advice is that you should resolve them right.
> 
> ...


sorry to tell you this but this is my way of making this work.... please re read my post.... 

and it does work for me and if somebody wants to use this method then they can, they don't have to... this thread was meant to give somebody hope not argue....

my solution.... and it works... if it doesn't help you then why respond of if you don't have any advice to give us in this thread, then please, let those who find this useful, let others know.....

remember if this doesn't help you then i'm sorry....

I KNOW WHAT I'M DOING AND IT'S NOT WRONG BECAUSE I'VE DONE IT AND PERHAPS YOU HAVEN'T.... PERHAPS YOU WANT TO DO THINGS ACCORDING TO THE SCREEN PRINTING HAND GUIDE... FOR ME I JUST FOUND ANOTHER SOLUTION... THIS AIN'T JUST FOR YOU DECIDE WHATS BEST FOR THE REST OF US... 

IF YOU WANT TO RETALIATE IN THE WAY YOU, THEN DON'T WASTE MY TIME SAYING SOMETHING YOU MAY NOT HAVE TRIED...


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## midwaste (Apr 8, 2008)

I want to hear more about using Vegetable cooking oil to get plastisol ink off... This doesn't seem like it would work and it would create a huge mess..


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## nativeera (Jun 4, 2009)

midwaste said:


> I want to hear more about using Vegetable cooking oil to get plastisol ink off... This doesn't seem like it would work and it would create a huge mess..



Hey... the only thing I can say is, it works for me. I'm not saying it's the only way but it's another way of doing it. You can try it..... a mess is a mess but you can not do it perfect in cleaning. It's up to you!!!

Hope it works for you!!!

Peace!!!


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## denck (Apr 7, 2009)

Just a thought-Have you considered
1. The Chemicals that your using are actually "locking in the Emulsion
2. Use the right tools for the job ( Screen reclaimer)
3. Clean your sreens out after done.
4. Dip tanks 
5. Heat 
That said I have personaly posted Tricks of the trade. Do a search and you would be amazed at what you find.
You say we as printers Hide those tricks- I'd say yes to a certain degree
"YOU GOT TO PAY TO GO TO SCHOOL" and why would I want to give all my secrets away to my competitor whos undercutting me every chance he gets?


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## nativeera (Jun 4, 2009)

denck said:


> Just a thought-Have you considered
> 1. The Chemicals that your using are actually "locking in the Emulsion
> 2. Use the right tools for the job ( Screen reclaimer)
> 3. Clean your sreens out after done.
> ...



I understand but some of you don't understand, is that I used Other Chemicals to get out emulsion that don't seem to want to come out of the screen. (because some of us make mistakes and leaving on reclaimer too long, then try to wash out the emulsion but can't because it locked onto the screen, therefore, seeming impossible to wash out)


And to you answer your number 1 issue, I used the bleach to wash out the emulsion that don't want to come out.

I think honesty, slow down when you read, seems you didn't read my post very carefully.

Not all of us have all the equipment we need. Sorry.

TO answer your last quote, You went to school and used all your money and much knowledge was gained so I understand Why you don't want to waste your money. Sorry your so damn selfish.
And about the competitor, what does washing out the screen have to do with getting ahead of you and I. If he can't get the emulsion out, don't be dumb, he will just buy another screen. Resulting for your sake, remaining a competitor after it all (even it means washing out a screen). This whole forum is filled with tips n tricks and places to purchase items and so forth. Will you tell them all the same thing you told me about secrets and so forth?













Smilies    [More]

I urge you to re read my post.....


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## denck (Apr 7, 2009)

"(that I used Other Chemicals to get out emulsion that don't seem to want to come out of the screen. (because some of us make mistakes and leaving on reclaimer too long, then try to wash out the emulsion but can't because it locked onto the screen, therefore, seeming impossible to wash out)"

Why- do the job right the first time and you wont "LOCK in the emultion"

("I used the bleach to wash out the emulsion that don't want to come out.")

Bleach-Although it works, is the worst thing that you can use on a screen
To Quote Richard Greaves
"Water or solvent resistance of a stencil depends on the complete cross-linking of the ingredients by the sensitizer with UV energy. If the exposure time is too short, or UV energy doesn't move all the way through the stencil, the cross-linking is incomplete, and complete resistance isn't achieved.

UV energy reacts with diazo or photopolymer sensitizer in the stencil and causes a chemical cross-link between the two components that make up the "emulsion". Linked together, and woven in and out of your mesh, the exposed/cured/hardened stencil will not dissolve with water and rinse own the drain.

Industrial stencil removers use Sodium MetaPeriodate (SMP, CAS 7790-28-5), to attack these cross-links, releasing breaking down the stencil so it will dissolve, and you can reclaim the mesh and coat it again.

If you let this "soup' of stencil remover & emulsion dry on the mesh before you can rinse them down the drain, they form a new chemical bond that is permanent. There is no chemical to break down this chemical combination except the brute force of water pressure. Yes you will also lose mesh tension blasting the mesh as it vibrates like a drum, if the stencil doesn't come out. If you use 3,000 psi water, you don't even need a chemical to breakdown your stencil, but it helps to have tight mesh to resist the pulsing water from a pressure washer.

This this hard to reclaim effect also happens with *under-exposed stencils*. No cross-links - hard to reclaim.

A stencil may have worked OK with harmless plastisol, but if you clean the ink with a strong solvent, the solvent can attack the defenseless under-exposed stencil and *chemically bond it to the mesh *that only a razor blade can fix.


Bleach _is used _to remove *gelatin indirect stencils*, but bleach is inferior to SMP for breaking UV cross-linked diazo or SBQ. It takes more bleach to do the work of a small amount of SMP. 

Many will answer, "but it works", this is a classic do you have time or money question. 

When you go home I want you to use a key to open your front door, not the kick of brute force.

If your going down the bleach route then White vinegar will remove the emulsion

("Sorry your so damn selfish")
You just dont get it- As a business man who's been in this industry for many years 
I want to help start-ups, but sometimes it helps when those start ups help themselves and figure thing out for themselves. Looking on your Past posts I see alot of the same questions that has been asked here time after time after time.
Unwanted Ink On Shirt / URGENT Best paper /One Color /- Image Price List./ Need help with mixing PaintColors / Securityshirt/ How long to print a shirt?/Fluorescent Bulb Image Expo

Do yourself a favor and use the search and find the answer to your question. 
Your question was answered the first time you asked this


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## nativeera (Jun 4, 2009)

denck said:


> "(that I used Other Chemicals to get out emulsion that don't seem to want to come out of the screen. (because some of us make mistakes and leaving on reclaimer too long, then try to wash out the emulsion but can't because it locked onto the screen, therefore, seeming impossible to wash out)"
> 
> Why- do the job right the first time and you wont "LOCK in the emultion"
> 
> ...



It was simply letting the people now how I attempted to remove the difficult mistake I made. And how I found a solution for this problem. Thats why I posted up asking so many question and concerns in the past. I was not given a definite answer by any so I did it my self.

Perhaps others who are new to this like I am, it will help them as well.

Thanks for your time.


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## Unik Ink (Nov 21, 2006)

We occasionally have an issue with small bits of emulsion not coming out. We harden our waterbased screens as well, so they are sometimes difficult to reclaim with regular emulsion breakdown chemicals. The best stuff that I have found is a powdered emulsion remover from CCI. You mix just a small bit of this stuff with a gallon of water and it cuts through the emulsion. If it doesn't come out right away, we reapply, scrub some more, and use the pressure washer right up next to the spot, and it comes out. The company I use for chemicals quit carrying this stuff, so I was stuck with less potent chemicals, but I will never use anything but the CCI powdered remover again. Spray on, scrub, let sit 20 seconds, spray off. It pretty much melts off when you are scrubbing it in.


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## foodaba (Jul 30, 2009)

Here is a thought......Believe it or not i had the same problem, dried in emulsion.....brought my screen to the do it yourself carwash.... used their high pressure wand (i
didn't have one at the time) solved the problem!!


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## carbaba (Dec 10, 2006)

i cleaned my screen the same way native because i let the reclaimer dry. so it is a useful quick fix when things go wrong.I wish people would not so anal about it. several different roads can lead to the same river.


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## INKFREAK (Jul 24, 2008)

Wow ,out for a week and what a cluster bomb of a thread. Hey everyone quit being SO defensive.I'm just trying to spread my 25+ years around without holding back.
I'm Scottish so I tend to be cheap, so I go with what works and has proven itself.I get consistent results without bleeding my bank account.I am also a tree hugger so I want to have as little impact on this great earth and not muck it up.Small amounts of chemicals with high pressure,1800psi,3000psi is over the top .water ,cold. and the fish and I can breath.


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## JonnRamaer (Aug 7, 2009)

Hey Nativeera, 

I am in the Caribbean and I too use bleach. I know that you do not only use bleach... i mention that because I think someone in an earlier post misunderstood you. It seems they thought you were using bleach as you regular reclaimer. I guess they didnt notice that you said you used screen reclaimer first, it dried and set in, then you found that the bleach-product helped. 

I use a normal hand held spray bottle, containing 3/4 water and 1/4 bleach. set my screens face down, spray from the inside (after cleaning out all the inks with wash-up) and leave them to sit about 20 - 30 mins, whilst I do other stuff like stretch screens, check orders, etc.

I dont bother with pressure washers, I dont like the noise. 
I use a manual sprayer, the kind which requires pumping the handle at the top to build some pressure. Its silent and effective. The only issue is that it needs refilling after every 8 screens or so. But with bleach/water mix and that sprayer, the emulsion washes out just as soft and easy as it does with regular screen reclaimer. 

This technique is not professional, but at 10pm on Friday when i need reclaimer, my supplier says they are closed next week for stock taking.... using bleach (or vinegar,did someone say?) is a nice trick that gets one out of a jam.

I am sad to see the thread had carried a sort of mini-argument for a while there. After all, we are here to help one another, right folks?!

Nativeera, keep posting, keep courage. Try not to get angry at the others if they misunderstand you. I get angry too when I am misunderstood, very angry. Try to be patient with them. 

I appreciate your post. It is encouraging. Thanks.


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## JonnRamaer (Aug 7, 2009)

Hey Nativeera, 

another question... vegetable cooking oil to remove ink? Hmm, curious. I like alternatives, in case regular materials are not available. 

How do I apply it? How did you do it?


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## wonubee (Oct 2, 2007)

Hey thanks Nativeera for sharing your discovery. I'm one of those non professional amatures who makes mistakes from time to time too, because, well we all start out as amatures and well some of us aren't anal retentive perfect people. So I love posts like yours that actually give suggestions on how to solve a problem. I havn't locked emulsion in a screen yet but I may some day or my kid might and now I have something to try to clean it out. So keep it up man cause it's good stuff like this that keeps me coming back to this forum.


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## Solmu (Aug 15, 2005)

JonnRamaer said:


> I am sad to see the thread had carried a sort of mini-argument for a while there. After all, we are here to help one another, right folks?!


I don't think nativeera was misunderstood - people understand and simply disagree. I think it's really important people learn that expressing disagreement is perfectly healthy. It doesn't mean we don't understand your viewpoint - it just means we think you're wrong. If no-one corrects ignorance and false assumptions, people are left to keep making mistakes. What you call a sad mini-argument, I call a positive attempt to help someone to learn and improve their print practices.

It is precisely *because* we are here to help one another that several people chose to post in this thread advising _against_ these practices. If we didn't want to help, we'd leave people to carry out every crazy idea they come up with without so much as a single warning. It would leave us with less headaches to leave people to their own devices. It wouldn't be very helpful or considerate though.

You're welcome to choose to interpret "Don't do this" advice as some kind of mean spirited personal attack, but the fact is we offer it because, from our professional point of view, it is *much* better advice than "I don't really understand how or why this works, nor have I thought through potential negative consequences of my actions, but I know it works so I'm sure it's fine..."

Let me put it another way: it would be downright *irresponsible* of us if we let these threads go by without comment, instead of posting warnings so that impressionable newbies can hear more than one side before they go and do something one guy said was a good idea (no-one said _not_ to, right?). Clearly some people are going to do whatever they want no matter what advice they hear, but some people like to hear a discussion (you know, two sides) before making a decision that could affect their health. For the sake of those people, we contribute these *helpful* posts of advice: don't do things half-assed. Just because you get results, doesn't mean it's a good idea.

I'm not here to jump on every single message that offers a new tip, but it isn't fair to criticise the best advice in this thread, the advice that comes from those with the most experience (and I'm not referring to myself here), the advice of those who actually know what they're talking about, as "not helpful".

If you want to use bleach on your screens, go for it. If people want to advise against it, just let them have their say as well.


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## midwaste (Apr 8, 2008)

Beautifully put, Solmu.

People come to this forum to get answers to questions and to learn. Is there going to be some "Eureka!" discovery that radically changes screenprinting or eliminates the need for established procedures and products, possibly, but probably not. This isn't exactly a new field.

As Solmu says, it's irresponsible to let "what-ifs" go unchallenged, as it brings down the level of overall knowledge and discourse of the forum. If you can back your claims/discoveries up, by all means, please share.


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## INKFREAK (Jul 24, 2008)

I agree Lewis, it would be irresponsible if we did not give the right advice and stick by it.Insisting on proper practices for safety's sake does not make anyone anal retentive.ie:dont put your finger in the light sockets kids.
I can only hope that the people on this site will take our best advice and adapt to their needs and realize that we are firm about things for a good reason.However there will always be those OSHA nightmares out there,films and shows like Jackass and the number one Youtube.Lord,look at Jerry Springer,people line up to get on that show.You cant get through to everyone so peace out and know you did your best.


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## JonnRamaer (Aug 7, 2009)

Great guys! Thanks. 

I didnt want to seem offensive or anything, I just thought Nativeera seemed put off a bit by the way the advice was expressed. I think use of "half assed" sorta caused some irritation...know what i mean?

I get it, really. No worries about advice/ correction from professionals. Learning can't stop, especially in young printers like myself. 

Authority is good. Particularly the authority of experience and confirmation.


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## anniken (Aug 17, 2011)

Unik Ink said:


> We occasionally have an issue with small bits of emulsion not coming out. We harden our waterbased screens as well, so they are sometimes difficult to reclaim with regular emulsion breakdown chemicals. The best stuff that I have found is a powdered emulsion remover from CCI. You mix just a small bit of this stuff with a gallon of water and it cuts through the emulsion. If it doesn't come out right away, we reapply, scrub some more, and use the pressure washer right up next to the spot, and it comes out. The company I use for chemicals quit carrying this stuff, so I was stuck with less potent chemicals, but I will never use anything but the CCI powdered remover again. Spray on, scrub, let sit 20 seconds, spray off. It pretty much melts off when you are scrubbing it in.


you said that the company you used quit carrying it..? do you know who does and about how much it should run? i have screens that i can not get emulsion out of and it's not because the reclaimer dried. it's just not working.


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## INKFREAK (Jul 24, 2008)

Naz Dar/ Source One carries CCI products. Use the CCI stencil concentrate. 1 liter makes five gallons. I don't know how much you use but you can make it weaker or stronger based on how much water you add.

It's around 35 for a liter but it goes a long way and works really well.Good luck!


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## glenglen (Jan 4, 2010)

Thanks nativeera for posting your useful findings.


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## PhilR (May 3, 2011)

I had some emulsion that had hardened on a screen. Then I bought a pressure washer. Not an amazing one, just something cheap. Problem solved.


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## Unik Ink (Nov 21, 2006)

anniken said:


> you said that the company you used quit carrying it..? do you know who does and about how much it should run? i have screens that i can not get emulsion out of and it's not because the reclaimer dried. it's just not working.


Old post, but some may still be looking for this. Pocono Mountain Screen carries the crystals which are $61 for 1 lb. It makes about 10 gallons, so that is $6.10/gallon. One of my suppliers told me that most liquid screen reclaimers consist of these crystals with water/fragrance added in different concentrations, so in reality you are paying $20-$30/gallon for water and fragrance.


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## brewersthings (Dec 9, 2011)

might try the bleach on some old screens some one gave me that don't clean up well


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## varnaip (Jan 13, 2016)

JonnRamaer said:


> Hey Nativeera,
> 
> I am in the Caribbean and I too use bleach. I know that you do not only use bleach... i mention that because I think someone in an earlier post misunderstood you. It seems they thought you were using bleach as you regular reclaimer. I guess they didnt notice that you said you used screen reclaimer first, it dried and set in, then you found that the bleach-product helped.
> 
> ...




You Sir just saved my day. VINEGAR won the match! (after really messing up, c.a. 3 hours of unsuccessfully trying to remove some leftover bits with other stuff and huge doses of reclaimer)


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## Kenneth59 (Sep 28, 2013)

guess we are old fashioned. Emulsion remover we get from our supplier, then 2200 psi power washer. Takes pure polymer emulsion right out, even on the rare occasion that the remover dries on the screen.


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