# Crystal Press by Ioline



## howie

Hi,

Curious if anyone in the forum is using another rhinestone system by Ioline called Crystal Press. 

This looks like another system besides Roland and DAS getting into the rhinestone business.

I checked Ioline's website and could'nt find any information on it. 

Maybe I will compare the system out when I get to ISS at Long Beach in the next few weeks.

Regards,
Howie


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## Kleverrr1

Hi,
I received that flyer in the mail promoting this machine. It looks like ISS long beach will be it's first showing since they don't have any information on there website.


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## RnRBerlin

Ioline has posted information about the Crystal Press system now. Ioline Crystal Press Motif Maker

It appears to be a basic vinyl cutter with a crystal placing head instead of the knife. Reading through the information it comes with one bowl but can be "upgraded" to two bowls to hold two different sizes and or colors.

I have been unable to find a price on it as of yet. If any one gets that please post.


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## DAGuide

RnRBerlin said:


> I have been unable to find a price on it as of yet. If any one gets that please post.


Check this link out - Compare the Ioline Crystal Press to other Motif Methods. It says that it is $4,000.


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## VIXEN

I went to the ISS show in Atlantic City and the guy was giving a demo of the machine and it broke also the machine can only use Swarovski crystals it does not use Rhinestones


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## michaeld

Hi

I live in Brussels (Belgium) and i just want to know the price of Ioline Crystal press machine.
i already receive price in euro from a special supplier (europe) but i think that too expensive 

thx


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## veedub3

This is not a new machine. I have a friend that has been using this since early last year. Not sure when it hit the market but it has been out.

Katrina


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## michaeld

Hi Katrina,

Thanks for your answer but do you know other sytem to press rhinestone ?


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## veedub3

michaeld said:


> Hi Katrina,
> 
> Thanks for your answer but do you know other sytem to press rhinestone ?


Eagle ultra force. A member on here I think sell this model.

Katrina


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## Guest

Ioline has a nice video on their site about this machine. I purchased it last month and am using it now. If you have any questions you can email me on this site or privately.
Vanessa


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## bonitaboutique

I am very interested in purchasing an automatic rhinestone setting machine but, when I called SWF I realized it was totally NOT in my budget.

I then found this thread and would like to know the differences between the Eagle Ultra and the Ioline Crystal Press and the prices. Am I correct in assuming that the Eagle Ultra only cuts the holes and you have to place the rhinestones yourself? I wanted a machine that places the rhinestones.

Can someone disclose the price of the Ioline Crystal Press?


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## bonitaboutique

I am very interested in purchasing an automatic rhinestone setting machine but, when I called SWF I realized it was totally NOT in my budget.

I then found this thread and would like to know the differences between the Eagle Ultra and the Ioline Crystal Press and the prices. Am I correct in assuming that the Eagle Ultra only cuts the holes and you have to place the rhinestones yourself? I wanted a machine that places the rhinestones.

Can someone disclose the price of the Ioline Crystal Press?


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## Monte Carlo

Last year I checked with Ioline for the crystal press it was $6000...


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## SandyMcC

bonitaboutique said:


> I am very interested in purchasing an automatic rhinestone setting machine but, when I called SWF I realized it was totally NOT in my budget.
> 
> I then found this thread and would like to know the differences between the Eagle Ultra and the Ioline Crystal Press and the prices. Am I correct in assuming that the Eagle Ultra only cuts the holes and you have to place the rhinestones yourself? I wanted a machine that places the rhinestones.
> 
> Can someone disclose the price of the Ioline Crystal Press?


With the Eagle Ultraforce or a host of other cutters, you do have to place the stones yourself but it's not difficult if 

(1) You cut the pattern from the right material 

(2) You make the circles a bit larger than the stones and 

(3) You use a very specific brush to easily get the majority of the stones positioned upwards in your template.

Here's a video to show you how easy it can be:

YouTube - Cutting Motif Rubber for Rhinestone Patterns


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## Guest

The Ioline does place the stones. That is why I wanted it. I don't have the time to cut stencil and then shake stones. The design is stored in your system. When you need another transfer just pull up the design, load the transfer paper in the CrystalPress, put the stones in the cup and push GO.
I love mine.
Vanessa


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## SandyMcC

ringtailusa said:


> The Ioline does place the stones. That is why I wanted it. I don't have the time to cut stencil and then shake stones. The design is stored in your system. When you need another transfer just pull up the design, load the transfer paper in the CrystalPress, put the stones in the cup and push GO.
> I love mine.
> Vanessa


Without a doubt, if one can invest $6000 in the Ioline, it will eventually pay for itself in the time savings.


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## bonitaboutique

I have to call them and see. I don't have the funds just sitting in a bank account but, I do have some I can put down. I had read it was $4,000 and now someone posted it's $6,000... that's a big difference. It would be different if they offered lease or financing options. We are a new company but, we already have interest in what we will offer.

I still don't understand how shaking stones will automatically place them correctly, with the crystal facing front. Do you have to go through the transfer and flip all the ones that are placed incorrectly?

I just don't want to spend $2,000 on a machine and then end up having to replace it because we don't have time to shake stones.


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## LB

It has been my experience that Ioline doesn't sell direct. They sell through distributors. It could be that they are quoting $6000.00 to cover their distributors. I have owned an Ioline Smart Trac plotter, the same one, for about 10 years. It works as good today and it did the day I got it. It has 500grams of force and will cut sandblast mask etc. If Ioline hasn't changed their policy, they support their machines with tech support forever. Their a good company, very reliable and are not a "Johnny come lately" to the industry. They produce heavy duty machines widely used in the textile industry.


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## SandyMcC

bonitaboutique said:


> I have to call them and see. I don't have the funds just sitting in a bank account but, I do have some I can put down. I had read it was $4,000 and now someone posted it's $6,000... that's a big difference. It would be different if they offered lease or financing options. We are a new company but, we already have interest in what we will offer.
> 
> I still don't understand how shaking stones will automatically place them correctly, with the crystal facing front. Do you have to go through the transfer and flip all the ones that are placed incorrectly?
> 
> I just don't want to spend $2,000 on a machine and then end up having to replace it because we don't have time to shake stones.


As I mentioned in Message 14 on page 1 of this thread, the key is in using a very inexpensive brush that helps with getting the stones right side up. I've watched it as I'm brushing the stones and the tiny little bristles on this Shur-Line touch up pad tend to flip out the upside down stones and then other stones are filled into those holes. So the key is to just keep brushing the stones around and you'll visually see that most of the holes end up being filled correctly within a minute. Then you just fix the ones that are remaining, which is usually just a few. I show this in the You Tube video if you want to watch it.


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## bonitaboutique

Sandy,

I watched the video, thanks for sharing! Just a quick question though, what software are you using and how much is it?


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## LB

Just a question..do you have enough rhinestone business to justify $4000 to $6000 to just get a template cut and the stones put in it? Seems to me you could just buy the software to make the holes ($200 or so) and with an inexpensive plotter and a little time accomplish the same thing.


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## bonitaboutique

LB said:


> Just a question..do you have enough rhinestone business to justify $4000 to $6000 to just get a template cut and the stones put in it? Seems to me you could just buy the software to make the holes ($200 or so) and with an inexpensive plotter and a little time accomplish the same thing.


Larry - you are right...  I think we are going the cheaper route, until it picks up. I have a lot of interest but, no real business right now. 

But, now I have to figure out what would be the best plotter machine, and software and since I'm new to this, I just wanted to be as informed as possible as to avoid a mistake and lose money.


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## LB

bonitaboutique said:


> Larry - you are right...  I think we are going the cheaper route, until it picks up. I have a lot of interest but, no real business right now.
> 
> But, now I have to figure out what would be the best plotter machine, and software and since I'm new to this, I just wanted to be as informed as possible as to avoid a mistake and lose money.


Mind you, I am not a rhinestone applicator at this time, but I have been looking at the possibility of making templates with my laser engraving machine. In the process of this, I picked up a couple of things. One of them is this software -_Winpcsign 2010. You might want to look at it, a demo is available on their site. If you are going to cut templates with a plotter, you need to get one with enough downforce to cut Hartco 25mil sandblast mask, which seems to be pretty popular for templates.I would say 500grams of down force. If I start cutting them with my laser, I will probably use oilboard. 
_


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## SandyMcC

bonitaboutique said:


> Sandy,
> 
> I watched the video, thanks for sharing! Just a quick question though, what software are you using and how much is it?


I'm using KNK Studio Maxx which comes with the KNK cutters. We have other versions of the same software with drivers for the Graphtec cutters or some people use the $139 version to create rhinestone templates to export as .EPS and .AI for importing into their own cutting programs.


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## bonitaboutique

SandyMcC said:


> I'm using KNK Studio Maxx which comes with the KNK cutters. We have other versions of the same software with drivers for the Graphtec cutters or some people use the $139 version to create rhinestone templates to export as .EPS and .AI for importing into their own cutting programs.



So, would I be okay with the KNK Studio Maxx and the $139 software?
Also, Does the KNK Studio Maxx also cut vinyl, felt and fabrics?


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## SandyMcC

Actually the MAXX comes with the software! So you don't need to separately purchase the $139 version. And yes, the Maxx cuts vinyl, felt and fabric and a host of other materials. If you want to cut fabric, then I recommend also ordering the fabric blade sold by Accugraphic.


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## Krusty

Hi,

I'm with Ioline. I'm sorry I missed this discussion earlier. I don't where I was.

I'll try to answer some of the questions about the Crystal Press. First, about the price. The current price is $5900 for the two-bowl system. The $4000 price was for a one-bowl system. At that time, the introductory price for the two-bowl system was $5000. The one-bowl just never sold, and was discontinued, because everyone liked the two-bowl better. There are some accessories you might need, such as additional sorter wheels for additional stone sizes. It comes with two 10ss sorter wheels.

At this time, we ONLY sell the Crystal Press direct. We are doing this to learn about the market and to give the best possible customer support (so we are not "one-level removed" by having distributors).

The Crystal Press includes a very simple software package called CrystalStudio that lets you import Corel(tm) or Adobe Illustrator(tm) vector files. CrystalStudio lets you select stone size, spacing, copies, etc. and it applies the stones onto "layers", one layer for each color or size of stone, You can have up to 16 layers, which are applied directly to the heat transfer sheet, two at a time. 

We also have a design program called Ioline Design, which is similar to other programs that are discussed here, but it has certain features that make it work well with the Crystal Press. It has, for instance, the ability to convert files from other rhinestone programs into files that will work with the CrystalStudio/Crystal Press. 

I want to thank LB and Vanessa for the kind words. We try to build simple, sturdy machines that get the job done as quickly and as easily as possible. You can visit [the Ioline website] to see a video that will answer more questions or you can e-mail me or just ask me here and I'll try to answer.

Krusty


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## txshirts

Krusty said:


> Hi,
> 
> I'm with Ioline. I'm sorry I missed this discussion earlier. I don't where I was.
> 
> I'll try to answer some of the questions about the Crystal Press. First, about the price. The current price is $5900 for the two-bowl system. The $4000 price was for a one-bowl system. At that time, the introductory price for the two-bowl system was $5000. The one-bowl just never sold, and was discontinued, because everyone liked the two-bowl better. There are some accessories you might need, such as additional sorter wheels for additional stone sizes. It comes with two 10ss sorter wheels.
> 
> At this time, we ONLY sell the Crystal Press direct. We are doing this to learn about the market and to give the best possible customer support (so we are not "one-level removed" by having distributors).
> 
> The Crystal Press includes a very simple software package called CrystalStudio that lets you import Corel(tm) or Adobe Illustrator(tm) vector files. CrystalStudio lets you select stone size, spacing, copies, etc. and it applies the stones onto "layers", one layer for each color or size of stone, You can have up to 16 layers, which are applied directly to the heat transfer sheet, two at a time.
> 
> We also have a design program called Ioline Design, which is similar to other programs that are discussed here, but it has certain features that make it work well with the Crystal Press. It has, for instance, the ability to convert files from other rhinestone programs into files that will work with the CrystalStudio/Crystal Press.
> 
> I want to thank LB and Vanessa for the kind words. We try to build simple, sturdy machines that get the job done as quickly and as easily as possible. You can visit [the Ioline website] to see a video that will answer more questions or you can e-mail me or just ask me here and I'll try to answer.
> 
> Krusty


I have a few questions:
1) Does IOline plan a 4 bowl machine?
2) How much does the material cost?
3) Why is it limited to 15" or 12.75" long? (assuming 12.75" wide)... why not 36" long so I can gang more stuff on one sheet of material.
4) How much waste of material at the front and back? (our GCC plotter hates to cut right up to the edge of any material and the Roland that preceded it was the same way)
5) How much is the transfer material and where does it have to come from? 
6) What are the realistic production numbers on 300 stone designs? The sales lit says 3000 stones per hour, but the videos I have been able to find look slower then 50 stones per minute. 

thanks,


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## Krusty

Hi Brian,

I'll try to answer all your questions without being too much of a sales guy, but since I see that you are in Texas, I hope you can come to the *Ft. Worth ISS Show* later this week. We are introducing a new model, the *CrystalPress II* that has faster throughput and is optimized for Asian stones. It also handles rhinestuds as well as rhinestones.

_I have a few questions:_
_1) Does IOline plan a 4 bowl machine?_

No, but you can apply up to 16 layers of different stone sizes and/or colors in sets of two on the same sheet.

_2) How much does the material cost?_

The heat transfer material comes in a package of 26 13.5"x12.5"sheets for $39.50.

_3) Why is it limited to 15" or 12.75" long? (assuming 12.75" wide)... why not 36" long so I can gang more stuff on one sheet of material._

We are introducing a new 13.5"x30" sheet at the show. I don't know the pricing on those yet. The original idea was to keep the sheets easy to handle when loaded with stones, but the new larger sheet will allow you to print a design and then trim that piece off while leaving the rest of the sheet in place.

_4) How much waste of material at the front and back? (our GCC plotter hates to cut right up to the edge of any material and the Roland that preceded it was the same way)_

I leave about 1/2" on the front and back edge. You can go flush to the left and right edges. The latest software has tools for ganging multiple designs as close together as possible.

_5) How much is the transfer material and where does it have to come from? _

Answered above, it is sold only by Ioline so it ships from the Seattle area where the machines are made. Keep in mind that you save the cost of the template material, the backing sheet, and that there are time and cost savings in the reduced manual labor.

_6) What are the realistic production numbers on 300 stone designs? The sales lit says 3000 stones per hour, but the videos I have been able to find look slower then 50 stones per minute. _

Honestly, I don't see that figure in our literature (maybe it was in an early press release?). but the speed numbers have bounced up and down as we developed the firmware and sensors. The videos on YouTube are really old, but I have always quoted 35-40 stones per minute on the CrystalPress I which is a safe number for that model. The new CrystalPress II has 20% faster throughput than the previous model so the best answer I can give for a 300 stone design is less than 8.5 minutes for the new model. I really think the best answer is, come to the show and judge for yourself.

Thanks for your interest.

Krusty


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## txshirts

There is a link on this system that goes to the UK division's compare-to sheet... it lists 3000 stones per hour, which is 50 stones per minute. 30 to 40 looks correct from the YouTube videos. I would suggest making a video and posting it so that people can get a virtual tour of the machine. At the price point this machine is at it's still very attractive as an option to manual placement. 

Template material is less than $1/sf currently.


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## Krusty

Hi Brian,

If you dig around on Youtube, we have a video similar to what you described.

HTH,

Krusty


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## doctordun

We saw this at the Ft. Worth ISS Show and loved it. Now, we have to save enough to buy it. No more debt for us in this economy.


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## gail12

Hi,

Has anyone seen the CrystalPress II. What new features does it have? Is it a lot more expensive than the CrystalPress I?


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## ccourtenay

doctordun said:


> We saw this at the Ft. Worth ISS Show and loved it. Now, we have to save enough to buy it. No more debt for us in this economy.


So what was it you loved about it..how was the ease of use and the way you could possibly make things up on the fly...I purchased one (the 2) and I have to wait until end of Oct to get it..they are sold out. I'm curious to find out what an unbiased person has to say about this machine.

Thanks, Cindy


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## vgary

Me too! I am very interested in finding a more "automated" way to lay down stones. The shake/brush method is OK, but time consuming. I had someone helping me today and while he shaked/brushed out 24 transfers, I heat pressed 4 designs on 32 shirts, tagged them, bagged them, boxed them up. He was not able to finish, ran out of 6ss stones and it took him like 4 hours. So, yeah, I need something faster. The Ioline is looking promising.

I'm concerned, though, about the transfer material, it seems pricey. I wonder if there is a way to use cheaper consumables.


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## doctordun

We have been sending out designs for others to make our crystal transfers and we always dislike the "minimum" requirements for each design and the wait involved for the designs to finally get back to us. The Crystal Press is the first machine to be within reach of our limited budget. We are looking forward to creating our own designs. We do mostly embroidery and this will be a way to incorporate more rhinstones in our designs and we can produce them as we need them and not have to keep a big inventory. The software that comes with it is very easy to use and that was a big plus. It appeared to be a program developed for this process and not a corel draw add-on. 30 or 40 cents versus several dollars per design will help this pay for itself.....or at least that is our plan.

Doc


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## txshirts

Here is a brief recount of my visit to IOLine's booth to see the Crystal Press II along with my impressions of it.

I walked up and said hello. There were 3 gentleman in the booth. The individual who goes by Krusty here, another sales rep, and an older gentleman who was in a bad mood and rather bitter. When I asked for Krusty he looked at me like I'd spat on him and the 3rd guy finally figured it out.

The bulk of my time at the booth was spent listening to the older guy bash the CAMS machine over "complexity" and being "industrial". He went on about how on his machine the castings are made in Oregon, and how the machine was end-user serviceable.

After about 5 to 10 minutes the sales rep was able to get the computer to send a design to the machine.

I brought up that the material was 8x more expensive then my current source. IOLine sells sheets of transfer paper for $1.56 each in packs of 26. In my opinion, the point of automation is to lower the cost of production, not transfer the cost from labor to materials.

Yes, they are introducing a 30xwidth material, but they are not adjusting the cost. It will be priced proportionately. 

One thing I thought was interesting is that they had run low on stones 3 hours into the show and had subsequently mixed clear (shiny) with rhinestuds.

Anyhow, so the machine began to run. It's slow. but we already knew this. I estimated it was placing about 1 stone per second.

As I watched it, something looked strange about the stones. I commented that they were all upside down...... I'm used to doing them with a template.... and the gruff response from Mr. Bitter was that of course they were all upside down. I then looked closer and saw that yes, of the 100 stones on the film, 98 were glue-up which is correct, but 2 were glue-down which is UPSIDE DOWN.

When I pointed this out, the comment was, well you occassionally have to fix one or two. Um, NO. 2% defects is as bad as doing it with a template. The idea of a machine is not to use a pair of tweezers!

Now let me contrast my visit to the All-American and SWF booths.

At All-American I met my sales rep. He was very nice, but didn't remember spending 30 minutes on the phone with me 2 days before the show. Ah sales reps.... gotta love them. Anyhow, the machine did exactly what he said, it did it quickly, and was about $14K. They were showing the direct to fabric version and while it's nice, I want a motif builder. All-American has a nice option. Stone discs are a tad expensive though at $450. All American wouldn't discuss other companies even when asked how the machine compared to CAMS which they used to carry.

SWF was a big booth. They had a 6 color, 4 head-6 color, and mini cams (2 color) on display. Everyone there was very knowledgeable and nobody mentioned anyone else. The machines just ran. Far from being a toy, the machines are indeed Industrial. They use Festo pneumatics which are a major name brand. Yes, they have some machined parts, but the machines are well built. They have a few options for connecting a computer.

While the mini wasn't running at 150 stones per minute, it was running much faster then 50. When I asked SWF about the speed they said the air pressure in the convention center was on the low-end of what the machine needs.... so it might not have enough vacuum being generated. Okay, that's a legit answer. Even so, when it would pick and have an issue the crystal would fall back in the bowl and the machine would sense this and pick again. Each crystal placed was in the right orientation and in the right spot. I'd much rather have pick failures wind up in the bowl then upside down, etc. 

Lastly, when you compare $5900 for the Crystal Press to 11,900 with compressor (or $10,900 without) there just isn't a contest. The CAMS works right and is substantially faster and will work with any material for transfer material.


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## Boomerbabe

Thank you, Brian. Really good information.


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## txshirts

Sure thing.... I forgot to say I watched the CAMS Mini run a 1054 stone design twice.... with ss6 stones in close placement.


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## doctordun

txshirts said:


> Lastly, when you compare $5900 for the Crystal Press to 11,900 with compressor (or $10,900 without) there just isn't a contest. The CAMS works right and is substantially faster and will work with any material for transfer material.


I suppose it is a matter of perspective and availble cash. I can't afford an extra 6,000 just to get a couple stones correct. 

My experience at the booth was very different. The personell were courteouse and helpful and even let me try the software. 

Since I've never gone with the brush and shake with a template method, I don't have an opinion except that I want the easiest method I can find where I can design the transfer on my computer and within a few minutes, have the product.

Since we do mostly embroidery, I can bring my embroidery design into the software, place the stones where would like them, and make the transfer. For doing one of a kinds, this is a solution that appeals to me.

We don't have a big business on stones at the moment and 10 or 20 designs a week would be fine for us.

Doc


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## txshirts

It would be just fine for what you are describing. If we had seen this machine prior to buying the DAS system we would have bought this instead as the small additional investment is minor.

However, we have the need for more precision and the ability to do more volume, so this machine is under-sized for us.

To put stone placement issues in perspective, they are identical to threadbreaks in a design. Can you imagine having a 5000 stitch design that broke the thread twice every time you ran it? That is unacceptable to me as it runs the cost of the job up by requiring additional labor. It also can impact quality if your operator isn't paying attention.


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## sjidohair

Great info again Brian,
thanks

so you are leaning towards the Cams unit,, ?
what model number.
also with the cams, do you need special transfer tape as well?
and what size is the output on this machine, in the 11,000. range?
thanks
Sandy jo
MMM


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## txshirts

sjidohair said:


> Great info again Brian,
> thanks
> 
> so you are leaning towards the Cams unit,, ?
> what model number.
> also with the cams, do you need special transfer tape as well?
> and what size is the output on this machine, in the 11,000. range?
> thanks
> Sandy jo
> MMM


I signed the paperwork for the CAMS machine..... It does just under 10x12 (9.8x by 11.8x) That will cover the majority of what we do and considering that rhinestones are primarily a front decoration for women, that's an appropriate decoration area that avoids issues associated with body profiling and excess attention.

Body profiling is a nice way of grouping the issues related to left chest placement, belly, bust, etc for women. Women will get what I'm referring to instantly.... Guys, just realize that women are sensitive to how things look and prints that are too far to one side, too tall, too big, or too wide may not look right on all women.

Excess attention is closely related and encompasses the same issues where mistakes in design sizing and placement may make a woman feel uncomfortable about wearing a shirt with that design. In these cases the woman is reacting to a concern about having a part of her body emphasized by the shirt. One example, sweatshirts with an elastic tail call attention to the midsection. My mother hates this because she feels it calls attention to her figure. When she was younger she wore Juniors and now she doesn't. She prefers seamed sweatshirts such as the Authentic Pigment boxy sweatshirt that just hang down and hide unflattering body countours.


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## sjidohair

Brian 
Did you decide to lease or Purchase,, ?
If leasing can you give us details, montly payment, balloon, and how long?
Thanks for all your leg work in this,, 


And what software is this compatalble with,, for exporting designs are already designed?

MMM


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## txshirts

sjidohair said:


> Brian
> Did you decide to lease or Purchase,, ?
> If leasing can you give us details, montly payment, balloon, and how long?
> Thanks for all your leg work in this,,
> 
> 
> And what software is this compatalble with,, for exporting designs are already designed?
> 
> MMM


Sure..... a few points first.
1- I have ample, high-quality air as part of my screenprinting operation. So I did not need a compressor or dryer as I have both of those.

2- I've been in business since 2002 and have revenues over $1MM/yr so my finance choices may be different than someone just getting started. Conservation of cash and conservation of credit are extremely important when you are getting started.

As for my choices:
My first pick is to put it on a credit card that I have open. I need a small line increase on this particular card and I'm waiting on that to happen. That would give me a minimum monthly payment of $220 and the ability to pay it off in about 9 months according to my cash flow projections.

My second option would be to lease and I'm waiting on a quote for that to materialize. The estimates were 10% payoff and around $350/mo on 36 months.

If the line increase doesn't materialize I may also opt for some cash and the balance on credit card. I normally don't think a credit card is a good finance tool, but this is a reasonably small purchase (10,900), I currently have reason to believe that sufficient cash will exist to payoff the debt within 12 months, the minimum required payment is easy enough to live with should things get tight, it is a dischargeable debt should things go to hell.

A lease and a term loan usually will both carry fees and closing costs.... a credit card doesn't.

In addition, I have an existing business module that I'm simply upgrading so revenue to offset the cost is less of an issue.


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## txshirts

Oh, and yes, I recommend that you always consider the dischargeabilit of a debt..... SBA Loans in particular are a bad choice should you need to go out of business. Nobody ever wants to close up shop, but you need to keep in mind that should you become disabled, etc what is the fallout if the business suddenly needed to go away?

I used to think you could just ignore that... but the last couple of years have made me realize that things can always get worse.... lol, SBA Loans are one of the few that don't go away under most circumstances.


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## sjidohair

Thanks Brian, Tons of info ,, and I love that,, Thank you for also breaking down all the info as well, 

Sandy jo
MMM


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## Krusty

txshirts said:


> Here is a brief recount of my visit to IOLine's booth to see the Crystal Press II along with my impressions of it.
> 
> I walked up and said hello. There were 3 gentleman in the booth. The individual who goes by Krusty here, another sales rep, and an older gentleman who was in a bad mood and rather bitter. When I asked for Krusty he looked at me like I'd spat on him and the 3rd guy finally figured it out.
> 
> The bulk of my time at the booth was spent listening to the older guy bash the CAMS machine over "complexity" and being "industrial". He went on about how on his machine the castings are made in Oregon, and how the machine was end-user serviceable.
> 
> After about 5 to 10 minutes the sales rep was able to get the computer to send a design to the machine.
> 
> I brought up that the material was 8x more expensive then my current source. IOLine sells sheets of transfer paper for $1.56 each in packs of 26. In my opinion, the point of automation is to lower the cost of production, not transfer the cost from labor to materials.
> 
> Yes, they are introducing a 30xwidth material, but they are not adjusting the cost. It will be priced proportionately.
> 
> One thing I thought was interesting is that they had run low on stones 3 hours into the show and had subsequently mixed clear (shiny) with rhinestuds.
> 
> Anyhow, so the machine began to run. It's slow. but we already knew this. I estimated it was placing about 1 stone per second.
> 
> As I watched it, something looked strange about the stones. I commented that they were all upside down...... I'm used to doing them with a template.... and the gruff response from Mr. Bitter was that of course they were all upside down. I then looked closer and saw that yes, of the 100 stones on the film, 98 were glue-up which is correct, but 2 were glue-down which is UPSIDE DOWN.
> 
> When I pointed this out, the comment was, well you occassionally have to fix one or two. Um, NO. 2% defects is as bad as doing it with a template. The idea of a machine is not to use a pair of tweezers!
> 
> Now let me contrast my visit to the All-American and SWF booths.
> 
> At All-American I met my sales rep. He was very nice, but didn't remember spending 30 minutes on the phone with me 2 days before the show. Ah sales reps.... gotta love them. Anyhow, the machine did exactly what he said, it did it quickly, and was about $14K. They were showing the direct to fabric version and while it's nice, I want a motif builder. All-American has a nice option. Stone discs are a tad expensive though at $450. All American wouldn't discuss other companies even when asked how the machine compared to CAMS which they used to carry.
> 
> SWF was a big booth. They had a 6 color, 4 head-6 color, and mini cams (2 color) on display. Everyone there was very knowledgeable and nobody mentioned anyone else. The machines just ran. Far from being a toy, the machines are indeed Industrial. They use Festo pneumatics which are a major name brand. Yes, they have some machined parts, but the machines are well built. They have a few options for connecting a computer.
> 
> While the mini wasn't running at 150 stones per minute, it was running much faster then 50. When I asked SWF about the speed they said the air pressure in the convention center was on the low-end of what the machine needs.... so it might not have enough vacuum being generated. Okay, that's a legit answer. Even so, when it would pick and have an issue the crystal would fall back in the bowl and the machine would sense this and pick again. Each crystal placed was in the right orientation and in the right spot. I'd much rather have pick failures wind up in the bowl then upside down, etc.
> 
> Lastly, when you compare $5900 for the Crystal Press to 11,900 with compressor (or $10,900 without) there just isn't a contest. The CAMS works right and is substantially faster and will work with any material for transfer material.


Hi Brian,

I regret that you and I didn't get to speak directly to each other. It 
seems to be a rule that, if I am expecting two separate people at a 
show, they will arrive at the same time. The couple I was helping when
you came by had spoken to me before the show and they drove way across 
Texas, check in hand, to buy a CrystalPress. They had a lot of 
questions and, by the time I got finished, you were gone.

I'm also sorry that you didn't have a good experience in our booth. We 
try to answer everyone's questions and respond properly to their 
concerns and if you feel that didn't happen, then we failed somehow. I didn't hear the conversation, but I would guess that you asked about the CAMMS. I have to note that saying that it is "complex" 
isn't necessarily "bashing" it, 
nor is is saying its "industrial" as you state further on. They are just very different different machinesbuilt with different philosophies.

Regarding running out of stones, I think there may have been some sort 
of misunderstanding. We had plenty of Asian stones and rhinestuds on 
hand. We ran stones in one bowl and studs in the other just to show 
that we could do that.

The big issue that I feel I have to address is the upside-down stones. 
Asian stones can vary in size by 15-20%. If a stone is 15% too big 
then it won't fit the cup and it won't get picked up. If a stone is 
15-20% too small, then it may fall into the cup upside-down and 
it can get placed that way.

I don't doubt that you saw what you say you saw, but I feel I should 
also state what I saw over the three days as well. I ran a 2"x2" two- 
layer heart
design with 57 placements, stones on one layer and studs on the other. 
Each 12.5"x13.25" sheet finished with 5 rows of 5 hearts for a total 
on each sheet of 1350 stones. I did 2-4 of these sheets each day. Some 
sheets had 2-3 upside-down stones. That is a successful placement rate (on those sheets) of 
99.852% to 99.778%.
If we had been running a better, more consistent stone, the successful placement rate 
would have been even higher, but we wanted to run inexpensive Asian 
stones and studs since they are so popular. I don't know what kind of 
stone the other guys were using.

Finally, as to the indirect suggestions that the Ioline (small "o" btw), is, by comparison, a 
"toy". I can only say that the new CP 2 pickup and placement system 
has been tested thru several million cycles so far and it is still going 
strong. We have been building plotters and motion control technology 
in America for 26 years. Our plotters are in use around the 
world in some very hostile shop conditions. For twice the money, we 
could have built a faster, more complex stone placement system, but we 
felt that is not what the market wants (especially in this economy). 
We wanted to build an easy to afford, easy to use system for the shops 
that don't do rhinestone work exclusively and that's what the 
CrystalPress is. If it's not the system for you, that's ok, but we had 
a real good show, so I think a lot of people think it's a good choice 
for them.

Krusty


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## Guest

I was at the ISS in Ft. Worth and did visit the Ioline booth. I had a good visit with "Krusty" Tom and met JoAnn face to face. I had talked to her on the phone many times and is very pleasant. As far as the older guy, I didn't meet him. I have the first model Crystal Press and am enjoying it. The tech support has been wonderful. Brian, I am sorry you had a bad experience. I hope you'll give another chance.
Vanessa


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## Red Fox

I also looked at Crystal press at a previous Long Beach Show. I now met a guy in NY that has one you can only run certain crystals, it gets lots of jams, also only can run certain material to place crystals on.


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## Guest

You can buy the transfer material by the roll and cut your own from a company called Coleman and Company. That makes it more cost effective.


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## txshirts

ringtailusa said:


> You can buy the transfer material by the roll and cut your own from a company called Coleman and Company. That makes it more cost effective.


That is a huge factor in the total cost of the crystal press. However, the speed and the hostile/arrogant attitude are also important. I'm glad it works well for you and I think for situations where cost and production speed are not important it would be fine.

Keep in mind that some of my work is retail and some of my work is contract. Contract work must be inexpensive, quick, and precise. I can't plan on having 45 seconds of labor per transfer and wind up spending 3 minutes fixing it. That translates to a loss of about $1 due to excess labor costs. How do I get to $1? Easy. Labor costs are $12.50/hr or less for production staff. Temp agency would charge me $12.50/hr for a $8/hr employee, and we start our basic production staff at $8/hr. That means that my hard cost is 20.8 cents per minute. Now, multiply that by a factor of 2 and you have what you should be selling labor for. That's roughly 41 cents/minute. 41 cents per minute times 2.25 is 92.25 cents and in this case we'll round the cost up to $1.

As a business owner you need to have a return on all investments, including the purchase of labor. This allows you to absorb minor inefficiencies and mistakes and still make money.

by the way, temps are something new for me this year, but they work really well because I can scale up or down my staff with just one phone call. If my business drops off I can send them home and reduce my overhead. If I get slammed, which is what happened this month, I can bring additional workers in. Most production tasks are not skilled labor.... catching T-shirts, pulling t-shirts, counting t-shirts, bag and fold, trimming embroidery, pressing designs on t-shirts, making buttons, and assembling awards. It's what I call LCF Labor. (Lucy and the Chocolate Factory). Step Step Repeat.  They do require supervision though... which is where permanent employees shine.... I can leave them unattended for longer periods with fewer surprises.


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## allhamps

Hey Krusty, I was seriously considering a Crystal Press after having realized that I went through 20 feet of 15" stencil material for single names alone, that I may never use again. What a waste of template material. I even have a webinar set up for tomorrow evening. Now my concerns, after reading some of your information are as follows:

Am I to understand that I can ONLY use your pre-cut transfer sheets to make my transfers? This would be a definite deal breaker for me as I have my transfer paper specially cut at 15" and shipped in from overseas at an extremely good price.
What's the deal with the "Asian stones" comments? Is this machine designed for stones made specifically somewhere else or some "other" type of stones? Again, a major deal breaker for me as I do use Korean stones, the top quality, and have them shipped to me directly.
I was moving away from the cams and cams type machines because frankly, I have no experience with things like compressors, don't currently have the space or electrical capacity to run those machines, but do have the business to support its purchase. I was leaning towards the Crystal Press for the immediate, to help me eliminate the waste of stencil material and a lot of time on "single-use" transfers, but it won't make sense, if that reduction in costs/time is simply transferred somewhere else if I have to do something different for transfer paper and rhinestones. Maybe you can shed some light here BEFORE I bombard this guy tomorrow with all these questions. I don't want to count this out completely without being fair.


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## Clarke

I must say that in todays market there is little use for manufacturing your own rhinestone transfers. The cost of amortizing the machine is prohibitive, and cannot be easily recouped through profit. There are MANY manufacturers of custom stones and metal studs. Airwaves, Wildside, and X-it! all offer small custom runs of stones. The prices of the ( commodity) stones have come way down recently. This new pricing makes owning an expensive machine outdated.


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## Krusty

allhamps said:


> Hey Krusty, I was seriously considering a Crystal Press after having realized that I went through 20 feet of 15" stencil material for single names alone, that I may never use again. What a waste of template material. I even have a webinar set up for tomorrow evening. Now my concerns, after reading some of your information are as follows:
> 
> Am I to understand that I can ONLY use your pre-cut transfer sheets to make my transfers? This would be a definite deal breaker for me as I have my transfer paper specially cut at 15" and shipped in from overseas at an extremely good price.
> What's the deal with the "Asian stones" comments? Is this machine designed for stones made specifically somewhere else or some "other" type of stones? Again, a major deal breaker for me as I do use Korean stones, the top quality, and have them shipped to me directly.
> I was moving away from the cams and cams type machines because frankly, I have no experience with things like compressors, don't currently have the space or electrical capacity to run those machines, but do have the business to support its purchase. I was leaning towards the Crystal Press for the immediate, to help me eliminate the waste of stencil material and a lot of time on "single-use" transfers, but it won't make sense, if that reduction in costs/time is simply transferred somewhere else if I have to do something different for transfer paper and rhinestones. Maybe you can shed some light here BEFORE I bombard this guy tomorrow with all these questions. I don't want to count this out completely without being fair.


Hi Slick,

First of all, let me be perfectly clear, the guy you are doing the webinar with tomorrow is ME So bombard away. I'll be happy to answer your questions in detail then. I do appreciate your being fair in your assessment and I look forward to speaking with you.

But, since you asked, I'll try to answer your questions in a basic form here.

_Am I to understand that I can ONLY use your pre-cut transfer sheets to make my transfers? This would be a definite deal breaker for me as I have my transfer paper specially cut at 15" and shipped in from overseas at an extremely good price._

I don't know if your sheets will work or not? I DO know that you will have to add strips to the edges to get them to run through the machine. Our sheets are 15.75" wide and we tested several types in the development of the CrystalPress. Some worked and some didn't.

As to running our HT sheets in general, please bear in mind that there are other savings that mitigate the cost of our heat transfer sheets. Your hand labor cost of filling templates is eliminated. Your cost of template material goes away. If you are doing multi-color/stone sizes these savings are compounded, and, of course, while the CrystalPress is doing the stone placement, you can be doing something else.

_What's the deal with the "Asian stones" comments? Is this machine designed for stones made specifically somewhere else or some "other" type of stones? Again, a major deal breaker for me as I do use Korean stones, the top quality, and have them shipped to me directly._

The new CrystalPress Two is optimized for running Asian stones, which includes Korean as well as Chinese stones and rhinestuds. It can also run Swarovski and Preciosa stones. I would be happy to test your stones. If your stones are good quality, it will probably run them fine, but we like to test to be certain. The previous model, the CrystalPress One, would run Asian stones pretty well, but it was slower and had more drops. FWIW, I ran the CP Two throughout last week's show and it never dropped a single stone or stud.

Krusty (or Tom)


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## txshirts

Krusty said:


> Hi Slick,
> 
> FWIW, I ran the CP Two throughout last week's show and it never dropped a single stone or stud.
> 
> Krusty (or Tom)


What about the ones it set upside down? An upside down stone is worse then a drop IMHO.

A drop is visibly missing, a reverse has to be picked out and then replaced.


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## allhamps

Ha, I knew I was bad with remembering names, but I think I just outdid myself:
Anyway thanks and I look forward to our webinar. I think testing the stones I use would be a plus. Better to know now if I need to switch to machine cut, etc. With the pricinging info on the sheets I guess I can remodle my pricing structure as well as determine my true "savings". I say this as I sit at football practice plucking a stencilt that did not weed :


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## lizziemaxine

Clarke said:


> I must say that in todays market there is little use for manufacturing your own rhinestone transfers. The cost of amortizing the machine is prohibitive, and cannot be easily recouped through profit. There are MANY manufacturers of custom stones and metal studs. Airwaves, Wildside, and X-it! all offer small custom runs of stones. The prices of the ( commodity) stones have come way down recently. This new pricing makes owning an expensive machine outdated.


The companies I have dealt with usually takes a week or more just to get a quote on making transfers. To actually produce them is another week or two. Oh, and the small runs are typically higher than what I need. And, I want a higher quality stone than is used by companies like those that you mention. So, if I had the money in my budget I would be buying my own machine.


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## txshirts

lizziemaxine said:


> The companies I have dealt with usually takes a week or more just to get a quote on making transfers. To actually produce them is another week or two. Oh, and the small runs are typically higher than what I need. And, I want a higher quality stone than is used by companies like those that you mention. So, if I had the money in my budget I would be buying my own machine.


Can you actually tell the difference between the different "grades" of stones? If so, what did you see?

The average person can't tell the difference between a 4.5, 5.1, and 6.0 ounce per yard fabric much less degrees of sparkle.


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## allhamps

I agree with you Jane. Most of those companies also charge crazy prices for custom transfers. Brian, you are sadly mistaken if toy think folks can't tell the difference in the stone quality. Just do a transfer in low grade Chinese stones and if they don't get you on the lack of shine, they will definitely get you when they wash the item and the stones fall off


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## txshirts

We use a quality Korean stone..... I've never had them fall off and with a lifetime warranty on our rhinestone shirts I'd have heard about it by now. 

I ask because I think there is some snobbism over stones..... one poster on another thread mentioned taking 5 grades of stones to different booths at ISS Longbeach and most people couldn't tell the difference.

So yes, I'm a tad skeptical. I saw a shirt with simulated stones (screenprinted glitter) and I honestly had to look twice at it. I'm very critical, have excellent vision, and am accustomed to looking at apparel and apparel decoration. It shocked me as to how it actually looked similar. Of course what ultimately caught my attention was the lack of fullness to the print....

So, I'm curious how one can tell the difference between Swarovsky, Preciosa, Korean, and Chinese ? My point here is that if I mixed a bunch in a bowl could you find each type of stone? The reason for asking is that we have a liability as decorators to being duped by dishonest suppliers who change glue colors, labels, etc. Trust me when I say that if the unscrupulous of China will screw McDonald's than you and I don't have a chance.

Lastly, my personal stance on this is that Swarovsky is probably ever so slightly more premium, Preciosa a little better then average - Korean just fine, and Chinese slightly below average.

To me, more important then the country of origin is the method of manufacture and I think acrylic vs glass and cut vs molded is probably the real difference here along with the glue type. I can tell you that once you get out of the hard core novelty market and start working with people who are buying in bulk, price becomes a huge factor. They want to know that it's "shiny enough" and cheap cheap cheap. Brokers and resellers first priority is fattening their margin.

As for the contract market, I too find it stunning that nobody is open about their pricing. I checked out most of my competition trying to locate their pricing and couldn't find it. That tells me it changes with the weather or uses a mechanism that is pretty undeveloped.


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## Buechee

I had some Korean and they look no where near as good as the Czech that I use. The shine is not the same. I think how ever told you that must sell cheap stones or just wanted to say something. I have used cheap one and good ones. the glue seems to be the same, but when the light hits them, oh you can see the difference in them.


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## Krusty

txshirts said:


> What about the ones it set upside down? An upside down stone is worse then a drop IMHO.
> 
> A drop is visibly missing, a reverse has to be picked out and then replaced.


Hi Brian,

I wrote a long reply to your previous report about your visit to our booth. It got moderated. On the chance that it may eventually turn up I won't repeat it here, but to reply to your question about inverted stones I'll offer that part of it.

Asian stones vary from 15-20% in diameter. if a stone is 20% too big, it won't go into the cup that carries it up to the pick tool. If it is 15-20% too small, it may fall into the cup up-side down. If it does it will probably get placed upside down on the sheet. Now, you said you saw two stones out of 100 placed upside down. I don't doubt that you saw what you say you saw, but I will just tell you what I saw. I ran a two-layer 57-placement heart design in 5 rows of 5 hearts throughout the show. That works out to 1350 stones per sheet and I ran 2-4 sheets like that per day. Some of those sheets had 2-3 upside down stones or studs (i was running one layer of studs and one layer of stones.)
That works out to a success rate of 99.852% to 99.778%. This is using a very inexpensive stone. We used those stones because people want those inexpensive stones and we wanted to show that we could run them. The law of averages being what it is, I can't promise that the next 100 stone design I run won't have 2 upside down stones, but what I just described is what I saw.

Krusty


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## txshirts

Interesting information. I wish my visit had gone better... as I've said before, I think the machine has value in the right applications, and I'm not convinced it would be a good fit for our needs.


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## Krusty

Buechee said:


> I had some Korean and they look no where near as good as the Czech that I use. The shine is not the same. I think how ever told you that must sell cheap stones or just wanted to say something. I have used cheap one and good ones. the glue seems to be the same, but when the light hits them, oh you can see the difference in them.


I'll offer what I have learned about stones (or crystals, if you prefer) over the last few years.

First of all, Swarovski makes a very nice crystal. If I recall correctly it has 14 facets. Some time back they had 10 or 12. The number of facets has a direct impact on the brightness and nature of the sparkle. More facets means that the crystal reflects light from more angles, but it also means that the sparkle is less bright (all other things being equal), so a many-facetted crystal is a better look at short distances (so it might be a good choice for fashion garments), but a, say, 8-facetted crystal will give off more light from a greater distance, so it might be the preferred choice for a dance outfit that will be viewed at a distance.

The Preciosa has 12 or 14 facets, but used to have 8 (Some of the 8-facet stones are still available). It is a very nice stone also.

As to quality, my understanding is that Swarovski rejects 40% of the stones it produces on the basis of Table Height. That is the height of the crystal from the base of the facet to the flat top of the stone. Table height has an impact on the symettry and light quality of the crystal. Asian manufacturers are not so picky about table height, or diameter, or broken stones or even the ultimate cleanliness of the stones. Obviously, not rejecting stones lowers their cost. I should say here that the molded acrylic stones are pretty consistent, but their sparkle lacks, as you all have probably seen. I have also been told by importers that Asian stones can vary from batch to batch, and if they do vary, then the importer does not have a lot of recourse to return them.

As to glue quality, I hesitate to say, because I've heard so many different stories (mostly here on this forum). I just know my Preciosa-encrusted shirts have held up well over the past two years.

This is not to condemn Asian stones at large. There are good quality stones out there and if there weren't, then rhinestone design would not be as popular as it is. To some degree, you get what you pay for, but you should shop carefully.

Krusty


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## Krusty

txshirts said:


> Interesting information. I wish my visit had gone better... as I've said before, I think the machine has value in the right applications, and I'm not convinced it would be a good fit for our needs.


I wish it had, too, Brian. I wanted to speak with you, but the couple I was working with had driven way across Texas with check in hand to buy a CrystalPress and they had a lot of questions. By the time I finished with them, you were gone. Sorry we didn't connect.

Krusty (Tom)


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## vgary

Tom (Krusty) - When will Ioline have updated information on the newest model of Crystal Press on their website? I'm interested but would like to see the newer model info.


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## lizziemaxine

Krusty said:


> As to glue quality, I hesitate to say, because I've heard so many different stories (mostly here on this forum). I just know my Preciosa-encrusted shirts have held up well over the past two years.
> Krusty


I use Swarovski or Preciosa stones because I have found their glue will hold up to dry cleaning. My customers are rodeo people who want sparkly things on denim and twill and they sent these things out to the laundry. The few times I used Korean stones I had to replace some after the garments were dry cleaned. With Swarovski or Preciosa I have yet to replace a stone.


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## Guest

Jane, those are the only crystals I use and for the same reasons. You definitely can't beat the sparkle. My stone don't fall off. I wash and dry mine at home and do the dry cleaning and never have a problem. People don't realize the difference in the shine until they are compared side by side. There really is a difference-a difference in price, too, but you get what you pay for.


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## allhamps

Just a comment on the "placement of upside down stones". I recently ordered 15 transfers from a company that I use occassionally when I'm backed up. They do very good work and I will continue to use them. However, of the 15 transfers, I pressed 13 onto shirts. Of the 13 I pressed, 11 of them had at least 2 upside down stones in the ss06 stones that were set. I couldn't see this before pressing, but noticed it as I peeled the paper off. Now the design itself has 439 ss06 montana stones, 606 ss06 light siam stones, and 192 ss10 light siam stones, for a total of 1237 stones. Now I'm sure they are not using a Crystal Press, but upside down stones DO happen, apparently with automated processes. The thing that bothered me was they don't send out extra stones with the transfers. What if I didn't have any stones to replace the ones that were upside down and the glue had already melted off. I don't think I would flunk the Crystal Press just for a few upside down stones.


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## Clarke

I must say that you have had bad experiences unfortunately with your custom stone efforts. I can't speak for all, however, the more reputable and stable the company you are doing business with the more likely it is to deliver quality products, with reputable service. As mentioned earlier, by Liz," I would buy a machine if I had the money" . That was my original point here. The equipment is tremendously expensive, and therefore it takes a huge amount of sales to subsidize, time, art , development, all things necessary to equate into purchasing such equipment, and it's potential profit potential. In the end, as with embroidery, and prior to that silk screening, the market place is so over flooded with personal machinery it has become more profitable, to farm out this work and concentrate on selling. The same is true in the rhinestone industry. As I said, the stone it self is a commodity. There are many grades available, from Austrian, and Czech, crystals, to the many grades of Korean, and Chinese. The labor and paper, and artwork are the only other variables. Once again dealing with reputable companies, helps to ensure all that I previously mentioned. In the end, unless you have commitments for a number of pre sold garments the investment into manufacturing is far greater than most anticipate, and is as aforementioned not necessary despite any trials and tribulations described here by a few fellow posters.


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## Krusty

vgary said:


> Tom (Krusty) - When will Ioline have updated information on the newest model of Crystal Press on their website? I'm interested but would like to see the newer model info.


Hi Vgary,

It will probably be up there in a couple weeks. We're short a marketing person right now. 

Tom


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## 1charles

Hi everyone, I am thinking about buying the Crystal Press by Ioline but want to make sure how it is. Is it easy to use? Software easy?
Any info would be helpful. thanks Carolyn


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## allhamps

Hi Carolyn, I definitely think this is a good machine to have, as long as you know what you are getting, and it meets your expectations. Here are my viewpoints/experience:

Mine had some glitches that really frustrated me when I first got it in January 2011. However, it seems to be going fine now. I've probably run about 100,000 stones through that machine from January 4th to yesterday, and it seems to be holding up. Tech support and Ioline were very helpful in working things out.
This machine is NOT built for speed. I would guestimate that I am getting about 70-80 stones a minute placement rate. However, I am ok with that because I didn't buy it for the speed, I bought it as a "2nd pair of hands", to help me keep up with my order load. The fact that I can run designs while I do something else, or continue to make additional designs using my templates, was a plus to me.
It is compact and does not take up a lot of space. No air compressor needed. A few seconds to change out the sorter wheel or stone colors. *Make sure you get Ioline to test your stones in the machine, so that you can get the appropriate sorter wheels. *I run Korean stones, but I actually use the Preciosa wheels and not the Asian wheels because my stones work better with the Preciosa wheels.
My verdict is still out on the software as a whole, simply because I have not yet tried to use it to actually design anything. I've been designing in another software for about 4 years, so I just stuck with that. It is very easy to convert my other files to ones that will print out with the CPII by simply running them through Corel and then exporting as a.plt. About 30 secs to to that. *I do like the cutting features of the software, especially the ease with which you can see if you have stones that are too close together, or perhaps you have stones duplicated in your design (right on top of each other). I don't like the restrictions you have in putting multiple designs or copies of a design on a sheet. You can't space them where you want to, you have to use a toggle button to make copies horizontally and/or vertically, but if you have just a corner left over, you can't put a single copy in that space.*
The transfer sheets are not that expensive, so I don't mind purchasing those.
Overall, I would say I've been able to double my efficiency, and nearly double my production with the use of this machine. For me, it was a very good match and investment.


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## 1charles

Do you have another machine too?


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## allhamps

No, I've been using the "template" method since I started doing this in late 2007. I purchased my software from DAS (Digital Art Solutions), and have been using that and my vinyl cutter. I still use my templates, but the CPII just gives me an "employee" to help out


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## 1charles

thanks for the info.


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## duran118

all of these posts and only a few mentions of U/S/D stone placement. i opened my system today and ran a simple GIANTS text logo. wasn't to thrilled about the software. i found the fills weren't all that great compared to the DAS system. In the DAS system there is a lot more control on the fill. but i decided to run it anyway just to see it work. i ran it twice. this was a 320 stone design, 1 color, i had 15 percent U/S/D stones and on the second one i had 17 percent U/S/D stones. is this average for this machine. can some one please advise.


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## Krusty

duran118 said:


> all of these posts and only a few mentions of U/S/D stone placement. i opened my system today and ran a simple GIANTS text logo. wasn't to thrilled about the software. i found the fills weren't all that great compared to the DAS system. In the DAS system there is a lot more control on the fill. but i decided to run it anyway just to see it work. i ran it twice. this was a 320 stone design, 1 color, i had 15 percent U/S/D stones and on the second one i had 17 percent U/S/D stones. is this average for this machine. can some one please advise.


Hi Duran,

Have you contacted anyone at Ioline Customer Service? That is way beyond what we expect to see, so we need to get involved. My first thoughts are, possibly, a bad batch of Asian stones (which, despite promises from our stone supplier, remains a concern) and/or some issue with the sweeper mechanism. If you PM me your phone number, I'll call you today and we will look into it.

Tom/Krusty


----------



## allhamps

Duran, I would agree with Krusty on the piece that I have experienced regarding the stones. I run Korean stones, but I found that the stones from my normal supplier work very well using the Preciosa wheels, not the Asian wheels. However, in my absentmindeness, I ran out of stones and needed to finish a design. I ordered some from a DIFFERENT supplier, and was flabergasted when a large portion of the design ended up U/S/D. However, since I had already run this design of approximately 700 stones with my normal supply and had about 10 U/S/D total in the previous 20 transfers, I know it was the stones. I would recommend, and I'm sure Krusty will too, that you get the stones you intend to use tested, and try to stick with a consistent supplier.


----------



## allhamps

Duran, forgot to mention that I too have DAS, and I have continued to do all of my designing in DAS, because it is what I am most familiar with. It is not a long or complicated process to design in DAS and then convert to a .plt file for cutting on the crystal press. As a matter of fact, I have just "hired" my son to convert my entire library of designs, about 500, in total, from DAS to a separate library of files for the CPII, and he has no previous experience with DAS or Corel.


----------



## Leg cramps

He will be busy for a while! LOL...good for you,boy wont that be nice when it is all done!
I have had alot of my family pitch in too!great isnt it!


----------



## allhamps

Oh, I am sooo looking forward to having that all done and out the way. If he does a good job, maybe I'll keep him busy with the bookkeeping software next


----------



## Krusty

Hi Duran,

One more thing I should have mentioned. The 10ss sorter wheels that come with the CrystalPress are different sizes (because the stones from different suppliers vary in size). If you are using the 162-40 10ss sorter wheel and getting a lot of USD's, try the 159-40.

Tom


----------



## sjidohair

Thanks Krusty for the info,,,


----------



## allhamps

Duran, I dropped that package in the mail for you, but Tom makes a good point. I looked at my wheel and I am using the 159-40 for ss10 stones. I just ran a design with 580 stones and only had 3 U/S/D. See if you can exchange out your wheel for the 159-40. Your stones may be fine, they just might not fit that particular wheel.

PS - I sent it Priority Mail, so hopefully you get it by Sat and can test.


----------



## idonaldson

Allhamps who are you getting your stones from?


----------



## duran118

slick, thank you very much for that. i have been using the same design since i've received the machine in an effort to keep everything consistent. it is a simple giants text logo with 333 stone count. here's what i've come up with on my last run:

DAS ss10 stones in orange:
162 wheel = 125 U/S/D
159 wheel = 101 U/S/D
150 wheel = 77 U/S/D

cheap asian stones:
162 wheel = 23 U/S/D
159 wheel = 26 U/S/D
150 wheel = 7 U/S/D

go figure.


----------



## allhamps

Wow, that is baffling. Do you want to send me the file and have me try to print it?


----------



## allhamps

idonaldson said:


> Allhamps who are you getting your stones from?


I import directly


----------



## idonaldson

Ok maybe that is my problem - with the USD stones - that they are not fitting into my wheels. I did not even know that there are two different number 10's. Not sure it is for the 1st CP a few months ago or it was an upgrade to CPII. I think mine has sweeper issues and pick-up issues. Thanks.


----------



## duran118

slick,

wondering if you got my email and attachment. anxiously awaiting your results


----------



## allhamps

I did. I'm going to run it tonight. Will let you know


----------



## duran118

slick, i got some of iolines "new" stones and was able to run the same design i gave you as is, using the preciosa wheel and it came out perfect. ZERO U/S/D stones. i read your note on the shipping of your stones. just wondering if you were able to run the design with your stones yet. if your stones work i would rather buy from you and save some $$$. thanks again!


----------



## idonaldson

We all are waiting - I need to know if my problem with my CP are the stones.


----------



## Krusty

Hi Irv,

I sent you a pm.

Tom/Krusty


----------



## idonaldson

Thanks - got it and replied


----------



## rhinestoneshirts

What is the cost on the new ioline machine? How many colors can it do at one time


----------



## duran118

brand new it's around $5900, but that only comes with 2 sheets of transfer paper and only the size 10 wheels. the ss6 wheels are about $140 ( i believe that's what i paid, don't quote me on that one) a piece. not quite sure on the maximum numbers of colors or different sizes it supports, but i know it will definitely handle at least 6 different colors or sizes.

Krusty would be the one to ask more specific questions, as he works for ioline and is very responsive. the one thing i have to say about the company is that their support is outstanding, and they will try everything to make the customer happy. if you have any "new user" questions that you would like answered from a new user feel free to pm me.


----------



## Krusty

Hi Rhinestoneshirts,

The CrystalPress can print two colors at one time and it can print up to 16 layers (each layer being a separate color or size of stone or rhinestud) on one heat transfer sheet by applying two layers, then two more layers, then two more, etc. All the layers are placed in register with each other and can be heat-pressed down together.

Krusty/Tom


----------



## macetiq

dear friend:
I wonder if it is true that this machine (crystal ioline press) works only with the first hot fix, which are the most expensive


----------



## allhamps

macetiq said:


> dear friend:
> I wonder if it is true that this machine (crystal ioline press) works only with the first hot fix, which are the most expensive


Not quite sure what you are asking here? Are you referring to the type of stones? I use Korean stones that I import. They work fine and they are not expensive. Hey Duran, sorrry for the delay, but I was able to print your design with no problem. I hope you have worked out your U/S/D issues


----------



## Krusty

Hi Macetiq,

The CrystalPress can handle a wide variety of crystals and rhinestones and rhinestuds from the high-end European crystals to the inexpensive Asian stones and studs. However, not every kind of stone out there will work in the CrystalPress. As noted earlier, if you have stones that you want to use that you buy from some distributor, you should check with Ioline or send some to Ioline for testing so we can say for sure whether they will work.

Krusty/Tom


----------



## sjidohair

Ok some one please tell me what USD means,,,, 

thanks
MMM


----------



## idonaldson

It took me for ever to figure out - and I had the problem forever - U(up) S(side) D(down) stones. the nightmare for automatic stone laying.


----------



## sjidohair

thanks irv,, my mind was thinking of all kinds of things,, but up side down,, lol

I have been watching this thread alot as i am very close to getting a machine as well.

thanks for all the great info guys, 

MMM


----------



## idonaldson

I will give it another look at the ISS AC show - would like to see the difference between my machine and the CPII.


----------



## dan-ann

USD -so glad I wasn't the only one who had no idea what this meant LOL


----------



## allhamps

ISS Atlantic City was fantastic. Great to meet, and see again, some of the Ioline folks. 

Here's why I REALLY LOVE my Ioline:

Friday before I left for the show, I did some designs for a customer in FL for a proposed Haiti fundraising event, called Save Haiti/Project Medishare and Heat for Haiti. This morning she sent me photos of the photo shoot for the project with Gabrielle Union and some of the Miami Heat basketball players wives/fiancees, WEARING MY SHIRTS.

Tom, I'm gonna be needing some more of those machines, hopefully


----------



## sjidohair

Carol,, 

That is awesome,, and your shirts look great,, .

Did you get the crystal press II ?

I did not see it on their website..


----------



## allhamps

Thanks, and yes, I do have the CPII. I think that is the only version they are shipping now, but I could be wrong.


----------



## sjidohair

Thanks Carol, 

MMM


----------



## Boomerbabe

Carol
Those are beautiful! Congratulations on a job very well done.


----------



## dan-ann

hey slick that is awesome thanks for the pictures


----------



## BML Builder

Hey Slick, Those are great!! Congrats!!! Another job well done!!


----------



## DivineBling

Carol, your shirts were beautiful at ISS AC! I was super impressed with the detail! Great job!!!


----------



## allhamps

Thanks, and it was so nice to meet you. Hubby said he was glad to meet other folks who got as excited about rhinestones as I do, so that now he knows I'm not completely crazy


----------



## DivineBling

allhamps said:


> Thanks, and it was so nice to meet you. Hubby said he was glad to meet other folks who got as excited about rhinestones as I do, so that now he knows I'm not completely crazy


Lol! Speak for yourself! I'm nuts over rhinestones! But it spoke volumes that he was willing to wear that blinged out shirt for you! He wore it like a champ and looked like a stud!!! 


Sent from my iPhone using TShirtForums


----------



## Leg cramps

Carol that is awesome!The photo shoot looks great.I am crazy about rhinestones too.I also have some "big names" that I wish I could reveal!!!!I love the designs!Im going to have to read this thread now.lolok well mabey not but I will look into the crystal press.
I have a photo shoot coming up,I am running the whole thing...there is so much to do!
The models look great too!I wish I knew some of them pretty heat ladieZ!
I wear rhinestones too!


----------



## Leg cramps

sorry didnt see the pricing.What are these going for?


----------



## Leg cramps

Hey anyone wanna loan me the money so I can get a couple of these? LOL


----------



## allhamps

The price isn't that bad. Even without the pending "big" deal, I figured that the added productivity of this machine will allow me to pay it off in 4.5 months with funds after expenses, etc.

At the rate you crank out decals and beautiful designs, I'm sure you could do it way faster.


----------



## RhinestoneFetish

How long does it take you to make one of the designs with your machine?


----------



## Leg cramps

lol so youll have no problem frontin me with the cash!lol...J/k.


----------



## duran118

krusty---need some help. i'm getting frustrated!!! i have pretty much figured out the U/S/D and am now about anywhere from 92% on up. i am good with that. my problem lies in the machine arbitrarily deciding to stop mid way while running. the status light stays green and the cutter icon in the program is red. if i reset i lose the job. i press the pause/ play button and it does nothing. on the error screen it shows no error, it just has the "printing progress" bar. i have no blinking red lights on the wheels or on the c-tip. there are no stones stuck on the c-tip. all my red indicator lights are a steady red. is this common, is there fix, or is this problem with the machine. this is about the 8th time this has happened to me and i have ruined many a motif because of this. HELP!


----------



## Krusty

Hi Duran,

Sorry about the problem. I will have one of our tech guys call you this morning (Tuesday). I have your phone number.

Tom/Krusty


----------



## streetcertified

I spoke with a sales rep a week ago. He stated that the machine is 5900. Is that competitive in the market. I am sad to hear that it broke. Also glad because I was consider buying it.


----------



## allamerican-aeoon

Leg cramps said:


> Hey anyone wanna loan me the money so I can get a couple of these? LOL


 Instead of $$$ rent you a machine works too?
Am I getting a big hug Eric?  Sound strange to man.


----------



## streetcertified

I spoke with a sales rep from ioline and he stated the machine is 5900. I am not sure if this is competitive or not. I to am interested in a competitor to compare the two.


----------



## duran118

it is very competitive in the market. for the price you have to sacrifice speed and accuracy, which i was willing to do. i'm just a little upset with the company though. in speaking with their reps, (which up until this point, customer service was great) the rep stated to me that "there is a problem with the software. this machine runs off of a dongle, and the software continually runs a thread to make sure the dongle is there, and at the same time, it also runs a thread to make sure the machine is hooked up. when those two threads collide it shuts the machine down. this is a known problem, however we are having a hard time replicating it." 

i purchased the machine for a specific job that i had coming up for $3500. that was going to pay for more than 1/2 the machine which helped me make my decision on the purchase. because of the faulty software, i was unable to do the job. not only did i lose out on the $3500 job, i lost a customer, and not to mention the dollar amount it cost for all the supplies. 

now what really pisses me off, is the company has a no return policy. I FOR THE LIFE OF ME CANT UNDERSTAND THIS! What reputable company would not take a machine back if it was faulty. let alone sell the machine knowing this was an issue. now i am stuck with this $5900 P.O.S. how secure do you as a company feel if you arent even willing to take back a brand new machine you just sold. it's not as if i had it personalized and nobody else could purchase the machine unless they wanted the same personalization. WHAT A BUNCH OF CRAP!


----------



## streetcertified

I asked about financing and they stated that they have several companies that offer financing for the machine. You may also use a financing company you are comfortable with.


----------



## streetcertified

How many rhinestones does it place in a hour? How are their prices when it comes to buying supplies rhinestones transfers etc?


----------



## Stitch-Up

streetcertified said:


> How many rhinestones does it place in a hour? How are their prices when it comes to buying supplies rhinestones transfers etc?


According to their brochure, it states 5000 stones per hour, however, having watched the videos on Youtube, I don't see how this could possibly be achieved!

I have to say that after reading Duran118's post above, I'm somewhat 'put off' to say the least!

Anyone?


----------



## allhamps

For pricing and planning purposes I ran a test when I got my machine back in Jan. Avg stones per hour for ss06 was 2804. Avg stones per hour for ss10 was 4511. Initially I had some issues with my ss06 stones that worked themselves out. Haven't done the test again


----------



## 1charles

I am really confused. i really want to do rhinestoning but afraid of what to buy.


----------



## streetcertified

I have read this entire thread and you all have done a tremendous job. One thing i would like to know what software is best for this type of machine? I have to place this post here because the other categories are not as knowledgable about this particular machine. I have seen many are using Corel Draw and other add-ons. How many of you have another software ie DAS or KlicnKut and how is it working for you?


----------



## DivineBling

This machine comes with its own software.


----------



## streetcertified

Yes you are right. I am aware of that software. How flexible is it compared to others that are out there? Who has comments about the software? I would like to know its limitations and how it is compared to DAS, KlicnKut, Idesignr and others. Any comments or advise anyone?


----------



## allhamps

I have never used the software that comes with the machine. I
Am just more comfortable with my DAS sofware so I have continued to use it.


----------



## streetcertified

allhamps said:


> I have never used the software that comes with the machine. I
> Am just more comfortable with my DAS sofware so I have continued to use it.


I read it was expensive. How much was it? How is the customer service? Which apps of DAS do you use? Do you have to Corel Draw to run the app? Please forgive so many questions. I am just getting into the biz.


----------



## allhamps

I bought the "whole" DAS system in late 2008 for about $5500 I think. That was the SmartCut Pro software, which does the rhinestone part, some rhinestone designs software, a supply kit, and their Smart Designer software which is a CorelDraw plug in. I don't think you HAVE to have Corel to do the rhinestone piece, as I very rarely use Corel, but they were selling it as a package. I believe, and don't quote me on this, that DAS will be having a rhinestone software that can be used as a stand alone product, but I need to look into that more


----------



## sjidohair

I heard the same thing Carol.. 

Sandy jo
MMM


----------



## agensop

how is the productivity of using it that way. are you using das to "print" to it and just sees the pattern and arranges it? i am intrigued. i have thought about this exact machine.




allhamps said:


> I have never used the software that comes with the machine. I
> Am just more comfortable with my DAS sofware so I have continued to use it.


----------



## allhamps

I do all of my designs in my DAS software. Then I convert them to the .plt format that the Ioline software uses to send the design to the machine to "print" out the transfer. It takes about 30 seconds to convert:

design in DAS and save as .job file (specific to DAS)
import design to CorelDraw
Export file from CorelDraw to my hard drive as .plt file
Open .plt file in Ioline and send to machine for transfer
Another reason I still use my DAS software is that I still do templates, so if it's designed in DAS, and I need to, I can still always cut a template.


----------



## lizziemaxine

allhamps said:


> I believe, and don't quote me on this, that DAS will be having a rhinestone software that can be used as a stand alone product, but I need to look into that more


DAS has a webinar scheduled for Wednesday titled
"StoneCut Pro Product Launch".


----------



## KWilliam6163

We saw this demonstrated at the DAX show in Chicago a few weeks ago. Very compact and quite. Could a be a nice way to enter into auto rhinestone setting


----------



## sjidohair

Does anyone know which of the cams or crystal press machines are going to be able to be used with the new DAS program?

In the webinar or elsewhere i heard that this might be a possiblity or I dreamt it,,, lol

Anyone know


----------



## agensop

i think they did but i thought they meant only for design purposes, you would still have to export it to a file readable by that machine.



sjidohair said:


> Does anyone know which of the cams or crystal press machines are going to be able to be used with the new DAS program?
> 
> In the webinar or elsewhere i heard that this might be a possiblity or I dreamt it,,, lol
> 
> Anyone know


----------



## sjidohair

i think so to adam but not sure if the export was a DMX or what is needed,, i will know once i get a lil further into the program,


----------



## agensop

do you have a crystal press???


----------



## sjidohair

not yet,, lol


----------



## agensop

this isnt for ioline but for cams.. but it essentially shows the process....


YouTube - ‪GemMaster Conversion‬‏


----------



## BlingCouture

for those who own the crystal press....What stones do you use? I am in the process of purchasing mine, but was told to first send a good amount of the stones that I use so that they can be tested to make sure they work with the machine. I usually stick with the Korean grade stones.


----------



## allhamps

That advice is very true so that you can determine which sorter wheels you should get.

I use my own Korean stones (imported and for resale) and I use the Preciosa sorter wheels (sorry but I don't have the part number on hand right now) for the ss10, not the Asian wheels.


----------



## allhamps

agensop said:


> this isnt for ioline but for cams.. but it essentially shows the process....
> 
> 
> YouTube - ‪GemMaster Conversion‬‏


 
Similar process for Ioline. *CAUTION: The StoneCut Pro software has the .plt export option, which is the file type used by the software for Ioline, but for some reason, I have not been able to open a .plt file in the Ioline software that I exported directly from StoneCut Pro. I still have to go through the process of exporting from StoneCut Pro to Corel, then from Corel to .plt.*


----------



## sjidohair

Has anyone else noticed at the bottom of a message we send, that this is attached to ever message i send on T-shirt forum?

why is it attached?

see attachement


----------



## allhamps

It seems like it's some kind of tracking/link that has been imbeded in this thread. It doesn't appear when I answer other threads.


----------



## sjidohair

Carol,, do you have it too?


----------



## Claudio

is anyone using DESIGN ERA or HOTFIX ERA from Sierra Technology Group?
works for CAMS, cutters, exports PLT, produces hotfix stone & sequin motifs, and embroidery too.


----------



## allhamps

sjidohair said:


> Carol,, do you have it too?


Sorry, Sandy Jo, but yes it shows up everytime I respond to this link. Bonanzle.com is supposed to be some sort of site like Ebay, from what I quickly saw when I looked it up. However, this direct link didn't seem to take me anywhere.


----------



## sjidohair

Weird,, I wonder if it is a tracking cookie or something,,,,


----------



## BlingCouture

I got my Crystal Press...Def been worth the money for sure. however at first I thought the machine was broken bc it is SOOOO loud. I called Tech support and he said no it sounds normal, I said really?? it seemed so quiet at the ISS show, he said It must have been really loud at the show...LOL. 
Then I was surprised that when I inquired about purchasing the software that DID not come with my machine called Crystal Design or something like that, the Tech basically told me not to waste my money. Um, ok then....The machine is def not as fast as they say it is, but It does the job and is way better then the old method of templates and shaking the stones. The only thing I wish they would be a bit more helpful in explainging the sorter wheels and having a better price for stones. I am needing to purchase another machine, bc my orders are out of control. I have 4 employees and we still cannot keep up with the amount of orders...def. not complaining here. But Im going to look into the CAMS machine for my 2nd purchase. After purchasing the machine, another sorter wheel, stones, paper, shipping, etc I spent close to 10K.


----------



## Stitch-Up

I like the Ioline for its ability to set multiple colour designs.

I like the Ioline for it's price.

I don't like the Ioline because it's slow.

Based on your experience, would you say this machine is able to produce the goods in a commercial environment or is it more a 'hobby' machine? Can you make a profit from it? How easy is it to create multi-colour patterns? How much do all the extrs cost?

Why will your 2nd machine be a CAMS?

Cheers

John


----------



## allhamps

Stitch-Up said:


> I like the Ioline for its ability to set multiple colour designs.
> 
> I like the Ioline for it's price.
> 
> I don't like the Ioline because it's slow.
> 
> Based on your experience, would you say this machine is able to produce the goods in a commercial environment or is it more a 'hobby' machine? Can you make a profit from it? How easy is it to create multi-colour patterns? How much do all the extrs cost?
> 
> Why will your 2nd machine be a CAMS?
> 
> Cheers
> 
> John


You will need to qualify what you mean by "commercial environment". If you are talking about producing 100+ transfers a day, then no, the Ioline is not your machine. However, I consider what I do "commercial", and I use the machine consistently. My run schedule for this past weekend, 1/2 day Sat due to Irene, and at least 12 hours Sun, was for 75 transfers and a total of 81,150 stones.

I do not see this as a "hobby" machine. It is too expensive if you don't plan on putting it to work to make money.

Yes, you can make money with the Ioline. It is not a speed demon, but because it is automatic, you can set transfers to run while you are doing something else. The Crystal Press II is my employee. While it is running, I am free to send out new quotes, press shirts, fill other order, or heck, I even get to eat now and then. I have been able to pretty much double the amount of orders I can produce, because I now have an "employee" who can be making those orders while I design new ones.

When I was using the template only method, you can't do anything else while making transfers with a template because it requires both hands on. Now I can run the machine AND do templates if I choose.

I personally have already outgrown the ability of my CPII already and now need another pair of hands. I do a lot of detailed designs, so I know I really need at least a 4-color/size machine. However, I am so comfortable with the Ioline, and have so little space right now, I may invest in a second CPII until I can boost my bottom line to accomodate a bigger machine AND a store location.

As far as design ability, I really don't know. I have always used DAS as my design software, and I continue to do so now, and simply import the designs to the CPII to be printed.

I think the cost of a package depends on what you need. I was at $7500, including shipping, for the machine, Crystal Studio design software (I've never used it), 3 packs of transfer sheets, an extra C-stick body, 3 extra C-stick tips and 7 additional sorter wheels (two came with the machine).

The CPII won't be a good fit for everyone. If you need speed, or are trying to do a lot of on the spot work while the customer is waiting, you may need to go with something that moves a little faster. However, as long as I can keep my CPII chugging along at least 8 hours a day, I had been able to keep up with my orders and get them out in a timely fashion. Now that things have picked up, or Mother Nature has slowed me down, I've had to pull out the old templates a little more often to try and keep up. Hoping by the end of the year to have another "something" to pick up the slack.


----------



## Krusty

Stay tuned

Krusty (Tom)


----------



## Stitch-Up

Thanks for the excellent reply slick, very helpful for someone like me, thinking of 'tooling up'.



Krusty said:


> Stay tuned
> 
> Krusty (Tom)


 Do you have a revellation Tom


----------



## sjidohair

Cant wait for Toms response,,,,


----------



## Krusty

If I could say more...I would...but I can't...so I won't.....

Sorry,

Krusty (Tom)


----------



## Stitch-Up

Krusty said:


> If I could say more...I would...but I can't...so I won't.....
> 
> Sorry,
> 
> Krusty (Tom)


Hopefully this side of Christmas maybe?


----------



## Stitch-Up

Hi again Tom,

Do you have a timescale for your revellation? Does it concern hardware or software?

Wanting to buy a rhinestone setter but waiting to see if anything new is due to be released. 

Cheers

John


----------



## Krusty

The announcement will come early next week. I'll post it here.

Tom (Krusty)


----------



## Stitch-Up

Thanks Tom, I look forward to yor post

John


----------



## sjidohair

Me too I will be watching as well.


----------



## Stitch-Up

Bump! 

My adrenalin levels are rising


----------



## Krusty

Stitch-Up said:


> Bump!
> 
> My adrenalin levels are rising


Well, we don't want any medical issues here. 

At the Ft. Worth Imprinted Sportswear Show, proceeding from Sept. 29 to Oct. 1, we will be previewing our CrystalPress Multi-Unit System Driver (that's not the name, I hope), which will make it possible to drive up to 4 CrystalPress printers from one computer. Final release date is TBD, but it will be within a few weeks. 

This means a number of things:

1. If your business requires more throughput than one CP can provide, you can buy two or more units and run them simultaneously.

2. You can print a different design (or the same design) on each printer. All printers are driven from a single instance of CrystalStudio.

3. You can be printing from one printer while working on another design, so the CrystalStudio program is not locked up while printing. Also, the multi-printer functions don't appear unless there are two or more printers connected and turned on, so it's invisible if you have a single unit.

4. If you plan to start out with a single printer, you can add a second printer when your business grows to the point that you require more output, so your investment matches your requirements.

5. If you all ready own a CrystalPress, you can add this feature to your existing system. It runs on the same operating systems as earlier versions of CrystalStudio. Your only requirement would be an additional USB port or serial port.

Pricing for multiple unit systems and upgrades will be announced at the Ft. Worth ISS show. When I have that information, I'll post it here.

I hope I see some of you at Ft. Worth!

Tom (Krusty)


----------



## sjidohair

Tom , 
This is prefect timing,
I am at the point of putting in machines to help me or getting employees,, to help make the custome transfers,, 

I can see running a few of these , working right next to you.

Thank you for taking this to the next step for all of us.

Sandy jo


----------



## Krusty

sjidohair said:


> Tom ,
> This is prefect timing,
> I am at the point of putting in machines to help me or getting employees,, to help make the custome transfers,,
> 
> I can see running a few of these , working right next to you.
> 
> Thank you for taking this to the next step for all of us.
> 
> Sandy jo


You're welcome Though I didn't have much to do with it. But I will pass your kind words on to the engineers at Ioline.

Tom


----------



## allhamps

STOMP!! STOMP!! STOMP!! That's me dancing a jig. I am ohhhh so excited about this new development. Can't wait for the actual roll out. I'm already putting my pennies aside 'cause I KNOW what Santa is bringing me for Christmas. Hey Tom, are they going to have an extra long, or longer USB cord available? I'm thinking from the way I'll have to set these up, the normal 6 ft cord might not be quite long enough

Sure do wish these could be wireless. Then I could put one in every room in the house

Great work Ioline for the effort to take "small" out of small business!!


----------



## Krusty

Hi Slick,

I just got back from the Ft.Worth ISS show. I saw a lot of the folks from TSF there. I'm sorry I didn't make the TSF Meet-UP. We got stuck at the show writing up orders. It was a good show, though a little slower than last year. A lot of folks really liked the new features, which we are calling Crystal-Q (because it queues files, get it).

Anyhow, to answer your question, the USB cable that comes with the CrystalPress is 10 or 12 feet long. You can add a USB extension cable which comes from any computer supply store.

Merry Christmas, 

Tom


----------



## MrRudeDog

Always gotta be careful with USB cable length. I've had problems before. A good resource is: USB.org - FAQ: Cables, Connectors, and Networking

Ray


----------



## allhamps

10-12 feet should work, I was thinking it would be a 6ft cord. Gonna go measure right now


----------



## idonaldson

Well I wondering how the CPII is working out - The CP one is still collecting dust for it never worked as in the video. Go figure 4 months later the CPII came out. You think someone would have told you.


----------



## allhamps

Mine is working out just fine. I run it practically 24 hours a day. I've been holding off on getting another one because All American was talking about bringing out a cartridge type machine which would not need a compressor, but I haven't heard anything more from Peter, so it looks like another CPII will be in my plans for 2012.


----------



## sjidohair

Carol I have been waiting right there with you .
Cant wait much longer either.

Sandy Jo


----------



## idonaldson

I am so happy for you guys. I hate my Crystal Press and have never got my return on that investment. I brought all the extra wheels and stones and had great plans for its use. You would think in NYC - I would be knocking them dead. Not - Do not trust it to take on jobs. I had to finish the jobs I did take on by hand. I like the SWF but do not have disposable income like that - but if another system comes out - I will give it a good look. I do not think the brushing stones methodology is in my future.


----------



## allhamps

I agree. Not enough disposable income for something like the SWF, which is why I had so much hope for the "new" machine All American was talking about. So far, though, that just seems to be all it was, talk. I am glad I got my issues ironed out with the CPII, as there is no way I could have grown doing templates & brushing alone. It requires hands on at all times, and I don't have that many hands


----------



## idonaldson

Well I was offered the upgrade - and must say it sounds reasonable, but if "A" does not work at "Y" price, then hard to put "Z" funds towards "B". In my part of the woods, NYC, we call that 3 card monte. To sit and watch all those stones not falling into the wholes and then the ones that do not getting picked up is so depressing - I can brush faster but like you said with a small shop and doing embroidery, lasering, and printing, not enough hands or time. Can I breathe - thanks


----------



## Krusty

Hi Irv and Slick,

I guess I'll chime in here. I am no good at cards, especially three-card monte. I just work as hard as I can to support Ioline's products and to help our customers. We just got back from the ISS Show in Long Beach which was very successful. We sold a lot of machines and, in fact, a couple of folks who had been happy with their CP I stopped by to tell us how "awesome" their CP II upgrade has been. 

Irv, as a Roland Certified Tech, I'm sure you know that technology manufacturers keep improving their products and whenever they come out with something new, the folks who bought the previous product feel that they wish they had gotten the newer model. I'm sure that sign guys who bought the Roland PC-600 four months earlier weren't too pleased when they saw the first Versa-Camm, So, though I understand how you feel, as you noted, Ioline has a reasonable upgrade offer for the CrystalPress II. I know you have met folks at shows who have had both the CP I and CP II (heck, I introduced you) and they did well with both machines, but the CP II IS a big improvement. PM me and I'll connect you with some more folks who got the upgrade.

Slick, I understand your interest in Peter's rumored all-new machine, on the computer screen, it sounds pretty cool, but (with no criticism meant toward Peter), you would be getting on at the very front end of a product development curve, which is fine if it goes smoothly, not so fine if it doesn't. I assume Peter would work hard to be sure you are happy, but I KNOW we can take good care of you and I'm looking forward to seeing you get another CrystalPress (so you can run them BOTH 24 hours a day)

Tom (Krusty)


----------



## idonaldson

Yes you are so right Krusty about what you stated. And I can assure you that even Ford produces a lemon every now and again. You also has said you would send me items for my machine that never came. You also on other occassions stated you would call me and never did. So I did not those things up. And as a roland tech - with a good relationship about their machines - you ever notice there are roland products I do not talk about - I wonder why. Why because I do not drink the koolaid and will not violate my morals to cover things that are wrong. I paid my dues on foreign soil so if you want to run your CP product up the flag pole - I will take that on - it is crap and has been crap for me from the start - and that was documented. Now maybe that is a good business plan for Ioline to unload as many machines as possible before their new model, and maybe that is why I will suck in business, but if I know there are problems and the machine can be refit then why keep selling them - how long was the new machine in development - I am quite sure it was ready the 4 months prior to it selling date. If you want to bring up my credentials - I will connect you to my Linkedin where you can use some more letters which appear behind my name. Pull up your old post - I'll wait.


----------



## Krusty

Well, Irv. You and I have tried to connect without success in the past and I will try again, but I don't have a Linkedin account so I'll call you again next week at one of the numbers you gave me. I'm sorry you're not happy with your purchase. We'll try to fix that.

Tom


----------



## idonaldson

I am saying - that was told to me in the past without any satisfaction or action. How about I be patient and drive it to the ISS show in March you can use it as a demo machine, and then tell me that it is user not machinery. I will glad report back here that it is I not my significant investment that is with ailment. Do you know that not only did I purchase the CP but I also purchased the IO300 - I have yet to say bad words about that machine for it does what it supposed to do. My only complaint with IOline methodology is the number of dongles required if you are using multiple machines and software.


----------



## allhamps

Irv sorry you have had such a bad experience. I had some trying issues in the beginning too but Ioline never stopped working to find a resolution. It wasn't the easy o!!ut of the box up and running process I expected but we got there and that time pain and money investment has paid off.

Krusty you are right. I know this is a new machine and it sounds incredible. Haven't heard anything about its supposed debut at the ISS show in Ian and that makes me very nervous. That second CPII is definitely on my list.


----------



## Stitch-Up

sjidohair said:


> Carol I have been waiting right there with you .
> Cant wait much longer either.
> 
> Sandy Jo


My advice - hang on in there 

I'm sure it'll happen and will be worth waiting for.


----------



## manninm5033

Just read through this thread & still am wondering if Ioline is worth the investment? If not, is there a better option at a comparable price? Thanks!


----------



## idonaldson

Jury is still out for me - but I will report back when I have a definite answer.


----------



## rangersgirl36

I have a question, I just bought a used Ioline are you able to use different stones than preciosa? I need a distributor for stones but feel overwhelmed I am told to get one grade below swvorski(sp?) I need some help advice something.


----------



## rangersgirl36

Does anyone know of any quality rhinestones equivalent to the preciosa stones that work well with the ioline crystal press? I'm also looking for a distributor for these stones. Please help!!


----------



## sjidohair

Jennifer , I believe tom suggests that you test stones, to see what works with your different wheels,

Did you get the swarovski wheels, 

There are wheels as well for korean stones as well.

I would check to see what wheels you are using and then , maybe give tom a call at ioline .

What will happen if you do not have the right stones is you will have USD stones. 
Up side down stones, 

You are gonna love this machine. Congrats.


----------



## rangersgirl36

Wow! Thanks so much! I was told Korean stones are the lower grade stones, I am all about quality I make dresses for sports and bling them out and since so many use screen print on these dresses it is what sets mine apart from everyone else. I have been using a company that says they use crystals one grade below the swvorski( I really need to learn how to spell that) so I am not sure what that means but I love the quality of them. I have been known to put 1oo plus stones on a dress so I need to know my clients will be satisfied as one of the owners wives of the Rangers has one, its important for me to provide that level of quality. When I did the webinar on the Ioline I intended to buy new but couldnt but they were very adament about telling me how important it was I used their stones. I guess I am concerned.


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## manninm5033

I had been using Korean stones, then machine cut. Since buying our Ioline I'm using their "Ioline" stones which are gorgeous! We have the ioline wheel...look at the wheels you have & see what they say.


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## rangersgirl36

I didnt get the swvorski wheels I have 4 wheels and not that one, I dont want to use those they are so expensive. Sorry I forgot to add that.


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## manninm5033

What wheels do you have?


----------



## sjidohair

Yep match up your stones with the right wheels,


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## rangersgirl36

10,6, and 16ss I believe I just got it. I still need a 20 if they have one.


----------



## sjidohair

jennifer but there are different kinds of wheels for different kinds of stones too,, 

there are precosia/swarovski wheels, in each size 

ones for lesser stones,, 

tom at ioline will help you,,


----------



## rangersgirl36

The people I bought the machine from were amazing! They sent me quite a few stones that were purchased from Ioline, they are beautiful and I am impressed, I just dont think I can get the quantity I need at a price I can afford. I need tons of rhinestones I do a ton of work, so I want to order bulks of stones in colors and sizes, I just really wish I could find a distributor to buy from wholesale I could afford. I have checked alibaba and they dont impress me they seem to gouge people there too. I also need a heat press and feel very overwhelmed all I can tell you is I was paying a company to do my stone work and I was tired of waiting days, they would go out of town and disappear for 2 weeks and I never even knew and I dont run my business that way so I took it into my own hands and now feel overwhelmed.


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## rangersgirl36

My wheels are precisosa.


----------



## Krusty

rangersgirl36 said:


> The people I bought the machine from were amazing! They sent me quite a few stones that were purchased from Ioline, they are beautiful and I am impressed, I just dont think I can get the quantity I need at a price I can afford. I need tons of rhinestones I do a ton of work, so I want to order bulks of stones in colors and sizes, I just really wish I could find a distributor to buy from wholesale I could afford. I have checked alibaba and they dont impress me they seem to gouge people there too. I also need a heat press and feel very overwhelmed all I can tell you is I was paying a company to do my stone work and I was tired of waiting days, they would go out of town and disappear for 2 weeks and I never even knew and I dont run my business that way so I took it into my own hands and now feel overwhelmed.


Hi Rangersgirl36,

I'm with Ioline and I'll try to explain the variety of wheels that we offer. First question, though, is do you have a CrystalPress II? Does the printer use a small vacuum pump to pick the stones up? If so, read on, If you have a CP I, the wheel choices are different. 

Understand, first, that we only offer multiple wheels for the 10ss and 6ss wheels. In other sizes, the wheels are "one size fits all". Typical Asian 10ss stones are slightly larger than the "Preciosa" 10ss crystal, (likewise with our "Ioline" brand stones). In turn, the "Swarovski" crystal is made slightly smaller than the "Preciosa" crystal. 

All the wheels have numbers on them that correspond to their particular size. You might see; a 10ss-162-40 which is optimum for Asian stones, a 10ss-159-40 that is optimum for "Preciosa" crystals (also rhinestuds), and a 10ss-150-40 that is optimum for "Swarovski" crystals. 

A word about what makes a wheel "optimum". It means that we have tested that particular wheel size and it gives the fastest thoughput for that certain stone, but it doesn't mean you can't use a different stone with that wheel. You could, for instance, run "Ioline" stones in the "Preciosa" wheel and it would work fine, you just wouldn't get maximum placement speed. But, you don't want to use a wheel that is too big for a certain stone because you will get upside-down stones.

PM me and I'll send you a current price list of our rhinestones and rhinestuds. It is true that our Ioline stones are not the very least expensive stones out there, but, I think, for the price, the quality you get, makes them a real good value. And there are stones out there that cost more, but offer less quality and less size and shape consistency.

Tom/Krusty/The Ioline Guy


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## lizziemaxine

rangersgirl36 said:


> swvorski.


You are really close on the spelling. It is Swarovski.


----------



## bek416

ringtailusa said:


> The Ioline does place the stones. That is why I wanted it. I don't have the time to cut stencil and then shake stones. The design is stored in your system. When you need another transfer just pull up the design, load the transfer paper in the CrystalPress, put the stones in the cup and push GO.
> I love mine.
> Vanessa



Vanessa, 

Looking to talk about this privately - please pm me!


----------



## bek416

VIXEN said:


> I went to the ISS show in Atlantic City and the guy was giving a demo of the machine and it broke also the machine can only use Swarovski crystals it does not use Rhinestones


How in the world would the machine know the difference?


----------



## bek416

allhamps said:


> ISS Atlantic City was fantastic. Great to meet, and see again, some of the Ioline folks.
> 
> Here's why I REALLY LOVE my Ioline:
> 
> Friday before I left for the show, I did some designs for a customer in FL for a proposed Haiti fundraising event, called Save Haiti/Project Medishare and Heat for Haiti. This morning she sent me photos of the photo shoot for the project with Gabrielle Union and some of the Miami Heat basketball players wives/fiancees, WEARING MY SHIRTS.
> 
> Tom, I'm gonna be needing some more of those machines, hopefully


I don't mean to sound critical, but this is the type of design I *don't* want - too scattered, not very detailed... I prefer a MUCH more detailed, closer stone look... this is the type of design I see around here, and I know they can be done better and more professional looking. I know you did these quickly, so again, I don't mean to pick on you - but this is an example of a "home job" look which I don't want. I hope the CrystalPress can do tighter designs???


----------



## lizziemaxine

bek416 said:


> I don't mean to sound critical, but this is the type of design I *don't* want - too scattered, not very detailed... I prefer a MUCH more detailed, closer stone look... this is the type of design I see around here, and I know they can be done better and more professional looking. I know you did these quickly, so again, I don't mean to pick on you - but this is an example of a "home job" look which I don't want. I hope the CrystalPress can do tighter designs???


That's why there is chocolate and vanilla ice cream. Not everyone likes the same thing. Some like them loose and some like them tight. Doesn't mean one or the other is wrong.


----------



## allhamps

Thank you Jane. This design was done for the sole purpose of the CUSTOMERS appeal. It is my job to give THEM what they want, not what I or anyone else wants. The machine can go to a tighter placement if it is required. However, if you are looking for your stones to touch, then I think you need to contine with hand placement, as all of the machines currently available have a "collision" limit on how close they will place stones.

As Jane said, different strokes for different folks. If the customer doesn't want to pay for a 2,000 stone design, but wants the same design, then the option is to go looser and bigger stones. The best piece of advice I can give you right now Becky is that just because you like something, doesn't mean it will sell or be what the customer '. Make sure you know what your customers are looking for and what they are willing to pay for, or you will be left with a lot of unpaid time.

And in case I didn't say, critcism is ok. I'm not offended at all. I've heard worse, but you live and you learn

Besides, I don't think the celebrities wearing the shirts, or the Artist who provided the original piece just for this project had anything negative to say, and I'll have my stuff on a celebrity any day I can, including Bird Man, Flo Rida, Nikki Minaj & Lil" Wayne!!!


----------



## bek416

allhamps said:


> Thank you Jane. This design was done for the sole purpose of the CUSTOMERS appeal. It is my job to give THEM what they want, not what I or anyone else wants. The machine can go to a tighter placement if it is required. However, if you are looking for your stones to touch, then I think you need to contine with hand placement, as all of the machines currently available have a "collision" limit on how close they will place stones.
> 
> As Jane said, different strokes for different folks. If the customer doesn't want to pay for a 2,000 stone design, but wants the same design, then the option is to go looser and bigger stones. The best piece of advice I can give you right now Becky is that just because you like something, doesn't mean it will sell or be what the customer '. Make sure you know what your customers are looking for and what they are willing to pay for, or you will be left with a lot of unpaid time.
> 
> And in case I didn't say, critcism is ok. I'm not offended at all. I've heard worse, but you live and you learn
> 
> Besides, I don't think the celebrities wearing the shirts, or the Artist who provided the original piece just for this project had anything negative to say, and I'll have my stuff on a celebrity any day I can, including Bird Man, Flo Rida, Nikki Minaj & Lil" Wayne!!!


Slick, 

The basketball shirt for Haiti is the one I'm talking about - it looks like I did it by hand.. when my customers see my work, it stands out because it's dense in stones and they are willing to pay a little more since they don't look like it was done by hand. I appreciate your post and advice! I have a "personal brand" in my town and I will always live up to what people expect of me when my name is on any kind of work. I compete in the beauty biz and I am very picky with how things look. I do appreciate your advice though. Now I'm also the one who emailed you about a custom job and I want that to be nice and tight  (I understand the limitations of the machines)


----------



## allhamps

Becky, I fully understand what you are saying. The basketball shirt was actually a design that was done several years ago for use with a template, which of course required more spacing to cut holes. It was not "designed" to utilize the ability of the CPII to get stones closer together. None the less, it's all about what the customer will pay for. If I can do so without having to change the pricing on some of my older original template designs, I reduce the stone spacing on all of them as I convert them over for the CPII. At times, even I am surprised at how much space was required to cut a template without it tearing into one big mess

I don't remember exactly what the minimum spacing is for the CPII, but you can pack them pretty closely. The machine also has a feature, as I'm sure others do to, that will indicate when two stones are set in the design too close to each other, and thus will cause an error.


----------



## bek416

Slick,
After reading up here, I think I am going to stick with ordering custom and premade transfers from people like you... you said you were swamped, do you think I should find someone else to go with? You seem nice enough  Let me know - I want to get started. Also, do you have a rec for a heat press under $400 that I could get started with?


----------



## allhamps

If you have something you want me to start with, send it to me and I will give you an honest opinion on how quickly I can get it done. You can also try posting in the Classified posts for someone. There are lots of folks here who can do that, but I don't have a personal recommendation.

As far as a heat press, I have only experience with my original HIX SWINGMAN, and I don't even remember how much it costs. I've seen several profiled here, so although not the short route, a search might turn up some good leads.

Let me know if I can help with anything else.


----------



## bek416

I sent it through your web form, I believe... it's the word STRIIV --- have a look, let me know when you can, thanks!


----------



## stefi2012

Hi,guys.I want to sell my crystal press.Who want it can email me to [email protected] used for 2 times,it looks like new.I dont need it because i changed my work.I can take pictures.


----------



## vgary

Stefi - How much? Is it Crystal Press or CP II? I am interested.


----------



## stefi2012

Hi,its crystal press.Im selling it with 4000$,it costed 6,765.68$.I have sorter wheels too 10ss,12ss,16ss and 6ss.And the software ioline crystal press.Im selling it with everything for 4000$.
Im from Romania.


----------



## twok4hd

As regards to "packing the stones in tightly" I have found on my CPII that just because the software indicates there will be a collision doesn't mean it won't print. We have made designs where the stones are less than 1mm and it ran great. 

One thing we did learn, if you are going to put a mixture of stone sizes that are going to be packed in real tight, we start with the smallest stones (6ss)first and the next largest after that. What we found is you can squeeze the 10ss in between a bunch of 6ss without the c-tip touching the 6ss stone because the 10ss is taller. If you try it the other way around then the outer edge of the c-tip touches the 10ss because it sits up higher.


----------



## HumbleShirts

twok4hd said:


> As regards to "packing the stones in tightly" I have found on my CPII that just because the software indicates there will be a collision doesn't mean it won't print. We have made designs where the stones are less than 1mm and it ran great.
> 
> One thing we did learn, if you are going to put a mixture of stone sizes that are going to be packed in real tight, we start with the smallest stones (6ss)first and the next largest after that. What we found is you can squeeze the 10ss in between a bunch of 6ss without the c-tip touching the 6ss stone because the 10ss is taller. If you try it the other way around then the outer edge of the c-tip touches the 10ss because it sits up higher.


I didn't think the software would let you press the GO button to send the design to the CPII if you had "!" showing in the layout. In our case, you have to have all the stones clear before the GO button turns green and will let it be sent to the CPII.

Am I missing something?


----------



## ifusion

I thought that too... but yes indeed, I was told by the tech support on the phone that it would work, and it DID work.


----------



## manninm5033

Just hit go...you'll get an error message but hit ok & it'll start printing.


----------



## mrsbabs

Good Morning,
Would you be willing to share the name of the design software you do use? I greatly appreciate you assistance


----------



## manninm5033

I use a combination of Illustrator and winPC pro.


----------



## NeedleLittleHelp

Ok, this is an old thread, but I am wanting to know how to get around buying their transfer/ sticky paper. That is the only stopping point for me. I often REUSE transfer paper...


----------



## NeedleLittleHelp

Ok, so getting current, does anyone know IOLINE/ Crystal Press ISS - show special deal? 
they sent email...promo says "too good to tell".
any ideas, ISS REP for IOLINE, I am on the fence about making next week in FT. Worth, any tips you can share?
THANKS


----------



## sjidohair

I create my own with reg transfer tape and masking tape.
That was the only thing stopping me when i purchased mine as well,

I love my machine,, It is slower but places the stones very well.

It works right beside me, as I work.


----------



## NeedleLittleHelp

Thanks, I want to make it to the ISS show to see the new softwear.
Basically can I just take the eps file I get, and tranport/ export directly to the crystal press.
How do you do the masking tape? If you don't mind sending me the details privately, thanks again


----------



## sjidohair

The crystal press does not use a eps file,
and if you purchase download files they need to be specific to robotic machine as they do not need to be sized up like a template does.

The crystal press works with plt and dxf files. as well as others,


----------



## ifusion

NeedleLittleHelp said:


> Thanks, I want to make it to the ISS show to see the new softwear.
> Basically can I just take the eps file I get, and tranport/ export directly to the crystal press.
> How do you do the masking tape? If you don't mind sending me the details privately, thanks again


In coreldraw you can export objects (circle, square, heart, lines, etc) as .plt files into the ioline program and then the software can outline, fill or both with rhinestones.

You can also take your 3rd party "circle" designs that are meant for cutters and export those as PLT files too. In the software you do a "center fill" and it will insert its own rhinestones in the middle of each circle, making the design.

As far as the transfer paper goes... I would recommend buying at least 1 pack from ioline to get you started. Then you will see how the masking tape part works. Basically you would take 1 inch masking tape and fold it over the 2 sides that slide under the wheels. This way when the wheels shift the paper back and forward it doesnt stick the the transfer paper. If you buy 1 pack and look at the paper, you'll get the idea.

Then you can go and order your transfer tape from anywhere you like. I find that shineart in California has good pricing.

I may be wrong on this statement now (i was using the CPI)... but your challenge is going to be finding reasonably priced stones of all qualities that sit nicely in your plates so that you don't spend your time flipping upside down stones.


----------



## twok4hd

The last time I calculated the cost of a sheet of Ioline transfer paper it was about a $1.53 a sheet. Now my question is, can you really save that much money by buying transfer paper and masking tape somewhere else and making your own? What about your labor? How do you repay yourself for that? If you haven't looked lately Ioline has an on line store that now sells transfer paper with the edging tape on it in bulk rolls.

Let's do the math. Each sheet costs 1.53 or .007 cents per sq. in. The bulk roll (50 yds X 15.75) costs 159.00 or .006 cents. Granted, not much savings. BUT, you can custom cut the roll reducing waste. How many sheet left overs have you had to throw away.

Now, lets talk stones. I buy the Ioline. Why, because I have less USD stones once I learned which stone like which wheel and the amount to put in each bowl. Believe me it can make a difference. The 6 and 10ss crystal stones cost me .002 cents a stone when buying at 500 gross. 

I also do embroidery and it amazes me the number of people that buy cheaper needles and thread and then gripe about the number of thread and needle breaks they have. Well guess what, they are less productive, and spending more money in the long run than I am. If you aren't able to run 500k to 750k stitches without a thread break you may want to look at the quality of the materials you are using.

Bottom line is the bottom line. You may spend less up front, but if it is slowing you down from doing what you are supposed to be doing by printing and pressing deigns, then you are losing more money than what you would have spent up front.

No, I do not work for Ioline. But I thought I would throw out my 2 cents.


----------



## BML Builder

Do you mean other rhinestone machines or are you looking for a heat press? If you are looking for other rhinestone machines, there are a couple of other really popular machines. There is the Cams machine and the Decor machine. The Cams is sold by Coldesi in Florida and the Decor is sold by Mesa Distributing in Texas. They are both very similar machine, but the biggest difference is that the Decor machine doesn't need a compressor to run it. It uses a pump system to run it. If you are looking for heat presses, there are many of them out there.


----------



## BSMAZ

NeedleLittleHelp said:


> Ok, this is an old thread, but I am wanting to know how to get around buying their transfer/ sticky paper. That is the only stopping point for me. I often REUSE transfer paper...


You can purchase their transfer paper in a roll and that will save some money. Otherwise, you can get some from Mesa Supplies, but you have to trip the edges of the backing, so that it has paper that runs under the CP rollers.

I have done it but I will admit that I went back to their roll for convenience. I had trouble with my paper edges not being wide enough.


----------



## BSMAZ

I also have a CPII. I have tried the rolled paper from another company and like the ioline rolled paper better. It allows me to reduce my waste.

Also, I find that the Ioline stones are actually large and the sparkle is really good compared to other Korean stones. They are smaller and also don't run as well in CP; therefore, I end up doing clean up on the back end. Definitely time consuming. However, there are times, when there isn't a choice because Ioline doesn't carry the 2mm studs or a stone color. So, in that case, I will default to Mesa Supplies. Their stones, even the Stellar, run well in the CP using the Rhinestud sorter wheel.

Time is money and we want to reduce our Labor time as much as possible.


----------



## PatsyB

Hi Preciosa stones are costly are there any really good alternatives out there that were with the Ioline two bowl system, keep having to turn really cheap stones back over which is a real pain.................

Thanks for any advice guys

PS in the UK


----------



## Stitch-Up

PatsyB said:


> PS in the UK


Where in the UK are you?

We're in Bridgend


----------



## PatsyB

Thank you Bedford!


----------



## Stitch-Up

Bridgend, Bedford, both begin with B 

Which Ioline do you have and how would you rate it?

I took at look some years back but they were too small and failed quite often!

Cheers

John


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