# What About A Home Server Host Your Own Stuff??



## swissarmour (Apr 29, 2007)

ok heres the thing hosting companies are just very confusing ive heard too many horror stories u dont raelly know who to trust with reviews 
and to be honest i dont really feel like i want to "settle" for something, let it be clear i havent actually been with a host i just got in with NEARLYFREESPEECH cause of the pricing but the interface itself is weird, so i think it might just be easier if i got some old pent4 machine put linux and just ran server software off of it that way im totally in control and theres no catches like with just about everyone its just too much false advertisement u never actually get what they promise and for personal sites its ok but not something like ecom where u cant risk having ur records wiped out or cancelled or suspended or whatever, most guys allow u a couple seconds per day to operate so much cpu, at hostgator its only 25% cpu i think in dreamhost its like 2500 seconds total per day sounds easy to get cancelled oh and heres the thing i want to launch a clubbing website with many pics so to advertise in there, so.. i just wanna toy with the stuff really hands on and forget about all these fine print problems...

so how do u set up a server at home??
ive heard linux is pretty easy on cpu so u dont even need a heavyweight cpu an old machine will work fine.. this is mainly for a start ill probably move to a host later but im not ready to shell out a yearly contract from a company im not sure about.. has anyone ever done something like that?


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## Rodney (Nov 3, 2004)

I think you may be making hosting way more complicated than it is. If you read too much on webhostingtalk, you'll get the idea that it's all fraud and bad experiences.

It would seem more of a risk to setup your own server if you don't know how to manage one securely than it would be to pay the small monthly fee to have it professionally hosted by a company that specializes in that business

Sometimes you have to stop reading reviews and just "jump in" 

It's really not that easy to get canceled. Just running a shopping cart or even a moderately successful site won't get you canceled off of a server or even give you extra charges.

Pair, LunarPages, ipowerweb, bluehost, and other hosts that have been recommended here will probably be more than you'll need for years.

If I were you, I'd just try out LunarPages and take it from there


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## swissarmour (Apr 29, 2007)

ur most probably right, the only reason id be willing to try that out is because i wouldnt mind learning how to set it up, however im feeling inclined to work with a local host and i think ill go with them.. 
heres what i looked at..
10 months totally free u only need a cc to b verified
they answered right away
they have cpanel fantastico cube zen and joomla until now i hadnt been able to find all together except hostgator

ur right rodney i am taking it too far trying to make a server, but im pretty sure most of us have some old machine lying around apart from the cpu theres no other cost involved most linux distros are free, i think its an awesome alternative to paying a year upfront to someone u dont know alot of besides the negative stuff especially if ur new

of all plans i liked dreamhost and then hostgator, dreamhost requires u to pay it all upfront and has no cpanel rather its own.. i dont like that... and hostgator is tried and true just theres so much negative stuff i felt like i was "settling rather than choosing.." just wasnt too big on em to pay money, i need a host quick and the least commitment possible.. im still learning
i also wanted to learn more about "theplanet" and a very highly considered "steadfast net" on webhostingtalk (tho alittle pricey), 10 months for one dollar cant go wrong there i mean if im cancelled i lost a buck..

i just think this would make good discussion to have here.. not to mention an awesome reference atleast to get the hang of stuff like running a cart cpanel etc for most of us newbies to ecom its like making ur own tin foil hat phone to stay connected before signing a eyarly contract its em rushed decisions the ones u always regret


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## Rodney (Nov 3, 2004)

> ur right rodney i am taking it too far trying to make a server, but im pretty sure most of us have some old machine lying around apart from the cpu theres no other cost involved most linux distros are free, i think its an awesome alternative to paying a year upfront to someone u dont know alot of besides the negative stuff especially if ur new


The problem there is that you're paying in "time" trying to learn how to setup a server. You could also be paying in fines if you lose and expose customer data due to an insecure setup. Also, if you have a high traffic site, your high speed internet provider is going to want to discuss bandwidth charges with you as well, since they don't base your pricing off of commercial usage.



> i need a host quick and the least commitment possible.. im still learning


There are lots of hosts with "cpanel" installed that allow quick installs of cubecart/zencart/joomla.

I don't know that you'd need "all" of those when setting up an ecommerce store, but even for the hosts that don't have quick install links, the installation process is pretty easy for each of those programs (they all provide step by step instructions)

There are lots of hosts with a small or zero commitment. You may have to pay a setup fee for a small commitment requirement, but if low commitment is your issue, then a setup fee won't be too much of an issue. Also, paying a year in advance can get you some serious discounts. If you can pay less than $100 for a year's worth of hosting at a big name provider, that's worth more than the time it would take a person who doesn't know linux or server administration to try to set it all up on its own.

If you're a techy kind of person and you just want to do it as a challenge to yourself, that's one thing. 

But I wouldn't recommend the "average" t-shirt store owner try to setup their own server. Takes too much time away from their core business.



> i just think this would make good discussion to have here


I agree, I'm just putting my own opinion into the discussion. I'm sure there are other opinions out there to be shared as well 



> to get the hang of stuff like running a cart cpanel etc


These days there are tutorials for just about everything under the sun. There are video tutorials built into cpanel that teach you how to use almost every function.

Each shopping cart has tutorials on how to setup and use their software. There are also forums for each that have a ton of knowledge that has been shared by their users.

I think it helps to narrow it down to what your hosting budget actually is, figure out what you need, and then make your hosting choice from there.

The hosting plans these days are so inexpensive, it seems like a bad move to get option paralysis on this step. You can always change your mind.


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## Chani (Jun 18, 2007)

If you do decide to go with DreamHost, they give you a 97 day, 100% money back guarantee. That's more than enough time to decide if their (great) service is worth it to you.

I've used quite a few hosts, and initially I got my money back the first time I went with them because I couldn't figure out their control panel. But when I went back recently, I got over that and now I understand it a lot better. Yes, it's weird coming from cPanel.

Keep in mind, tho, that it's not possible for an individual to purchase a license for WHM/cPanel. You need to be a hosting company (or buy site licenses that cover multiple machines).

The other thing to keep in mind that everyone knows cPanel. Including hackers. It's a lot more vulnerable than DreamHost's proprietory software.

The down side to that is that a lot of automation scripts won't work with their software, but there's one less thing to be hacked.

You can also find deals up to $97 off your first bill if you look at people's signatures on their forums.

All and all, I'd say you'd be pretty safe setting up hosting with them. 

Good luck with whoever you choose! Just don't risk all of that by doing it yourself. Unless you're an IT guy, please leave that part to the professionals.


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## Solmu (Aug 15, 2005)

There are *so many* reasons not to do this, not least of which is the fact that it's almost certainly against your ISP's ToS. A few others in quick dot point form:

security
speed
maintenance
downtime
cost (same principle of batch cost vs. individual cost applies here - I'd be very surprised if you actually saved money)
convenience
reliability
All in all, it's a very very very bad idea.


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## Solmu (Aug 15, 2005)

swissarmour said:


> dreamhost requires u to pay it all upfront


Last I checked they were like almost every other host - they allow monthly billing, it's just cheaper if you pay upfront.


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## AustinJeff (May 12, 2007)

swissarmour said:


> i think it might just be easier if i got some old pent4 machine put linux and just ran server software off of it that way im totally in control and theres no catches


For someone without Linux server experience, there is no way that it will be _easier_ to run your own server. Not even close. Not even in the same universe of ease.

Also, you are _never_ in total control and there are _always_ catches. You have to get your bandwith somewhere. Your ISP has plenty of fine print, too. 

That's not to say that you shouldn't do it. It could be a great learning experience. And it could be fun, if you are into that type of thing.

I would suggest finding a good Linux forum and posting your question there. I'm sure you'll get lots of well-informed suggestions. Don't be surprised if you get a few RTFM's as well.

Good luck.


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## expo (Mar 22, 2007)

If you want to experiment with setting up a home server I say go for it.

I would highly recommend you not run your business off of it though. 

Dreamhost, hostgator or the other big guys make it pretty easy. I have my own VPS and could save lots with going unmanaged but there is so much to worry about. If you don't know how to tweak a httpd, secure a server, manage numprocs, prvimages, or the like, don't put your business at risk.

The number two problem will be server speed. Even with 3meg download you still only have 256k upspeed. If you never get more than one customer at a time it may only look amateur, but more than that and you will crash and burn.

If you set up a home server let us know how it works.


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## Rodney (Nov 3, 2004)

> The other thing to keep in mind that everyone knows cPanel. Including hackers. It's a lot more vulnerable than DreamHost's proprietory software.


I wouldn't call it "a lot" more vulnerable than dreamhost. I don't know if there's any data to support that claim.

I don't really think cpanel is a bad choice for anybody choosing hosting. Most hosts stay on top of patches, and security is going to be a concern for any major hosting company.


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## SomeSailor (Jun 29, 2007)

I host through Lunarpages (4 websites). I've NEVER had an outage... NEVER lost a bit of data... or had anything but the best service. They run something on the average of $150/year and are great folks to deal with.

If you're serious about doing eCommerce... don't even think about hosting at home. You're asking to get blacklisted.


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## Moo Spot Prints (Jul 16, 2006)

SomeSailor said:


> They run something on the average of $150/year and are great folks to deal with.


I run a linux server from home. My monthly costs are around $80 ($60 for a static dsl line + $20 for the juice). I have been running linux since it could only be gotten on floppies. My friends and I use it for out email, web hosting, etc. and share in the maintenance. We are all software engineers and know what we're doing. We still manage to screw things up *all* the time. Backups fail, config files get misconfigured, drives fill up, the OS needs updating, Ack! we got hacked... It can be a lot of work sometimes! 99% of the time it's on autopilot but that 1% -- ugh it's like having a second job.

We are not set up for e-commerce of any sort. We would need a much beefier UPS for power, hardware redundancy, better security, OS tweaks... the list goes on. It's doable but it's a lot less work (and cheaper to boot) to use a dedicated hosting company. FIOS will change that to some extent. At $100 for a business license and fiber speeds more people will probably opt for in-house hosting.

I don't mean to discourage you either. Learning linux (or any unix) is a great way to learn computers. Everything is out there and pretty well supported thanks to google. It will probably help you understand what your provider is doing for you to boot.



SomeSailor said:


> If you're serious about doing eCommerce... don't even think about hosting at home. You're asking to get blacklisted.


You mean email? This can be a serious problem as email gets locked down tighter and tigher. Try getting unblocked from AOL sometime. I dare you. You can void most of your headaches by relaying your mail through your ISP and not sending directly from your box.


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## jakt (Jul 28, 2007)

I don't know about you guys but using hosting companies like Godaddy and the others are far cheaper than your own server, setting up a server is way more costly and you have to know what you are doing 
(what type of RAID configurations? how many concurrent hits? What type of disaster recover plan? How do you back up? How do I keep my server hacker free? The list goes on and on) 
Plus you have to use a real server rather than a computer you call a "server" because psuedo servers don't cut it. If you ran your own site from your own server your customers would have a bad experience, you would have little security, countless possible hardware issues and terrible bandwith (unless you want to shell out thousands for a dedicated T1 line), take my advice ecommerce is easy if you stick with the companies that make it easy. Do your customers a favor and don't DIY with your money maker.


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## SomeSailor (Jun 29, 2007)

Moo Spot Prints said:


> You mean email? This can be a serious problem as email gets locked down tighter and tigher.


No... I mean eCommerce. Try to explain to your merchant provider that will allow you (for long) to process Visa / MC transactions from home.


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## aspen (Aug 1, 2007)

Well if you were running it off your cable modem or DSL remember most ISPs have rules against doing that, so you risk being cut off.

Also, what happens when your power goes out? Or your ISP does maintenence and turns off your connection for a few hours. Do you have a backup generator, redundant ISP connections? No. Well all hosting companies do.

I have two servers through The Planet (formerly Ev1, formerly Rackshack) and have used them ro 6 years or so now and have no complaints. Previously I used many small hosts and they would have problems at times. If you cannot afford a dedicated server, they also do virtual hosting. 

Remember, what you spend on hosting is tax deductible, there really isn't a good reason to do it yourself.


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## Moo Spot Prints (Jul 16, 2006)

aspen said:


> Well if you were running it off your cable modem or DSL remember most ISPs have rules against doing that, so you risk being cut off.


That's what business class lines are for.



> Also, what happens when your power goes out? Or your ISP does maintenence and turns off your connection for a few hours. Do you have a backup generator, redundant ISP connections? No. Well all hosting companies do.


Again, business class lines provide some level of reliability. A decent UPS will get you through the brownouts. You really think *all* the cut rate hosting services offer six nine's of uptime? That costs real money. Besides, we're talking about t-shirt sites for pete's sake! Is your world really going to crumble if your site is down for a few hours every couple of months?




> Remember, what you spend on hosting is tax deductible, there really isn't a good reason to do it yourself.


It's deductible whether it's in home or off site. 

Don't get me wrong, I think it's definitely not a good idea for the average Joe to host their sites at home. You really have to know what you're doing to keep everything working smoothly. 

However, it is a very good learning experience for somebody who's technically inclined. You will come to appreciate the dents servers and hard drives leave on the drywall after you fling enough of them against the wall. 

The compelling reasons to have it hosted *by a reputable, proven company* are:


It will probably be cheaper
It will probably be more reliable
Hardware problems will become someone else's problems

Security, software and transaction issues are yours regardless of where it's hosted.


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## aspen (Aug 1, 2007)

If you're down for a few hours when Googlebot comes by and that downtime causes your site to be delisted for a month it matters. Or maybe some journalist wants to mention one of your designs in an article but oops, your site is down when they're working on it.

I've built dozens of PCs in my spare, time, worked for years as a programmer, managed web servers about as long as the web has existed, and I'd never do it out of my home. With hardware and bandwidth costs dropping every day hosting is dirt cheap. There was a time in the mid90s when it was pretty expensive, but not anymore. So unless you're doing it for the "fun" of it, find a good host.


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## Moo Spot Prints (Jul 16, 2006)

aspen said:


> If you're down for a few hours when Googlebot comes by and that downtime causes your site to be delisted for a month it matters.


Google won't drop it right away. The bot will make several attempts before tossing it to the bit bucket. How long is the power going to be out? If it's for a few days, how are you going to connect to your server and get the orders? How will you manufacture the goods if there's no power? Will the post office even be open? 

I think the always-available-always-on model is overrated for 90% of the web sites out there.

Note: This doesn't include your Rodney. This forum had BETTER be online to eight nines or there will be hell to pay. We need our daily fix! 



aspen said:


> Or maybe some journalist wants to mention one of your designs in an article but oops, your site is down when they're working on it.


Certainly a valid point. There's a tradeoff between reliability and cost. The original poster wanted to minimize cost and wanted to explore the possibility of hosting it himself and then eventually hosting it off-site.



aspen said:


> I've built dozens of PCs in my spare, time, worked for years as a programmer, managed web servers about as long as the web has existed, and I'd never do it out of my home.


Funny, I've built dozens of PCs in my spare time, worked for years as a programmer, managed web servers about as long as the web has existed myself and I've done it from home ever since the cost got down to a level where I could afford it. No plans on changing that, especially now that FIOS is being lit up. 

I really don't care if people get a 404 from time to time or if email is down for a few hours if the power goes out. My needs are different, I'm not trying to host Amazon.


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## aspen (Aug 1, 2007)

Well I guess it depends on volume. I'm a business man and look at the big picture, I want the business to grow and I need to make sure my solution fits my needs. You might have a website that only gets a few hundred daily visitors, mine right now gets over a hundred thousand unique souls visiting a day, bandwidth requirements are rather large. So thats the perspective I'm coming from when I post. Your experience will obviously vary, to each their own.

Also, FWIW, if the power goes out for a few days (heck, 6 hours), I'm taking my laptop to Starbucks or somewhere else that has power and free wifi. I live right next to a large university with their own power plant so worst case scenario, I'll use their wifi. Back in the big blackout on the east coast to midwest in 2002 was it? All around us power was out but the university still had power. The little open Blimpies in one of the buildings made a killing that night. 

ps... wish I could get fios here.


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## hycheese (Feb 21, 2007)

know this subject has been beat like a dead horse - but:
When I ran a home server it cost me $160 a month for open ports and unrestricted bandwidth, my upload was only 384k at the time - which would be the visitors download speed, very slow if you get more than a few people at the same time.

You may be able to trick your ISP for a while using a DNS port forwarder but they will catch on soon and you will be black listed, if they are the only game in town then you lose.


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## SomeSailor (Jun 29, 2007)

aspen said:


> I'm a business man and look at the big picture, I want the business to grow and I need to make sure my solution fits my needs.


And that's precisely why you should opt for being hosted by professionals. Let them assume the risk of down time, the expense of fat pipes, security monitoring, SOX compliance... not to mention cost of keeping up with hardware requirements. 

If you're an ISP, by all means host yourself, but leave their jobs to them, and concentrate on your own business plan.


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## Moo Spot Prints (Jul 16, 2006)

hycheese said:


> know this subject has been beat like a dead horse


Nah, just some debate and different perspectives. It's all good. Isn't that the point of this forum - to learn and share? 

I don't think anyone would advocate hosting a large/popular or mission-critical web site from home on a dsl/cable modem line (at least for long). However, setting up a server and hosting a small site is totally doable and (IMO) a very valuable experience for when you *do* outsource it. There's nothing better than screwing things up to teach you how to do it right. 

If you've ever been curious, download ubuntu and have at it!


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## hycheese (Feb 21, 2007)

I can echo that Moo Spot Prints, that's how I learned - by my own mistakes.
Haven't played much with ubuntu though I hear it is good, SuSE is what I like. started with redhat 4 did a little gentoo too.

It is very easy to start a server by running the apache triade even on a windows machine.


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## SomeSailor (Jun 29, 2007)

hycheese said:


> It is very easy to start a server by running the apache triade even on a windows machine.


I agree... and I don't wanna sound like a stick in the mud either. Just be careful when working with MC/Visa. If you ever have a problem, or get hacked or get caught storing numbers improperly... and get blacklisted... that'll affect you forever


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## hycheese (Feb 21, 2007)

Right toe there Sailor, i should of made that part clear myself. Me being an MS IIS guy and my son spending the last 15 years on Linux - I still don't run a server for salable items paid via the net - only simple webpages and such.

sorry for any confusion
cb


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