# Mug Sublimation Problem! (Help)



## jscargo (Oct 13, 2013)

Hey guys, I'm new to sublimation and I'm trying to print some mugs using an oven wrap, but I haven't been successful so far..

So here it's whats happening.... I'm putting the mug with an oven wrap (using a silicon wrap + paper clips for pressure) on the oven for 6 min at a temperature of 150-180 C... and the result is not good at all - some areas are correctly printed... but most of it... it's like... different colour intensity, some parts more, some less - as if it's stained... like pretty bad.... I've tried longer temperatures and longer times, but then the transfer becomes brown... or similar results... wiith less time and less temperature, either the sublimation doesn't happen or similar results... I've tried to iron heat a t shirt and it worked fine...

Any ideas of what could be the problem?

I have a epson s22 printer, transfer paper for light garments, sublimation ink with CISS on the printer, which is new...

could it be the ink? or the lack of pressure on the oven? 

If I buy a mug heat press, would the results change?


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## paintersspouse (Jul 26, 2012)

I do my mugs in a convection oven but my time is 15 minutes.


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## jscargo (Oct 13, 2013)

15 min and what temperature? here 15 min was too much in most cases, the transfer got brown, so, i supposed it shouldnt be like that... any other idea?


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## paintersspouse (Jul 26, 2012)

400 degrees.


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## jscargo (Oct 13, 2013)

yeah here that's not the problem... at this time the transfer paper gets very brown and the surface whre there is ink very burnt... maybe its a pressure problem? or low quality ink?


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## paintersspouse (Jul 26, 2012)

Maybe its your temp. Do you know if your thermometer is correct? My paper goes brown when my temp is too high, other than that I have no problems.


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## jscargo (Oct 13, 2013)

can the ink be a problem? i bought it as a sublimation ink.... but print looks watery... like the ink melt.. instead of becoming a gas.. could this be an issue?


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## paintersspouse (Jul 26, 2012)

Anything could be the problem. We can not see your results or your sublimation ink, paper and blanks.

However I have already worked through the problems and know that you can not just hop from idea to idea thinking this is the problem. It is a process of elimination.

It could be

Temp.
substrate
pressure
paper
ink
printing

You have to go through each one and rule them out.


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## jscargo (Oct 13, 2013)

well, maybe u guys can help with the elimation proccess... transfer paper sold for light garments is the same as the one used for mugs?


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## paintersspouse (Jul 26, 2012)

I did, you said you knew that it was not that.


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## jscargo (Oct 13, 2013)

another thin, how does the printed part of the transfer should be, after the sublimation has happened? same colour as if it got out of the printer, or lighter, darker?


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

jscargo said:


> Hey guys, I'm new to sublimation and I'm trying to print some mugs using an oven wrap, but I haven't been successful so far..
> 
> So here it's whats happening.... *I'm putting the mug with an oven wrap* (*using a silicon wrap + paper clips for pressure*) on the oven for 6 min at a temperature of 150-180 C... and the result is not good at all - some areas are correctly printed... but most of it... it's like... different colour intensity, some parts more, some less - as if it's stained... like pretty bad.... I've tried longer temperatures and longer times, but then the transfer becomes brown... or similar results... wiith less time and less temperature, either the sublimation doesn't happen or similar results... I've tried to iron heat a t shirt and it worked fine...
> 
> ...


Most wraps have either a clamping bar or a bolt that screws into a metal assembly to increase pressure. What do you have specifically? I can't fathom the need for a paper clip. A paper clip would not give you adequate pressure.

Are you saying you made your own using a silicon wrap and a paper clip?

Here are a couple of common mug wraps ...

Cactus Mug Wraps

Where To Buy A Mug Wrap. | Call LRi Today!#


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## paintersspouse (Jul 26, 2012)

Mike

I have made my own mug wraps. I use bull dog clips but I have also had success with tape as well.


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## jscargo (Oct 13, 2013)

yeah i am considering that it might be a problem of pressure too... as I cant really know what difference of pressure i am getting from these cactus wrap with a silicon wrap + a metal paper clip for office use.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

jscargo said:


> yeah i am considering that it might be a problem of pressure too... as I cant really know what difference of pressure i am getting from these cactus wrap with a silicon wrap + a metal paper clip for office use.


Suggest to buy a few wraps from a sublimation vendor, I have used both types I mentioned.

There would still be some "tweaking" by trial and error of time/temp/pressure, and possibly with the transfer creation as well, but I think that will solve your problem.


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## superD70 (Dec 22, 2010)

jscargo said:


> I have a epson s22 printer, transfer paper for light garments, sublimation ink with CISS on the printer


This would be my first guess, sublimation paper and ink jet transfer paper are not the same


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

superD70 said:


> This would be my first guess, sublimation paper and ink jet transfer paper are not the same


That would be a big problem too.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

jscargo said:


> another thin, how does the printed part of the transfer should be, after the sublimation has happened? same colour as if it got out of the printer, or lighter, darker?


To David's point (Super D70) ...

When you remove your paper does it stick hard and force needed to peel it off? Are you really using sublimation paper and not paper meant for regular inkjet transfer paper onto tshirts?

For your question .. the transfer should look lighter/weaker on paper _if_ you are color correcting with an ICC profile. After transfer then the colors "pop" and should look more like the source image in your computer.


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## jscargo (Oct 13, 2013)

so, what's the difference between sublimation paper and transfer paper?


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## jscargo (Oct 13, 2013)

here is the kind of result i am getting now..the mug... and how the transfer paper looks like after peeled off... could it be the ink?


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## jim55912 (Jun 10, 2008)

jscargo said:


> so, what's the difference between sublimation paper and transfer paper?


Sublimation paper is made to work with sublimation dye. 

We used to do tons of mugs, we used cactus wraps, we wrenched them pretty tight. I think you need a fair amount of pressure or the image will bleed.

We taped the transfer to the mug nice & snug and then put on the wrap. After heating we quickly removed the cactus wrap and plunged the mug and transfer (still taped on) into water. If you move the transfer when the mug is still hot you can smudge the print.

A convection oven works better.

You will have to experiment with time.


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## jscargo (Oct 13, 2013)

yeah well, now I got the mug press, so I think pressure is ruled out as a problem...


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

jscargo said:


> here is the kind of result i am getting now..the mug... and how the transfer paper looks like after peeled off... could it be the ink?


That 2nd picture should not look like that. I have to wonder if you are using a plastic based transfer paper and not sublimation paper. 

After you remove the paper do you feel anything on the mug itself like and raised area or edge in the design part? Looks like a plastic release paper to me. 

That plastic release paper (which we would call regular transfer paper) will sublimate since it is a polymer, but will leave behind a "patch". The 2nd photo looks like what would happen if some of the plastic stuck on the mug but other parts of the plastic stayed on the paper.

Sublimation paper looks like a bright white inkjet matte paper, there is no plastic carrier. If you run your finger across the surface there should be no feeling difference between the areas where your transfer is and the areas where there is no transfer.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

jscargo said:


> here is the kind of result i am getting now..the mug... and how the transfer paper looks like after peeled off... could it be the ink?


Look at the areas where I have red arrows pointing to. There is a very distinct transition from the dark to the pale. Even with poor pressure using the correct you could have some poor dye release in some areas, but shouldn't be such a contrast in the transition. This looks as though you have some plastic (clear film like) on that paper and some is staying behind on the peeled paper.

Referring bask to SuperD70's comment about the paper and his highlight of "_transfer paper for light garments"_ ...

We never call out sublimation paper being for "light garments" printing on a light garment is always assumed. We don't sub on dark garments, at least with sublimation paper.

"Regular" Ink jet transfers can be for either light or dark garments. "Light garment" transfer paper has a clear plastic (film like) carrier and "Dark garment" transfer paper is a white plastic that give the ink on top opacity. These papers are really a "sticker" that sits on the surface. This leaves suspicion about your paper you are using.


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## jim55912 (Jun 10, 2008)

mgparrish said:


> Look at the areas where I have red arrows pointing to. There is a very distinct transition from the dark to the pale. Even with poor pressure you could have some poor dye release in some areas but this looks as though you have some plastic (clear film like) on that paper and some is staying on the peeled paper.
> 
> Referring bask to SuperD70's comment about the paper and his highlight of "_transfer paper for light garments"_ ...
> 
> ...


When I buy sublimation paper it comes in a package that says "sublimation paper"....


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## jscargo (Oct 13, 2013)

thanks guys, the problem is evident with the type of paper, I bought proper sublimation paper and will show you the results when able.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

jim55912 said:


> When I buy sublimation paper it comes in a package that says "sublimation paper"....


 Me too! Never saw sub paper distinguished as being for light garments.


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## GordonM (May 21, 2012)

mgparrish said:


> Me too! Never saw sub paper distinguished as being for light garments.


LRi has something like this (second item down), though I'm not sure what it is or what it's composed of.

Sublimation Transfer Supplies | LRi

It does say "for textiles," but some folks may miss that.

This may not be what the OP is using, but sadly there are products out there that have the potential to confuse. They ought to come up with different names for this stuff, or provide more detailed descriptions.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

GordonM said:


> LRi has something like this (second item down), though I'm not sure what it is or what it's composed of.
> 
> Sublimation Transfer Supplies | LRi
> 
> ...


Looks like the "I Trans Lite" is regular inkjet transfer paper which could also be used as "prep" paper if used for sublimating onto 50/50 fabric. Many of these type of papers can "prep" ... but I never see the need, just use pigments for those. But if someone didn't have or want an extra printer with pigments and wanted to do 50/50s then it might be useful.

They do mention "white of light colors" for fabrics for the EZTrans, which looks like true sub paper, but they also mention hard goods usage in the description.

Could be they distinguish on the white/light aspect on the papers as they have a White Fabric Patch for dark fabrics on the same page.

Come to think of it most sub papers I have seen they don't designate the papers as being _just_ "for light garments". The OP may have truncated the description but most all sub paper can be used for both hard goods and soft goods. Where some papers like TexPrintHR tend to be used mostly for fabric, they aren't restricted to just that usage ie glass transfers with white backing benefit form "HR" type papers. 

Could be other sub papers out there calling out "light garments" in the extended descriptions but excluding hard goods on any sub paper would seem uncommon. One exception might be Beaver Tacky Sub Paper, which is mostly for large format unless you could find it cut.


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## skdave (Apr 11, 2008)

jscargo said:


> thanks guys, the problem is evident with the type of paper, I bought proper sublimation paper and will show you the results when able.


E mail me your address and I will mail you a transfer that is correct so you can see the difference. no cost. 
[email protected]
Dave


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## binki (Jul 16, 2006)

jscargo said:


> well, maybe u guys can help with the elimation proccess... transfer paper sold for light garments is the same as the one used for mugs?


Now this is your problem. You also need to use sublimation ink and a sublimatable product.


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