# Dye Sublimation Questions



## Ken Styles (Mar 16, 2006)

Hi All,
I am thinking about getting into dye sub.
I already do plenty of vinyl and screen printing jobs.

My question is concerning the fading of the image on the products.
Does it happen? Particularly with the t-shrits?
Any customer complains, returns..etc?

Does it all depend on the brand of sublimation ink you are using?
If so, what are the better brands?
Thanks!

Ken


----------



## imeccentric (May 13, 2007)

Ken,
Dye sub doesn't fade. You can even bleach it and it retains it's color. Sawgrass holds the patents on sublimation inks so you only have a couple of choices through them.


----------



## BGSSUB (Oct 17, 2008)

On garments, sublimation prints will not fade (unless one uses bleach and it will affect just like any polyester colored material).

On FRP (Fiberglass reinforced plastic), aluminum, and other substrates it's dependent on exposure to UV. Blues (the worst offender I've had) tend to fade out if in the sunlight for extended time ... ie license plate, signage, etc.

If the substrate is not exposed to sunlight, the colors will not fade and remain brilliant and have that "WOW" factor!


----------



## imeccentric (May 13, 2007)

I bleach my shirts all of the time and have never had a problem with color loss.


----------



## Ken Styles (Mar 16, 2006)

I just checked out the prices of the sublimation ink and it's 100+ per refill for 1 color?
$800 bucks to fill up a printer? Wow! .
Is that accurate? How long do these cartridges last?
Can you print the image on a draft setting or must they be on a picture quality setting for the image to come out nicely on a t-shirt.
I'm sure you can make a profit if you set prices accordingly, but would probably be hard to sell products in times like were are in now


----------



## [email protected] (Jan 27, 2009)

We don't generally suggest doing sublimation for shirts. The shirts have to be 100% poly (which are expensive shirts) and the ink, as you have found out, is expensive as well. It does make nice shirt, but heat transfers are a great substitute which is much more cost effective. have you looked into heat transfer paper?


----------



## Ken Styles (Mar 16, 2006)

No, can you direct me to a heat transfer that has a very soft feel? 
I don't want people to complain that it is an "iron on"


----------



## BGSSUB (Oct 17, 2008)

I prefer sublimation shirts over heat transfers for those customers wanting a nice quality product that will last through multiple washings and still look the same as the day they purchased them. These customers understand why the shirts cost more and are willing to pay the price to have a shirt that lasts. Some of our little league teams prefer the shirts to be the moisture wicking poly for two reasons ... the kids stay cooler in the hot sun and the shirts look nearly the same after an entire season as when they first issued them to the players at the beginning of the season. Cotton t's can't do that.

My jumbo cartridges last nearly 6 months ... that's using them for hard substrates and garments ... maybe average 100 shirts a month ... with smatterings of larger orders and continuous daily use for namebadges, signs, mugs, plaques, etc.

We've had the system for almost two years (printer, press, paper, inks ... etc.) and I'm pretty sure we've paid for the whole setup already with profits from sales.

It's a matter of making the right sales pitch and giving customers all the facts ... good and bad ... about what would be right for the purpose of their inquiry. Sublimated shirts at $20 vs $10 heat transfer shirts have their place for those customers wanting to have the option.


----------



## imeccentric (May 13, 2007)

I agree. I market mainly my sublimated t's and customers don't blink an eye. It's all in "perceived" value, not real value. Mine run $30-35 each so $20 is a bargain. Of course that includes any image adjustment or quick artwork that may be needed. Not all of us have, or want, the same market, so sublimation isn't for everyone. As for the cost of the inks, they run the same/ml as my regular canon inks do. It's just that you are buying in larger quantity. Since my main business is embroidery, my customers are a little more used to high end embellishment pricing.


----------



## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

The price you got is about right..Sawgrass has a strangle hold on the inks in the US..and you cannot legally import the chinese inks...besides they are not very good and no support. The carts last for a while..depending on how much you print. I use a bulk system and you get 5-6 times the prints or more for just about double the cost..


----------



## selzler (Apr 4, 2007)

imeccentric said:


> I agree. I market mainly my sublimated t's and customers don't blink an eye. It's all in "perceived" value, not real value. Mine run $30-35 each so $20 is a bargain. Of course that includes any image adjustment or quick artwork that may be needed. Not all of us have, or want, the same market, so sublimation isn't for everyone. As for the cost of the inks, they run the same/ml as my regular canon inks do. It's just that you are buying in larger quantity. Since my main business is embroidery, my customers are a little more used to high end embellishment pricing.


 
I agree sublimation is the way to go. I use softlink and vapor and my customer love the feel and the print not cracking and falling off. We just did a order of 500 shirts. The customer said that is what he wanted I told him that it would be cheeper to screen print them and he said no. I like the feel and no heavy inks on the front of the shirt he likes that the shirt can breath were the ink is on the shirt. He told me he wouldn't buy anyother shirt any more.


----------



## koronto (Jun 17, 2008)

charles95405 said:


> The price you got is about right..Sawgrass has a strangle hold on the inks in the US..and you cannot legally import the chinese inks...besides they are not very good and no support. The carts last for a while..depending on how much you print. I use a bulk system and you get 5-6 times the prints or more for just about double the cost..


 
Hi what do you mean bulk systems? How big are the catradiges. Also what type of printers do you gusy use to print your sublimtation transfers? I am thinkign of buying a 1400 epspon for a dye sublimation printer... just not sure. Do you just print from illustrator or photoshop? Have a good day all.


----------



## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

A bulk system...sometimes referred to as Continious Ink System (CIS) is hardware that replaces the carts in a 1400 and attached to either bottles or bags or ink. Most any vendor of sublimation ink has such for sale. I use an epson 1400 with artainium ink. I think the price of the hardware/ink is around $1000 but will out last 4-5 car refills. One suggestion..buy the CIS systema and ink from the same source...avoid ebay..buy quality from a quality vendor...some of the forum sponsors have the setup


----------



## imeccentric (May 13, 2007)

Charles,
Or some of us use the 4800/4880 which has 110 or 220ml cartridges which run the same as the bulk system inks. Same price but no external bulk system. Since I run the hybrid and use artainium, I need a rip with mine and run it through corel draw.


----------



## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

Jim I mentioned the CIS for the 1400 as that is what the thread starter indicated he was thinking of getting. I am certainly aware of the 4800 series and the larger ink supply as well as the large price tag. There is also the wide format..I think those start with the 7000 series and the new ricoh 7000(I think it is from ricoh) with gel ink...could be the coming thing


----------



## imeccentric (May 13, 2007)

Charles, 
I just mentioned the 4800 because most just starting out don't realize it doesn't need the bulk system. That really was one of the main reasons I purchased it. It really is overkill for those who don't print much or don't want to invest that much money in a printer. I have no doubt you print lots more than I do and I bow to your expertise Do you use a rip with your artainium or is there a profile that works for you? Because I have the hybrid and use artainium, I had to have the rip(I think the translation for rip means outrageously expensive). As for gel ink, this industry is moving so fast, it's amost silly to invest a lot in a printer(unless that is your main business and you print a lot) because they are obsolete so quickly.


----------

