# fabric's - what is the max cotton ratio for dye sub?



## sbob_22 (Dec 24, 2007)

what is the max cotton ratio for dye sub? is that all you can print on is cotton/polyester? can you print on spandex or anyother type of fabric? (as you can tell im a newbie.thanks)


----------



## selzler (Apr 4, 2007)

*Re: fabric's*

Hi:
I don't sublimate on and cotton frabric at all I only use polyester and other man made frabric, Nylon, nylon satin, spandex doe's work. Most man made fabrics work but not natrual made frabric.


----------



## celmoso (Jul 15, 2007)

*Re: fabric's*

The lower the polyester %, the lower contrast in your colors. I have printed on stuff that was part spandex when I wasn't concerned about the boldness of the design.


----------



## BRSIGNWORKS (Dec 24, 2007)

I have done sublimation on 50/50 shirts and it comes out looking a little washed out. If you stretch the shirt a little you can see where the ink didnt hold in. If your customer doesnt mind the look it an ok process.

I would get a few 50/50 shirts and do some samples and compare with other fabrics.

Sublimating on 100% poly is always the best and it's recommended.


----------



## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

If you want true sublimation...zero cotton!!!.. sublimation causes the ink to turn gas and bond to polyester..it will NOT bond to cotton and it will wash out. It might look okay at first...but will not last. you can put lipstick on a pig but it is still a pig..

do a test yourself...print on a piece of polyester and then on a 50/50. The term 50/50 is sometimes confused with the Hanes Soft Link 50/50 shirt..that is NOT a blend...but made just for sublimation and has 100 % polyester on the outside for the sublimation ink but 100% cotton on the inside for comfort...dual layer..


----------



## BRSIGNWORKS (Dec 24, 2007)

sorry if i may have confused some. I was talking about using the 50 cotton/ 50 poly shirts and not the softlink.


----------



## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

then my answer holds...I was not confused by your post..it will not work satisfactorily period...the dye sub ink will not bond to the cotton and will show wash badly. If you read what sublimation is and is not you will see why cotton is not a viable option...at least not for me


----------



## helix-2000 (Nov 6, 2007)

Using 50/50 shirts gives you the washed out. faded look. If using dye sub stay with a higher ratio of poly vs cotton.


----------



## selzler (Apr 4, 2007)

I think people that want to do sublimation should use the right garments that way the sublimation printing can stay strong and not get a bad rep. like a lot of heat transfers have got for not staying on. Sublimation will not crack and peel but if it washes out you lose. And not only sublimation work your customer may think all your work is junk. So don't cut corners and do it right. It will be better in the long run.


----------



## binki (Jul 16, 2006)

We have done dye sub with 50/50 and it will look somewhat washed out after you wash it. 

We also used the Duracotton98 as a pre-treatment to dye-sub papers and the results were not bad, again on 50/50's

The best results will be on 100% poly. 

Having said all of that, we really don't care for dye-sub on shirts. The shirts cost 4-5 times a cotton shirt and their are a number of perils in the process. You will need to command a premium price to do this. If you are successful, the results will be stunning.


----------



## cryman (Mar 19, 2007)

anyone here found an 65 per cent polyester and 35 per cent cotton or has sub printed on that stated here??


----------



## D.Evo. (Mar 31, 2006)

Yes, and result is still the same - faded and washed out print. You will lose 35% of your image as the dye-sub ink will not bond to cotton threads.


----------



## Lola (Jan 18, 2008)

Hi,
We dye sub all the time onto 35% cotton/65% polyester and it works really well if you want a slightly faded look - which we do. The feel of this blend is much better than 100% polyester and the fade on the print is not a significant as on 50%/50%. The special Ts for dye sub ie Hanes SoftLink have the disadvantage that they are very expensive AND Hanes has stopped making them! You do get a good bright durable print from them but we find this does not make up for the price difference.
We get our 35/65 Ts from kdsblanks.com. Good prices and good quality. Check it out.


----------



## cryman (Mar 19, 2007)

Lola said:


> Hi,
> We dye sub all the time onto 35% cotton/65% polyester and it works really well if you want a slightly faded look - which we do. The feel of this blend is much better than 100% polyester and the fade on the print is not a significant as on 50%/50%. The special Ts for dye sub ie Hanes SoftLink have the disadvantage that they are very expensive AND Hanes has stopped making them! You do get a good bright durable print from them but we find this does not make up for the price difference.
> We get our 35/65 Ts from kdsblanks.com. Good prices and good quality. Check it out.


where's the link to Kdsblanks.com ??? or is it kidsblank?
thanks


----------



## Lola (Jan 18, 2008)

Sorry - typo! The correct name is www.kidsblanks.com


----------



## selzler (Apr 4, 2007)

hey go ahead and use those cotton blends I just had a store down the street go out of business he kept using those cotton blends and they looked washed off and people were coming in and asking why when they print shirt they look faded when I told the customer that they don't know what they are doing because they are using blended shirts and we only use 100% polyester shirts that are soft like cotton and I will back my product not to look faded I took a enough of his customers away after almost 2 years in the business he is now closed. If you want to keep your business going always use the right product to keep your customers happy. trying to find a cheep way my only make things go backwards.


----------



## Lola (Jan 18, 2008)

Hi Selzler,
If you are looking for 100% bright, durable effect with sublimation then 100% polyester is what you need. But you have to put up with a sweaty, scratchy T-shirt which clearly for your business is OK. In the UK, where we are based, most people will not buy 100% polyester. There are also plenty of people in the US who feel the same way. We know because we, like you, have a successful business selling these Ts. Also we are not using standard sublimation printing and are not looking for 100% bright prints with 100% durability. We are having great success with the 35/65 Ts which have a soft feel, are not sweaty or scratchy and have a very good price point. They are not 'cheep' quality and offer better value than the 100% polyester. So it all depends what you need.


----------



## D.Evo. (Mar 31, 2006)

Pat, Lola you both are absolutely right - all depends on your market and the demand.

In my case - we cater for clients that want to buy active wear - often with sponsorship, club colours or bright multicolour designs. Obviously, faded look is not an option in this case.

My clients generally choose performance shirts that look and feel like cotton, because they want to stay comfortable, cool and dry in hot weather or when working out, doing any kind of outdoor activities, going clubbing, etc... 

Standard cotton/poly blends (even more so, "polyester outer-shell" types like Softlink) tend to trap sweat and hold it till they are washed. Same with 100% cotton. Performance fabrics designed to draw sweat away and evaporate it. 

So, I would debate the statement that all polyester shirts are sweaty - most sports garments are made of performance polyester and I believe there's a very good reason for that  
Looking around in our current 35 C spring scorcher I see a lot of fashionable cotton t's with massive sweat patches and peculiar smell. Even Ed Hardy looses appeal on those days.

I guess, climate-wise Lola's market in the UK is in less need of comfortable moisture-wicking garments than California (biggest market for Vapor), Nevada or Queensland in Australia. 

Design-wise - if customers want trendy "vintage" look and fashionable sculls or flourishes they are not going to be picky about a particular PMS colours, so printing on blends is fine. 
In my line of printing, using blends would mean that I'll have to deal with big guns like Ford complaining that their logo colour is wrong shade of blue and not vivid enough. 

Us, printers, really need to be very careful how we present our experiences with dye-sub printing and blanks to new-comers, as we can inadvertently give them ill advice or send them on a wrong track. Very true - it all depends on what you need...


----------



## Lola (Jan 18, 2008)

I agree - and what you say about presenting a balanced picture is particularly true if you are promoting one particular brand of Ts, as you are. Whilst Vapor Ts are good for some purposes they are not the only option for sublimation.
In the UK and for some US customers, there are issues around 100% polyester based on environmental issues. I try to avoid this debate because there are equal production and recycling problems for cotton and polyester but many people over here perceive polyester to be a 'bad thing'. for the environment. It does not matter how well it performs, what the price is or how soft it is, they won't buy it. This is why our company has to find alternatives which meet the performance requirements plus the social ones!


----------



## selzler (Apr 4, 2007)

I have found that if you show the difference between different shirts printed with sublimation they will go with the vapor almost every time the colors make difference they want the colors to be bright not washed out. And the store down the street from me wouldn't use the vapor or 100% polyester shirts he said they cost to much. I look at it save some money and go out of business or spend the money and go forward. Using the right products for the prosses your using can make a big difference.


----------

