# AVOIDING BURN MARKS on Performance Wear Materials



## FLEXYOURFAITH (Apr 24, 2017)

Hi err'body!

I know this has been asked in different ways before, but I was curious about something a little unique, *regarding the avoidance of "burn marks" that is created on some of our ActiveWear items with specific blends of rayon and spandex etc.*


We use Siser Easy Weed most of the time (Chemica and glitter etc. are used as well)...*HOW CAN WE AVOID the burn marks on clothing from the heat-press that shows clearly where the vinyl was transferred?*
We use both soft-pillows and the mouse-pad type cushions for apparel with zippers and buttons but this seems to create additional pressure obviously, which worsens the problem - can this be avoided?
We've heard from reps at Stahl's that it's perfectly fine to apply heat transfer designs usually recommended at 305-310 as low as 275 to lessen the heat-marks and left behind "holograms" on garments...*is this true and will it diminish the durability of the design or adhesion to the substrate/shirts?*

ANY OTHER ADVICE WOULD BE GREAT! We won't ever sell/ship items from our growing collection if it isn't perfect - so hopefully there's a solution, because we're already using Teflon sheets. THANKS!


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## durtmane (Jan 29, 2014)

Hello. Try tying an old sweat shirt around the heating element. I have done this. I actually do this to shield the heat from heating the media while I reposition it as needed some because some of the media I use curls up when the heat from my press radiates from it. Simply cover the heating element with the shirt as you would a person and use the sleeves to tie the shirt around the top of the press as tight as you can. Press it to remove wrinkles. Hopefully you have an item to test and wash to if my method will compromise the longevity of your design. Hope this helps.


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## into the T (Aug 22, 2015)

if you can get a vinyl that applies at a lower temp for a lower time, like the flexcutx4, 
then you have a much better shot at leaving no burning
(holger forgot to mention that the x4 is only a 4 second press)


i can attest to the quality of sef vinyls, i have a detailed press i did that is still like new after +15 wash/dry cycles


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## bwdesigns (Aug 10, 2006)

Stahls has a silicon sheet which , when used, means you can lower the temp of your press.


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## PTCo (Dec 22, 2011)

Usually I would suggest using temperature test strips to make sure you are getting to where you need to be without overshooting, especially with performance fabrics where temperature is so important. With a dwell time of only 4 seconds the strips will probably not work in this case though. That's fast!


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## FLEXYOURFAITH (Apr 24, 2017)

WOW THANKS SO MUCH FOR THE ADVICE EVERYONE!! 

*Sweater wrapped around top element:* That's a great idea! When I ordered my Signature Series press from HPNation it came with a soft cloth platen protector but only on the bottom platen (the top is exposed steel)...wouldn't the sweater lower the overall nature of direct-heat-application by creating a buffer between the transfer and the platen cause less adhesion though? 

*FLEX CUT X4 w/ 4 second application*: Four seconds, that's amazing! I'm between 12-15 right now with all our Siser EasyWeed standard, flock, and glitter, around 300-315 degrees. Not all the materials get burn marks, only the stretchy type performance drifit wear. Does the FLEX CUT weed easily, and would it be appropriate (thin and soft) for performance wear? Our customers expect a high quality feel, and I've seen thick cheap looking/feeling vinyl...but sounds like FLEX CUT is a winner!

*Press from backside:* I never thought of it, nice! The only thing I'd need to figure out is most of our designs have front and back graphics

*Silicon sheet:* We've been using the "Pro Teflon Sheet" for $18 through HPNation from day-one, which after looking on eBay and Amazon and seeing the SAME sheet for $4 lol, I feel silly about. Anyway, would a silicon sheet offer better heat-protection over the Teflon sheet? Can this sheet on Stahl's be found anywhere else for less? HERE, because it looks like the winner: "for performance wear, protects buttons and zippers..." I wonder if it also protects the fabric, and how much _"added time"_ would be required (?)

Speaking of paying too much...the Graphtec CE6000-60 blades are $77-80 through Graphtec and their vendors, but the same tungsten blades, shipped domestically, with thousands of 5-star reviews...are $3.20 each on eBay. WHAT!? Man, we have a lot to learn about saving company funds and not overpaying, whew!

THANKS AGAIN!


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## bwdesigns (Aug 10, 2006)

To the Flexcut x4 users, where is the best place to purchase online in the US? It is not available from Canadian Distributors.


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## FLEXYOURFAITH (Apr 24, 2017)

Hi all! 

We gave up on avoiding burn marks on performance materials...all the offered solutions were great and thoughtful, but ended up not being practical since we have well over $2,000 in vinyl that has to be applied @ 310-315 for 15 seconds for optimal adhesion and pressing from the back only creates burn marks on the back - and doesn't help since we also design the backs of our apparel. 

What I'm wondering about now, is how can we avoid press-lines on our hat press? I reached out to the manufacturer and they actually send us a YouTube video of ANOTHER manf's hat press as a solution, which included tips that didn't apply to theirs...LOL, what on earth?

Basically, our press is from Heat Press Nation, and is creating very amateurish looking designs because it creates obvious lines where the platen comes down (even on lowest pressure setting). NOW WE'RE BACKED UP ON ORDERS, and having to apologize to customers and we're wasting company money on hats we have to throw away


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## FLEXYOURFAITH (Apr 24, 2017)

FOREVERCS said:


> have you tried forever flex soft 'self weeding vinyl'?
> It can be applied with temperatures as low as 220 °F, so you won't have any torchmarks.
> 
> Especially when you have small details like in logos it could be an alternative.
> ...


You had me at self-weeding, lol!! That sounds awesome. 

Right now, we have a combined 300+ yards of remaining Siser EasyWeed vinyl...so before investing in a new brand/color-scheme of vinyl, we'd want to get lower on inventory and try a few sample items. 220 degrees, that sounds awesome - how are they able to do that? If the quality and ultimate resulting product is par with Siser, along with cost comparison, why wouldn't everyone do it?

As far as turning the garment inside out, that's a great solution...but would make it much harder to properly align the designs keeping them straight if we can't eye-ball them.

Really hoping we can get the headgear/headwear designs down for hats - we have a lot of interest in the new designs, but want our customers to have an amazing experience with the apparel quality and finish.


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## FOREVERCS (Apr 24, 2017)

FLEXYOURFAITH said:


> You had me at self-weeding, lol!! That sounds awesome.
> 
> Right now, we have a combined 300+ yards of remaining Siser EasyWeed vinyl...so before investing in a new brand/color-scheme of vinyl, we'd want to get lower on inventory and try a few sample items. 220 degrees, that sounds awesome - how are they able to do that? If the quality and ultimate resulting product is par with Siser, along with cost comparison, why wouldn't everyone do it?
> 
> ...


Flex/Vinyl is something that is used since probably the last 20 years. The self weeding Flex Soft is not even 20 months old, and it takes some time until it gets widely available at the different markets worldwide.

It is a bit like people are so busy with weeding, that they overlook other possibilities - they are trapped in their own habbits (see picture).

This is how it works:
You choose a pre-coloured media (i.e a silver sheet for a silver print) and print your design mirrored onto that sheet with an ordinary desktop laser printer. Doesn't necessarly have to be a specific brand or model. Even cheap monochrome printers work.

You marry it with a B-sheet, peel it off and press your transfer to the garment.
Whatever you have printed on the sheet, will now stick to the fabric.

Here is a short video about the process:
VIDEO: Flex-Soft (No-Cut) vs Flex/Vinyl Promo video - FOREVER Black Toner Transfer

In regards of wash fastness: about 30-40 washes with 100 °F are unproblematic.

It is a bit more expensive on the sqaremeter than regular vinyl, but it saves you time, work and labour costs on th other hand.
So, whenever you need something detailed, like numbers with lines or holes in it (breathable) or logos, it might become useful.

You can buy packs of 10 sheets at the typical dealers like Conde, US Cutter etc.

Regarding the temperature: it can be applied to various substrates like polyesther, cotton, leather, nylon, paper and so on, as it can be trasfered in a range of 220 to 300 °F.
So whateveryour substrate requires, you just adjust the temperature in your heat press accordingly.

It might not replace vinyl in every case, but for special cases like yours, it is an alternative.


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## TrueNorthGear (Sep 27, 2005)

The Siser EasyWeed products can be applied at 280-285 for 20 seconds.


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## durtmane (Jan 29, 2014)

Test the method I suggested. Add add about ten seconds to compensate the temperature or to be comfortable you can invest in a digital temperature gun https://www.walmart.com/ip/Precise-...0659&wl11=online&wl12=141294937&wl13=&veh=sem to get the temp you require.


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## durtmane (Jan 29, 2014)

13 bucks from the Wally World website 


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## FLEXYOURFAITH (Apr 24, 2017)

TrueNorthGear said:


> The Siser EasyWeed products can be applied at 280-285 for 20 seconds.


Thanks a lot. I assumed longer contact-time at a lower temperature would be the same as higher temperature for a shorter contact-time; but I'm wrong a lot LOL

The issue with hats is that crease mark where the top platen comes down...yikes, it looks bad


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## TrueNorthGear (Sep 27, 2005)

FLEXYOURFAITH said:


> Thanks a lot. I assumed longer contact-time at a lower temperature would be the same as higher temperature for a shorter contact-time; but I'm wrong a lot LOL


I have not done extensive testing with 100% Polyester and Siser EW at the lower temp, but what I have done hasn't been too bad for the press shine.

I also have the silicone pad from Stahl's that I'll be using to test applying to polyester in the coming weeks. Apparently it works in a similar fashion to the sweatshirt idea in that the pad absorbs the heat so a longer dwell time is needed.


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## FLEXYOURFAITH (Apr 24, 2017)

TrueNorthGear said:


> I have not done extensive testing with 100% Polyester and Siser EW at the lower temp, but what I have done hasn't been too bad for the press shine.
> 
> I also have the silicone pad from Stahl's that I'll be using to test applying to polyester in the coming weeks. Apparently it works in a similar fashion to the sweatshirt idea in that the pad absorbs the heat so a longer dwell time is needed.


"Press shine," at least now I know what it's called. 

I ordered the pillows and mouse-pad cut-outs with my original order and have used both several times, but the "press shine" is worsened by the added isolated pressure on the apparel. So now it's the choice between pressing zippers or having a shiny rectangular patch on the garments...not a great choice either way 

Heat Press Nation told me a couple days ago they'd have someone call or email me back with advice on how to use the hat-press machine to keep from leaving press-marks, pressure lines etc...but still nothing.

Uphill battles make the way down more enjoyable, but we're a week behind in orders now, and it's getting to the point I may have to refund a lot of money, which is horrible because I'm donating funds to credit card processors now AND ruining our reputation.


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## 1090gal (Aug 2, 2016)

I don't think I saw what kind of hat press you have...but if you have one with various platens (I have hotronix hat press with multiple sized platens) I have found with the low-profile hats I get a better press if I use the smallest platen --> less of a crease from the platen, and the best contact with the heating element. Also, I really work the hat to place it on there so the brim is close as possible to the front edge of the platen and this has helped with the "platen mark" that is left at the top of the hat. I also reshape the hat to "bend out" the platen mark while the hat is still hot, if that makes sense. These things help, but on, say, a twill hat, there is still a stiffness that shows where the platen was used to apply the transfer. It does soften up after the hats have been worn, though. I haven't had any customers complain or felt like I needed to waste a hat due to this press mark. Can you post a picture of what you're getting that is causing your hats to be scrapped?


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## into the T (Aug 22, 2015)

for platen marks i use the smallest cap platen i have
then i use one sock folded in half placed horizontally across the platen,
then another sock folded in half across the vertical center

this seems to simply compensate for the 'voids' in the cap that leave crease marks

have you tried a sample of x4 for your polyester tee issue,
or have you rectified it with lower temp/longer dwell and easyweed?


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## FLEXYOURFAITH (Apr 24, 2017)

1090gal said:


> I don't think I saw what kind of hat press you have...
> 
> Can you post a picture of what you're getting that is causing your hats to be scrapped?


Hi! Thanks 

1) I have a Heat Press Nation "Signature Series" Cap Press (to match our HPN Sig Series 16x20 Auto-Open press). I purchased the Signature Series at the advice of a couple reps I emailed, live-chatted, and spoke on the phone with... which is why we were really surprised and bummed that it didn't have interchangeable platens like we explained we wanted. HERE is the link - it's the best model they manufacrture

2) I'm attaching pictures


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## FLEXYOURFAITH (Apr 24, 2017)

into the T said:


> for platen marks i use the smallest cap platen i have
> then i use one sock folded in half placed horizontally across the platen,
> then another sock folded in half across the vertical center
> 
> ...


1) THANKS for the sock idea, that's what Esteban from Heat Press Nation suggested. Unfortunately our HPN Signature Series Cap Press doesn't allow for interchangeable platens (which if I knew, we wouldn't have purchased it - it's well worth more money to have the flexibility of more platens)

2) We didn't figure out the heat shine issue, so we've been focusing much more on more resilient apparel items with a hybrid of cotton and polyester with fantastic results!


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## 1090gal (Aug 2, 2016)

Ok. Hmm. I see what you're talking about there. Can you lighten up on the pressure? If you are using Siser EasyWeed (did I remember that correctly, or did I just dream that up?), it really doesn't take much pressure to get the vinyl to release from the carrier. Try lightening up significantly on your pressure. May have to test with it dialed way, waaaaay down (all the way to zero or 1?) and then see what the lightest pressure you can get to get it to release. May have to go up on time, but if pressure is less, that should not cause a crease mark. I have gotten Siser EW to release with temp 290 deg and pressure of 1-2 (on a Hotronix, FWIW). Since hats aren't laundered regularly, you can probably get away with that with no adverse outcomes.


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## FLEXYOURFAITH (Apr 24, 2017)

1090gal said:


> If you are using Siser EasyWeed (did I remember that correctly, or did I just dream that up?) *HAHA, YES, THAT'S ALL WE HAVE ACTUALLY*
> 
> Try lightening up significantly on your pressure. May have to test with it dialed way, waaaaay down (all the way to zero or 1?) *THE MACHINE WE HAVE "HPN SIGNATURE SERIES" DOESN'T HAVE A PRESSURE INDICATOR, JUST A LEVER AND A SCREW KNOB. I HAVE THE KNOB AS LOOSE AS IT WILL GO, I EVEN USED PLIERS TO LOOSEN IT. STILL CREASING. THE ONLY WANT TO GET LIGHTER PRESSURE IS NOT TO LOCK IT IN BUT TO MANUALLY HOLD IT DOWN WITH MY HAND*
> 
> ...


*QUESTION FOR ALL:
*
I think I'm going to return my HPN Signature Series hat press for either the Stahl's or the HPN Red Series listed HERE (both of which have swappable heat platens).

*The HPN Red Series is HALF the cost of the Stahl's and uses the same form-factor and interchangeable platens...is the Stahl's really worth double the amount of money for something so similar that the end customer will never know about?* I'm not doing 10,000 hats a month, more like 100. THANKS!


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## into the T (Aug 22, 2015)

if you were happy performance-wise with your previous hpn cap press (and their service),
i would recommend saving the money for now


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## FLEXYOURFAITH (Apr 24, 2017)

into the T said:


> if you were happy performance-wise with your previous hpn cap press (and their service),
> i would recommend saving the money for now


Hey Into the T!

Definitely not happy with the HPN hat press, that's most of what this thread is about. But luckily they are willing to let me return it toward a better model with the interchangeable platens which will allow for better adjust-ability and overall results.

HPN has always been willing to help out, I've enjoyed their service over time! I'm going with their private-label American made "RED SERIES" that allows for the Stahl's changeable platens, and a better pressure adjustment. This, coupled with lighter pressure and temperature, should be able to yield a great looking end-result!!


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## Dan_GrafixGuys (Aug 7, 2018)

FLEXYOURFAITH said:


> Hey Into the T!
> 
> HPN has always been willing to help out, I've enjoyed their service over time! I'm going with their private-label American made "RED SERIES" that allows for the Stahl's changeable platens, and a better pressure adjustment. This, coupled with lighter pressure and temperature, should be able to yield a great looking end-result!!



Hey FLEXYOURFAITH,
How did things work out for you? I just found & read all the comments in your thread since I also had issues with both, Heat Press marks on polyester shirts and crease lines on Hats from my hat press.
Curious as to what remedies worked for ya. 
- Dan


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## FLEXYOURFAITH (Apr 24, 2017)

Dan_GrafixGuys said:


> Hey FLEXYOURFAITH,
> How did things work out for you? I just found & read all the comments in your thread since I also had issues with both, Heat Press marks on polyester shirts and crease lines on Hats from my hat press.
> Curious as to what remedies worked for ya.
> - Dan


Hey Dan! Thanks a lot for asking. We've designed and shipped thousands of garments since that post, and while there's ALWAYS room for a L-O-T of improvement, we just decreased the temperature by 10-15 degrees and increased the duration of press for 5 seconds. After extensive testing it's a pretty solid workaround for the scorch-marks at manufacturer recommended temperature settings, especially manufacturers like Stahl's and Specialty Materials ThermoFLEX that suggest even higher temperatures. I wouldn't recommend the Stahl's fashion film for ANY business owner, large-or-small scale, but the ThermoFLEX has been a great performer for us overall. Thanks again!


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## Dan_GrafixGuys (Aug 7, 2018)

FLEXYOURFAITH said:


> Hey Dan! Thanks a lot for asking. We've designed and shipped thousands of garments since that post, and while there's ALWAYS room for a L-O-T of improvement, we just decreased the temperature by 10-15 degrees and increased the duration of press for 5 seconds. After extensive testing it's a pretty solid workaround for the scorch-marks at manufacturer recommended temperature settings, especially manufacturers like Stahl's and Specialty Materials ThermoFLEX that suggest even higher temperatures. I wouldn't recommend the Stahl's fashion film for ANY business owner, large-or-small scale, but the ThermoFLEX has been a great performer for us overall. Thanks again!



Gotcha! Thanks for the quick reply. Glad to hear you were able to get back in the swing of things. Good luck going forward. - Dan in Rhode Island


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