# Melco Constant Issues



## Daddyof4 (Aug 23, 2011)

Here is our laundry list of issues we've had with our Melco Bravo since purchasing 10 months ago but they are getting worse and worse. Now we limp through every design.

1. Constant thread breaks or bobbin breaks or it comes unthreaded from the needle at the start of each design with 2/3 of it being on the tackdown stitches and now often on the satin stitch.
2. Half the time the threads don't break and the machine just stops and gives the thread or bobbin error message but the thread is still attached to the garment. 
3. You can watch the machine start a design and see that the thread isn't being caught by the hook like it's supposed to be and sure enough the thread either comes out of the needle or it just stalls (see 1 and 2 above).
4. The thread tubes leading from the spools to the machine are supposed to stick up above the thread cones but the problem is they won't stay up and we don't see a mechanism to keep them up. We are having to use tape to keep them up. If there is a tightening device on the machine please let me know.
5. The thread issues stated above are particularly pronounced on fonts. We can't do even one letter without a thread break, or it comes unthreaded, or some other bad start. And it can't be the third party font companies we buy from because we buy from dozens of companies and the problem is equally bad on all of their fonts. All of them can't be bad digitizing companies. If the problems could be isolated to one or two companies I would say yeah it's the company but not dozens. Plus their other designs run better than the fonts.

Here is a list of what we have done on our own and at Melco's direction.

1. Made sure we use fresh needles.
2. Made sure needles are turned slightly and in the right orientation (scallop to the rear).
3. Melco tech tried to say it was the sticky stabilizer gumming up the needles and the hook but at his direction we took needle plate, bobbin off and soaked the entire hook and trimmer area in WD40 to the point it was running onto towel. We then dried it out with compressed air and used non-sticky stabilizer only to have the same issues. So this issue is not related to the sticky stabilizer in any way.
4. Tried to update software but computer wouldn't take the update and this issue is not a software issue because it is getting worse and worse.
5. Adjusted the thread tube height over the cones to different recommended levels which didn't help.

I am in talks with the dealer and techs but if any of you veterans with the Melco machines have any ideas please let me know.


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## drdoct (Jul 26, 2011)

I bet it's a timing issue. I'm kinda puzzled that's not first on your list of things checked out.


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## Daddyof4 (Aug 23, 2011)

Well I wondered that too but the Melco tech didn't bring it up other than to send me the latest updates to download for the Amaya software. If there is a timing issue I guess he lumped it under the umbrella that the updates will take care of it. 

For whatever reason our computer would not download the updates from the site so we just received the cd rom today in the mail. I'll download it now but I"m not holding my breath that it will solve anything.


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## drdoct (Jul 26, 2011)

I know nothing about the Amaya but assume the timing and hook clearance would be done manually. The easiest and best thing for you to do if you really want to get sewing is get a tech in there to look at it. Any generic tech would work just to check out your hook for burrs or alignment. Those will shread and break thread left and right. You could look it over, but without seeing someone set it right once it's shooting in the dark. I got mine to where it wouldn't do anything before I broke down and got a tech. Now after watching him do it (he even taught me), I can do my own checking. Turns out that I can't find the burrs near as good as him though.


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## Bodwick (Aug 20, 2010)

I ran a google search "Melco Bravo rotary hook timing" and came across 'this' 
Before I got any further I read this:- 

6.2. Is there a Standard Test to check the Sewing Performance of my AMAYA machine(s)?

Yes, there is one. It is a very valuable test to run a baseline – it will allow you to find out if the machines perform well or not. To do this, complete the following steps:

1) Load the AMAYA test design named AMPASS06E.EXP. This file is located in the AMAYA Test Designs directory (usually Program Files\Melco Embroidery Systems\AMAYA\Test Designs).

2) In AMAYA OS, set material thickness to 3 points.

3) Set the maximum machine speed to 1200spm (stitches per minute), if you are using Polyester thread. If you are using Rayon thread, you might consider lowering the maximum speed slightly.

4) Hoop two layers of backing on a 30 x 44cm or larger hoop.

5) Check the upper thread paths (that the machine is threaded correctly, thread is under thread feed rollers, there is no thread wrapped around the tops of the thread cones).

6) Insert the bobbin, with the bobbin tension set so that when you gently bounce the bobbin case - holding the thread with your fingers - it should drop 2-4 inches / 50-100mm.

7) Trace the design.

8) Press the Start button to sew the design.

9) Observe machine performance. You should see very few problems.



Have you done this? Post a pic of the result...

As DrDoct mentioned the rotary hook will not be changed in any way by a software upgrade. 
Do you own properly fitting tools and feel you have the ability to set the hook yourself? 
I've done this on my Tajima and took say two day's to learn the process from scratch. I found it fascinating and after a bit of stress understood what I was trying to do. It's just a machine after all... lol...
Day one was stripping, printing and reading instructions and a first attempt. Day two was easy after a good sleep. It all just slipped together and made sense.

Run the test and if you feel able or interested I'd hazard a guess that the rotary hook is next...


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## Bodwick (Aug 20, 2010)

AMAYA Hook Timing Inspection/Adjustment...

Initial reading...


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## zoom_monster (Sep 20, 2006)

In addition to the AMPASS test design, I would make sure you are hooping tight enough and make sure that the bobbin is properly set and calibrated. The AMPASS test designs can tell a lot about what is happening with the machine. Do a full maintenance as well. Since you had issue updateing the software (OS? or DS?) you might also make sure that the communication settings are correct and that you have you desicated NIC card set correctly. I had an issue at the begining that related to the order in which the different software components booted up. I start my computer first, have the MSSQL server boot up next, then the OS, Then the machine. If it turn on the machine first... things do not work correctly.

Thanks Bodwick for posting the hook timing document. I used to work on Tajimas and SWFs and the complexity of my Amaya has always perplexed me. Fortunately mine has always performed well


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## Daddyof4 (Aug 23, 2011)

Bodwich, thanks for the link but I'm confused. 

I went through this but it wasn't very clear as to the "Z" position. When I did the head up then bottom center my hook was way to the right of the needle. So I adjusted it as prescribed such that the hook is barely visible to the left of the needle. But then it prompted me to adjust the "Z" position. My machine had a 199.6 default written under the plate so I adjusted to that. But now at 199.6 the hook is nowhere near just to the left of the needle. This is confusing. How can the hook be visible just to the left of the needle on the bottom center position AND at the prescribed "Z" position?


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## Daddyof4 (Aug 23, 2011)

Ok, I manged to get through that timing setup but the directions were very vague in the area of setting the hook the first time vs setting it again on the Z position. I'm at least running right now but we'll see how well.


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## Posylane (Mar 3, 2011)

Are you experienced at embroidery or a newbie? Did you get training when you got the machine? The hook timing is not obvious but if you look at the various manuals you can see what to do. But unless you are experienced and confident, I think you have crossed the bridge of bringing a good tech in to take a look. In fact you crossed that about 9 months back. You should be able to embroider with very few thread breaks. We use sticky back stabilizer extensively with no issues.


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## Daddyof4 (Aug 23, 2011)

We aren't newbies but aren't veterans either. We ran a Brother PR1000 for months and then got the Melco last December. 

The Melco Bravo has had issues since we bought it. Constant thread breaks and an inability to do fonts without threads coming out or false breaks or even real breaks. We've been in contact with the third party company we bought the machine from brand new and Melco itself and now they are sending a tech over here. I gave them the symptoms and they couldn't find a solution over the phone.

Guess we'll see how this plays out. Not impressed so far.


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## Daddyof4 (Aug 23, 2011)

Oh and we discontinued all production and had the machine cleaned and oiled and ready for the tech and then he didn't show up. I had to call him and he was in the ER because of his blood pressure. I hate that his blood pressure is up but he should have called to cancel rather than make me call him so now we have another day with issues and no production.

Customer support with Melco is a REAL issue!


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## Posylane (Mar 3, 2011)

I am sure your blood pressure is up high. Who did you buy the machine from? I have a feeling it was on-line from a website and I have heard similar issues. I am not sure you get the same warranty or access to technical support from Melco in this case.

Your starting position sounds like ours was - embroidery experience but not experts. I think you made your life really difficult not getting onsite training. We actually used the machines for a couple of weeks before having the onsite training so that we knew the pain points that had to be addressed. For better or worse, you are going to get to the same point.

I have never used a Bravo but understand it is more or less the same machine as the XTS. There is light at the end of the tunnel, the machines are great, you will figure it out.


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## Daddyof4 (Aug 23, 2011)

Well I was amazed that Melco and our third party company worked in conjunction and sent a tech from Mobile, AL which is over 400 miles away. 

He spent the day with us and checked out our machine and found nothing out of the ordinary other than the propensity to have false thread breaks. And he attributed that to the extra thickness of the Monag t-shirts which when the needle goes in on the straight stitch the shirt actually envelopes around it and causes a false thread break. 

He wants us to cover the fonts with solvy before running to keep the thread out of the shirt. Trouble is this wasn't a problem months ago as much but has gotten worse over time.


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## jj5d1 (Jun 8, 2012)

My Bravo also has it's own personality. When I have trouble with those pesky thread breaks, I find that it is most often the presser foot is not adjusted correctly to the thickness of the fabric. Try adjusting the presser foot height. It often takes care of the thread breaks. It took a long time before I discovered that it needs to get changed for different types of garments. I always think there is not a logical answer to the problems that come with embroidery, but usually there is an answer that makes sense. I have found Melco to be very helpful when all is said and done. Oh, for the thread tubes, get some zip ties and cut them into inch or so segments to stick between your thread tubes and the metal part they come out of. This will keep the thread tubes in place above the cone. I think my tech folds them in half before he stuck them between the thread tubes and the metal holder. Hope this helps.


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## inobu (Dec 29, 2010)

David,

The only way you will resolve this issue is to understand the machine. It is the fundamental cause and effect routine that you have to go through. 

One component effects another and so on. You must identify the effect (thread break) and locate the cause (loose bobbin). 

Before we get into that you must realize that these machines cannot see, think or reason yet it can sew better and faster than us under certain conditions. It is up to us to set up those conditions for the machine to do its job. 

The machine cannot see a thread break but it can feel or sense the absent of thread tension. When you thread the machine the bar that you loop the thread around is the device that senses thread breaks. 

This is why tension is so important. The tension is always on the thread/bar, either from the thread feed wheel or the bobbin thread that the bobbin hook loop onto the thread from the needle.



If the bobbin thread is too loose there wont be any tension the thread bar as the needle pulls up. The machine will throw a bobbin thread break. 

If the thread tension is too loose from the cones/top feed the thread bar will not have tension and the machine will call a thread break. This is how the machine detects thread breaks without seeing. 

Each component on the machine serves a purpose Understanding the components will help you to reason what is causing the machine to error out. 

As you pointed out "this wasn't a problem months ago as much but has gotten worse over time."

This means something is deteriorating or changing. You have to start isolation components. 

You have 16 needles with different feed wheels. This will isolate the top portion. If all 16 needles are having the same trouble then one can assume that the bottom/ bobbin components are in question. Also remember that the presser foot will be common to the needles. adjust the foot first then go through the needles. 

There are many more components you just have to go through them and eventually you will narrow down the possibilities. 

Hope this get you going in the right direction. 

Inobu 











Cause and effect

Blue H - the white bobbin thread has so little tension that the needle is pulling the bobbin threat as the needle is going up. This is why there is little blue thread showing on the underside and a lot of white bobbin thread. 

The red h is perfect as the threads are equal by 1/3 on each side. When the needle stitch the red thread through the bobbin hook loops the thread and the tension is just right. As the needle pulls up the bobbin thread releases and the thread is taught. Because the thread is taught the bar has tension and no thread break is register. 

The yellow H has the bobbin so tight that there is no bobbin thread being released. 

Keep in mind that there is a tug of war between the top and bottom (top thread verses bobbin thread). The objective is for the thread to have 1/3 on each side.


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## Daddyof4 (Aug 23, 2011)

Thanks for the advice so far. Still having the same pesky thread errors. We've adjusted the foot up and down with no effect on the thread errors. And now we are having timeout errors for the x axis. The troubleshooting says this is an internal or software issue with the machine.

I hate to say it but Melco is getting an ear full today. I've had it with them.


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## inobu (Dec 29, 2010)

David,

*The instruction here are for informational purposes. You do not want to do anything that could void your warranty. Just do visual inspections to see what may be the problem and point it out to the tech when he gets on site. * 

_(Remember there are two computers involved. The Bravo's computer and your PC. Your PC is your interface to the Bravo and it lets you see what the Bravo is doing. The Bravo's computer takes the command you send either through the control panel or Your PC and relays it to what ever components it needs to for what ever action.) _

The X axis trouble might be a good thing in that it may be pointing to the component that is deteriorating.

Back to the cause and effect. 

The machine is complaining about X timeout errors. Which means that the mother board sent a command to turn the X Axis motor. There is a XY Home PCB that is suppose to handle the communication between the two (motor and CPU/Mother board). 

Lets run a test 

The Bravos mother board (MB) sends out a command and wants to know if it was carried out. The XY PCB will apply the voltage to turn the X axis motor and will registers each turns. It then sends the results to the MB. 

If you can control the X and Y axis manually (via control panel) then you know that the commands to the motor are being sent by the motherboard via the XY PCB. If you can see the X axis move then you have verified the effects of your cause (pressing the x axis button)

If the motor moved then the motor received the instruction. If the MB is reporting a X axis timeout error then the XY PCB did not send the results. 

Here is where you apply reasoning. 

Where is the break down between the XY PCB and MB?

Cable between MB

Cable disconnected?
Cable is loose?
Cables worn and the wire is broken? 
Cable has short? 

XY PCB is bad? 

MB interface to machine is bad? 

This is just one of many potential issues. You just have to step through them by identifying the probable cause and effect. 

In any case the tech should start swapping out components to eliminate possible problems. 

I would do a visual and see if the cable is loose or if it has rubbed somewhere causing a break or short. 

Inobu

How can all this be related? 

A faulty interface on the mother board could be deteriorating to the point where it is not reporting the motor position or thread status correctly.


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## galmurembroidery (Nov 26, 2014)

I have a melco Amaya 16 needles, before I call a tech I want to ask 
i calibrated the needles because is not embroidering the color ( needle)
i need . and is not working still giving me the wrong colors
i hope i exlplain my self

thanks
help please!!


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## Daddyof4 (Aug 23, 2011)

This thread was two years ago so we've learned a lot since then. I quit using the "appliquÃ©" function because it would offset a color. Is this what you are experiencing?


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## inobu (Dec 29, 2010)

Most like your problem will be in your configuration. Either physical or in the software. 

First go through the threading. Write down the color of thread associated with the number position 1-16 on top of the machine. Next verify the color it threaded on the face of the machine with the correct needle. 
If they all match up then go into the software.

software matches the color to the needle location. The machine does not know Color only position. If position 1 is assigned white thread in the software and you have Black thread loaded then you will have the problem.

The Amaya OS has the needle sequence set up. the color matching of the needle position is done there. The correlation with the digitized file and the thread color must match up there. If those numbers do not match up
You will experience color miss matches. 

I think it is highly unlikely you have a call out problem. 

Inobu


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## jolfers1 (Nov 30, 2014)

I found that when I stopped using Coates brand bobbins, my thread breaks went down SIGNIFICANTLY. I switched to cheaper bobbins that are about half the price (see hammerbrothers.com and look at their L-Style bobbins that are "their best seller). 

Also, check your needle points often for burrs, especially when you are having a lot of thread breaks. 

See amayausers.com for more discussion on Amaya machines.


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## Posylane (Mar 3, 2011)

The melco tech left without your machine running perfectly and the tech and melco thought that was ok? If so, that is completely unacceptable. What are they saying to you when they are leaving and your machine is not running correctly?


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## norma14 (Jan 19, 2017)

Were you able to find out what the problem was. I am having similar issues. The weird part about it a technician came out made it run fine cut once I put in a different design there's to many thread breaks.


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## selzler (Apr 4, 2007)

I've been having the same problem Medco tech was no help. I contacted a Brenina sewing store he sell the brenina 16 needle which I found out is a Medco he came over and found that the machine had some adjustments that needed to be done. Also adjusted the software he also talked me that the air in our embroidery room was to dry which will cause the thread breaks. My main problem was the machine the tension wasn't right and it would cause the thread to rap around the needle this would happen mostly on short stitches. That was what was breaking the thread. Small stitches it still struggles with but now I can get product thru the machine.


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