# Printing On Black.



## frankieboywonder (Jun 6, 2007)

Hi, I am new at this and am trying to evaluate the best setup for me to invest in.

I was thinking of going the dye sub route but just read somewhere that it it only suitable on light colours. Most of my designs will be on black so I wanted to know if anyone could confirm that this is a bad idea.

Of course I'd love to screen print, but don't have the skills. Can anyone confirm that this Platisol is as good as it sounds???

It sounds like it might be the best solution for high quality on black, but if anyone has alternative suggestions I'd love to hear them.


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## jberte (Mar 25, 2007)

dye sublimation on black is a very bad idea.......sorry, we all wish it weren't so!

your best choices for black remain screen printing, plastisol (which is screen printing without the mess  ) or transfers, inkjet or laser.


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## frankieboywonder (Jun 6, 2007)

OK, thanks for that, the other option I was considering is vinyl, but I'm not sure I have ever seen a vinyl tee print in the flesh so to speak.

Are they higher quality than transfers?

Does anyone have any photo's of a completed garment?

Thanks.


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## artistatwork (Jun 9, 2007)

I agree dye sublimation on black fabric is a bad idea.
I have had experience using plastisol over water based inks.
I prefer plastisol because it is generally safer than water based inks. 
Water based inks can ruin the emulsion/screen stencil in a few days if it doesn't have a hardener. the photoemulsion used for stencil preparation is not very resistant to water. Actually it is water soluble. 
plastisol uses phthalates plasticizers. a good plastisol can be stored for two years and still usable. water based inks are prone to bacterial attack.
the only thing good about water based inks is the soft hand feel but this too can be had using plastisol of a different kind.


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## vctradingcubao (Nov 15, 2006)

1) Screen printing will give you the best results and the lowest cost for commercial quantity. But yes, it requires skills, and lots of experience to be good at it. It becomes expensive when you're printing 1 or very few pcs because of the initial cost of the screen. If you're just doing your own designs, maybe you can outsource.
2) Plastisol transfers are technically still screenprinting. So it will still give you great results when printing on black.
3) For sublimation on black shirts, there's a hybrid paper out there which can be used to print on black shirts.
4) Opaque transfer papers are availble for Laser & Inkjet printers for printing on black shirts. You get a "rubbery" feel when you use this opaque transfers. Cutting the design is a little time consuming and gives it a "non-professional" look.
5) Vinyl transfers cut on a cutter/plotter such as the Roland GX-24 is another option. It's best to use on 1 or 2 color designs only.
6) "Solvent dark" transfer papers printed on print&cut machines such as the Roland versacamm can also be used for dark shirts.
7) DTG's especially the Kornit machines will give you the best outcome when printing high resolution, photographic images. The machine though is very expensive.


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## eltigga (Jun 9, 2007)

Hi, i'm new to all this! I'm a graphic designer with ideals of opening a clothing line starting up on tshirt designs mostly on black for now. What would be a good method to print? Has anyone heard about the brand FYASKO? or VOLCOM? that's the type of printing I would like to achieve on my shirts... also, where can I find great quality t-shirts? that would be good for printing, as for quality and comfort. Any replies would be helpful, thanks folks!


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## frankieboywonder (Jun 6, 2007)

Thanks for all this info guys, it's been very helpful.

eltigga, I know Volcom stuff and I would *guess* that this is screen printed. 

As for t-suppliers, I am thinking that Hanes, Fruit of the Loom or American Apparel look to be the best 3. Google them.

Although I have seen other threads on this site that deal with that issue.


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## eltigga (Jun 9, 2007)

thanks Frank! I will look that up!


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## Rodney (Nov 3, 2004)

frankieboywonder said:


> OK, thanks for that, the other option I was considering is vinyl, but I'm not sure I have ever seen a vinyl tee print in the flesh so to speak.
> 
> Are they higher quality than transfers?
> 
> ...


You can find some photographs of the different printing processes with the "pics" tag keyword search:
http://www.t-shirtforums.com/tags/pics/

For vinyl pics, you can view a few pictures with the vinyl pics tag:
http://www.t-shirtforums.com/tags/vinyl-pics/


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## Marcurts (Sep 3, 2007)

Hi all, I recently bought a black paintball jersey that had a logo sublimated on it and it was perfect. The company (Empire paintball) also advertised it as sublimated. There must be someway that we could get similar results, what about the Darkwear product from Alpha?


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## Rodney (Nov 3, 2004)

Marcurts said:


> Hi all, I recently bought a black paintball jersey that had a logo sublimated on it and it was perfect. The company (Empire paintball) also advertised it as sublimated. There must be someway that we could get similar results, what about the Darkwear product from Alpha?


If it was a dye subbed jersey, it's likely that the WHOLE jersey was printed black with dye sub. 

I think I saw Chris from Vapor at a tradeshow once wearing something like that. He say the jersey is printed before it is sewn together. It starts out white, and it is printed with dye sub all over the jersey on a large format printer. Then it is sewn together. So instead of printing ON black, it's printing the whole shirt black (With the logo) to make the garment black.


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## taigraphx (Nov 26, 2006)

ANY dye sub product that's got a black base was probably printed before it was cut and sewn. Sorry, that's the reality. For more info look up a few custom cycling jersey websites. I work with Sugoi a lot. Anyways, as with sublimation you're basically dying the fabric a different color obviously you have to start with a color lighter than the color you want to dye it... you can kind of sublimate on colored shirts, ie you can get a decent (not great or very high impace) black sublimation print on say a royal blue shirt but nothing at all on black).


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## NicMartel (Sep 13, 2007)

I am confused... all the above postings should clearly state that the sublimation process can only be acheived on plymers not natural fibers like cotton even if 50/50 thus it is not just a matter of printing on dark but what garment fabric is used as the base...


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## terradjohnson (Jun 4, 2016)

I have sub inks and I read 100% poly and poly blends. I haven't had any issues. I also got SS JET PRO to do on light cottons and they sell and opaque. essentially the opaque is transfer film. the ss jet pro is self weeding which means it will only transfer the part that has the color on it. its a hot peel then stretch! I haven't had any issues.


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## rogerbowser (Apr 22, 2008)

For black shirts, you can use CAD-cut graphics (vinyl, glitter, metallic, etc.), white-toner transfers, screen-printed transfers, or screen printing.

The startup expense is not bad for CAD-cut or white-toner transfers, and minimum for screen-printed transfers that someone else makes for you!


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## Steve Fuentes (Mar 30, 2016)

there is a discharge option that is available. which removes the dye from the fabric, to be printed on after. you may look into that. dye sublimation is a great decorative system


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