# Siser easyweed cracking and peeling



## binki (Jul 16, 2006)

I am having extreme cracking and peeling siser on some of our shirts. 

I am suspecting the washing is what is causing this. 

Thoughts?


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## 13 Stitches (Jul 31, 2007)

I had problems recently with Siser peeling too, and called the manufacturer to see if there was a bad batch. They responded with asking how I cured it but not that anything was wrong with any batches. It's my softball team, so even more embarrassing. I have shirts way older than that that have never peeled. This was a first, but if three teams start peeling, I am going to have a 'bad' name.
I am not sure if the dryer makes it peel quicker, but it should certainly last way longer no matter if you put it into the dryer or not.


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## ericsson2416 (Aug 29, 2007)

Been using siser for about a year. Switched over to them cause they had local distributor. Recently had some white siser used on names crack within three months. Was for a team I know a lot of the members personally. Liked the product but can't risk it - going back to Eco-film. Little more expensive and longer ship time but we're a small town and gotta go with what I know works.


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## binki (Jul 16, 2006)

I sent the pics to their tech support. Hopefully they can get back to me tomorrow on this. I have had a few issues with it but I am suspecting it is the washing of the garments that are causing the problem.


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## binki (Jul 16, 2006)

Talking to tech support at Siser we agree that the customer is doing some aggressive washing and drying of the shirts. This is what I suspected.


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## graphicdetails (Nov 17, 2012)

What exactly is "aggressive washing and drying"? I recently switched to Easyweed about a month ago and have used it on many orders already.

I'm not sure what aggressive washing and drying would entail. Can you be more specific?


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## Whittierink (May 21, 2013)

I use specialty material no problems ever


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## WindoraBug (May 29, 2013)

graphicdetails said:


> What exactly is "aggressive washing and drying"? I recently switched to Easyweed about a month ago and have used it on many orders already.
> 
> I'm not sure what aggressive washing and drying would entail. Can you be more specific?




I'm going to guess, they mean not following the manufacturers wash recommendations, for starts. Most shirts are cold wash & delicate/light and low heat/tumble with them turned inside out.Anything other , is what I would consider aggressive, or negligent. 

We do alot of testing where I work and this was a hot topic as one of our main people washes EVERYTHING hot hot on regular/heavy cycles and then dries high heat, without inside out. When she was testing, noone questioned why everything shrunk badly and colors were bleeding. Let's just say, those days are over and we now test to the individual articles suggested parameters. 

I strongly suggest testing heavily before material/product combinations to customers. And adding a little note somewhere to make sure they follow the manufacturers care instructions for longevity of their new custom textile!


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## splathead (Dec 4, 2005)

WindoraBug said:


> Most shirts are cold wash & delicate/light and low heat/tumble with them turned inside out.Anything other , is what I would consider aggressive, or negligent.


Correction, anything else would be how 99% of the buying public washes their garments.

Sorry guys, but your decoration needs to hold up to how most people wash; hot water, normal tumble dryer. This is not 'aggressive washing and drying'. Siser, and everyone else needs to engineer their product to how everyday people wash. Not how we say WE wash, or how we would want our product washed. It's just not realistic.

I've got a ton of personal product decorated with Siser and I guess then I would be considered a super-duper-aggressive washer and dryer, and I've NEVER had cracking or peeling of their product-never. So this line from them blaming the public is BS. We need to hold them better accountable.

Binki you should press that same batch of vinyl on a scrap shirt and do some 'non-aggressive' wash/dry tests and see what happens.


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## binki (Jul 16, 2006)

By Aggressive I am meaning commercial washer/dryers such as a laundrymat. We are finding the high heat in the dryers are causing problems along with using a dry cleaner shop who would do the same thing. 

We are not sure if other additives such as brighteners or fabric softeners are also being used and causing problems. 

Now, as far as home washer/dryers, I wash all of our products in cold but maximum time and dry on high heat for 70 minutes without problems. 

We do hundreds of garments a week with this same vinyl and have very few problems. The shirts in question look awful and are pretty much worn out after 6 months of use. We are removing and replacing the graphics this time for the customer on the same shirts and now include a care instruction sheet with each order.


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## WindoraBug (May 29, 2013)

splathead said:


> Correction, anything else would be how 99% of the buying public washes their garments.
> 
> Sorry guys, but your decoration needs to hold up to how most people wash; hot water, normal tumble dryer. This is not 'aggressive washing and drying'. Siser, and everyone else needs to engineer their product to how everyday people wash. Not how we say WE wash, or how we would want our product washed. It's just not realistic.
> 
> ...




I am not condoning the public at blame hypothesis by any means. I should have also indicated that. The material (flex/flock) company should be accountable and I think they should do more aggressive testing on their end as well. The inconsistencies I come across with finger pointing as the answer is unacceptable by all means. We are on the same team here....

But I also don't think that 99% of people wash everything hot and dry hot. Out of a room of 8 people in a meeting only that 1 person washed like that. If I wash and dry hot, I generally don't get to wear that shirt again, and every male particularly in the room said the same things as we aren't little guys. I could agree with 50% or maybe even up to 65% that don't follow care instructions. Even though in the room that day it was more like 10%.


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## graphicdetails (Nov 17, 2012)

Nobody follows care instructions, especially when we are talking about t-shirts. I don't think I've ever turned a shirt inside out to wash it. I don't want to think about that, and neither does any customer. I just throw it in.

Over the years I've used Stahl's Econoprint, Stahl's ThermoFilm, and ThermoFlex Plus. They have been washed in every way possible, and not one person has ever had a problem with anything falling off. And none of my personal items or family's clothes have had issues either. So I know the durability is there and attainable. 

If I have issues down the road with Easyweed and they tell me it's due to "aggressive washing", I will be aggressively going back to ThermoFlex Plus. I switched from ThermoFlex to Easyweed because I can see the cut lines better on Easyweed and I can't see them at all on ThermoFlex. But I would switch back and deal with it if durability becomes a problem.


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## binki (Jul 16, 2006)

I will add that this company supplied shirts to 6 employees and 2 had problems. Siser took our comments and immediately started testing. 

Like I said, we use our products and I dry at high heat for over an hour and remove from the dryer , ball it up and toss in the pile to wear when I need a shirt. Never once a problem


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## imhotep9 (May 25, 2013)

binki said:


> By Aggressive I am meaning commercial washer/dryers such as a laundrymat. We are finding the high heat in the dryers are causing problems along with using a dry cleaner shop who would do the same thing.
> 
> We are not sure if other additives such as brighteners or fabric softeners are also being used and causing problems.
> 
> ...


Binki....how did you remover the design off the shirt? 

Sent from my SPH-L710 using T-Shirt Forums


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## binki (Jul 16, 2006)

imhotep9 said:


> Binki....how did you remover the design off the shirt?
> 
> Sent from my SPH-L710 using T-Shirt Forums


Stahls has a remover that I used.


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## digitizewedo (Nov 2, 2010)

You may need the vinyl that is design to stretch, some siser vinyls do not stretch that sweater appeared to be a knit, you the right product and you should not have this problem, I use it exclusively.


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## binki (Jul 16, 2006)

It is a gildan tshirt. We confirmed the problem is high heat from a laundry mat dryer


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## tammygraphics (Feb 10, 2014)

We're seeing cracking on some of our shirts and peeling. We had 2 returned out of a batch that were done on fashion film fairly quickly. They look like the logo is all pulled together and wrinkled w/ some of it coming off. I think they were pressed too hot at not enough pressure? The rest of the group was ok. The person pressing them had read on the net and talked to someone locally that said high temps short time was ok. I put a stop to this practice.

However, now items that were done about 6 months ago with sisser are cracking and peeling. My husband's moving company shirts/ sweatshirts. They are washed and put in the dryer with our cold wash clothes. Some hold up fine. I'm assuming it's a sisser issue? Some thing have never had a problem and I have even accidentally thrown them in with towels once or twice... I'm just lost. I can't get items back - it's embarrassing.



My


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## 135367 (Mar 10, 2011)

I've been using easy weed for the last 2 years. Just recently, I had a shirt crack, but I think it was that the shirt shrunk and not the fault of the vinyl. I've not had any other problems.


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## vanmaninc (Jun 5, 2012)

From my experience cracking sometimes occours because of the 5% shrinkage on pure cotton tees

There are also alot of variables at play. Like for example All of my personal full colour cmyk eco solvent printed designs get washed off in 5-7 washes.

But my friend whom ive printed for looks exactly like the day I printed it 6 months ago 

The difference is the way his wife washes his tops compared to the way my wife washes mine. 
Supplier says cold wash is prefered and as soon as heat is introduced problems occur

I personally don't use siser because the supplier who brings it in is very expensive.
But I have used poly-flex and stahls transfers with very little issues. And at roughly $9 a meter its cheaper compared to $15.6 for siser


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

I know this is old. I think the commercial dryer thing is crap. All dryers manufactured, commercial or residential have a 145F limiting thermostat on the output side of the dryer. There is also a safety limit at 222F or 333F but the regulating thermostat is still at 145F. The commercial dryers have a much larger element larger air circulation motor. 

I use all Specialty material products and never give customers ant special instructions. I do tell them though that completely drying a shirt with vinyl will shorten the life but I have shirts I have done 7 years ago that I wear and wash weekly that are just now failing and have never done any special laundering. The vinyl still isn't cracking though its just starting to peel. 

I was sent a large sample pack of Siser product and the just didn't compare. I only ever used the stuff test materials and it wouldn't stretch as well as others. The Thermoflex plus can handle a second pressing after the carrier has been removed that allows there to be very little hand. Most other vinyls I have tried to double press have actually started to peel on the edges. When I asked the manufacture or supplier it was said that the adhesive over activates and looses it holding ability.


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## royster13 (Aug 14, 2007)

IMO most problems to do with vinyl cracking are to do with overdoing it while applying it.....Too much heat and/or too much time....I use the bare minimum of time and temperature and do not ever re-press....I have used Siser Easy Weed for several years and never had an issue...


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

I agree with you Royce except the thermoflex plus is labeled for repressing. It is one of the only vinyls I have seen that recommends this. It also makes it go from feeling like 80% of the other vinyl to a light screen print feel. Back when I was doing a lot of vinyl, I had suppliers sending over samples of just about every vinyl. I just couldn't ever get the results I was with Thermoflex. I now rarely now touch vinyl unless its for a name placement or a 1 off. 

I would rather pay a little extra for high quality materials then try to make a few extra bucks cause in the end it could cost you a few customers.


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## royster13 (Aug 14, 2007)

sben763 said:


> I agree with you Royce except the thermoflex plus is labeled for repressing.


I must have missed that instruction in the sheet I got with my material......I just looked at both Poli Tape and Specialty Materials websites and can not see any reference to re-pressing...

Can you please refer me to where you have seen this instruction....Thanks...


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## binki (Jul 16, 2006)

royster13 said:


> IMO most problems to do with vinyl cracking are to do with overdoing it while applying it.....Too much heat and/or too much time....I use the bare minimum of time and temperature and do not ever re-press....I have used Siser Easy Weed for several years and never had an issue...


We worked with the Siser tech team on this and found in testing that laundrymat dryers and fabric softener were the culprit, not our application. 

We have added that to our care instruction sheet that goes out with all of our orders.


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

royster13 said:


> I must have missed that instruction in the sheet I got with my material......I just looked at both Poli Tape and Specialty Materials websites and can not see any reference to re-pressing...
> 
> Can you please refer me to where you have seen this instruction....Thanks...


[media]http://www.artdoggie.com/thermoflex_plus.pdf[/media]. These are the original instructions from specialty materials. Although rewritten. I have a copy of original in the office somewhere. I seen it was changed when they changed the original press times to slightly longer.



binki said:


> We worked with the Siser tech team on this and found in testing that laundrymat dryers and fabric softener were the culprit, not our application.
> 
> We have added that to our care instruction sheet that goes out with all of our orders.


IMO that's a excuse for a inferior product. I have a commercial dryer and my wife uses fabric softener. I do not want my reputation dependent on a client not caring for a garment. I find that ridiculous a dryer(by the way doesn't get any hotter then a residential dryer) and fabric softener causing cracking. 

In 7 years have never had 1 complaint or issue with vinyl and never given out 1 care instructions.


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## binki (Jul 16, 2006)

Just because you haven't had complaints doesn't mean it didn't happen. I have a 3 year old shirt with Thermoflex that just started cracking. I dry at high heat for 70 minutes. 

We have done thousands of shirts with vinyl over the years and the failure rate is pretty low though. Just adding my experience.


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## vanmaninc (Jun 5, 2012)

binki said:


> We worked with the Siser tech team on this and found in testing that *laundrymat dryers and fabric softener* were the culprit, not our application.
> 
> We have added that to our care instruction sheet that goes out with all of our orders.




which is what i also said in a earlier post. 
there are lots of variables and the way people wash there clothes is one of them lol


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

As a appliance tech for 20+ years I can tell you that the dryer in a Laundromat may be bigger and a larger element with a lot more airflow then a residential dryer but the regulating thermostat is set at 145F in order to comply with UL regulations. With having more air flow it may actually keep cooler inside as long as the vents are clean. This will dry cloths faster then higher heat. 

Almost everyone of the vinyl orders we did were for current customers. Although I mainly screen print now there are still customers that ask if the can still get vinyl. I will but usually they will go with screen print with the price difference. My service company I made shirts for myself and the few subs that help out 7 and 5 years ago with vinyl. The 7 year old shirt are falling apart and the vinyl is just going bad. I also in the beginning always made a shirt for me of all clients shirts, wore and washed on a regular bases just for my piece of mind.


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## Teestretcher (Sep 7, 2012)

I am have the same problem with siser easyweed peeling on the top layer. I have been pressing using mostly siser easyweed. I have had shirts over two years layered with two colors and still holding up. My temp. , process and curing methods have all been the same. Mostly my layers will peel when using black and white. With the Black or White being the bottom Layers. We have only had two returns because of peeling in two years, but I have 2 personal shirts that have peel right off after wearing for a month. The way we launder our clothes hmmmm I don't think so, not this kind of peeling. Almost aways the shirt is turned inside out light wash, med to high dry, dryer sheets not fabric soft liquid. We are switching our product to see if the problem persist. I really would like to get comfortable layering again because lay ins just do not contour up evenly because of material shrinking up after the vinyl is pressed.


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## Teestretcher (Sep 7, 2012)

I will try a few methods mentioned in the post. 
1) cold launder 
2) make sure 1st layer is only press 5 second then apply second layer
3) Pre press garment
Has anyone ever heard applying rubbing alcohol to the top layer to dull the finish before applying the second layer? Is there anyone doing this?


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