# Vinyl Recommendation



## jasonsmith (Mar 30, 2011)

I was looking for a vinyl recommendation. I'm looking at going mostly with white. And since it will be going on black shirts. Then I'd need the white to be real opaque.

I also want the vinyl to have a true matte finish with no shine. As I think shine makes the vinyl look like a sticker.

I was also wanting it to have a clear backing like the Eco-Film. As that makes placement and lining up real easy. But I guess this isn't a real biggy as the others are more important.

And also something that has a soft hand and doesn't come off looking like a sticker. If possible, something that doesn't stick to leather seats or a wet hand, etc.


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## jean518 (Sep 23, 2009)

Give Stahls Cad Cut Premium Plus a try. The Super Film is great also but has no sticky carrier. Fashion film is nice also. Check out their website. They are in the preferred vendors list. I also like Thermo Flex Plus.


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## pxs93710 (Jun 21, 2010)

Siser easy weed has been my workhorse and have had no problems stacking designs. I also use Twill USA with a textured mat that gives an extra dimension to the vinyl. Thermoflex is also a good product.


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## thutch15 (Sep 8, 2008)

I use a lot of ThermoFlex Plus. Most all vinyl that you use for the proper application will be very opaque.


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## Nick Horvath (Feb 26, 2010)

jasonsmith said:


> I was looking for a vinyl recommendation. I'm looking at going mostly with white. And since it will be going on black shirts. Then I'd need the white to be real opaque.
> 
> I also want the vinyl to have a true matte finish with no shine. As I think shine makes the vinyl look like a sticker.
> 
> ...


Most all heat applied vinyls have a see through carrier, so that wont be much of an issue.

Is the Black a Cotton or Polyester base?

If it is Cotton, then just about any vinyl will work. However, if it is Polyester then you need to find a vinyl on the thicker side to successfully block the dye migration.


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## jasonsmith (Mar 30, 2011)

Nick Horvath said:


> Most all heat applied vinyls have a see through carrier, so that wont be much of an issue.
> 
> Is the Black a Cotton or Polyester base?
> 
> If it is Cotton, then just about any vinyl will work. However, if it is Polyester then you need to find a vinyl on the thicker side to successfully block the dye migration.


I had seen some with carriers that were mostly white. But that could have been tape.

It is 100% cotton.

I've got a list of requirments in my first post that I'm wanting. Opacity, true matte finish, doesn't look like a sticker, and doesn't stick to leather seats or to a wet hand.


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## thutch15 (Sep 8, 2008)

jasonsmith said:


> I had seen some with carriers that were mostly white.


Those could have been plastisol transfers.


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## stuffnthingz (Oct 1, 2007)

thutch15 said:


> Those could have been plastisol transfers.


I agree, I've used Plastisol screened onto paper. I did a hot peel and on a very dark shirt the white was not crisp. When I complained the vendor said I had to go with a cold peel, the cold peel tends to look thick and shiny, I like vinyl better in that case.

I use thermo flex, it is a flat white, but is thick.


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## Kammies (Dec 16, 2010)

I use Joto Multicut White and it is very opaque and you can layer it no problem. The hand is about the same a plastisol transfer. 

I also used the Joto Blockout White but it's not needed + the hand on the blockout is heaiver. 

I just so happen to have a picture on my iphone of the multicut white on a black shirt that I did for a customer two nights ago. It's not a good picture so if you need a closeup I can take one with a digi cam when I goto the shop tonight.


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## jasonsmith (Mar 30, 2011)

Are any of these vinyls sticky? i.e. stick to leather seats and wet hands? That wouldn't really work. And I'd like something too that bends with the shirt. I know some problems people have had with vinyl is it is real stiff. If I had a big giant square. I'd like to be able to wad it up like the rest of the shirt, and not crack/peel later on.


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## Kammies (Dec 16, 2010)

jasonsmith said:


> Are any of these vinyls sticky? i.e. stick to leather seats and wet hands? That wouldn't really work. And I'd like something too that bends with the shirt. I know some problems people have had with vinyl is it is real stiff. If I had a big giant square. I'd like to be able to wad it up like the rest of the shirt, and not crack/peel later on.


 
No these vinyls won't stick to anything. You are able to wad it uplike the rest of the shirt and it will not crack or peel off. 

I have also made tablecloths with the same vinyl. It's soft and pliable.


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## jasonsmith (Mar 30, 2011)

Kammies said:


> No these vinyls won't stick to anything. You are able to wad it uplike the rest of the shirt and it will not crack or peel off.
> 
> I have also made tablecloths with the same vinyl. It's soft and pliable.


Thanks. I had gotten to wondering if people were making recommendations on what vinyl they like to use vs. what my requirments are.


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## jasonsmith (Mar 30, 2011)

Forgot to add if you can dry your shirts on high heat with these vinyls without causing problems or cracking? I have to dry all my clothes on high heat as medium doesn't dry them all the way and leaves lots of wrinkles.


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## jean518 (Sep 23, 2009)

Embellished shirts of any method should not be dried on high heat. Unless you have a faulty drier or are putting too much in at once, shirts should dry on medium. Can't say for certain that will not crack etc when dried on high heat.


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## scuba_steve2699 (Nov 15, 2006)

Many of the preferred vendors will send you samples that you can test for yourself to see if it will meet your criteria. I would recommend asking for samples and then testing them.


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## jasonsmith (Mar 30, 2011)

scuba_steve2699 said:


> Many of the preferred vendors will send you samples that you can test for yourself to see if it will meet your criteria. I would recommend asking for samples and then testing them.


Yeah, that is what I plan on doing. I figured it would be good to get pointed in the right direction. Then go from there on my testing.

There is someone local who does vinyl and has a press. So, I'll probably see if they'll let me press my shirts there since this is just a hobby. So, I'll just be doing shirts here and there.

I think this will be alot easier than doing screen printed one-offs. And since I'm doing white on a black shirt. I don't have to worry so much about getting an opaque white like I would with screen printing.


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## jasonsmith (Mar 30, 2011)

Kammies said:


> I use Joto Multicut White and it is very opaque and you can layer it no problem. The hand is about the same a plastisol transfer.
> 
> I also used the Joto Blockout White but it's not needed + the hand on the blockout is heaiver.
> 
> I just so happen to have a picture on my iphone of the multicut white on a black shirt that I did for a customer two nights ago. It's not a good picture so if you need a closeup I can take one with a digi cam when I goto the shop tonight.


Where did you get the Joto Multicut White from?


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## Kammies (Dec 16, 2010)

jasonsmith said:


> Where did you get the Joto Multicut White from?


 
I get it here locally. I tried to order directly from jotopaper.com but they will not sell to you directly if you have a distributor near you. 

If you email them they will tell you where your nearest dealer is located.


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## jasonsmith (Mar 30, 2011)

Kammies said:


> I get it here locally. I tried to order directly from jotopaper.com but they will not sell to you directly if you have a distributor near you.
> 
> If you email them they will tell you where your nearest dealer is located.


What kind of multicut is it? I saw there were 7 different kinds. I'm assuming Multicut ULTRA?


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## Kammies (Dec 16, 2010)

jasonsmith said:


> What kind of multicut is it? I saw there were 7 different kinds. I'm assuming Multicut ULTRA?


 
Yes it is the ULTRA.


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## tshirtprintNewb (Jun 18, 2011)

Anyone has any good and affordable vinyl to recommend?
Affordable in a sense that I can make decent profit if I dont spend too much on vinyl


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## tee09 (Oct 30, 2009)

I primarily use siser easy weed. Gives me great results.


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## jasonsmith (Mar 30, 2011)

How does the Joto Multicut Ultra compare to the Thermoflex Plus? Looks like those are the two best options to choose from.


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## Flint54 (Oct 16, 2008)

We ran a test on ThermoFlex Plus and Extra. Each one was applied to a t-shirt 50/50 blend, gray & White with a layered design also applied with the Extra. 

We then sent them to a commercial laundry that put them through 30 wash & dry cycles. Wash water temp was 140 F and dryer temp was 180 F. Both the plus and extra single layer & multi layer designs held up through the first 10 cycles on both color Ts. After 20 there was some slight edge lift on a couple of areas of the Extra that was layered the single layer was fully intact. After 30 cycles all of the Extra multi layer designs were loosing parts or coming loose all Plus and Extra single layer designs were still intact and fully adhered.

This was a torture test, I only wish that I had been able to include other brands but was unable. I also wish that I had been able to do a multi with the Plus but only had 1 color and didn't think to layer the same color.

But we now have a good reference that we can relate to our customers about the adhesion of the vinyl that we use.


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## royster13 (Aug 14, 2007)

jasonsmith said:


> How does the Joto Multicut Ultra compare to the Thermoflex Plus? Looks like those are the two best options to choose from.


As far as I know, they are the same product....Both made by Poli-Tape...

But I like Siser Easy Weed and/or Specta EcoFilm because they require lower temperature and shorter press time....


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## jasonsmith (Mar 30, 2011)

Has anyone tried that Stahls Premium Plus to compare? I had read alot of good reviews on the Premium Plus saying they could hardly feel it on the shirt. Though, I know some had trouble cutting it.


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## jean518 (Sep 23, 2009)

Yes. I have tried it and really liked it. Cutting and weeding are a little different in that you MUST HAVE A BLADE THAT HAS NOT BEEN USED TO CUT ANYTHING ELSE and use extra weeding/cut lines to facilitate weeding. Do not pull hard when weeding. Other than those things which once you get it through your head, it is wonderful. Your cutter strip must also be in good shape with no grooves in it.


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## jasonsmith (Mar 30, 2011)

jean518 said:


> Yes. I have tried it and really liked it. Cutting and weeding are a little different in that you MUST HAVE A BLADE THAT HAS NOT BEEN USED TO CUT ANYTHING ELSE and use extra weeding/cut lines to facilitate weeding. Do not pull hard when weeding. Other than those things which once you get it through your head, it is wonderful. Your cutter strip must also be in good shape with no grooves in it.


I'm going to be getting a GCC Expert. I'd have to order an extra blade just for the Premium Plus if I decided to also use that. But not sure how it would hold up to detail.

I don't know about the extra weeding/cut lines as it will cut as is from Corel Draw.

Have you compared the Premium Plus to MultiCut Ultra or Thermoflex Plus with regards to feel and hand?


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## royster13 (Aug 14, 2007)

What is the attraction to Premium Plus?....Is it because of price?.....


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## jasonsmith (Mar 30, 2011)

royster13 said:


> What is the attraction to Premium Plus?....Is it because of price?.....


Because some have commented on how they really like it. And that some have mentioned it seemed like the print blended into the shirt to where you could hardly tell it was on the shirt. As I don't care for the sticker on a shirt feel/look.

But maybe the Thermoflex Plus and/or the Joto Multicut Ultra blends into the shirt as well so it doesn't have that sticker feel/look.

As I know some films can feel like a tarp on your shirt if you have a large print.


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## tee09 (Oct 30, 2009)

royster13 said:


> What is the attraction to Premium Plus?....Is it because of price?.....


That and also it REALLY has a soft hand feel. Like screen print.

Personally i never used it but i had received a sample of it and i felt real nice.


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## jean518 (Sep 23, 2009)

You should be able to put the extra weed lines in manually by drawing a line the just goes to the graphic but not through it. My software does this automatically for me. I just click on horizontal or vertical weed lines and it puts them on the cut area inside the weed border. GCC great cut probably has that option as the software I use is similar to great cut. I can move the lines to suit me if necessary. I do this with most any vinyl espcecially if there is text or if it is a large graphic. Trying to weed a graphic that has open areas can cause lifting as you tend to pull harder on the vinyl. Enjoy your cutter. I have the GCC Jaguar IV.


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## jasonsmith (Mar 30, 2011)

jean518 said:


> You should be able to put the extra weed lines in manually by drawing a line the just goes to the graphic but not through it. My software does this automatically for me. I just click on horizontal or vertical weed lines and it puts them on the cut area inside the weed border. GCC great cut probably has that option as the software I use is similar to great cut. I can move the lines to suit me if necessary. I do this with most any vinyl espcecially if there is text or if it is a large graphic. Trying to weed a graphic that has open areas can cause lifting as you tend to pull harder on the vinyl. Enjoy your cutter. I have the GCC Jaguar IV.


I'll have to see what software comes with the GCC Expert. I know through Imprintables, they give you Cadworx.

I'm assuming that with extra weed/cut lines. Does that mean it cuts the lines in the vinyl twice? Or is it something else?


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## jean518 (Sep 23, 2009)

No. Let me see if I can explain. Your graphic is normally framed by a weed border which is a square/rectangle around your graphic. There are open areas of vinyl that will need to be removed/weeded. Sometimes when removing those areas, you have to pull a little harder because of the size. These lines are just extra cut lines to reduce the size of the area to be removed so that you do not have to pull so much vinyl. Sometimes pulling a large piece can cause the wanted area to pull up. You will be removing smaller pieces thus reducing the chance of pulling up wanted areas.


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## jasonsmith (Mar 30, 2011)

jean518 said:


> No. Let me see if I can explain. Your graphic is normally framed by a weed border which is a square/rectangle around your graphic. There are open areas of vinyl that will need to be removed/weeded. Sometimes when removing those areas, you have to pull a little harder because of the size. These lines are just extra cut lines to reduce the size of the area to be removed so that you do not have to pull so much vinyl. Sometimes pulling a large piece can cause the wanted area to pull up. You will be removing smaller pieces thus reducing the chance of pulling up wanted areas.


I understand what you are saying. Sounds like a good idea. Thanks.

When I order my GCC Expert, I'll probably go ahead and get an extra blade incase I go with the Premium Plus film. I like the idea of the Premium Plus blending into the shirt, but had read of alot of problems cutting it. Or small pieces falling off since the backing isn't too sticky compared to something like Thermoflex.


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## tee09 (Oct 30, 2009)

Fyi, Coastal is having a promo right now on Siser easyweed. 10 percent off.
Valid through the 17th.


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## jasonsmith (Mar 30, 2011)

tee09 said:


> Fyi, Coastal is having a promo right now on Siser easyweed. 10 percent off.
> Valid through the 17th.


Siser Easyweed is semi-gloss. I only want matte.


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## royster13 (Aug 14, 2007)

I just looked at samples of Siser Easy Weed and ThermoFlex Plus and it is to tell them apart as far as matte versus semi-gloss.....I press with a teflon sheet.....Does that change the finish?....


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## jasonsmith (Mar 30, 2011)

royster13 said:


> I just looked at samples of Siser Easy Weed and ThermoFlex Plus and it is to tell them apart as far as matte versus semi-gloss.....I press with a teflon sheet.....Does that change the finish?....


I didn't get that first part.

On the teflon sheet. I'm not sure how true this is or not. But I read at Imprintables that Teflon will leave more of a gloss finish, and Kraft will leave more of a matte finish. But I'm not really sure what type of transfer they are referring to.


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## scuba_steve2699 (Nov 15, 2006)

Kraft paper will give your finish a more matte finish and the teflon will maintain a gloss finish. The matte finish is not a true matte but it will lessen the glossy look.


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