# BANDING on the EPSON 9700



## Vahanvaty (Nov 15, 2009)

Hi Guys,

I've been told that the 9700 printer cannot withstand big runs as the cartridges loose their pressure, therefore, shorter commands are to be given and the machine should be turned off periodically after every 50 mt. job.

If this is not done so, then you are to face tremendous banding issues that even a clean will not be able to help.

Firstly, is this true??? and if yes how does one solve the issue if it ever can be solved???

Second, i'm using Watsach as my rip, but my colours are really dead !!! can someone help me here??? the guys doing the profile, are ............... better not use the word here!!!


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## Conde_David (May 29, 2008)

Not true for our printers. We run all over shirts
many hours a day. Maybe with cheap carts?

Alignment is important at installation and
If banding is present with a good nozzle check.


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## Vahanvaty (Nov 15, 2009)

which cart do you suggest, and where can i get them from??? 

ive done the alignment and its helped to a certain extent, however, ive found, that, if you give a run of around 2500 inches, you must turn the printer off and then restart it. This does help in removing the banding a bit.


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## Conde_David (May 29, 2008)

Be sure to upgrade the firmware.
We sell the carts.


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## Vahanvaty (Nov 15, 2009)

David,

Please mail me the cost and shipping etc - mushtaq@sportiff.co.in, also the machine is only 2 weeks old, do you still feel i need to upgrade the firmware ??


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## Conde_David (May 29, 2008)

One step at a time.
Upgrade the firmware and then run through
the auto alignment twice.


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## Vahanvaty (Nov 15, 2009)

done david, seems to have helped already !!!! to some extent !!


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## alumation (Jan 26, 2009)

Vahanvaty said:


> done david, seems to have helped already !!!! to some extent !!


If you have 2 options in pair cleaning (normal and power) then i think you have the latest firmware. 
Our older 9700 does not have it but the new one has.


on a lighter note--you can always outsource your print job to the printer just 5 miles north of you. hehe.


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## mags1892 (Mar 31, 2012)

I'm a reseller of Epson as well as others and havevnoticed a great deal of head replacements on all the models with the 9700 head. They also have a colour issue force first 7cm of a new print after being idle for a hour or so.
I have never seen a problem as you explain so I would blame the cart, this range of Epson have a hard to copy cart.

If its not the cart its the head but good luck with that if you're not running genuine Epson ink.


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## Conde_David (May 29, 2008)

The firmware upgrade seems to have taken
care of the start up issue.


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## PositiveDave (Dec 1, 2008)

9700s get their speed from running two heads for each colour, it simply isn't possible to align two heads as well as one, there seems to be an inconsistency with this model, some seem OK others are dubious. I've just stopped supplying them!


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## Conde_David (May 29, 2008)

With the new firmware, I have had excellent
luck with alignment and quality.


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## Riderz Ready (Sep 18, 2008)

PositiveDave said:


> 9700s get their speed from running two heads for each colour, it simply isn't possible to align two heads as well as one, there seems to be an inconsistency with this model, some seem OK others are dubious. I've just stopped supplying them!


Great to see a post from a vendor being upfront and honest on a new printer they sell. Early indications from posts remind me of the good old Ricoh 7000. New printer, touted as a really fast reliable solution yet early problems were just the tip of the iceberg to what was going to come down the road. 

The entire concept of a dual head 9700 makes little sense. Sure vendors will get people excited about the "speed" versus other printers but just like the Ricoh 7000 what percent of users truly take advantage of the increased speed? Who has their printer running 8-12 hours a day thus needs the extra speed? If you do a Ricoh 7000 or a Epson 9700 is probably not the right printer for such heavy use.

Second if you are in the wide format arena you know that virtually every major issue and related cost with the printer are print heads. Why would anyone want to double their headaches and double their maintenance cost on a printer for some extra speed?

Cannot imagine in a year or so of heavy use what replacing two print heads would cost unless Epson really drops the price of them compared to other models. Only time will tell whether this is the next Ricoh 7000 or a valuable tool one should consider.


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## Conde_David (May 29, 2008)

I don't give up so easy!
I have a good friend at Epson that helped
me understand the issues and the new firmware
support. 

Do you remember the 4000?
It's dual support really worked out well.

If your ever in our area, would love to have
you visit. We have an excellent printer lab.


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## Riderz Ready (Sep 18, 2008)

One can have the greatest printer lab in the world yet it obviously does not reflect a printers value or reliability. That is only done once the printer is in the hands of a large number of consumers. No lab can recreate mass distribution and long term use. Case in point the GX7000

Again the concept of having two heads to maintain and replace makes zero sense. What is the cost to replace two heads and all the dampers?


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## mags1892 (Mar 31, 2012)

The 7700/9700 uses the same print head as the 7890 7900 9890 and 9900 the 7700 used more of the head for less colour hence its speed.


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## Conde_David (May 29, 2008)

Good point except we have a large print services
operation. Again consider a visit.

There is only one printhead.


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## PLitv001 (Apr 25, 2012)

We're running 3 Epson 9700's. Same issue on all three printers. 

I upgraded the firmware to the latest edition, ran Bi-D 2 Color Alignment, then Uni, then Bi-D All. All three were done in manual mode.

I hope this helps someone else since we spent hours on this -through trial and error we've found that the best settings are Paper Thickness:0.0 mm
Platen Gap: Minimum (0.8mm)
Roll Paper Tension: Default
Paper Feed Calibration: 0.1
Vacuum Intensity: 1.00

We are using a Variable Dot Light Pattern because this printer is so damn fast. Our profile guy is fantastic and he can't figure it out either.

The banding occurs on all the colors but is the most prominent on the black and the cyan. Within each pass you see

We have a 9880 that operates flawlessly using the same ink.

I would think that it was the cartridges but we are using 2 different bulk systems because our supplier only had two sets and we bought the third separately. All Korean made and appear really thought out.

The banding issue is absolutely driving us crazy. I would appreciate any and all assistance.

Sample of the issue
http://www.s411062069.onlinehome.us/Trash/photo (2).JPG


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## mags1892 (Mar 31, 2012)

These passes look very wide whats the resolution / pass rate you are using ?


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## PLitv001 (Apr 25, 2012)

360 x 720

The point of us getting the 9700's was the speed. To have shorter passes, we would have to bump up the resolution, and pay to reprofile.

Conde seems to be running theres without issue. I don't know what their resolution though.


If I don't have any other choice then I guess we will have to. I don't know if it will fix it even if we do...


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## Vahanvaty (Nov 15, 2009)

Dude, ive been so messed up myself regarding this banding nonsense and been told by many that if you do this or that things will be okay.................... its bull**** !!!! i've bought all the crap they told me to buy thinking that its going to work and my foot...................... nothing ever did !!!

Most people i know, give a 150" command and then stop the printer and restart it again after a gap of 15 mins so that the pressure is built up again and give another 150" commad and so on and so forth.

BUT !!!!!!!!!!! Not even 1 person, who talks very highly about being able to set the machine has ever come forward and given an actual solution to the problem.

I know speed is an issue, but, i figured becuase of the speed of the machine at 720x720, its not possible for any machine to lay down the ink consistently and uniformly at that speed, and hence the banding........... its like you trying to sprint 100mts and then trying to sprint 300mts in the same time you did for the 100 !!!!!

so the only solution we found was to go back to the slow speed,,,,, on the 9700 its 720x1440, variable dot, quality mode. works amazingly as the 9880 did at 360x720 and quality is amazing. At least this way you know that you are going to get what you want and dont have to waste your time, energy, and money, in thinking of something that is not going to bloody happen !!!!


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## PLitv001 (Apr 25, 2012)

Thanks Vahanvaty. I'll try at 720x720 to try and eek out anything I can get and see how it comes out. If not, then I'll have to do the 720x1440.

It just seems funny, Epson wouldn't make a drafting printer incapable of producing draft quality without issue. I keep thinking were not doing something right. Cartridge pressurization is the most likely culprit but I'm running 2 different sets from two different suppliers. This is maddening.

I might just have to run the 9880 (From 2007) for jobs that need that level of quality. lol

This is bummer. If anyone else has any input I would love to hear it.


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## Vahanvaty (Nov 15, 2009)

Mate, no way out !!!! Incase you do, buddy, ill buy you an ice-cream !!! Smile !! Anyways, the 9880 is out of production by Epson, and the 9890 is the upgraded version of it. 

In all honesty, we buy the printer which is actually to be used for photography, and tweak it to use 3rd party inks, which is something that is wrong in the first place. 

If you can wait for a while, I've been told that Epson is launching a machine for Sublimation itself sometime in July-Aug, along with sub inks compatible with it,,,,,,,, so I guess its going to get better, but we have to just wait it out !!!


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## danielschelin (Apr 1, 2011)

The post about the Epson 9700 having two heads was misconstrued. The Epson 9700 has only 1 printhead but utilizes two channels per color or 720 total nozzles per color. The Mutoh RJ900 for example also uses 2 channels per color or 360 total nozzles per color. Firmware, alignment, cartridges and/or bulk system must work well in the printer for it to function properly. If you hear the air pumps coming on often you could have a leak causing more cleaning. In addition, if you want to compare Epson vs Mutoh. The Epson printhead will probably cost about $2000 to replace. The Mutoh printhead is about $1900, not including install. Dampers for a mutoh are $96/each and there are 4 of them. The Epson has 5 dampers and replacement cost for all 5 is about $200.


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## PLitv001 (Apr 25, 2012)

Hi Daniel,
This appears to be a overall printer issue. We have a few of them with the same result. Epson support on two occasions said they cant guarentee perfect performance in regards to this because it's a "draft mode." We are going to try something different next week. We bought a 9890. Wasatch has a cust inset setting for it to allow dual cmyk. It also allows two passes over the same area. This appears to be a solution. The 9890 settings will drive the 9700 so we're going to profile it and see what happens.

Pavel


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## danielschelin (Apr 1, 2011)

Hi Pavel,

The 9890 settings will drive the 9700 but to my knowledge, the pass settings are cut in half on the 9890 when compared to the 9700. I don't think Wasatch's custom dual CMYK mode will allow you to print at the same speed as a 9700. I'd be interested if that were the case. Many of the issues with the Epson 9700 printers are related to either refillable cartridges being used or the ink itself (even though the same ink works flawlessly on previous generation printers). Give me a call and I'd be happy to explain it. Personally I recommend running the 9700 with a 3 or 4 pass mode 720x720 (depends on RIP options) and have never attempted to run 360x360 or 360x720 modes. I can't imagine the ink drying well enough in sublimation for the 1 pass or 1x2 pass modes to work well.

Daniel 702-234-3178


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## Conde_David (May 29, 2008)

You are correct. Speed is half.


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