# DTG only good in contineous use?



## Walter T (Dec 27, 2007)

After a few days on this forum, we decided that DTG-printing may be something to expand our business with. We're now more in the designing, digital (paper)printing and embroidery business. So I called a local reseller of Anajet for more details, prices and samples.

They told me they'd stopped selling before they even started because the printheads clogged all the time if you don't print on a sort of semi-contineous base.
Since we'll be starting from allmost scratch, so to speak, the machine will be more out then in production...
They tolled me - after I mentioned this forum and losts of enthousiasts (in the US) - that it's only profitable in regions with better climat (so that people where more often T-shirts).

Are there DTG-shops in colder regions  with experiences?


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

Most dtg printers do operate better if you are printing on them regularly. One of the better things when going with a closed ink system (i.e. Anajet, iDot, Direct Advantage,...), is that it is really easy to remove the ink cartridges and put cleaning cartridges in so that the heads will not clog if you are not going to use the printer for several days. However, you will lose all the ink in the lines and the head. So, this cost can add up. Other printers have created automatic cleaning schedules (i.e. HM1) so that the printer will do an automatic cleaning as well to keep the head / nozzles / lines from clogging. There is also a cost associated with doing this as well. So, it all depends on what your business plan is and how much effort you are going to put into trying to sell this new application.

Yes, all printers can act differently in different climates. Most dtg printers operate best in or around 50% humidity. Most companies control this with a digital temperature gauge and a small humidifer if necessary. Some dtg printers (i.e. Brother) have built in warnings that warn you when it gets too cold. There are definitely dtg printers in colder regions. Mistlewoods I believe is in Colorado. You might want to contact them and see what their experiences have been with the Flexi-Jet in a colder climate. One thing to be careful of is making sure that the white ink does not freeze. Otherwise, it is no good.

Hope this helps you out. Best wishes.

Mark


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## blibby53 (Jun 12, 2007)

I purchased my Brother in July, I do not use it continuously. I do two or three large orders per month. My machine will sit for two weeks and then run for three days straight. I do not have any problems with doing this. I have had to put a heater in the room because it gets too cold to run it. Once the heat press is running and the heat builds up in the room I shut off the heater. I have been very happy with my Brother. It is a great machine, it is a plug and print machine for the computer dummies like me. Barb


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## akaratemom (Feb 20, 2007)

I too, have a Brother and love it! We did find that after having it for a year, that we have to keep a humidifier in the room especially in the winter when the humidity drops. I only recently had a print head need to be replaced because we didn't use it for a couple of weeks in low humidity. Be careful and keep the humidity up. It is an expensive mistake. A new head is costly. So far we only had to replace one. It is still in my opinion, the best machine on the market!


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## blibby53 (Jun 12, 2007)

Thanks for the advice I will watch the humidity and put a humidifer in the room. Barb


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## anajetuser (Sep 28, 2007)

Walter T said:


> After a few days on this forum, we decided that DTG-printing may be something to expand our business with. We're now more in the designing, digital (paper)printing and embroidery business. So I called a local reseller of Anajet for more details, prices and samples.
> 
> They told me they'd stopped selling before they even started because the printheads clogged all the time if you don't print on a sort of semi-contineous base.
> Are there DTG-shops in colder regions  with experiences?


Had to read this a few times, but I was glad to see someone was told about Anajet up front. I bought mine direct from Anajet, got the song and dance how the "closed ink system" fixed all the problems. The sales person knew I was going to need this machine as an add to my embroidery business and would not run much. But I was told that it worked OK for that. Bottom line is it needs to run every day, or take the ink out. VERY expensive and time consuming. Now Anajet sales does not stand behind what they told me. So I am stuck, but still glad to see some else did not get the same story. 
BTW, the closed ink system does have it's draw backs, and it's just not the extra cost for ink and cleaners. You are also locked into the ink and cleaners the company supplies, you have no way to know if the ink is drying out or getting thick. I had this happen once. Seems the Anajet cartridge does not always seal up when you take it out to install the cleaners. After a lot of trouble printing for months, I laid the cartridges on it side one day, and the ink ran out the port of one. So I took one of the cartridges that was giving me trouble apart, the ink was so thick it was no wonder I was having trouble.


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## adawg2252 (Dec 12, 2007)

i have a TJet 3 and I'm in boston, mass. It's 20 degrees out right now and my office takes a while to heat up.

Generally I always turn it on/off daily, so that it can perform a head cleaning, but I don't necessarily print something everyday.

I run at least 1 (sometimes 2) head cleanings during the day if i know i'm not going to use it to keep the lines moving so nothing sludges up.

if the room is too cold though, the printer moves a big sluggish, so i turn the heat press on to help out, and then generally it's fine.

I've never once actually used a barometer to see the humidity in the room, but I know it's definitly not that high if i were to guess, and I've never had any ink dryups or clogging that wasn't my own fault.

Even if you aren't doing jobs, it wouldn't kill you to print one shirt a day, even if you keep printing over the same shirt just to run the machine. I do that sometimes If i'm getting ready for a big job so that the machine is "warmed up"

good luck!


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## Walter T (Dec 27, 2007)

anajetuser said:


> Had to read this a few times, ...


Sorry my English isn't all that good, so you had to read several times... 
(My native language is Dutch.)


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## blibby53 (Jun 12, 2007)

Andrew, you are right it would not kill me to print a shirt everyday, just had not thought about that. Thanks for the great idea, duh a little slow sometimes. Lots of good info on this forum. Barb


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

anajetuser said:


> Seems the Anajet cartridge does not always seal up when you take it out to install the cleaners. After a lot of trouble printing for months, I laid the cartridges on it side one day, and the ink ran out the port of one. So I took one of the cartridges that was giving me trouble apart, the ink was so thick it was no wonder I was having trouble.


Anajetuser,

Just curious as to if you remember whether the cartridge was for white ink or CMYK? I have been told the cartridging of the white ink goes through an extensive de-gassing (not sure if that is spelled correctly) process. So, the introduction of air could lead to the ink becoming thicker like you can see with the refillable bottles that other companies use (i.e. a white ink sludge at the bottom of the bottle). One dtg manufacturer actually has a mixing / agitating system for the white ink to counter this problem.

One thing that I recommend to any closed-ink dtg owner is to label the cartridges with the slot # you put them into. The reasoning behind this is the needle that punctures the nozzle on the cartridge inside the printer might be in a slightly different location from one slot to another. Thus, if you pull a white cartridge from slot #5 out -> put a cleaning cartridge in -> then put the same white cartridge into slot #6...you might create a wider hole in the cartridge's nozzle. This could have (no guarantees as there are other factors) lead to the ink getting thicker. You should also shake your white cartridges once a day just like the bulk refill ink as well.

Hopefully, the new dtg inks that are coming out (or already have come out) will make life easier for everyone.


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## adawg2252 (Dec 12, 2007)

blibby53 said:


> Andrew, you are right it would not kill me to print a shirt everyday, just had not thought about that. Thanks for the great idea, duh a little slow sometimes. Lots of good info on this forum. Barb


No worries, it happens. I kept getting fed up with wasting shirts which is why I just started re-printing over them. I don't care if the image is over another one and I can't see it. I know it printed. I even turn them inside out and print on the inside of the shirt sometimes!

Then usually I donate them or cut them up for rags when I've completely used all available space.

Helps save shirts and money.

Good luck!


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## oldkush (Jun 25, 2007)

adawg2252 said:


> i have a TJet 3 and I'm in boston, mass. It's 20 degrees out right now and my office takes a while to heat up.
> 
> Generally I always turn it on/off daily, so that it can perform a head cleaning, but I don't necessarily print something everyday.
> 
> ...





Andrew

Just out of curiousity, do you have any idea how much it cost to do each head cleaning [ink costs] ?

Bob


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

Bob,

Good question about how much a head cleaning cost. It would be great if there was some place people could see how much ink is used for a nozzle check and head cleaning. Thus, they could determine what the cost would be for each one. I will start a new thread asking this question.

Mark


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## anajetuser (Sep 28, 2007)

DAGuide said:


> Anajetuser,
> 
> Just curious as to if you remember whether the cartridge was for white ink or CMYK? I have been told the cartridging of the white ink goes through an extensive de-gassing (not sure if that is spelled correctly) process. So, the introduction of air could lead to the ink becoming thicker like you can see with the refillable bottles that other companies use (i.e. a white ink sludge at the bottom of the bottle). One dtg manufacturer actually has a mixing / agitating system for the white ink to counter this problem.
> 
> ...


I have never run white. I have enough trouble just getting this Anajet to print colors, do not even want to think about use white with Anajet.

Yes, I have always put each cartridge in the same spot, both for the colors, and for the cleaning solution. Per the factory service guy that came here, leaking cartridges are seen with Anajet. He was not surprised when he saw it, and they did not even want it back at the foctory. When notified about the cartridge with very thick ink, Black, they did not even respond. 
As to new inks, either Anajet does not notify customers, or they have never changed inks to keep up with everyone else. It really worries me when I see what temps and time others use to set the ink. Way different from the 350 and 35 sec they recomend.


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## anajetuser (Sep 28, 2007)

Walter T said:


> Sorry my English isn't all that good, so you had to read several times...
> (My native language is Dutch.)


I had to re-read because a dealer told you the way it is. I'm not use that from Anajet.

Your english is good.


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## blibby53 (Jun 12, 2007)

adawg2252 said:


> No worries, it happens. I kept getting fed up with wasting shirts which is why I just started re-printing over them. I don't care if the image is over another one and I can't see it. I know it printed. I even turn them inside out and print on the inside of the shirt sometimes!
> 
> Then usually I donate them or cut them up for rags when I've completely used all available space.
> 
> ...


Andrew have you tried printing on paper. I have purchased large pads of paper at an art store and always do a test on the paper. I use less ink when I print on the paper, but it gives me an idea of what the design will look like and if I need to move it up or down in the program. 

It is cheaper than shirts. Barb


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## adawg2252 (Dec 12, 2007)

oldkush said:


> Andrew
> 
> Just out of curiousity, do you have any idea how much it cost to do each head cleaning [ink costs] ?
> 
> Bob


No idea. I don't know specifically because I can't actually see the levels in my bulk system change at all. So I want to say that the head cleaning is very little in ink cost. If I had to guess it's less than a dollar.

An Ink CHARGE, which is a "power cleaning" or "power flush" definitly pushes through a noticable amount of ink. I would put that at 2-5 dollars worth of ink. At least. But I only have to run those when I haven't printed white in a while and it's not coming out satisfactory.

hope that helps you out in your search.


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## adawg2252 (Dec 12, 2007)

blibby53 said:


> Andrew have you tried printing on paper. I have purchased large pads of paper at an art store and always do a test on the paper. I use less ink when I print on the paper, but it gives me an idea of what the design will look like and if I need to move it up or down in the program.
> 
> It is cheaper than shirts. Barb


I've printed on paper and all sorts of stuff. I also print on strike-offs, which are basically just cotton scraps. I buy them in 100 pound boxes or so and it's just cut scrap of white cotton fabric. 

If you try printing on photo paper it gives a really cool effect because the ink absorbs differently, it's really neat.


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## Mistewoods (Jul 7, 2007)

We do not print continuosly- we print mainly on weekends as we have another occupation. We do not print with white ink at this time- and printing dual CMYK we really don't have any clogging issues even printing sporadically. 

Our printer is in our home so it is not subjected to cold- however we live in a high desert and humidity can drop to below 10% ( though we rarely have any problems even then). The Epson printers do not like cold and some people report problems in the morning if the machine has gotten too cold at night.

On the Epson 4800- the quick clean cycle reports 4.6 ml of ink usage. The power clean cycle , which can also be used to charge the system with ink reports a 96.4 ml of ink usage. I calculated an estimate of about 75 ml in the lines themselves.


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## adawg2252 (Dec 12, 2007)

Mistewoods said:


> We do not print with white ink at this time- and printing dual CMYK
> 
> On the Epson 4800- the quick clean cycle reports 4.6 ml of ink usage. The power clean cycle , which can also be used to charge the system with ink reports a 96.4 ml of ink usage. I calculated an estimate of about 75 ml in the lines themselves.


What do you mean dual cmyk? You have the 8 nozzles printing two each CMYK? what DTG system has a setup for that?

Thanks for the estimate on ink usage, that will help me when I do estimates on ink-cost.


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## Mistewoods (Jul 7, 2007)

adawg2252 said:


> What do you mean dual cmyk? You have the 8 nozzles printing two each CMYK? what DTG system has a setup for that?
> 
> Thanks for the estimate on ink usage, that will help me when I do estimates on ink-cost.


We own a flexi-jet. It has an 8 cartridge set up as it is based on the Epson 4800 which uses two blacks plus CMY and LT CMY. The RIP by Iproof allows it to be controlled as dual CMYK- which gives some really bright prints in one pass.

Any 4800 (or 4880) based printer should be able to do the same- and probably some others as well.


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## Euroshirt (Nov 14, 2007)

I would definately agree that a DTG is best in a continuous production setup. I have a DTG Kiosk which will clog after a couple of days of no use..


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## mk162 (Sep 24, 2007)

It depends on the printer...the Brother doesn't clog, even after a couple weeks of no use.


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

Brad, can you clarify your statement that "the Brother doesn't clog" to reflect that it actually depends on which inks (brand of ink, CMYK vs White inks,...) you have in the printer and several other factors (i.e. humidity, maintenance procedures,...). All inkjet printers can clog - even the Brother printer. Any printer that runs white ink is more likely to clog than one that does not. Thus, the reason why the Brother printer has less clogging / banding issues - no white ink. There are plenty of posts on SPU that talk about the Brother printer banding and lines clogged. 

Bottom line, your printer is a piece of equipment that needs to be maintained. Run a sample print every 2 days or so to help with your marketing efforts and that will help keep the lines flowing. If this is something you can't do, then look at another form of decorating or find someone to do the contracting printing for you.


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## mk162 (Sep 24, 2007)

That is true, we of course don't run white ink and we run the standard Brother inks. But I can tell you, even in the winter when the humidity drops, we don't have clogging issues.

Brian and I discussed at length the problems we found with Gildan shirts banding. We found the banding wasn't consistent and it was the shirts causing the banding. We use Anvils now and have no problems with banding.

I think part of the reason is the Brother heads are bigger and the jets are larger, so there is more ink that needs to dry out. The Epson heads are much finer and clog easier. This is also why the Brother prints aren't nearly as fine as the Epson heads, but of course far superior to the detail of screen printing.

The Brother was better designed than most for trouble free printing. Brother has more of a name to protect than any of these other companies out there.


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## skegrie431 (Oct 31, 2007)

Hi,
I have a T-jet 2 with a "open" system and I only use the printer 1 or 2 days a week. Between this times I don´t do anything with the printer. But each time I´m finnish I clean it and put a few drop of "window-cleaning" in the waste-cup.

By the way, I live in Sweden and it´s snowing outside...


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## Belquette (Sep 12, 2005)

> The Brother was better designed than most for trouble free printing. Brother has more of a name to protect than any of these other companies out there.


The need to run your printer all depends on the environment the unit is in. 
If you live in the desert then you better turn it on more often then if your living in the rain forest.


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## clsgraphics2100 (Nov 20, 2007)

Hi all!
My name is Larry from CLS Graphics. I been sitting on the side lines for some time just reading all the posts.Two years ago I out sourced my screen printing because I didn't want to spend the time,it was too messy for my environment,and I have expectations of buying a DTG printer. My need to buy a printer is getting more urgent because I can't seem to find a printer that will get thing done when he says he will. I keep on being told it's a "screen printers thing" or "an artist thing".
After reading the posts on several DTG subjects,ie.white ink, clogged nozzles etc. this morning, I have convinced myself that I should wait a little longer to buy a DTG printer.
Everybody seems to feel comfortable sharing knowledge and it's appreciated. Thanks


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