# Alternative to expensive Chemicals and Towles for screen printing



## machinegunnwilly (Jan 4, 2016)

Hey guys, I'm growing tired of paying for the screen printing companies cleaning chemicals. I recently discovered via this forum you can use Simple Green degreaser instead of the ones I've been paying 4x the amount for, which brings me to this question.

Are there any alternatives to the higher priced press washes to remove plastisol from screens, emulsion removers, ink removers ( to remove stains from garments ,mine smells like nail polish remover). Even towels, I've currently been using blue shop towels from home depot but they do not absorb much ink and and go through a ton of them!

Thanks guys, hopefully this can help everyone!


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## jimknudson (Dec 24, 2015)

A little money saver here.Screen opener is just non-chlorinated brake cleaner.You can buy it at Advance Auto Parts for $3.50 a can.I buy it when they have the buy 1 get 1 free sale.Also the brake cleaner works great for removing wet ink from t-shirts.Also for shop towels/rags I use Viva paper towels,which also works great as a test pelon.This is what I have been doing for years and I have never had a problem.If you can buy them in bulk from Sams club or something that would be the best.Emulsion remover,bleach works but it takes 15-20 minutes for the emulsion to come off.Maybe in a dip tank,not sure.Also if you use pallet tape that costs $60-80 per roll,you might want to try clear shelf paper from the dollar store.You don't get a lot for the $1 but I don't have to change tape very often.Also instead of using spray adhesive to hold down shirts,I use the water based adhesive from ryonet.I mix mine with water and spray it on.Last a long time and I can "recharge" it by spraying a little water on it.Works great.A pint of that has lasted me for months.Also about emulsion remover buy it in powder form.I buy it from performance screen supply and it is $125 but it makes 22 gallons or so.And to clean screens just buy mineral spirits,I buy it for less than $10 a gallon and it works great.I know that there are more things but since I am not in the shop right now that is all I can think of off the top of my head.I hope it helps.


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## jimknudson (Dec 24, 2015)

Oh yeah,if you scorch a white shirt then just take a paper towel,dab a little bleach on it then dab the scorch and then blot with a wet paper towel.Works amazing.


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

jimknudson said:


> A little money saver here.Screen opener is just non-chlorinated brake cleaner.You can buy it at Advance Auto Parts for $3.50 a can.I buy it when they have the buy 1 get 1 free sale.Also the brake cleaner works great for removing wet ink from t-shirts.Also for shop towels/rags I use Viva paper towels,which also works great as a test pelon.This is what I have been doing for years and I have never had a problem.If you can buy them in bulk from Sams club or something that would be the best.Emulsion remover,bleach works but it takes 15-20 minutes for the emulsion to come off.Maybe in a dip tank,not sure.Also if you use pallet tape that costs $60-80 per roll,you might want to try clear shelf paper from the dollar store.You don't get a lot for the $1 but I don't have to change tape very often.Also instead of using spray adhesive to hold down shirts,I use the water based adhesive from ryonet.I mix mine with water and spray it on.Last a long time and I can "recharge" it by spraying a little water on it.Works great.A pint of that has lasted me for months.Also about emulsion remover buy it in powder form.I buy it from performance screen supply and it is $125 but it makes 22 gallons or so.And to clean screens just buy mineral spirits,I buy it for less than $10 a gallon and it works great.I know that there are more things but since I am not in the shop right now that is all I can think of off the top of my head.I hope it helps.


Bake cleaner and screen cleaner are not the same. https://p5.zdusercontent.com/attach...4GNQv2dcfQmEtj54YNBpWA.xfJGRE6JsK56DEstsZ8Mpw
[media]http://www.crcindustries.com/faxdocs/msds/5089.pdf[/media]

Attached is the SDS or MSDS for each look at section 3. 


I bought paper towels a year ago and still have over a case. I buy either test tube from one stop or silver creek sales. These work best for test prints and they work 1000x better then paper towels for cleaning. I scrape all the ink out the push left over ink on to tape and pull tape. A quick wipe there is almost no ink in screen. CCI has some great eco ink degraders that rinse with water. Also Saati has the ir18 and it works so well no dehazer is needed. 

Yes simple green works and I used it for years. There is one thing those degreasers are missing if doing high quality halftone images. Wetting agent. Otherwise it works great for spot images and low LPI 45 and under. Once I discovered the wetting agents which only a few degreasers have it, I found how much better screens turn out. 

There are places you can cut corners. 1 buy quality chemicals. Ryonet and Bob at performance screen aren't the best place. Saati sells ER 2 about a $100 qt. can't remember how many gallons it makes but I mixed a gallon last February. Cycled about 600-800 screens this year and still haven't finished the mixed gallon. Bought a gallon of screen prep, and haven't used the entire gallon. Be careful what you use to clean screens. Depending on your emulsion some chemicals can lock your emulsion. 

There are suppliers that sell at a much better price then the standard internet presence and quality chemicals work so much better that you use very little.


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## jimknudson (Dec 24, 2015)

The msds that you provided is not for non-chlorinated brake cleaner.It needs to be non-chlorinated brake cleaner.Non Chlorinated Brake Cleaner is almost identical as the Plastisolve Plastisol Ink Remover that Ryonet sells.IT MUST BE NON-CHLORINATED!!!!!And it works great at opening the screens.It is basically acetone in a spray can.The stuff Ryonet sells is $8.49 a can.I buy 2 cans of non-chlorinated brake cleaner for $3.49.Or you can just buy a gallon of acetone as that would be the cheapest way to go.But I have been using the non-chlorinated brake cleaner for about 8 years and it works great and is cheap.Plus the ER2 is a good product but it costs WAY more than than the emulsion reclaimer from Performance.


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## jimknudson (Dec 24, 2015)

Degreasers can be purchased with or without wetting agents. A degreaser with a wetting agent will leave a smooth, even, sheet of water on the mesh when rinsed. This type of degreaser with wetting agent is recommended for use with capillary films although many stencil technicians in the industry claim that they also improve the coating ability for direct liquid emulsions. Degreasers without wetting agents are designed for use with direct liquid emulsions.

I do not use a degreaser with a wetting agent as I have been told the previoust statement years ago.About 85% of my work involves halftones and have never had a problem with any of the degreasers I have used over the years.I have also noticed that a degreaser without a wetting agent lets the emulsion stick better to the mesh and therefore doesn't washout when doing a halftone image.But I have used degreasers with wetting agent before and it worked just fine for me too.But I do have a preference and mine is using no wetting agent.


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## PatWibble (Mar 7, 2014)

Methylated Spirits/Denatured Alcohol is a good cheap screen degreaser. The main advantage is it doesn't need rinsing out afterward - it evaporates away. I don't totally replace 'proper' degreaser - I use Methylated Spirits 4 times out of 5, and give the screen a proper scrub on the fifth use.


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## Ripcord (Sep 2, 2006)

For ink rags, use cut up pieces of old T-shirts (the sleeves work great.) For cleaning ink from screens, I'd say there's no better or environmentally safer way than with a biodegradable solvent and a washrag. You can rinse the washrag out and use it again and again for years. For stubborn ink or if the stencil is to be reused, try a piece of foam rubber instead of a rag. I wouldn't cut corners with screen wash.


For pallet tape, I use a piece of sign vinyl. It's strong and waterproof so you can scrub the fuzz off your pallet and keep it relatively clean for a long time. Scrubbing the fuzz will also refresh the stickiness of the water based adhesive mentioned above. Use Mean Green to scrub the pallets.


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

jimknudson said:


> The msds that you provided is not for non-chlorinated brake cleaner.It needs to be non-chlorinated brake cleaner.Non Chlorinated Brake Cleaner is almost identical as the Plastisolve Plastisol Ink Remover that Ryonet sells.IT MUST BE NON-CHLORINATED!!!!!And it works great at opening the screens.It is basically acetone in a spray can.The stuff Ryonet sells is $8.49 a can.I buy 2 cans of non-chlorinated brake cleaner for $3.49.Or you can just buy a gallon of acetone as that would be the cheapest way to go.But I have been using the non-chlorinated brake cleaner for about 8 years and it works great and is cheap.Plus the ER2 is a good product but it costs WAY more than than the emulsion reclaimer from Performance.


They stil, aren't the same. Only thing in common is the acetone and carbon dioxide. Plus your comparing ink remover not screen opener as in your first statement. I don't use either and don't buy from Bob or Ryonet. Their prices are outrageous compared to real suppliers. 

As for the reclaim crystals. You don't mention the $25 hazardous material UPS charge which is added. Then look up what what your using. Prolong use of that stuff is horrible to your health. So even if it's cheaper what's it really costing you. I happen to have to watch whats used and disposed of. Some localities you can even legally dispose of that stuff down the drain.


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## jimknudson (Dec 24, 2015)

Try using one can of each and you will see that they are the same.I use brake cleaner as a screen opener,and general ink cleaner and it works great.I personally bought from Ryonet once,and it was a few different aerosols when I was on the road.I had a mobile screen printing truck.Good products but you are right,high prices.Mostly I use franmar products.But the whole purpose of this thread is to find alternatives to expensive chemicals.


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

jimknudson said:


> Try using one can of each and you will see that they are the same.I use brake cleaner as a screen opener,and general ink cleaner and it works great.I personally bought from Ryonet once,and it was a few different aerosols when I was on the road.I had a mobile screen printing truck.Good products but you are right,high prices.Mostly I use franmar products.But the whole purpose of this thread is to find alternatives to expensive chemicals.


I don't mind alternatives except when they are irresponsible. Brake clean contains toluene. Toluene is widely used as an industrial feedstock and as a solvent. Like other solvents, toluene is sometimes also used as an inhalant drug for its intoxicating properties; however, inhaling toluene has potential to cause severe neurological harm. 

Brake clean only contains 50% acetone. 30% toluene. Screen cleaners contain about 75% acetone 0% toluene its replaced with the acetone and isopropyl alcohol. Carbon dioxide is in both and is the propellant. 

I buy 90% isopropyl alcohol. It works great as a color change. It can be used as a screen opener but requires a little scrubbing if just poured on. I buy fillable spray cans at Menards. Put the alcohol in that and use compressed air to charge the can. Works well not a instant but much safer on you skin, lungs and general health.


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## jimknudson (Dec 24, 2015)

Just about everything there is contains harmful chemicals.Every chemical we use has to be handled safely.I bet that the chemicals you use in your shop are dangerous too.Everything is.People inhale gasoline to get a buzz,but that doesn't mean that we can't put gasoline in out cars.The original poster of this thread wanted to know cheaper alternatives to buying some chemicals.So that's what I did.And the products I use work great.


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

jimknudson said:


> Just about everything there is contains harmful chemicals.Every chemical we use has to be handled safely.I bet that the chemicals you use in your shop are dangerous too.Everything is.People inhale gasoline to get a buzz,but that doesn't mean that we can't put gasoline in out cars.The original poster of this thread wanted to know cheaper alternatives to buying some chemicals.So that's what I did.And the products I use work great.


Just cause something works doesn't mean it's great. You kept trying to push the point that it was the same and and it's not. A big difference is that brake clean it contain other solvents that are even more dangerous then the origonal product. I have alternatives for the same use that aren't even close in health risk. Never said that I don't use dangerous chemicals but I'm not adding a new one to save a few bucks either. If you look at the MSDS sheet YOU posted they are black and white in terms of handling, and health risk. If you can't understand that maybe time for a trip to the neurologist from long term toluene exposure. 

Any professional mechanic doesn't even use brake clean for the most part. They use a water/soap solution. Only using as a final rinse if needed due to any contamination on re assembly.


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## jimknudson (Dec 24, 2015)

It works the same.And I don't breathe it in.Seriously I don't even smell it because it is nowhere near my face.And to say that "Any professional mechanic doesn't even use brake clean" is not even close to accurate.They go through brake clean like crazy.My dad owner 2 car dealerships and my uncle owns 2 and is co-owner of another,plus I have worked in 2 mechanics shops and ALL of the mechanics I have seen use it like it's going out of style.And once again the whole point of this thread is someone asked for cheaper alternatives to costly products,which is what I did.Just because you don't want to try a product,that's fine.You don't have to.But I responded with a great money saving tip to someone who asked.You keep talking about what products are the best as far as health,not what is good and cheaper for someone to use,which is the point of this thread.


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

jimknudson said:


> It works the same.And I don't breathe it in.Seriously I don't even smell it because it is nowhere near my face.And to say that "Any professional mechanic doesn't even use brake clean" is not even close to accurate.They go through brake clean like crazy.My dad owner 2 car dealerships and my uncle owns 2 and is co-owner of another,plus I have worked in 2 mechanics shops and ALL of the mechanics I have seen use it like it's going out of style.And once again the whole point of this thread is someone asked for cheaper alternatives to costly products,which is what I did.Just because you don't want to try a product,that's fine.You don't have to.But I responded with a great money saving tip to someone who asked.You keep talking about what products are the best as far as health,not what is good and cheaper for someone to use,which is the point of this thread.


It is irresponsible to suggest a product that is even more dangerous. First I said professional mechanics. Secondly I said for the most part so your quote isnt even accurate. In the shops I worked in the early 90's they would allow heavy use of the stuff. Got my associates degree in auto mechanics 1988 and ASE certified in 1989. There are many industries that act irresponsible, doesn't make it right just cause you can do it. If you can't smell the brake clean you seriously have damaged your respiratory system. That stuff evaporates in the air and is circulated so you are breathing it unless you have a exhaust hood, or using outside. 

Yes the point is to suggest alternatives but suggesting stuff that is more dangerous, plus your claim was that it was the same as screen cleaner is wrong. Newbies come here looking for advice and they see crap like this and go buy the crap. I personally won't use screen opener in my shop and many other dangerous chemicals. 

Franmar has some good chemicals some safer then the main stream screen chemicals but their dehazer is not safer then most others as it contains the same hazardous chemicals as the others. Once I learned that I threw the crap out the door.

You suggestions of using brake clean, emulsion remover crystals all containing more dangerous chemicals just to save a few bucks is reckless.


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## jimknudson (Dec 24, 2015)

So a mechanic that works at a dealership is not a professional?

I have no problems with my respiratory system.I don't spray it in the air.I give a super quick shot into a rag and then use it.I don't use it anywhere near my face.I don't douse a rag with it soaking it till it is dripping or anything.


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

jimknudson said:


> So a mechanic that works at a dealership is not a professional?
> 
> I have no problems with my respiratory system.I don't spray it in the air.I give a super quick shot into a rag and then use it.I don't use it anywhere near my face.I don't douse a rag with it soaking it till it is dripping or anything.


It contains acetone. This dries 100% residue free. How does it do that hmmn called evaporation. The toluene when combined with the acetone also evaporates. You can wipe it all you want and it will still become airborne do I need to give you the definition of evaporation. See you don't even know what your talking about. I only take the stand because this is completely reckless and since people come here to learn they need to know the truth

I will only comment just cause one works at a place doesn't make them a professional. Acting responsible within their industry plus proper training and education does.


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## jimknudson (Dec 24, 2015)

Ok,so there is no professional mechanic in the world who uses brake clean?You are a delusional person if you truly believe that.So if 2 mechanics both with great technical skills and educational background & training work in the same shop and one uses brake cleaner and the other uses soap and water to clean brakes and other dirty/greasy parts,then the only one that is a professional is the one who uses soap and water?If that is the case then I don't believe you are a screen printer,I think you draw little pictures with crayons onto a t-shirt.

Also,for the record I do know what evaporation means and I don't need you to explain that to me.I never said that it doesn't evaporate.If I spray this into a rag and keep it at arms distance you cannot smell it.Even though it is in the air,the vapors don't get into my nostrils.Also I never said that it is better than other products,just cheaper.I really think that you need to read what the original post says when he asked "Are there any alternatives to the higher priced press washes to remove plastisol from screens, emulsion removers, ink removers".He never asked "what is the most environmentally friendly products that cause no health problems and/or is safe to use"?He asked for ways in which to save money and I gave him some tips to do so.You don't seem to understand anything that I am saying.


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

You keep saying things I never said but yet twist words to try and make a point. 

I stand by my statement that suggesting chemicals that are even more dangerous then the original to a person is reckless. Especially in this industry there are many untrained people that just buy a few things from these internet sites and start printing.

Yes I do believe that acting in a responseable maner along with proper training makes one a professional. Simply having training and not using it properly does not.


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## jimknudson (Dec 24, 2015)

So what am I saying that you never said?


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## WalkingZombie (Mar 15, 2014)

Hey Jim, I love your input as they are alternative suggestions for the OP's initial question.

Just reply with a, "Yea, ok." and just let it be. You've said your peace and no need to defend it. This has gotten way off-topic and has focused on moral use rather than alternative use. You have given alternatives and I myself will surely try anything, even though I always do my due diligence in researching before using anything. Thanks for your input bro!


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## jimknudson (Dec 24, 2015)

I agree with you,but unfortunately I am not built that way.I answered the post.And he chimed in because it wasn't the safest product in the world.I agree.But I just answered someones question.That's all.


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

jimknudson said:


> A little money saver here.Screen opener is just non-chlorinated brake cleaner.


This statement alone is the only reason I brought up the whole thing. Its not screen opener, Its brake clean and contains a substance that with continued use can cause neurological damage that the screen cleaner doesn't. Had he stated I use brake clean in place of screen opener I probably wouldn't have even bothered but the claim was screen opener is just non-chlorinated brake clean A lot of people will read that statement and will just use without any investigation.

I don't use either in my shop. 90% alcohol(medical grade) works very well without the exposure to the harsh chemicals.

Its not a moral issue. if it where I wouldn't even be printing. This industry creates a lot waste. Uses many harsh chemicals. You see a lot of ads of people selling their stuff due to "health reasons" 

I think its great there are alternatives. I used simple green for 7-8 years. Still due but then use 1-2 squirts of a degreaser that has a wetting agent


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## Pegasus30 (Nov 18, 2010)

sben763 said:


> This statement alone is the only reason I brought up the whole thing. Its not screen opener, Its brake clean and contains a substance that with continued use can cause neurological damage that the screen cleaner doesn't. Had he stated I use brake clean in place of screen opener I probably wouldn't have even bothered but the claim was screen opener is just non-chlorinated brake clean A lot of people will read that statement and will just use without any investigation.
> 
> I don't use either in my shop. 90% alcohol(medical grade) works very well without the exposure to the harsh chemicals.
> 
> ...


sben763 is right to chime in about being responsible. I have been in the screen printing business for some time. I too could not smell the chemicals that some knucklehead said was a cheaper alternative. Now I suffer with peripheral neuropathy which normally is caused by diabetes but mine is chemical exposure. The pain in me feet and legs will never go away. So beware of the things you cannot see or smell.


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## bpfohler (Jun 7, 2009)

We’ve never seen the need for screen opener. White t-shirts are cheap and plentiful as rags. Cheap tape that sticks to your screens and leaves a residue is a PITA, split tape is not that expensive if you figure how long a roll last.
We use a dip tank which saves on emulsion remover, we get hundreds of screens before it needs a refresher. 
Most of or other chemicals are envir safe and biodegradable, they are a little more expensive but not as expensive as lung disease or cancer.


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## into the T (Aug 22, 2015)

bpfohler said:


> Most of or other chemicals are envir safe and biodegradable, they are a little more expensive but not as expensive as lung disease or cancer.


that is a great reminder/starting point in any process


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## printsfordays (Oct 6, 2017)

Sben, I find it intriguing and inspiring that you try to avoid using dangerous screen openers and other chemicals.

Inherently, our industry is a minefield of corrosive chemicals that can lead to nuero toxicity. I use many myself which I look at in disdain every time i pull them out. Damn schooling, teaching me how dangerous all this stuff is. lol 

Anyway I would like to progress our shop towards something that is safer for me and the environment.


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## tern101 (Feb 21, 2008)

sben763 said:


> Bake cleaner and screen cleaner are not the same. https://p5.zdusercontent.com/attach...4GNQv2dcfQmEtj54YNBpWA.xfJGRE6JsK56DEstsZ8Mpw
> [media]http://www.crcindustries.com/faxdocs/msds/5089.pdf[/media]
> 
> Attached is the SDS or MSDS for each look at section 3.
> ...


Subject: How should we clean ink off of 4 color process screens that we warehouse instead of reclaiming? We use Saati PW4 to clean the Wilflex Epic process plastisol ink on 355 mesh for our 4 color process screen printing of our stock designs. The smell of it bothers or irritates the noses of coworkers, and it bothers other workers too. We clean the Wilflex EPIC process ink off the screen with mineral spirits, then dry the screen, then use the PW4, then use the mineral spirits again. We are warehousing the screens, as we reprint the designs in our line of shirts. A few years ago, we tried some other products, but they smelled worse. We are using Chromaline UDC-2 emulsion and a M&R/Nuarc 6K lamp. Are there better substitutes? Should we build a fume hood? Also, some of the comments by Bill Hood suggested that we should not use mineral spirits. We use them by a Safety-Kleen parts washer next to an exhaust fan.


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

tern101 said:


> Subject: How should we clean ink off of 4 color process screens that we warehouse instead of reclaiming? We use Saati PW4 to clean the Wilflex Epic process plastisol ink on 355 mesh for our 4 color process screen printing of our stock designs. The smell of it bothers or irritates the noses of coworkers, and it bothers other workers too. We clean the Wilflex EPIC process ink off the screen with mineral spirits, then dry the screen, then use the PW4, then use the mineral spirits again. We are warehousing the screens, as we reprint the designs in our line of shirts. A few years ago, we tried some other products, but they smelled worse. We are using Chromaline UDC-2 emulsion and a M&R/Nuarc 6K lamp. Are there better substitutes? Should we build a fume hood? Also, some of the comments by Bill Hood suggested that we should not use mineral spirits. We use them by a Safety-Kleen parts washer next to an exhaust fan.


Mineral spirts is not good long term use. 


For cataloging screens use Franmar beanedoo, CCI citrus or other eco ink degrader. these work with water so you just clean excessive ink, spray degrader, scrub lightly with a little water and rinse. Let dry and store screens.


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## tern101 (Feb 21, 2008)

sben763 said:


> Mineral spirts is not good long term use.
> 
> 
> For cataloging screens use Franmar beanedoo, CCI citrus or other eco ink degrader. these work with water so you just clean excessive ink, spray degrader, scrub lightly with a little water and rinse. Let dry and store screens.


Thank you very much. We will try the eco ink degraders. Do you still have a link to a washout booth filter and layout on how to build? Or any updates on which types of filters to buy? Ryonet and Rhinotech have ones with paper.


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

tern101 said:


> Thank you very much. We will try the eco ink degraders. Do you still have a link to a washout booth filter and layout on how to build? Or any updates on which types of filters to buy? Ryonet and Rhinotech have ones with paper.


I built my own. There use to be pics and schematics on forum. The commercial units just wouldn’t remove enough for me. I had one of the better ones I think blackline and it was ok but I needed as much filtration as possible. Looking into maybe making it a recirculating system.


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## printsfordays (Oct 6, 2017)

I have also been wondering for a while about any alternatives to using a parts washer with a solvent, (mineral spirits?), for cleaning ink out of screens and then storing them for later use without reclaiming. 



Problem is, I use ulano capillary film and ulano #10 blockout. The blockout is water soluble so I need to remove the ink with something that is not water based. 



Anything out there that would work and is more health friendly than traditional solvents?


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## Klamper (Dec 1, 2019)

sben763 said:


> It is irresponsible to suggest a product that is even more dangerous. First I said professional mechanics. Secondly I said for the most part so your quote isnt even accurate. In the shops I worked in the early 90's they would allow heavy use of the stuff. Got my associates degree in auto mechanics 1988 and ASE certified in 1989. There are many industries that act irresponsible, doesn't make it right just cause you can do it. If you can't smell the brake clean you seriously have damaged your respiratory system. That stuff evaporates in the air and is circulated so you are breathing it unless you have a exhaust hood, or using outside.
> 
> Yes the point is to suggest alternatives but suggesting stuff that is more dangerous, plus your claim was that it was the same as screen cleaner is wrong. Newbies come here looking for advice and they see crap like this and go buy the crap. I personally won't use screen opener in my shop and many other dangerous chemicals.
> 
> ...


I happen to have an auto repair business, as well as a screen printing business. Non chlorinated brake works great. However in the auto shop it does not work as well as chlorinated, and I buy it by the 5 gallon drum. its the most used chemical in the shop.


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