# Mug press or wraps?



## Cutting_Edge (Jun 30, 2006)

Good Morning.....

Which gives better and more predictable results.....a mug press or wraps?

I have been using the wraps and seem to not have the process down pat......I have ghosting, scorching...etc.......

Your info would be greatly appreciated.

Margaret
Cutting Edge


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## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

The ghosting occurs when you are not careful in removing the wrap.. since the substrate is sensitive to heat, and the wrap is still hot and the paper on the mug shifts a bit...even momentarily, you can get ghosting...and you can also get ghosting with a press... pressing with a press is about 3-4 min..so can be faster.

best price I know of is a mug press from Photomug.com.. will be under $500


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## Buechee (Dec 22, 2005)

How do you press mugs? I've seen the press, but I want to know do you use the same paper and ink as in a t-shirt. Can I print my own transfers using my c88+ and dura bright ink and press a mug?


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## recrisp (Oct 25, 2007)

Buechee said:


> How do you press mugs? I've seen the press, but I want to know do you use the same paper and ink as in a t-shirt. Can I print my own transfers using my c88+ and dura bright ink and press a mug?


I don't even pretend to know as much as the other guys here, but I have done a lot of reading on it lately, but it still doesn't make me right, plus, I haven't even made one yet... heheh

I talked to Kevin (Support) at Johnson's Plastics about the presses and the wraps, he said that the wraps were better than the presses due to the fact that they are more controlled.
The entire mug and wrap goes into your home oven, heating the whole mug evenly, versus the mug press only heats the middle parts, and the closer it gets to the edges it cools down some, making mistakes more possible.
(Keep in mind though, I'm kind'a paraphrasing here)
That can be why mug presses have ghosting problems, but it can also be by other reasons, it's a lot of stuff to understand all at once. 

I also talked to the owner of TOG (Texas Original Graphics) and he told me the same thing, he's been in this business since the 60's, and been doing mugs since the 80's. (I think I got all of that right) 
According to them, there are a few little tricks that make it to where thr wraps work a lot better, with almost zero problems...
I know, I read stuff here and all of the problems, but this guy says it, and I'll believe him, I'm going to go and talk to him again tomorrow if I can.
I'll let y'all know what happens if I am successful with their knowledge, and I am hoping to have all of my stuff here by Saturday, if not, maybe Monday, then I'll do some tests.
It's not like I'd be testing 'em, it's really their expertise, I'll be mimicking them, that's all.
Supposedly, I'll be able to make it work every time, and the only time a person would need a mug press is when you have a customer waiting on you.

That's what I have been told, and as soon as I find out if this does work, I'll take notes and go step-by-step (that is if anyone's interested) and try and break it down so people won't have to go through a LOT of mugs before they get a good one.
I was also told that the ICC profile is a really easy thing to do if you know Photoshop, and that kind'a program, and I do, so we'll see.
I was led to kind'a believe that there is something really, really hard about profiles, I've set my own up many times with normal print paper, but I have heard many horror stories about the sublimation profiles, and again, we'll see... 

Please don't think I think I am a know-it-all, I'm a newbie at all of this, I am just going to try what I was told, that's all, and I'll report it, I'm just trying to help, that's all. 

Oh yeah, you can't use the DuraBrite inks in the Epson printer to do the mugs, look on the TOG site for "sublimation" inks and see the set-ups they have there.
It's not cheap at all, $52.00 (per color) is the cheapest I've seen, and some goes for way more than that for cartidges, in other words, it takes a special ink to do the mug sublimation.

Randy


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## Cutting_Edge (Jun 30, 2006)

Dear Randy......

Thank you for searching out more info......YES, please let me know what happens down at TOG......I have their inks and have been very satisfied with the colors on "flat" goods.......

I have the mug wraps and just can't seem to get consistant results on my mugs...some look good, others......well, let's say I wouldn't tell anyone I made them.......

Let me know what info you can get from TOG.....I will be all ears.

Margaret
Cutting Edge
[email protected]


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## recrisp (Oct 25, 2007)

Cutting_Edge said:


> Dear Randy......
> 
> Thank you for searching out more info......YES, please let me know what happens down at TOG......I have their inks and have been very satisfied with the colors on "flat" goods.......
> 
> ...


 Margaret,

if you're in a hurry, call them, Bill Welborn is the owner, and he took the time with me to explain it all, well, over the phone, but he made me feel as though I could do it.
(He's not a salesman type either, just a really nice guy that loves what he does, as a matter of fact, they are ALL very helpful there, I went there yesterday to buy my mugs n'stuff)
If he's not in, you can talk to his son Ty, and if they aren't there, (it's a small company) they'll return your call when they return.
I was REALLY impressed with them, after a week of being talked to like I didn't matter, it makes a big difference when people actually listen. heh
I was told to call them if I had ANY problems, and if I did, even to bring it in and they'd help me figure out what was wrong.

I'll still do what I said though, 'cause it may help others if it works. 

*Texas Original Graphics​ 1-800-223-4108​*
Randy


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## JMP8553 (Dec 28, 2007)

I've used both and the wraps are a pain and don't work as well as the press. The wraps are difficult to fasten and reuse while hot. I have 3 mug presses for volume and love them. Artainium ink is a must with regular sub paper. No other way. good luck.


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## Cutting_Edge (Jun 30, 2006)

Good Morning.....

Since reading and re reading Randy's posting with the information from TOG, I am getting great results with the wraps.....only problem I seem to be having is the paper sticking to the mugs.....I am going to try a little less pressure with the wraps.

Margaret
Cutting Edge


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## recrisp (Oct 25, 2007)

Cutting_Edge said:


> Good Morning.....
> 
> Since reading and re reading Randy's posting with the information from TOG, I am getting great results with the wraps.....only problem I seem to be having is the paper sticking to the mugs.....I am going to try a little less pressure with the wraps.
> 
> ...


Margaret,

I haven't had any trouble with any paper sticking to the mugs, yet anyway... 
I really don't know what that is, but, it does sound like it'd be attributed to over-tightening, maybe.
I know I ran into a slight problem yesterday with the (green) tape leaving a mark, and it was directly in-between the mug's handle, so I assume it was just a coating anomaly at the factory.
(The tape was 'not' over any image area, that will always leave a tape mark)
Not that you have that problem, but I'm just saying that with the mugs, it seems that even with a tried and true method, sometimes the mug itself may be the culprit.

I also use the pouring (warm) water method in the mug, in my way of thinking it lessens the 'smear factor' 'cause the mug stops sublimating faster, it works, again, _so far_...
That might help alleviate your sticking problem too, but I'm just guessing on that.
I'd definitely try not turning the bolt too tight _first_ so you'll know like you plan on.

I mentioned before that I was told to use a battery operated screwdriver...
I have one, but it's not really that good, so I improvised, I used a socket that I finger tighten, then I stick a screwdriver in it to tighten it about 1-1/2 turns.
(_I don't use a socket wrench_, it's too overpowering, I can't find my socket screwdriver that's actually made for it... heh)
So far, using that method, I haven't had any problems, it's not very scientific, I guess I just lucked into finding a way that works for me.
(I hope I didn't just jinx myself... heheh)

Good luck, and let us know what you find out though, I know I'll be waiting... 

Randy


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## plan b (Feb 21, 2007)

Hi, I use a mug press, I have 2 of them, and I have to tell you with 2 presses you can crank out the mugs,, I found the wraps to be a pain in my rear,, but thats just me,, if you have super large volumes maybe use wraps but I can do a case of mugs very fast with a press,, and I don't have any problems with immages.. and for 1 03 2 mugs the press is the way to go... so to each their own,, if you like wraps then use them

R.


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## oneeyedjack (Mar 7, 2007)

Margaret
I use sublimation toner so it could be different but when i had this problem i checked the temp on the convection oven with oven thermometer and it was about 30 degrees lower than what the dial said it should be so if i had mugs in for 15 mins inks were not getting fully cooked i guess you could say.This caused the paper to stick to the areas where ink had not been fully cooked ,usually towards the middle it seemed.Bought a new oven and the temp is spot on,i always keep an oven thermometer in oven when im making anything just to make sure it is staying at the right temp.Have not had one problem with paper sticking since.Not sure if the toner base instead of an ink base is different but i would make sure that the ink is fully transfered.Actually i forgot i had an order couple days ago and tried to rush it so i cut back on the time in oven and paper starting sticking about a half inch from the edge so i rewrapped it and stuck it back in for a couple mins and it peeled off like butter.Hope that helps

oneyedjack


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## conde tech (Nov 15, 2007)

I prefer the mug press. It is a very durable machine and will take forever to wear out. Over tightening the wraps too often can quickly destroy the wraps. The mug press can take a beating and keep on ticking. I strongly *discourage* using an oven in which your food is prepared. 

If your paper is sticking, lighten up on your pressure just a little. What paper are you using? If you are pressing ceramic mugs, those need to be dunked in room temp. water as soon as they come out of the press....... to stop them from cooking.


Sonya Blackwell
Conde Systems
Tech Support
800-826-6332 ext 205
[email protected]


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## Helping Udders (Feb 9, 2008)

Hi, there. I'm wanting to buy a mug press and in doing my research, ran across your post. What kind of press do you have? Would you recommend them?

Mikel Miller


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## COEDS (Oct 4, 2006)

plan b said:


> Hi, I use a mug press, I have 2 of them, and I have to tell you with 2 presses you can crank out the mugs,, I found the wraps to be a pain in my rear,, but thats just me,, if you have super large volumes maybe use wraps but I can do a case of mugs very fast with a press,, and I don't have any problems with immages.. and for 1 03 2 mugs the press is the way to go... so to each their own,, if you like wraps then use them
> 
> R.


When i did mugs on a regular basis, I would do 24 at a time and it took about 30 minutes to cook the mugs in the oven. I would gues with the toal set up and cool down process was less than a hour. I mainly used a convection oven and went to shows. This was where I could get 15-20 for a custom mug. I would have them waiting in line. I had two ovens and could do 6 in each one. The ovens were cheap 40 dollars or so. ...... JB


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## PressForProfit (Jun 11, 2008)

Cutting_Edge said:


> Good Morning.....
> 
> Which gives better and more predictable results.....a mug press or wraps?
> 
> ...


Several years ago we tried to make the transition from 5 mugs presses to mug wraps. (100 of them) ... and two regular convection ovens with doors (not a conveyor oven). 

There were some very cool things we did to speed up the clamping of the wraps like mounting electric screw guns (looks like a drill but has an adjustable clutch to not overdrive the bolt). I added a foot switch and a nut driver that was called "Gator" something or other. The nut driver was spring loaded with many pins to grab the bolt head. One screwgun was set for tighted one for loosening.

Now here's what we found. Depending where the mug was located in the oven, the mug could be under or over cooked. It also was a very hot and dangerous job to load and unload these ovens. Staff tended to burn their arms on the oven racks as they reached in an out. We ended up putting a mug press on the side to finish off the under sublimated mugs.

So what does this all mean...

Well...If we were doing limited production 24 or 36 a day. We could have limited how many mugs went in at a time. And gotten more consistant results.

However, we were doing 200-300 mugs per day. We ended up going back to new mug presses. It produced an extremely consistant mug with no hazard of reaching into hot 400-425 deg ovens.

BUT...If you have the daily volume production requirements for a conveyorized mug oven, this IS the way to go. It resolves the uneven heating problem and the hazards of reaching deep into a hot oven. Even in a small mug conveyor oven it is possible to do more than 200 in one hour or 1600-1900 mugs in an 8 hour shift. It is also possible to add an after cooler section to the unit, so the mugs come out cool to the touch

If you production requirement like ours were more modest (200-300) mugs per day, the mug presses were sufficient for our needs.

My 2 cents...


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## Supporterstuff (Oct 25, 2007)

Hi Mike,

Any idea how much a conveyor mug oven with cooler would cost? Do you need the clamps and can they just be carefully taped? I have started to think about these due to wanting to introduce Latte mugs to our range.

Thanks,

Andrew


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## Highpockets1946 (Jul 4, 2008)

Mug Press, or Wraps??
I've been told by several people in the mug business, in a BIG WAY that wraps are better than Mug Presses. If you have the volume, or the room to install a dedicated conveyor oven I'd have to agree, but for the average Joe that seldom does more than 150-200 mugs I'd lean heavily towards a Mug Press. I've bought 3 off Ebay, 2 vertical presses, and one "Full Wrap" press that takes the mug in a horizontal tube. The first two cost under $200, and after about 100 mug cycles started giving me less than ideal results. The third one was about $250 with shipping, and the only bad mugs I've had out of over 300 pressings was when the transfer paper was taped on upside down; NOT the presses fault! One word of advice for those of you that haven't been at this mug business very long. Print, and test a dozen or more mugs before you jump off the deep end and sell 100+ untested mugs to a new customer. I got stung on the first 5 cases I bought, they were not "hard coated", or certified dishwasher safe, and after 6 or 8 dishwasher cycles the coating cracked, and peeled off the mugs just like a cheap decal. What do you say to a Cop/customer when he knocks on your door at 08:00, and hands you a blank white coffee mug with a "decal" of the local departments badge, and arm patch in the mug, and asks if it was designed to peel off in the dishwasher. Rerunning an order of 200 mugs you originally made with a low profit margin, is not the best way to start a Monday morning. it took a few days of looking, and several hours on the phone, but I finally found a good, reasonably priced, source of mugs that are guaranteed to last 450+ dishwasher cycles without fading, or the coating peeling off. I've gone so far as to boil one of the new mugs in a high saline water bath to see if I could make it fail. It passed with flying colors. I dont consider myself an EXPERT by any stretch of the imagination, but printing somewhere over 400 mugs has given me pretty good insight into the in's and out's of this business. It's fun, it's profitable, the mugs almost sell themselves, and I plan on being here for the long haul.
John,
RENDER-GRAFX


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## Helping Udders (Feb 9, 2008)

Thanks for the info! I would be interested to know what brand (or from which ebay seller) you got the second press from (the one you are happy with). Too bad about the bad-mug thing. I can only imagine your horror. No one likes to disappoint a customer, but little guys like us feel even worse when it happens as it feels so personal.


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## lben (Jun 3, 2008)

I have both a mug press (cheapo Chinese version) and a cheap tabletop convection oven and wraps. I have 3 kinds of wraps, one kind screws, and the other two (more costly) snap off (like that's easy to do when they're 400 degrees!). 

In using the mug press, I tape my paper down to the mug, and then place the plain copy paper on top of that and tape it. Then I put it in the press and make sure there is no wiggle room. The mug has to be tight. Then I press it at 375 degrees for 3 minutes and they come out perfect. When I take them out of the press I peel off the paper as fast as I can in one motion. Then I set them down in lukewarm water to stop the sublimation process. I know my press must have a higher temp to it because when I press my mugs for the correct time and temp the paper starts to burn. 

I've burned my fingers already trying to get a wrap off (with oven mitts on, by the way) so I personally prefer the press. But I do use the oven for the stainless steel travel mugs. My press is too hot for them and scorches the surface every time.

I haven't had problems with ghosting since I tightened up the press. I learned that from someone on here. I'm attaching 2 photos. The ceramic mug I did in the press and the ss travel mug I did in my oven. Nor sure if you can see the images clearly enough, but there really is no difference in how they turned out except the travel mug didn't get scorced in the oven.


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## COEDS (Oct 4, 2006)

Loretta, That is really nice work.I think your doing awesome work. ..... JB


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## Helping Udders (Feb 9, 2008)

Can you please tell me what kind of mug press you refer to in this quote "The first two cost under $200, and after about 100 mug cycles started giving me less than ideal results. The third one was about $250 with shipping, and the only bad mugs I've had out of over 300 pressings was when the transfer paper was taped on upside down; NOT the presses fault! "

Also, how long do you press for? I was surprised to see that IBEN is only pressing for 3 minutes. I thought the usual time was closer to 12-14 minutes. I've been getting little black specs showing up on my work. I can't figure it out.


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## Helping Udders (Feb 9, 2008)

Hi Loretta. What kind of press is yours? I've been cooking mine for 12-14 minutes. Maybe that's what the problem is.


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## COEDS (Oct 4, 2006)

I know a lot of people are using sublimatio for mugs. i use wraps and have never used a press myself. I mainly do logo work and no photos. I'm now looking into pad printers. ...... JB


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## lben (Jun 3, 2008)

The directions that came with my mugs said to press them at 400 degrees for 6-8 minutes. A small fire started from the burning paper after 5 minutes and when I pulled the paper off the image was all blurry and the surface felt like stucco - all rough. 

Like I said earlier, I have a cheapo Chinese mug so the temp isn't accurate on the display, mine is much hotter than what the reading says it is. I bought a box of mugs to practice on while I tried to figure out how to use my press. So I started at a lower temperature (mainly trying to avoid another fire) and a shorter time and checked out the results with each change. My press prints out perfectly at 375 degrees for no more than 3 minutes. That is with mugs from Conde and paper & ink from BestBlanks. The results might be different with other mugs and/or paper & ink.


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## Helping Udders (Feb 9, 2008)

Ha, Ha. I just looked back on the notes I made when I bought my cups (from photomug.com BTW better prices and quality than conde) and it says 3 minutes at 400 degrees! Don't know now where in the heck I got 14 minutes in my head!

Thanks!


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## lben (Jun 3, 2008)

Mikel, 
My press doesn't have a name on it. It's a generic Chinese model. I got it for $100 + $49 S&H (won the auction) on eBay from "scalediscounters". They have a 4 in 1 press that I'd like to get but they want $150 S&H for it... I think they are Chinese product importers or something. Anyhow, it works, I just can't rely on the temp reading in the display and no matter how much I try to set the temperature on it, the display constantly varies sometimes 20-80 degress higher than what I have it set at. So for mine, 3 minutes is just fine and the 375 degrees is probably more like 400 degrees. 

I was told that with sublimation the substrate and the dye heat up and turn into gasses. The dye mixes with the substrate gas and the two bond. Remove heat and your dye becomes a part of the substrate. Now if you leave the heat on too long which 12-14 minutes is - unless you are wrapping your mugs and putting them in an oven in which case 20 minutes is the accepted time - the dye and the substrate return to the gas state and separate and when you remove the heat, the image goes right back onto the paper rather than sticking to the substrate. I've had that happen, too.

So I have learned in the 3 months that I've been doing this that I have to follow the directions that come with the substrates. Sometimes they are packaged with the product and sometimes this information is on their websites. I've also learned some expensively painful lessons on making sure which direction I'm holding the mugs when I'm taping on my transfers. It makes me sick to peel off the paper afterwards only to find that I either put it on upside down, or forgot to mirror the image. 

Another tip I've learned here is to put your mugs upside down in the oven to trap the heat inside the mugs. Most of my wraps come with the message not to use any oven that is used for food preparation and I'm not sure why except that maybe those gasses release into the air and get on the oven walls and then can get into food. Not sure, just a guess.


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

Hi. I bake my mugs at 400 degrees F for three and a half minutes. They come out fine every time.

I did my 'last minute raider' bit via an EBay auction for my mug press. It too is made in China, but extremely well built. Not everything that is made in China, is the junk that some people try to make out it is.


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## ino (Jan 23, 2007)

I,m sure not everything that comes out of China is junk,but since most presses do not have an established brand name, it seems that for most things its just pot luck.


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

I have no illusions about getting spares, service, or repair on any item that comes out of China. They do offer a low cost way to 'test the water' though. Moving into mugs was just an experiment for me. My mug press has paid for itself several times over now, so I am happy with the deal. If it breaks, I'll sling it away and buy another one. Same as I do with my Epson printers if they break outside of warranty.


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## lben (Jun 3, 2008)

I like my Chinese press. Even though the temp is a bit higher than what it says it is. It is easy to use, not so easy to tighten (has to be disassembled for that), but it works just fine and I didn't go bankrupt buying it.


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## Helping Udders (Feb 9, 2008)

DREAMGLASS said:


> Hi. I bake my mugs at 400 degrees F for three and a half minutes. They come out fine every time.
> 
> I did my 'last minute raider' bit via an EBay auction for my mug press. It too is made in China, but extremely well built. Not everything that is made in China, is the junk that some people try to make out it is.


Which one did you get? Or from which ebay vendor? That may be easier. I know they don't have a name, but it looks like each vendor has a different one.


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## lben (Jun 3, 2008)

I couldn't imagine testing the waters with a $1000 press! I start off as low cost as I can find and if things work out then I go bigger/better when able.


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

UK seller aaacut.


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## Helping Udders (Feb 9, 2008)

Doesn't look like they are still selling them. Do any of these look familiar?


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## lben (Jun 3, 2008)

I have the one in the upper left hand corner. It works fine, just a little hotter I think. I need a temperature gauge to check the temps on both of my presses.


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

A lot of the sellers import a container load of equipment from China (cheapest way), sell their stock, then import another container load. It's a question of grabbing items when available. Some of my other presses are direct imports.

The design looks closest to the bottom picture, although there are a lot of differences. I bought that model as it was capable of taking extra long items such as beer steins.


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## lben (Jun 3, 2008)

To find them go to ebay and look for heat transfer presses. The one that I bought is listed as item #150278039302 for a buy it now of $129.99 p + $49.99 S/H. There are also several others listed there too. Just search "mug press".


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## Helping Udders (Feb 9, 2008)

I bought a temp guage from George Knight ($89 bucks). My heat press went nuts and it was the only way I could convince them it wasn't me! 

I would let you borrow it for shipping costs plus $10. Shipping would be $4.95 each way in US. I would get a credit card number from you in case you decided to keep it ;-).


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## Helping Udders (Feb 9, 2008)

Thanks, Lorreta!


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## Helping Udders (Feb 9, 2008)

Hi, Lorreta
I got my press and tried a few mugs today. I got the one like yours. I have a couple of questions. I've set the temp to 400. It appears that the timer doesn't start ticking until it reaches that temp. Do you wait to put your mug in until the temp is at 400 - as it seems to be all over the place, clear down to 350 between cups. Would you suggest putting a dummy mug in to keep it hot and at the right temp for the mug with paper? Also, why do you cover yours with paper on top of the sublimation paper?


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## lben (Jun 3, 2008)

OK, lots of questions. I set my temp for 375 only because mine runs hot and 400 seems to either scorch paper or not print at all. I just turn it on, set the temp and wait until the dial says it's that hot. As soon as you put a cup in the temp will plummet, but it does come back up. I set the timer and don't start it until I put the mug into the press and push the lever. 

The timer doesn't start until I push the button again, not sure why. I use a sheet of plain copy paper on top of the transfer paper to prevent dye gasses from getting on my mug and putting color there which will migrate to anything else that is pressed with it. That was something I learned from the experts. I also set my timer for 180 seconds (3 minutes) and my press makes them come out perfect. When I do them for longer the image don't hold up. Also don't forget the tepid water to dip the cup into after you get the paper off. That stops the sublimation process and prevents the dye from running or getting blurry.

I also wait for the press to reheat between mugs. Also remember to throw out the plain paper after using it otherwise it has dye on it that will get onto something else. Learned that one the hard way.


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## conde tech (Nov 15, 2007)

What printer do you have?


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## Helping Udders (Feb 9, 2008)

Great answers, but I'm still a little foggy about when to start the timer. Mine starts by itself when it hits the temp it is set to. i don't think I can make it start (I have a red button that doesn't seem to do anything but stop the buzz at the end of the cycle). So, I guess I'm asking whether we count the warmup time in the 3 minutes, or does the 3 minutes only start when it reaches the set temp?


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## lben (Jun 3, 2008)

Way back on Aug. 8 Helping Udders posted some pictures of mug presses. The one I have (generic, no name on it, made in China) is in the upper left corner.


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## lben (Jun 3, 2008)

If you push the red button again it should start right away. You start counting the second you close the wrap press around the mug because that is when the heat begins to heat your mug. It will cool down right away because the mug will act as a heat sink for a few seconds until it warms up. 

Maybe you don't have the same one I have. Mine is in the upper left hand corner. Mine doesn't buzz either. Broken? Who knows it never did. My timer doesn't start by itself that I know of. My instrument panel does 4 things. I have no idea what they are except time and temp. Not sure what the other 2 are for. The instructions that came with it didn't have much to say about them either, and of course what it did say was lost in the translation from Chinese to English.


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## Helping Udders (Feb 9, 2008)

Yes, the one in the upper left hand corner.


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## lben (Jun 3, 2008)

I dunno. Try pushing the button and see what happens. I know the temp on mine is constantly fluctuating, and after it nosedives at the beginning of a press it comes back up, but then it doesn't stop at it's appointed part. Do you have a copy of the instructions? If so, could you email them to me? Maybe I'm doing something wrong. mailto:[email protected] I don't even know where my instructions are.


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## Helping Udders (Feb 9, 2008)

Ha! i don't think what I got could really be called instructions. it's a chinese guy's translation, and it was about t-shirts!! it sounds like you are doing fine without them. I really appreciate your advice. I'm going to ignore the fluctuations and try using the 3 minutes. How many mugs can I ruin anyway? ha, Ha!


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## lben (Jun 3, 2008)

Ruin mugs??? You would be amazed at how much useless junk one can create in a matter of minutes. Glad to know your instructions were as worthless as mine were. Maybe that's why I tossd mine.

I ruined 8 stainless steel travel mugs that cost me over $5 each just trying to print 2 of them for a customer. Finally gave up with the press for those and bought a small convection oven at Walmart and some wraps. The first set in the oven came out perfect... except for one small oops. It seems CorelDraw doesn't automatically mirror images. You guessed it. They printed perfectly, too bad you have to hold them in front of a mirror to read them. I could write a book on what not to do.


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## ctandt (Aug 31, 2012)

A mug press is for 3 minutes - a mug wrap in convection oven is longer - I do mine at 13 min


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## ctandt (Aug 31, 2012)

Have you had any problems with fading on full color images? I am doing stainless steel water bottles in the convection oven with a wrap - 400 degrees for 6 minutes, but my colors are splotchy at times and fade. I have tried adjusting time, temp, even pressure of wrap.... getting frustrated, as the blanks are not cheap like coffee mugs!


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## ctandt (Aug 31, 2012)

Try dunking the mug with the paper on it in water after sublimating- then the paper comes off pretty easily


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## firedancer4 (Jan 8, 2017)

JMP8553 said:


> I've used both and the wraps are a pain and don't work as well as the press. The wraps are difficult to fasten and reuse while hot. I have 3 mug presses for volume and love them. Artainium ink is a must with regular sub paper. No other way. good luck.


JMP8553, can you tell me what brand your mug presses are? I'm looking around but there are so many choices out there - inexpensive and expensive. Just looking for a good one that won't break the bank. Thank you!


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## firedancer4 (Jan 8, 2017)

plan b said:


> Hi, I use a mug press, I have 2 of them, and I have to tell you with 2 presses you can crank out the mugs,, I found the wraps to be a pain in my rear,, but thats just me,, if you have super large volumes maybe use wraps but I can do a case of mugs very fast with a press,, and I don't have any problems with immages.. and for 1 03 2 mugs the press is the way to go... so to each their own,, if you like wraps then use them
> 
> R.


Hi Roger, can you share what kind of mug presses you have? It sounds like you love them, and I'm trying to narrow my choices down to some good ones! I'm just starting out. Thank you!


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## skdave (Apr 11, 2008)

I prefer Wraps and oven concept.
We make a lot of mugs and wraps are much faster.


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## firedancer4 (Jan 8, 2017)

skdave said:


> I prefer Wraps and oven concept.
> We make a lot of mugs and wraps are much faster.


Thanks, Dave. Do you think, as I'm just starting out, that a press would be more efficient until I get my business up and going? I've heard that oven time requires around 4x's the "cook" time than presses, which makes me think I would be using a lot of electricity just to do 1 or 2 mugs at a time. I'd love your thoughts. Also - can you tell me where you got your wraps and if you're happy with them? Do your wraps allow a print to go ALL the way around - even under the handle? I'm looking for the method to be able to do this!


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## skdave (Apr 11, 2008)

Wraps are the cheapest way for you to start. A Good Mug press is $495.00
Wraps cost $15.
and you oven at your house works great. I will pm you in a second.


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## LandmarkArt (Mar 13, 2017)

plan b said:


> Hi, I use a mug press, I have 2 of them


What kind of mug press do you have? If you purchased it online, can you share the link? My mug press was under $100 and it does not give predictable results. About 1/3 of the mugs I pressed did not come out right ... the images faded at edges, and some strange specks all over the last 5 or so I pressed. I just ordered another case of AAA mugs, and I want to be sure I don't ruin anymore of them. I thought about getting a convection oven and wraps, but it sounds like that may be even more tricky to get good consistent results.

Oh, one more thing. I don't do anything to cool my mugs other than leave them sitting on the countertop at room temperature after the transfer paper is removed. Is this a mistake?


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## Viper Graphics (Mar 28, 2009)

Cooling your mugs....to dunk in water or not. I see people recommend putting in water.....and I used to myself until I read this a couple years back. I posted it before but it's been a while and I feel it's worth revisiting again if for no reason than to give a different opinion on the subject. Do whatever you feel is right.


"The Right Way To Cool
I hear many suppliers telling customers to quench the unwrapped mug immediately in water. This practice invites disaster down the road. Back in the day of softer coatings and lower transfer temperatures, I was guilty of this bad habit. The softer coatings allowed the dyes to continue sublimating (into the air) if the temperature wasn’t lowered rapidly. The solution was to dunk them in warm water to stop the process. In my defense, I would “ring” the quenched mugs with a metal object to check to see if the mug body was intact. A cracked body makes a muffled thunk rather than a nice ring.
As coatings got harder and transfer temperatures got higher, I could hear occasional pings and pops when the mugs were quenched and found a much higher percentage of thunks when ringing the mugs. I studied the mugs closer (out comes that magnifying glass again) and found that almost every quenched mug (even those that ring true) had hairline fractures in the glaze. The cracks can widen over time, and the cracks on the inside of the mug will stain over time and look like spider webs. The cracks are hardest to see on the outside of the mug because the coating bridges the cracks. If you don’t believe me, test it yourself. Quench a 400 degree mug in room temperature water. Pour some shoe dye inside the mug and use a cloth to rub the dye all around the inside of the mug, or better yet, let an inch or so of dye sit in the bottom of the mug overnight.
The right way to cool a mug is to use a fan. The fastest way to cool a mug with a fan is to angle the fan down at about a forty-five degree angle. The air will rush by the sides and displace the air inside the mug, cooling it to the touch in just a few minutes.
There you have it—the right way to transfer a mug. And when you have problems, there is a right way to troubleshoot.
Walk away from the problem for a few minutes.
Look carefully at what may have changed.
If it’s a color issue, too much or too little, look at the transfer paper to see how much ink is left and if the color of the paper itself looks normal. Oven elements do go bad, and it is possible to forget to set the oven to convection mode.
If it’s a wrinkle issue, check the mug for excessive taper and make sure you sized and taped the transfer properly.
If it’s an absence of color somewhere, check the sides of the mug with a straight edge for excessive dip and make sure the mug wrap didn’t hit one side of the handle while tightening.
If one side of the mug is darker than the other, make sure you left adequate space between the mugs for air flow.
If you quenched the mugs and your customer complains of stains or the handle falling off, I told you so."

From: The Right Way To Sublimate A Mug | A&E


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