# It is frustrating finding the right e-commerce solution



## proto (Oct 13, 2008)

Yep, here I am starting yet another "I can't find the right e-commerce solution" thread. I feel like I am missing something. But perhaps not, based on the number of new shop owners who seem to get stuck here 

Philosophically (or maybe just psychologically) I prefer the concept of a hosted solution. Consolidation of resources and all that. So I looked at bigcartel, because it's good enough for ugmonk. But Bigcartel is limited to 100 products, and we plan to have 100+ designs within the year, so they are off the list. We signed up with Shopify, because I like their templating system, and their admin tools seemed, at first, to be really good. But we are running up against a huge limitation with product variants. It seems they have chosen a path which will be a limitation for a lot of t-shirt sites: 100 product variants max. It is easy to hit this maximum if you offer mens/womens/kids sizes in a number of colors. Shopify also has a weak coupon system (cannot apparently set up a "free shipping" coupon).

So. BigCartel and Shopify are out. I am in a free trial with Volusion. They seem to have all the functionality I need, but I have yet to find an example store where I like the way the site (especially the shipping cart view) looks. Very klunky look and feel (to me). I am also trying to set up a trial with coreCommerce, but their new-account process seems to be broken (is that a bad omen?). Oh, also looking at ecwid. I like a lot of things about that solution, but I have decided I don't want to be that much of a pioneer.

In summary, I am looking for a hosted cart with a good templating system, unlimited product variants, ability to offer "free shipping" coupons. I want to be able to start out with a free template which does not look too awful but have as much flexibility as possible to design my own template later. 

Suggestions?

Thanks for reading


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## plan b (Feb 21, 2007)

Try Avast.com, oh by the way Ecwid is by the folks that built x-cart and I don't know if they have hosted solution but you might take a peek at that also


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## Rodney (Nov 3, 2004)

> ut I have yet to find an example store where I like the way the site (especially the shipping cart view) looks. Very klunky look and feel (to me)


The look and feel is something that you define. You could just hire someone to give the shopping cart the look and feel you want.



> I want to be able to start out with a* free template which does not look too awful* but have as much flexibility as possible to design my own template later.


That's going to be hard to find because only you know what's "not too awful" enough  The developers of the templates may have different taste than you.

Have you looked into Storenvy.com and Yahoo Merchant Stores?

You may need to start out small and grow as needed. 



> But Bigcartel is limited to 100 products, and we plan to have 100+ designs within the year


My suggestion would be to skip the hosted solutions and work with a shopping cart on your own server. The money you would have spent in monthly hosting fees for a hosted ecommerce solution could be paid as a one time fee to get someone to design a layout that you love and install a shopping cart that can be customized to fit your needs.


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## proto (Oct 13, 2008)

plan b said:


> Try Avast.com, oh by the way Ecwid is by the folks that built x-cart and I don't know if they have hosted solution but you might take a peek at that also


Avast?

Thanks, I will look at x-cart.


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## proto (Oct 13, 2008)

Rodney said:


> The look and feel is something that you define. You could just hire someone to give the shopping cart the look and feel you want.


Yes, to a point. But I think the foundations will always show through -- for example, every Volusion cart I have seen (speaking about the actual shopping cart view) has the same basic structure, with different styling.



Rodney said:


> That's going to be hard to find because only you know what's "not too awful" enough  The developers of the templates may have different taste than you.


Absolutely true. 



Rodney said:


> Have you looked into Storenvy.com and Yahoo Merchant Stores?


No, but I will -- thanks. 




Rodney said:


> You may need to start out small and grow as needed.


No way. I plan to make a million dollars in the first 6 months. That's only about 20,000 shirts a month. That's do-able right? 




Rodney said:


> My suggestion would be to skip the hosted solutions and work with a shopping cart on your own server. The money you would have spent in monthly hosting fees for a hosted ecommerce solution could be paid as a one time fee to get someone to design a layout that you love and install a shopping cart that can be customized to fit your needs.


You are probably right. I think it is mostly a psychological barrier for me. Installing my own cart just feels less secure to me. Like it's just me against the world. Maybe what I need is a therapist instead of a designer


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## Old Dog (Jun 13, 2010)

Have you looked at Dec-network by WilCom?


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## Old Dog (Jun 13, 2010)

OOPS- Deco-Network by WilCom


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## splathead (Dec 4, 2005)

proto said:


> We signed up with Shopify, because I like their templating system, and their admin tools seemed, at first, to be really good. But we are running up against a huge limitation with product variants. It seems they have chosen a path which will be a limitation for a lot of t-shirt sites: 100 product variants max. It is easy to hit this maximum if you offer mens/womens/kids sizes in a number of colors. Shopify also has a weak coupon system (cannot apparently set up a "free shipping" coupon).


Shopify's max variants is 50,000, not 100. And at any level of 2,500 variants and above, discount coupons can be done.


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## proto (Oct 13, 2008)

splathead said:


> Shopify's max variants is 50,000, not 100. And at any level of 2,500 variants and above, discount coupons can be done.


Shopify disagrees:
Maxium number of variants / Feedback / Suggestions / Discussion Area - Shopify Support


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## splathead (Dec 4, 2005)

proto said:


> Shopify disagrees:
> Maxium number of variants / Feedback / Suggestions / Discussion Area - Shopify Support


You are confusing variants with products.

I didn't help matters by using the term variants when I should have said SKU. 

One of your shirts, size small in black is considered 1 SKU. Same shirt, same size in white is considered another SKU. You can have up to 50,000 on those combinations with Shopify.

What the link you provided above is saying is that any 1 of your products can't have more than 100 variations. So any 1 of your shirts can't have 100 different ways to order. That might be a problem if you are selling cars, but I'm sure won't be an issue selling t-shirts.


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## proto (Oct 13, 2008)

splathead said:


> You are confusing variants with products.
> 
> I didn't help matters by using the term variants when I should have said SKU.
> 
> ...


Here's an example of how we exceeded the 100-variant maximum:

A shirt is available in men's, women's and children's sizes S,M,L,XL,XXL. Thats 3 * 5 = 15. Now add colors. we want to offer the shirt in 10 colors. 10 * 15 = 150 variants. 

I would think this is a common problem for a t-shirt seller. 

Hopefully I am missing something simple / obvious (that would be par for the course for me 

Chris


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## t square (Aug 23, 2010)

You can try another e commerce calle e cart. Great cart solution. I think anyway.
Ken


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## splathead (Dec 4, 2005)

proto said:


> Here's an example of how we exceeded the 100-variant maximum:
> 
> A shirt is available in men's, women's and children's sizes S,M,L,XL,XXL. Thats 3 * 5 = 15. Now add colors. we want to offer the shirt in 10 colors. 10 * 15 = 150 variants.
> 
> ...


This is not a common problem. But you sure are trying to make it one. 

Firstly, children's sizes don't come this way. And a child's XL is pretty much identical in size to an adult small.

Even more important, you are going to maintain an inventory of 90,000 shirts? (150 variants X 100 designs X 6 shirt inventory per size/color.) How big is your warehouse? 

Simple solution: Split up the product into 2, or 3 . One product page for men. One for women, and if you want, one for children. 

Or, probably the more sensible way since I haven't seen 1 design yet that looks good on both light and dark garments without some color adjustment; Have one product page for light garments of the design, and a different product page for dark garments of the design.

There is a fine line between not offering enough choices, and offering too many. 150 variants probably crosses that line. Overwhelm the consumer with too many choices and they are just as likely not to buy as to buy.


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## proto (Oct 13, 2008)

splathead said:


> This is not a common problem. But you sure are trying to make it one.
> 
> Firstly, children's sizes don't come this way. And a child's XL is pretty much identical in size to an adult small.
> 
> ...


I appreciate the feedback. It may be that we will discover that our business model does not makes sense  But we will decide that for the right reasons, not simply because our SC cannot do what we want.


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## vadan (Mar 9, 2010)

Magento Commerce, swear by it, the best in the market right now.


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## PPop (Jan 18, 2009)

proto said:


> Here's an example of how we exceeded the 100-variant maximum:
> 
> A shirt is available in men's, women's and children's sizes S,M,L,XL,XXL. Thats 3 * 5 = 15. Now add colors. we want to offer the shirt in 10 colors. 10 * 15 = 150 variants.
> 
> ...


1st of all, you should have the woman's, mens and kids as separate items. 

Your retail customers, your wholesale customers, and your google robots all look for them separately. 

My company for instance has a single graphic design available on Mens T-Shirts, Woman's Babydoll T's, Womans Tank Top Boy Beaters, Hats, Beanies, Stickers, Patches, Fridge Magnets etc.

They are listed separately, under the appropriate category, or section on the website.

This allows easier navigation, as a customer would be looking for a Men's Shirt wouldn't want to be faced with all of the posibilities at the point of research and sale. This simplifies and limits the number of variations needed.

Also, picking the color and size should be done with drop down menus. A basic item, like my KZ12 Kozik Smokin Bunny T-Shirt would be a single item, KZ12 where it is modified as S-M-L-XL-XXL-XXXL via the size drop down, and color Black, White Navy under the color drop down.

When we 1st started out in the 90's, we did ASR and MAGIC Trade shows, and thought we would tap into the Skate Market by offering, Tan, Brown, Slate Blue, Black, White, Gray etc. We discontinued them within a year and we stayed with Black White and Navy. Then reduced it to Black and White especially for the Woman's. Finally after having to only reprint Black as everyone really only ordered black for our product line, we now really only offer Black!!!

Look at Hot Topic's website.


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## huwJ (Feb 24, 2011)

Old Dog said:


> OOPS- Deco-Network by WilCom


Im thinking of having a go with Wilcom Deco Networks.Currently use RSK but find that the flash system take an age to load.Am I gpooing down the right road with Wilcom


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## goodtease (Nov 29, 2006)

Just curious....do you have the sales to support these variations? Just from my own experience I am pretty sure you will be eliminating alot of these variations because it doesn't make good business sense if you offer too many variations. Any successful company minimize cost by sku reduction. And from my experience with the tshirts you won't sell 100% of all your designs. It is impossible. If you have figured this out please let me know because I would love to know your secret.

Now it is great to have high goals....and I really don't know enough about your tshirt company anyways but since you came on asking about websites I just wanted to let you know that you do need to start small but have the ability to scale. So scalability is what you are looking for. Something that can grow with you. I really think that any one of the ecommerce sites are fine. If you are selling all of your 100 variants than you are going to have enough money to make your own custom system and you won't be worried about which engine will work for you. 

I use bigcommerce because it fits my needs. I have used oscommerce and customized it.....to much maintenance on that one. I used zen cart and I finally went with magento. Magento is a great system but cost a lot to maintain if you are going to be doing that kind of volume.

So my suggestion is just change your technology as you grow. Starting out small and simple will cost less and allow you to test your products out in terms of popularity and sales. Once you fine tune this you can then determine the scalibity you need. Anyways that's my two cents.....don't know if it will be worth anything 

Anthony


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## trexart (Aug 3, 2007)

I agree with what most others on here are saying. You probably aren't starting with all those varients, so I'd say get your shop up and running with the hosted solution that is as close as possible to what you need. Then, when you get to the point that you have 10 colors per shirt in men's, women's and children then you probably have enough money coming through to get a custom cart made. There will reach a point where a hosted solution probably isn't the right answer, but if you don't have the money in the very beginning to get a custom shopping cart done, then start with the closest and then expand later.

Cheers,
Steph


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