# We just incorporated...how can we sell our shares?



## T11 (Mar 19, 2011)

Hello,

My name is Patrick Williams and I am the founder of T11, Inc. I started selling shirts back in high school and by the time I graduated I had made up my mind that this was the field for me. A self taught screen printer and natural entrepreneur, I definitely found my niche.

I grew my business from friends and craigslist customers, to an office, into a inline mall shop, and finally into a warehouse. Now, we are 99% based online and have incorporated with a start of 11 million shares. Though it is just my business partner and I for now, we are just two people running the whole show. From marketing, to manufacturing, customer service, web design, graphic design, and managing the money, we do it all ourselves. 
After witnessing the results first hand, we realized that our dreams are very realistic, and thus it was time to upgrade and expand. So we bartered our services to a lawyer and he incorporated us.

Our plan is simple. We are going to leverage the shares to raise capitol in order to make strategic business moves that will benefit the over all profit of the company. From mobile and facebook applications, to online advertising, automated printing equipment, and new equipment to add services such as embroidery, and flyer printing, our minds are overwhelmed with what we can accomplish.

So that leaves us where? Well, we have 11 million shares to sell to our clients, friends and family. Most of them have ordered shirts or websites form us for much larger amounts then, lets say .11 cents a share. But how do we value the shares? And how do we go about giving them out? 

Ideally we would like to raise $11,000.00-$33,000.00 of capitol. Which would turn itself into an estimated 11 million over the next 3 years, with residual return of clients and various indirectly related projects.

I wanted to know the t-shirt forums communities thoughts. I do not see many printing companies that are public, or yet alone have shares. I also don't see anything that exists quite like what we are going to do.

Interested in your thoughts and opportunities,

Patrick Williams


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## kirbymurphy (Aug 25, 2009)

Congratulations on your growth!

Hard to sell penny stocks. Is the paperwork worth the effort? Printing, mailing, tracking.

What do you need the capital for? Equipment? Inventory? Marketing? Leasehold improvements?

There are other easier ways to raise capital than the penny stocks.
Bank loan
SBA loan
Family (maybe stock buyers)
Private equity investor
Leasing
Factoring
Credit card advance

Hold all the equity you can.


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## odil1372 (Aug 15, 2009)

You should probably get another lawyer. In order to go public you already have to be generating over a million dollars in revenue. The only sales you can make with your stock is through private sales.


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## T11 (Mar 19, 2011)

odil1372 said:


> You should probably get another lawyer. In order to go public you already have to be generating over a million dollars in revenue. The only sales you can make with your stock is through private sales.



I did not know that you had to already be generating over a million dollars in revenue, do you have an idea why they do this? I was under the impression that you had to have a million in assets, which is kind of a loop hole because a printing press is an unlimited asset. (ask the federal reserve lol)

You can create things more valuable then money, Ie. shirt for $1.67 per shirt, selling it for $16.70 after printed, yields 10 times the invested amount. 

My thought was to valuae each stock around the average cost of a shirt, purchases of stock would result in purchases of shirts, which are assets and as each shirt sold, the stock would rise based on how many shirts were selling.


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## T11 (Mar 19, 2011)

kirbymurphy said:


> Congratulations on your growth!
> 
> Hard to sell penny stocks. Is the paperwork worth the effort? Printing, mailing, tracking.
> 
> ...


Mostly need the capital to develop software for the industry as whole. More on the publishing side then anything. The income from such a thing would allow us to resolve other issues, such as equipment, inventory, and so forth. 

We would like to go public eventually and have our clients be stock holders. We see that as the best way of locking in our clients and creating a following. 

Every option you listed besides the stock, takes more time then it does to incorporate, they also involved interest. 

Does anybody know any printing companies that have stock?


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## jiarby (Feb 8, 2007)

You just have to sell an "angel investor" on the idea of your business and negotiate a percentage of the business. 

What is your business worth?? 

If you can turn $11k into 11M in 3 years then why are you in the T-shirt business??? Bernie Madoff would blush at that claim! You better check your numbers!


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## T11 (Mar 19, 2011)

jiarby said:


> You just have to sell an "angel investor" on the idea of your business and negotiate a percentage of the business.
> 
> What is your business worth??
> 
> If you can turn $11k into 11M in 3 years then why are you in the T-shirt business??? Bernie Madoff would blush at that claim! You better check your numbers!


Here are the numbers (and my plan, since i dont have 11k, maybe someone with it will take this idea and break me off a chunk)

11,000USD

1,500 to create software that automates the ordering process (similar to customink.com and spreadshirt.com)

Reselling the software for $99.00 to as many of the 27.7 million websites that offer custom tshirts (google custom shirts look at how many come up)

10,000 copies of software sold = 999,000 USD 

Charge $11.00 a month for content upgrades and upkeep

11.00USD reaccuring monthly charge X 10,000 users= 110,000USD monthly X 12 months = 1,320,000

(these are low ball numbers, could easily charge $100 a month for such services)

3 years = 36 months of 110,000 per month = 3,960,000

That puts the profit at 4,959,000USD
-----------------------------------------------------
Half way there
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with the original budget, 9500 left after software development to hire affiliates that would resell the software.
-----------------------------------------------------
After that first figure of 999,000 was acquired, 

open up a wholesale tshirt distribution company with same name as the software, when ever an order is placed, the shirts are automatically shipped to the printers. This means, +$1.00 atleast for every order
----------------------------------------------------
10,000 businesses using the software, over 1 million garments would be sold each month. 

---------------------------------------------------

thats 11k into 11 million with in 3 years. I just need the start up funding to give to my software developer. we are missing about $5,000 before we can launch.


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## kirbymurphy (Aug 25, 2009)

I think you have vastly underestimated the cost to develop such software.

Similar products are already available.

You have vastly overestimated the market, both existing and what share you could hope to capture.

Good luck.


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## T11 (Mar 19, 2011)

kirbymurphy said:


> I think you have vastly underestimated the cost to develop such software.
> 
> Similar products are already available.
> 
> ...


Where I am from, we call people like you haters. But to entertain your haterisms. 

I have already received a quote from a college graduate who is capable of developing such software at that cost, granted he received a royalty. 

And the market is actually under estimated, as a lot of people who do custom tshirts aren't even on google. Many, stressed over emails and struggling to automate. Software being resold at the price of $99.00, would beat what ever is on the market, creating a new demand. Appealing to existing people in the industry and entrepenears.

Sort of like, how ryonet.com created a new demand for people to become part of the printing industry. Infact, I would go to them and walmart to distribute the software. 

What software already exists that is under $2,000? I mine as well just get it right now.


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## kirbymurphy (Aug 25, 2009)

T11 said:


> Where I am from, we call people like you haters. But to entertain your haterisms. .


Where I am from we call people like you ostriches. If you don't want to hear advice, don't ask for it. Don't have a hissy fit because someone thinks your plan is not ready for execution.

I have a decent understanding of software development costs and yours is WAY off target.

_"Reselling the software for $99.00 to as many of the 27.7 million websites that offer custom tshirts (google custom shirts look at how many come up)_

_10,000 copies of software sold = 999,000 USD "_

If you think there are 27.7 million websites that offer custom tshirts, you should really learn to use Google. Your inference from the search results is laughable.

I wish you the best of luck, but don't be such a whiner. At this point I have to question your claims of growth and chalk it up to the crack pipe.


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## thutch15 (Sep 8, 2008)

Don't forget the full time lawyer you will be paying for.


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## Sport T (Nov 10, 2010)

I always find it odd when someone comes here and asks for opinions and if they don't like the opinions get upset. I tend to agree with Kirby's analysis.


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## odil1372 (Aug 15, 2009)

In theory your plan sounds like a great idea, but I also wonder about your target numbers.

As far as stocks, you need to do a little research on stocks. My company is an S-corporation and my husband and I are the sole owners of the stock in our company. Issuing stock during incorporation and issuing stock on the market with an IPO are two completely different things. Investment bankers and stock markets limit who can trade publicly to maintain the integrity of not only the stock markets but also to protect investors and dilution of available stocks. 

You really need to take at the minimum a business finance class to understand how the markets work and the ins and outs of working capital.


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## 1nightonlyprint (Jan 3, 2011)

I whole heartedly agree that some education is needed. You should be able to find some classes on Kahn Academy under the 'humanities and others' category. Also, your numbers are very elementary in the fact that you do not account for any liabilities related to the product you want to offer. Stay grounded, but keep pushing and you'll get there.


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## texasjack49 (Aug 4, 2008)

I think this post would make more sense if it was posted on April 1st. I don't think he is serious.


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## TripleSevensCC (Jun 15, 2011)

T11 I admire your passion and vision and creating a product that will bring you wealth but I do think you need to listen to what people are saying here as well. You sound like you been reading some of the Rich Dad series books and have been dreaming of a home run. You can hit the home run but you need to do more studying and research. First off you thought that you could do a simple IPO and offer your stocks for sale to the public. If you used a lawyer to Inc why did you not know that was not possible... I'm not saying you didn't use a lawyer but you didn't ask the right questions. Listen I use to sell business and real estate courses and have done thousands of dollars worth of them and dreaming big is a great thing. But you also need to be grounded a willing to learn from others. I don't know enough to know if your idea will work or not but your numbers don't add up. 
1. If you spend $1500 to create the software but you are going to only spend $9500 to generate 10,000 sales? That is less then $1 to convert a sale and that doesn't make marketing sence. 
2. Did you create a business plan for this idea? If not no one can take you serious because you are planning to fail. ( if you did do a business plan take it to a bank to see about getting a business loan or see about a government grant) if you are afraid your business plan is not good enough it's a good sign your plan is flawed.

In closing T11 you sound very young and you may need to mature a little before hitting that home run. And don't give up you can make 11 million from your business it just takes hard work, a lot of research, and a power team of people way smarter then any of us one here.
Good Luck!


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## garylyb (Oct 18, 2009)

I've been in the software business for many years, 1500 won't get you started. 9500 won't come close to what you need to market it.

Also, these folks: http://www.deconetwork.com/

who are preferred vendors already do just what you've described, why would I by from an unknown company when they have a working product, a track record and references.

I guarantee, they've spent a lot more than that just on their web site.

Gary



TripleSevensCC said:


> T11 I admire your passion and vision and creating a product that will bring you wealth but I do think you need to listen to what people are saying here as well. You sound like you been reading some of the Rich Dad series books and have been dreaming of a home run. You can hit the home run but you need to do more studying and research. First off you thought that you could do a simple IPO and offer your stocks for sale to the public. If you used a lawyer to Inc why did you not know that was not possible... I'm not saying you didn't use a lawyer but you didn't ask the right questions. Listen I use to sell business and real estate courses and have done thousands of dollars worth of them and dreaming big is a great thing. But you also need to be grounded a willing to learn from others. I don't know enough to know if your idea will work or not but your numbers don't add up.
> 1. If you spend $1500 to create the software but you are going to only spend $9500 to generate 10,000 sales? That is less then $1 to convert a sale and that doesn't make marketing sence.
> 2. Did you create a business plan for this idea? If not no one can take you serious because you are planning to fail. ( if you did do a business plan take it to a bank to see about getting a business loan or see about a government grant) if you are afraid your business plan is not good enough it's a good sign your plan is flawed.
> 
> ...


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## SickPuppy (Aug 10, 2009)

It is not an easy or cheap process but the basic steps include:

Organize corporate and financial books and records
Identify most appropriate legal and accounting resources
Complete financial audit
Identify investment banking firm
Complete registration statement
File with Securities and Exchange Commission
Clear the SEC review and comment process
Complete the public offering
File with the appropriate stock exchange


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## T11 (Mar 19, 2011)

TripleSevensCC said:


> T11 I admire your passion and vision and creating a product that will bring you wealth but I do think you need to listen to what people are saying here as well. You sound like you been reading some of the Rich Dad series books and have been dreaming of a home run. You can hit the home run but you need to do more studying and research. First off you thought that you could do a simple IPO and offer your stocks for sale to the public. If you used a lawyer to Inc why did you not know that was not possible... I'm not saying you didn't use a lawyer but you didn't ask the right questions. Listen I use to sell business and real estate courses and have done thousands of dollars worth of them and dreaming big is a great thing. But you also need to be grounded a willing to learn from others. I don't know enough to know if your idea will work or not but your numbers don't add up.
> 1. If you spend $1500 to create the software but you are going to only spend $9500 to generate 10,000 sales? That is less then $1 to convert a sale and that doesn't make marketing sence.
> 2. Did you create a business plan for this idea? If not no one can take you serious because you are planning to fail. ( if you did do a business plan take it to a bank to see about getting a business loan or see about a government grant) if you are afraid your business plan is not good enough it's a good sign your plan is flawed.
> 
> ...


These are really good points. And your right I am young. I started in the printing and apparel industry when I was 16. When I was 18 I opened my first office, and eventually a mall location that same year. I am now 21. There is plenty more to consider though, you bring up good points. It seems the best way would be to sell stock to just people whome I know, or not sell any stock at all and just look for the right investments. Or perhaps just a flurry of orders in my existing business.

I do have two different business plans, one just for printing and the second one based on having the proper software. I have found that creating a business model is more effective, over time I've learned the difference between owning a business and running a business. One is somewhat automated, the other is some what stressful. 

I guess the biggest advantage that I have is already being in operation, so it's easy to show the statistics and revenue to a target investor. Banks seem like a long shot, but I will see what they say. Do you have any links to government grants? Or any ones that you would recommend? 

As far as the software number goes, they may be a little bit high, but from my experience in this industry the numbers are reachable. For every commercial printing press sold, it is likely software would sell as well, espcially if sold together. 

Looking at the top 10 companies in the custom apparel industry, they all generate over 20 million per year and that is testimony to the advanced software they use that allows them to automate the ordering process. To be truthful 11 Million is 11 times the amount of money that I truly want to acquire. The 1 million mark would suffice 

* Marketing wise, the main strategy would be to go to the news, rather then online advertising, adwords, or that kind of stuff. The news has a way of creating a mass ripple effect.


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## Manos (Nov 23, 2008)

Patrick Williams, you dirty dog!
I can't find a single thing wrong with your plan and those numbers are sound. I'm approaching retirement age and lost my *** in that financial disaster they call the stock market. As such, my wife says she's not willing to give up getting her hair all did up every Thursday with the ladies, and so I've got to stay on the job at least another 7 years. 
That is, unless you'd be so kind as to let me invest what life savings I have left with you. I could sure use the kind of rate of return a guru like yourself is confidently able to offer. Why don't we get together and you can buy me lunch?

T11 in 2012, baby!


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## Just Teesing (Dec 12, 2011)

Listen, without a dream and passion you have nothing!, it seem as if you have both! wishing you success but offer the following advice. As mentioned above it might be easier to go for the SBA or find a few privates investors... $11,000 is easy to raise from friends and family. The legal fees involved with the real sale of stock will be quite costly it will far exceed the 11k you are seeking... Best of luck! And keep us posted!


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## idonaldson (Sep 29, 2008)

I find it so entertaining when you click into a post and discover the invention of the lightbulb. The invention is usually followed by a slew of assumptions. In life there are schools and those school offer courses. We have a structure like high school to give you entry level information, college to give you understanding and the ability to teach, masters to give you the ability to have a deeper understanding and design lessons, and the doctorate to discover and assemble the theory required to provide a sound foundation. Well without the foundation being properly set, the house built above it has a tendency to wobble and in some cases fall. Folks come here with entry level information, others try to provide the understanding and at times offer the theory. However, it is so hard to have the process work with the understanding of the communication model. I am so happy to see so many folks hear willing to help folks out, but also call folks out when needed. It is better to have nonsense knocked down here and the person return to the drawing board then to learn those lessons the hard way - called experience. Not even a trod of a mighty army can stop an idea, whose time has come. So if your idea is a good one, you have the fortitude to see it through, then do so. You will need thicker skin to go up against the challenges. So if you are rattled by some anonymous TSF members - I agree you are not ready for when you have to sit in front of your potential investors - it will be comparable to defending your dissertation. Ask and you shall receive and if what you receive is not what you like - there is a remedy - don't ask. We here wish all good luck in their pipe dreams - please don't confuse us with crabs in a barrel.


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## dwntwn49 (Jan 27, 2010)

Who are the top 10 20 million+ companies?


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## T11 (Mar 19, 2011)

To be honest, I started this thread in haste, not truly looking for the information but to see what type of response people would have if I were to present such a thing. 

Truth is, when it comes down to it. It is best to keep business very simple, and local. There is nothing wrong with local. Though the internet is an effective tool, I believe that the craft of screen printing, and creating apparel is best fit for human hands. Along with the social face-to-face aspect of creating a novelty item such as a custom t-shirt. 

The idea of having a huge corporation and making millions of dollars is indeed alluring, yet even the extremely rich will say it is not at all necessary. You can be wealthy with out being rich. Land can be found for cheap, a home can be built and surely in these states you will not go with out food. $1.00 gets you a hamburger. And for a couple hundred dollars you can enter the t-shirt business. I will work my way to a stable income, sound credit, cash and assets. Rather then trying to think of something as clever as the stock exchange to gather mass amounts of money that were not earned through honest thoughts, work and moral ideals. 

I will say that as part of the younger generation, the states are plagued with lazyness, or lack of ambition. Much rather outsource then get some ink on your hands. I see, that unemployement may be down, but this creates other opportunity. People will learn to survive with less and be happy with it. 

As for now, T11 is not doing so well. I have moved on to another project in hopes to gain a space for equipment.




Manos said:


> Patrick Williams, you dirty dog!
> I can't find a single thing wrong with your plan and those numbers are sound. I'm approaching retirement age and lost my *** in that financial disaster they call the stock market. As such, my wife says she's not willing to give up getting her hair all did up every Thursday with the ladies, and so I've got to stay on the job at least another 7 years.
> That is, unless you'd be so kind as to let me invest what life savings I have left with you. I could sure use the kind of rate of return a guru like yourself is confidently able to offer. Why don't we get together and you can buy me lunch?
> 
> T11 in 2012, baby!


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