# Melco tearing my T-shirts



## Daddyof4 (Aug 23, 2011)

We've posted the numerous issues we've had with our Melco on here. They did send a tech from 400 miles away but he was a nice guy but he didn't fix it. Nothing was solved. Now they are sending another one on Monday. And now another issue popped up in recent couple of months is perforated T shirts. We use top quality Monag shirts but lately they are perforating and the stitching looks awful. We've already contacted Monag and they said they have changed nothing in their production at all. My wife has been in sewing for over 20 years and she can't tell any difference in the shirts. 

We've added cut away stabilizer, adjusted bobbin tensions, changed needles, changed threads, raised the foot up and down, did all the default stuff with no help. I am attaching pictures. If any of you own a Melco maybe you can help me figure out what's going on. We are backed up on orders and now can't produce a shirt until this is fixed. 

This first pic shows the tears we are finding around the stitching even with cutaway stabilizer. Melco has seen the designs and said they are digitized correctly.










Here you see how awful the satin stitching looks, not smooth at all and obviously strained.










Here is a tear around the font.










Here is a loop from the thread breaking, we set it back up and it loops when it starts.











And here is the back of the garment.


----------



## philipfirth83 (Aug 17, 2012)

Hi, Don't think it has anything to do with the machine, Think embroidered t-shirts look like this and can cause holes as well.

Some people wont embroider onto t-shirts because of this.

I found using a 65/9 ball point reduces it but doesnt stop it completely.

Sure someone will be able to explain it better soon.


----------



## richt74 (Feb 11, 2011)

Personally by the look of the photos you have attached I would say the needles are not sharp and could be blunt. I know you have said that you have changed the needles but may be catching on something under the plate making them rough. What underlay have you used also as this will make a difference. Have you tried embroidering the same design on a different garment to see if you get the same results other than t shirt material. If you want send me the file and I can run a sample off for you on t shirt material and compare them?
Rich


----------



## zoom_monster (Sep 20, 2006)

For both types of fabrics shown, I would try lowering the top stitchdensity slightly, using one or two courses of edge underlay at about 4 pt from the edge(including any pull comp). If the density seems sparse I would make it up with a zig-zag of about a quarter density of the top stitching and also using intermediate stitches in the tight corners of anything over 3mm wide.

When I see the 1st picture with the cutting on the outside of a turn, I think that the needle may be too "sharp" for the fabric. If it does not seem to get better by slowing down the machine or by making sure that the fabric is taught but not stretched, you may want to double check to make sure you're using a ball point.


----------



## fubarsport (Sep 12, 2011)

By the way which Melco Machine are you using?
Nevermind its the Bravo


----------



## Liberty (Jul 18, 2006)

Light Ballpoint Needles, not sharps

Don't stretch the fabric when hooping, remember that the purpose of a light ball needle is to allow the needle to push the fabric aside when it penetrates and a substrate that is too tight in the hoop will not allow for this.

Try a topping, a piece of solvy on top can have the same stabilizing effect as a piece of backing.

Some of the cuts on the inside of the letters may be from the needle penetrations being too close together. If your software has a setting for "Shortening" try pulling it back a little more. This brings every other stitch penetration a little further apart.

Try cutting back the density of the top stitches a little. You can still get good coverage by increasing the underlay to a tighter double zigzag. But remember the underlay margins need to be back from the edge far enough to not make the situation worse, something like .4MM or more.

But I have to be honest, that picture of the back of the embroidery shows problems in my opinion. Tensions are way off, too much bobbin showing, and since it is on multiple needles I'd say the bobbin is loose. But more importantly, the jagged edges between the top thread and bobbin thread indicate another problem. There is some sort of inconsistency. Add the occasional looping into it and the fact that the problem shows on two colors (maybe more?) and I would lean towards a problem below the needle plate. Hook timing maybe, or too much gap between the hook tip and the needle scarf. And maybe something a simple as a small nick on the needle plate or hook.

On the older EMT Melcos we would get this when we had a nick on the lever of the UTC switch. but I'm not familiar with your model so I don't know if it uses a UTC or not.

If you would like to email me the design I'd be happy to take a look at it to rule out a design problem.

And my last thought, I am not at all familiar with the brand of tee you are using but it would not be unheard of to have a problem with the tees. It looks like they are a natural color tee which would be unbleached cotton and maybe a bit more delicate? Just a thought. Have you tried running the same design on a different tee?

Troubleshooting these issues can be hard on the nerves for sure. Just eliminate one variable at a time and try it.


----------



## Daddyof4 (Aug 23, 2011)

We've actually tried all the sharps vs ballpoint scenarios with no difference. Our hooping is fine. We use Fast Frames and sticky stabilizer for two years without a problem on those up until recently. The first thing Melco jumped on (predictably) was the word "sticky" which is taboo among embroidery machine manufacturers. But just to satisfy them I took everything down for deep, deep cleaning, removed all traces of dirt and any possible stickiness (no stickiness present), ran no sticky stabilizer, and fresh needles correctly placed at 5 degrees right. Same poor result. We clean the needles very, very often.

This particular cut in the picture is near a corner (and corners are worse for obvious reasons) but the cuts are actually around every letter and all the way around the design. We've also removed density to no avail.

We also did the solvy thing a couple weeks ago over the top of letters but it had no effect, at least none that we could determine.

I do agree the back of the garment is a real issue. Where you see clusters of thread represents a spot where the thread broke and we had to re-thread and restart. Usually we cut that out and restart but sometimes we don't. I agree it looks like a bad tension issue. So the Melco guy sent me directions to use our tension gage last night. I used it on the cables and they did need adjusting as they were loose. This got us excited thinking it might solve the issue. So we adjusted the tension to the specification but it was ineffective. If anything it actually made the lettering worse. The bobbin tension is something we've adjusted over and over but it never has a big effect. We've also swapped bobbin holders. We use standard cardboard side bobbins. We also tried some without the sides and those were no better.

In all of this I keep having to go back to the fact that we've historically run the T-shirts with stick stabilizer and no other stabilizer and had wonderful results. No tearing, no drawing up, etc. This was due to the applique fabric acting as a front stabilizer itself. Now on letters we would sometimes add some tearaway but still they never tore. Customers never complained but loved the garments. These issues are something that has gotten worse over time and has magnified to a serious level since early October. Now we have added one layer of cutaway stabilizer at Melco's insistence which is fine but hasn't helped. Too many layers of cutaway makes the T-shirt stiff around the design and the kids don't want to wear them.

We also sent off our worst acting designs to the Melco engineers and they analyzed them and said they were actually very good designs with no digitizing issues that would cause problems. 

This is such a frustrating problem. Melco has scheduled a second tech to arrive Monday morning so we'll see what he says. Something tells me you guys know more than their techs.

What I now notice above all is the uneven stiching both on the front and the back of the garments.


----------



## zoom_monster (Sep 20, 2006)

The only other thing I can say is turn the speed all the way down and watch very close to see if you see anything. The only part of the machine coming in contact with the fabric is the needle. If the timing was off, you would not even get a stitch to form and this would make no difference on how the needle an fabric interface.

When you sew on cut-away do you have the same issue? Also, Can you post an OFM file. I can check it on my end. Let me know what DS version you have and the OS


----------



## Liberty (Jul 18, 2006)

I agree the timing should not affect the cutting of the fibers but it could affect the erratic tension issues exhibited in one of the photos.

You could have a problem where you changed needles to one that was longer than when the timing was set and the result could be the pantogram starting to move before the needle tip is fully retracted from the substrate. We keep only one system of needles in the shop for this reason. Hook timing also means setting the needle depth on some machines.

The suggestion to slow it down and watch is great. With this kind of damage you should be able to see it happening. 






zoom_monster said:


> The only other thing I can say is turn the speed all the way down and watch very close to see if you see anything. The only part of the machine coming in contact with the fabric is the needle. If the timing was off, you would not even get a stitch to form and this would make no difference on how the needle an fabric interface.
> 
> When you sew on cut-away do you have the same issue? Also, Can you post an OFM file. I can check it on my end. Let me know what DS version you have and the OS


----------



## Posylane (Mar 3, 2011)

It seems obvious once you do it, but make sure you have a normal work load ready when the tech is there, and run through while he is there. I have seen people bring a tech over, aren't prepared, and then the problem isn't fixed.


----------



## Daddyof4 (Aug 23, 2011)

Just to update I did have a good pile of work ready when the tech arrived for the third and last trip. This time he replaced the thread sensor (which we had already replaced once before) and worked on the cable tensions. He was getting very frustrated but eventually he figured out it was the machine and not a lack of training. 

But after all that we are back to running perfect shirts and the tech did show us a lot of helpful hints. So Melco has more than redeemed itself with me. 

Looking forward to getting a second Melco soon.


----------



## philipfirth83 (Aug 17, 2012)

What was the problem with the machine?


----------



## Daddyof4 (Aug 23, 2011)

philipfirth83 said:


> What was the problem with the machine?


Numerous issues over the year we've owned it. It was stopping in the middle of a design with the thread still in the garment, it began cutting the shirts and the embroidery stitching was uneven, and it was having thread sensor issues. We struggled and the default setting of Melco is that it was a "training issue" which it turned out to be 90% machine with a few helpful hints to keep it running good.


----------



## philipfirth83 (Aug 17, 2012)

Sorry what I meant was, When you say he figured out it was the machine what did he do to fix it? Did he say what was cutting the shirts?

Thanks


----------

