# Epson 4800 Hybrid



## Rambler (Mar 13, 2008)

We're thinking of adding a Epson 4800 Hybrid to our shop. I was told that cartridges were better than the bulk ink system. Is this correct?
Is Chromablast cost affective for small jobs? We like the idea of being able to print on cotton. Where do you recommend buying from?

Thanks for the help.


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

Rambler,

The general rule is running a closed ink system is less trouble than running a bulk / refill system. Any time you can introduce air, dust or other containments into the ink delivery system...you are bound to have more maintenance. In regards to running refillable sublimation inks in the 4800, Sawgrass does not allow this. So, this is not really an option for you any ways.

ChromaBlast is a light transfer process and will cost around $2.00 - $2.50 for an 8.5" x 11" print (that is ink and paper cost - not shirt cost). There are other hybrid configurations that allow you to use other inks other than ChromaBlast for heat transfers and SubliJet IQ for sublimation ink. For example, there is a setup that has ink that is designed for both light and dark inkjet transfer papers for cotton shirts. The cost of the ink and paper is also less expensive. For more information on other hybrid setups, you can check out MultiRIP Screen Printing, Sublimation, Transfers, Photograph and General Printing RIP Software.

Hope this helps. Feel free to ask more questions if you have them. Best wishes.

Mark


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## Rambler (Mar 13, 2008)

I appreciate the help. With Chromablast can you only print on light color cotton shirts or does it work as long as the graphic is darker than the shirt? What is the difference between the 4800 and 4880 models? 


Thanks for the assistance.


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

For any light transfer solution (including ChromaBlast), the colors in the designs need to be darker than the color of the garment in order for the colors to look correct. The best example is if you wanted to put a picture of a blonde, caucsian girl on to a pink shirt. If you use a light transfer paper, the girl will have strawberry colored hair and will have a sunburn.

The primary difference between the 4880 and the 4800 is the 4880 is a little faster and the print head has a teflon coating. The positive thing for the 4800 (older version) is that the ink chips have the ability to tell you how much ink is in the cartridge and will allow you to move the cartridge from one printer to another. The current 4880 chips give you no clue as to the ink level and once they go into one printer, you can't move the cartridge to another printer. There are several companies that are working on a solution to these problems with the 4880 chips. Both the 4800 and 4880 are the best printers to hybrid in my opinion. So either one should be fine.

Hope this helps.

Mark


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## enquirer (Feb 3, 2008)

I just bought the 4800 with multirip software and a dual setup. I can do sub dye and heat transfer. I have 4 sub dye inks in one side of the printer and 4 multink(general printing and heat transfer on the other). You need to get the multirip software to split the printer. You don't have to go with Chromoblast to have a dual setup. I've heard some negatives about chromoblast so I didn't choose that route. It's also more costly than regular heat transfer and I don't think the results are much better. I highly recommend the JPSS transfer paper for heat transfer. It's a little hard to find the 4800 vs. 4880 now. I had to really look around. I don't recommend getting the package from Paper Ranch. I've had alot of issues with them. See if you can find it from another vendor. The Multirip is awesome and easy to use and I highly recommend that and Mark has been super to work with. When I didn't get my software from Paper Ranch like I was suppose to Mark was able to send me a link to go ahead and set it up while the paper ranch people told me I had to wait until Monday. He was out of town at a show and was able to help me out so I could get going over the weekend. Meanwhile, I still have not heard back from PR a week later.

In retrospect, I sometimes wonder if I should have gone with a cheaper printer- buyer's remorse...lol. The 4800 is super large. Much bigger than it looks. I actually thought I had received the wrong thing at first. The few items that I have experimented on so far have turned out great. The only problem I have with it is that it often doesn't feed the paper right for some reason. Also this printer is way too large to take on the road. Not and issue for me but something to consider if you do that sort of thing. We saw a neat setup at a gymnastics competition last weekend. A lady was taking photos of the competitors and had the full set-up on site to take those photos and print on a T-shirt, mouse-pad, etc. She sold alot!


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

Jennifer,

Glad to here you are up and running. Printing at events is definitely where the money is. You would be surprised how much people would be willing to pay for a shirt from an event where their child just competed in. We did the same thing for karate and gymnastic tourneys. You just need to have someone going around and taking pictures. We also do some staged pictures (i.e. picture of the kid breaking a board that was already broken) and they always looked better. If the customer bought enough, I would even email them the picture. 

When we first started off, we had an Epson 1280 for dye sub and Epson R1800 for transfers - both running bulk feed systems. The problem was it seemed like it took 10 - 20 minutes to get the bulk feed systems ready to print everytime. Even had to break out the syringe a couple of times. This was the primary reason why I got MultiRIP created. It is much easier for me to have one other person help me carry a 4800 printer into the gym and basically just turn it on compared to carrying two different printers with two bulk feed systems that are going to need some TLC to get them working properly. I can also lock down the print head on the Epson 4800 to make it better to travel with as well. Just a little background on where MultiRIP has come from. 

I just posted a very detailed Frequently Asked Questions page for MultiRIP - How to Instructions & Videos for MultiRIP Hybrid & MultiRIP GP RIP Software. It is filled with both written information and videos that is also found in the User Forum.

Best wishes,

Mark


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## Rambler (Mar 13, 2008)

What is the difference between Heat Transfer Ink and Chromablast?
I know Chromablast is made by Sawgrass and Heat Transfer Ink tends to be cheaper. Is there a different feel to the shirt? When we've seen digital transfer they sometimes feel rubbery. Is that due to the type of fabric that its bonded to? 

Thanks


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## enquirer (Feb 3, 2008)

Hey Mark,

I'm not suprised at all. I'm one of those crazy competitive gymnastics parents and I have paid tons over the last year for all sorts of things sold at the competitions. It's definitely a great market. It's very costly to put your child into a competitive team and so paying 30 bucks for a t-shirt, etc. is nothing. It seems like it would be easier to have a smaller printer but i guess considering all the things that could go wrong with the bulk systems etc., I see your point. 

Rambler,
I really don't know that much about the chromoblast. I did see a huge difference between like regular avery type paper and JPSS(jetpro soft stretch) with heat transfer. I like the sublimation alot better but I've done some decent tees just playing around with the heat transfer and jPSS paper. You just have to put some sort of outline around your design or lettering and cut 1/8th of an inch around and then it comes out nice. Otherwise, you will notice where the transfer paper ends. It can even be a faint line/ shape/ box, etc. I just try to incorporate that into the design so it looks like it was meant to be there. The hand is soft and it stretches without cracking. I'm new at this but I'm sure others could offer more advice.


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

Rambler said:


> What is the difference between Heat Transfer Ink and Chromablast?
> I know Chromablast is made by Sawgrass and Heat Transfer Ink tends to be cheaper. Is there a different feel to the shirt? When we've seen digital transfer they sometimes feel rubbery. Is that due to the type of fabric that its bonded to?


Rambler, 

When you look at a final product made by a heat transfer, the total look / feel of the design on the shirt is a combination of the chemistry of both the ink and paper. There are several different types of paper that provide you a different hand / feel. The traditional rule is the heavier the hand, the more polymer that is on the paper and the more polymer will help you keep your ink on the shirt longer. With the advancement in chemistry of the paper, the manufacturers have been able to minimize the hand / feel compared to the older heat transfer paper. What makes ChromaBlast unique is the binders in the ink allow you to use a transfer paper that has a very low amount of polymer on it. With the combination of the binders in the ink and the low polymer paper, you get a ready good hand / feel. But ChromaBlast is a light transfer paper solution.

It is also important to understand that there are two main categories of heat transfer paper: light and dark / opaque transfer paper. The light transfer paper when cured to the shirt will have the polymer separate from the paper backing of the transfer paper and will become clear. This is why when you do a transfer on to a color shirt, your colors can change. See my previous example in this post about the picture of the blonde girl on a pink shirt. The dark / opaque transfer paper is used when you have colors in your design that are lighter than the color of your shirt. The dark transfer paper has a white backing on it that will prevent the color of the shirt from altering the colors of your graphic. However, the white backing does make the hand / feel much more thicker than a light transfer. The same concept is required when you do screen printing and direct-to-garment (dtg) printing. If you go to the mall and look at any dark color shirts, you will see how it feels much thicker than a white t-shirt print. The only exception is discharge printing - which is an entire other subject. 

The best recommendation I can provide you is to call some of the heat transfer distributors and see if you can get some sample packs of paper to play with. Some distributors might charge you a small fee, but it will be well worth it. You really need to test several different types of paper and see what your customers are going to want.

Hope this helps. Best wishes.

Mark


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## Girlzndollz (Oct 3, 2007)

Great post, Mark. Hey, Mark, can the Epson 4800 run ink other than the Chromoblast on the side opposite dyesub? I"m still confused on this printer and what it's main function/perk is. Thanks.


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

Kelly,

Yes, you have the options of running the following ink sets in each channels:
- CMYK Channels - ArTainium or SubliJet IQ sublimation inks
- LcLmLkLlk Channels - ChromaBlast (light transfer ink) and MultINK (light & dark transfer ink, film positive ink)

The MultINK is an ink that is sold under several different names by distributors of transfer inks and film positive inks. Just like several types of transfer papers, the distributors tend to give products a different name so you will come back asking for the same name and stick with them. MultINK is just a good overall ink made for transfers that the manufacturer decided to put UV inhibitors into the ink to make it even better at printing film positives.

As for what the main perk of running a hybrid printer is that instead of investing in two smaller printers that have a smaller printable space, need bulk feed systems to run them cost effectively and tend to not last as long... you invest in a larger printer that is designed for production work. For example, I started out with an Epson 1280 for dye sub and an Epson R1800 for inkjet transfers. Trying to keep both bulk feed systems running properly was a chore in itself. So going with a larger printer (I own an Epson 4800), I can let the printer easily sit for a week and not have a problem with it. It would take me several head cleans or even using a syringe to get the bulk feed systems working properly. So less maintenance, your time savings and not wasting as much ink is why people consider the hybrid printers.

I hope this answered your question.

Mark


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## Girlzndollz (Oct 3, 2007)

Wow, thank you, Mark. It does help alot and I am going to save this post for future reference. I appreciate your posts so much, thanks, Mark.


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## kidnpat (Apr 25, 2009)

I have the 4880 and I'm disappointed with the color production from chromablast. I don't run it too often lately (just nozzle checks every other day) the ink that goes on the shirt isn't bright at all. It looks faded.

I previously ran a 60 shirt job and all ink looked blah. What can I do to enhance the color?

Thanks

Kid


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## Jmar22 (Sep 30, 2009)

Does anybody know if you can run ink for an epson 4800, in a stylus 1280?


Thanks


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## baddjun1 (Aug 5, 2009)

I believe while researching hybrids a little while back, the lowest cost hybrid printer I saw listed for chromablast and sublijet was the Epson 1900/


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## dtogs (Apr 1, 2007)

Might want to take a serious look at the new Ricoh printers... we operated an Epson 4800 for several years and switched over to the Ricoh GX7000. As for the 4800, now used for photography prints. Clogging issues with 4800 are gone as well.


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## ultrafashion (Nov 28, 2009)

kidnpat said:


> I have the 4880 and I'm disappointed with the color production from chromablast. I don't run it too often lately (just nozzle checks every other day) the ink that goes on the shirt isn't bright at all. It looks faded.
> 
> I previously ran a 60 shirt job and all ink looked blah. What can I do to enhance the color?
> 
> ...


hi 
I recently took the Epson 4880 for printing t-shirt and have the same problems, I would be grateful if you can help me. If you solve them? 

Bole


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

ultrafashion said:


> hi
> I recently took the Epson 4880 for printing t-shirt and have the same problems, I would be grateful if you can help me. If you solve them?
> 
> Bole


This is typically a result a two things:

1. The nozzles are clogged because of lack of use or the printer is in an environment with low humidity / or with the heater / air conditioner blowing on it. The ink at the surface of the metal piezo plate will dry up faster in environments like mentioned above. Run a nozzle check to see if they are clogged. If so, you can try running a couple of head cleans to clear them up. If that does not work, then call your distributor and ask them to help you through it.

2. The color management in your graphic software program is not setup correctly for the printing software that you are using. You will need to talk to your distributor that sold you the printer / ink to make sure that you set the graphic software program to match your printer software.

ChromaBlast ink is one of the fastest clogging ink in the Decorated Apparel industry based on the posts in this forum. That is why it is important to understand what options you have when selecting a hybrid printer for inks and printing software. Selecting an ink that clogs fast could lead to wasting ink from the other side that is not clogged. There are several companies that have cleaning cartridges in the ChromaBlast slots now as they were not able to make it work for their business, but still want to print dye sub.

Hope this helps get you pointed in the right direction.

Mark


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## ultrafashion (Nov 28, 2009)

Thanks Mark, I'll try something from the proposed and I see where it leads me ...
Bole


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## dt (Aug 12, 2007)

Hi Mark,

are you planning of doing a rip for the epson 7900 ? i read that it's really faster than the 7800

Will you make custom rip (for a roland hifi jetpro ) to use pigment ink(for poster, canvas...) on 6 and sublimation ink on the other 6

or a custom rip for the mimaki jv22 ( 4colorsx2 same kind of ink) ? but i don't want to change my ink
(Roland pigment ink + manoukian (sub))

Looking forward to read your answer.

DT


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

dt,

Below are the answers to your questions. Let me know if you have additional questions.

Mark



dt said:


> are you planning of doing a rip for the epson 7900 ? i read that it's really faster than the 7800


Yes, the 7900 is faster than the 7880 printer. It also has more ink channels (I think there are 11 of them if I remember correctly) that allows for more potential things to do with it beyond two sets of CMYK inks. However, we are limited as to which printers we can work with until there are good, aftermarket cartridges that will work with any printer. It took us almost 6 months after the Epson 4880 came out to find reliable aftermarket cartridges for it. If there are no refillable cartridges or the chips for closed cartridges, then no one will be able to get the inks into the printer. So typically we have to wait till companies like Sawgrass or the aftermarket cartridge companies have a source for these cartridges. I have not heard of anyone that has these. We are already driving the Epson 7900 printer as a film positive printer using Epson inks. 

The other thing to consider is the creation of new ink profiles if we add in more ink colors other than CMYK inks (i.e. Orange, Green, Vivid Light Magenta colors that are available from Epson, but not yet on the sublimation side). Making profiles is a time consuming and expensive process. So we have to be selective in which setups we choose to go with. This is why many other RIP software programs don't provide built-in profiles, but rather have you create your own profiles. I can tell you first-hand, paying for the sublimation tiles and glass is expensive in itself.



dt said:


> Will you make custom rip (for a roland hifi jetpro ) to use pigment ink(for poster, canvas...) on 6 and sublimation ink on the other 6
> 
> or a custom rip for the mimaki jv22 ( 4colorsx2 same kind of ink) ? but i don't want to change my ink
> (Roland pigment ink + manoukian (sub))


Our market focus is for the smaller Epson printers. There are plenty of RIPs out there that go after the market for the printers you have listed above - see Wasatch and ErgoSoft. Granted, their prices are higher and you need to create your own profiles. These RIPs have other features that are more desired than what most MultiRIP customers want. But those features also raise the cost in the RIP. We like to focus our RIPs on the smaller printers, provide the built-in profiles and keep the cost as affordable as possible. So I am not sure if those types printers are on your current plans for the future. We are working on some new things in the dtg printing realm though.


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## dt (Aug 12, 2007)

Mark,

Thanks again for another very useful and professional answer.

For the 7880 will it be possible with the multirip to use an pigment ink to do poster and canvas and an ink to do sublimation ? 

bulk ink system?


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

dt,

The answer is it depends - depending on the ink you use. All inks will have certain characteristics that will give it the color possibilities. I have spoken to people that have purchased inks from all over and have used a different ink with the profiles that come included with MultiRIP. They say they don't have any color issues. Now, good color is subjective. Some inks might have a completely different linearization or curves that will through the colors completely off. Others might be really close to the inks that come profiled in MultiRIP and you will not see a change in color. It really depends on which inks you get.

I would also note that some ink manufacturers don't have the same quality control standards as others. Thus, you can see how the ink colors will change from one batch to the other. So I would recommend if you are going to try this, that you do the following:
1. Purchase refillable cartridges for your printer and get a Liter of cleaning fluid. Before you put any new ink in your printer, completely flush out the previous ink using the cleaning fluid.
2. Find an ink manufacturer / distributor that you trust to provide you a consistent product.
3. Remove the remaining amount of cleaning fluid from the carts and fill it up with the new ink. Fill the ink lines with the new ink. Run some sample prints.

Please note, any time you do this type of experimental process... you have to understand that a risk comes involved with this. Some inks will work just fine and others may cause problems to your printer or may not work as well on certain substrates.

Hope this answers your question. Best wishes,

Mark


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