# Ink Costs



## CaulkinsGraphics (Jun 12, 2007)

Hi everyone. I recently purchased a Ricoh 3300 printer with Subli jet ink and have been trying to calculate ink costs. Since I just set this up, they advised me that 12% of the 1st cartridges would be used to charge the system, which I understand, but it seems like I am not quite getting the bang for my buck. I did a check on my ink supply and came up with Y-32%, M-19%, C-17%, and K-33%. I checked my print count and it was 69 color prints. When I print, I normally do 8.5x11 paper and will print 2 full wrap mugs, checkbook covers, or anything similiar as to not waste paper. With my calculation with the system already charged my next set of cartridges should produce around 120 color prints. If that is the case and I am paying $240 for a full ink set, each 8.5x11 print would be over $2 once you figure shipping. I guess I am wondering if this is the norm. Like I said, I just started a couple of months ago and still learning quite a bit.


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## freebird1963 (Jan 21, 2007)

contact David Gross at Conde or search thru the forum or on the conde site. . He did the GX-7000 ink cost and I thought he had done them on this one as well.

I thought the charging was just pulling the ink up into the lines and if so you don't lose that ink. Unless its dumping it into the waste thingy instead but don't think so. Can't recall tho.

Mark


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## CaulkinsGraphics (Jun 12, 2007)

Yeah, I think I just stated the charging the wrong way. I did find what Dave did for the GX 5050 and he had it figured at $.50 per 8x10. I guess I can't figure out why my prints are costing $2 for 8x10 full color.


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## jpkevin (Oct 22, 2007)

The 3300 has small 29 ml cartridges. I would estimate that it takes about 60% of the first cartridge to load the tubing up to the print heads.


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## jiarby (Feb 8, 2007)

Yep. the GX7000 has 110ml carts.


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

jiarby said:


> Yep. the GX7000 has 110ml carts.


I thought that the carts for the GX7000 and GX7500 printers were approximately 50 MLs. Could be wrong, but they are not the same size as a standard Epson 48X0 printer - which is 110 ML.

Mark


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## jpkevin (Oct 22, 2007)

The Ricoh GX5050 and GX7000 have 68 ml black, and the other three are 60 ml.


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## iT (Feb 5, 2010)

Is there a site where you can calculate / compare different ink & paper costs?

I saw an old post that calculated an ink cost of $.00625 per square inch of full coverage (or $.50 for 80 sq inches in an 8 x 10 letter size print). However, I believe that estimate was just for one brand of ink used in a specific printer.

I'm wondering if there's an easier way to compare the printing costs of all the different ink & paper brands than contacting each one separately. I'm guessing that's probably wishful thinking, but figured it was worth asking since there are so many different ink brands and printers out there.


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## jiarby (Feb 8, 2007)

oops, guess I was wrong!


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## mn shutterbug (Mar 19, 2009)

iT said:


> since there are so many different ink brands and printers out there.


Unfortunately, there is just 1 ink brand out there available to us. However, they do have 2 different types, depending on what your printer requires.


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## PhilDx (Feb 13, 2010)

I have printed 250 color pages using the GXe3300n and so far have used: 1 black and 2 of each color ink cartridges (total= 7 inks used). I'm printing about 80% coverage on each page. Also the printer is now requesting a new ink maintenance tank. At $60/ink and $30 for the maintenance tank that's $450, or about $1.80 per print. With paper it's closer to $2. 

I think either the 7000 is much more efficient or DG's calculations are off. 

What I've observed is that the actual printing is quite miserly on ink, it's the maintenance cycle that seems to really suck it down, I've seen it drop about 10% over one maintenance cycle.


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## mn shutterbug (Mar 19, 2009)

That calculates to about 3c per sq. inch, correct? If so, that's pretty much what I assumed.


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## PhilDx (Feb 13, 2010)

2.5 to 3c per square inch, yes.


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## CaulkinsGraphics (Jun 12, 2007)

I was on the phone with Conde yesterday asking about this. I was told a full set of cartridges should yield around 150 8x10 color prints. I know this may vary. My problem, I have went through 2 sets and need to order another set now. My count is 146 color and 0 black/white. Of that 146 count, 80% are mug prints on 8.5 x 11 sheets with 4 - 3"x3" designs. I'm not even doing 50% coverage and I have used $480 worth of inks already and the ink collector needs changed. When I purchased the unit, I called and they helped me set up everything, so not wanting to screw anything up, I have not messed with the settings. I went into properties to check the print quality and it has 3 choices High, Standard and Fast. Mine is set on High. I have also noticed that it seems like much ink is left on the paper after pressing, but I have no clue because this is new to me.


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## PhilDx (Feb 13, 2010)

I think you're seeing what I'm seeing: The ink usage while printing seems quite frugal, but maybe the maintenance cycles are what's taking all your ink. Are you using the printer frequently every day or does it sit for a while between batches?


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## binki (Jul 16, 2006)

The big push for this printer is no head clogs but that comes at a price. The ink is twice the cost of the bagged system for the epsons but either one is really expensive. 

We still use the 1280 and are on our second printer and have found that putting a drop of cleaning solution (from our DTG supplier, DTGInks.com) in the capping station helps keep the head clean. We also use printer jockey to flush clogged channels. 

I cannot say that small format (yes, the R-7000 is small format) dye sub printing yields a profit unless you are doing this work every day. We still offer it because it leads to other sales.


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## PhilDx (Feb 13, 2010)

I think our concern is that we bought the machine based on consumables costs that are turning out to be much much higher than we were led to believe. If we'd known at the outset that per-page cost was going to be about $2 that would have affected our buying decision.

I think Ricoh has a problem with this printer, maybe it's something they can fix with a firmware update (ie. be less aggressive with the maintenance cycles). Otherwise, any buyers reading these forums will think twice about getting one.


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

PhilDx said:


> I think Ricoh has a problem with this printer, maybe it's something they can fix with a firmware update (ie. be less aggressive with the maintenance cycles).


I think it is important for you to understand that Ricoh did not build or sell this printer as a dye sub printer. Epson has also not built a dye sub printer. The OEM printer manufacturers build printers to sell their ink and none of them to date that I am aware of make their own dye sub ink. The ink is what really motivates the printer manufacturers. This is why Epson keeps changing the ink chip encryption - to prevent 3rd party ink manufacturers from taking their consumables. Having to support the hardware components on the printer is not worth it just for the sale of the printer.

So I think you are going to find it a hard argument for Ricoh to spend money to change their printer when they are not making money on the ink. You probably have a better chance of hoping Sawgrass recoups their R&D money on making the ink for this type of printer and will drop the price.

Just something to consider.

Mark


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## PhilDx (Feb 13, 2010)

Good point about it not really being Ricoh's problem. Although 'regular' users with regular inks aren't going to be happy about the per-page cost either.


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

Other than the fact that the Ricoh ink is substantially cheaper than the cost of the sublimation ink for that printer. So it is substantially less noticeable to the average Ricoh customer.

Mark


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## PhilDx (Feb 13, 2010)

$45 vs $60, so still $1.50 per page, quite expensive for a normal print.


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

PhilDx said:


> $45 vs $60, so still $1.50 per page, quite expensive for a normal print.


There is a difference between cost per a cartridge and cost per a print. The amount of ink used per a print is based on the size of the artwork AND the ICC profile. The ICC profile is specifically created based on the ink being used, the printer and the substrate being printed on. The Ricoh ink is designed differently than the sublimation ink. So the yield per a cartridge is not the same between the two different inks. In addition, when you do sublimation you are using a release paper that does not release all the ink. So you have to apply more sublimation ink to the release paper to get the desired output. This is why the cost per a print is substantially higher with the sublimation ink compared to the Ricoh ink.

Hope this clarifies some things.

Mark


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