# New Brother DTG (A FEW VIDS)



## 102557 (Mar 6, 2010)

looks like the brother has incorporated one pass printing into there new line of printers?.. a few vids i ran into!!!

GT-381 showing one pass printing - YouTube



[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K0pMxe3dSwM&feature=player_detailpage[/media]

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSpt-2cqhso&feature=player_detailpage&list=ULHSpt-2cqhso[/media]


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## allamerican-aeoon (Aug 14, 2007)

It is RIP job. DTG was the first introduced this idea but image was not crispy so they kill this RIP. about 2 yr Plus ago. 
Cheers and beers!


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## 102557 (Mar 6, 2010)

allamerican said:


> It is RIP job. DTG was the first introduced this idea but image was not crispy so they kill this RIP. about 2 yr Plus ago.
> Cheers and beers!


Peter do the print heads sit back to back? travel together on the same carriage or does the color/cmyk move independent from each other moving at the same time?

seems like this could be done with the epson in effect cutting print time and eliminating any registration complications?? done within the rip printing passes of white on same line and color over on same line?


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## cavedave (Dec 5, 2006)

This isnt just about the RIP, its about the print head(s) how they are configured, firmware in the printer and the RIP / driver.
In our software its easy to get the white to print at the same time as the color, you just select White+Color, but that really is only part of the process.

The ideal setup is when you have separate print heads (such as in the Mimaki 3042), they stagger the CMYK print heads and White/Clear print heads, so you physically can print the white down on the media first and then the CMYK. Because this machine can print front to back or back to front, you can print White->CMYK, CMYK->White, Clear->CMYK or CMYK->Clear and as they heads are staggered you can use all the nozzles in the print head (so White->CMYK is the same speed as CMYK on its own).

When using an Epson head where all the channels are in the same head you cant stagger the White, so what you have to do is split the head, for example if you have 180 nozzles you can use the 1-90 for White and 91-180 for CMYK. But you now have only 90 nozzles per channelinstead of 180 and it will print twice as slow.
But thats not the end of it, as the BIG question is does the printer firmware allow you to control which nozzles you use for each color channel and that depends on the printer manufacture and model.

Roland and Mimaki both have features for nozzle masking (they use it for there machines that support White and Metallic, different from the 3042 and use an Epson head), its quite a high level interface and makes it very easy for RIP vendors to split the print head.
With Epson its more complicated as it depends on the printer, most of Epson large format machines its not possible to split the head, all the microweaving is perfomed in the printer and the level at which the RIP comminucates with the printer you have no control over which nozzles gets used on which channels. So on a 4880 machine you can print white and CMYK in the same pass but the will print at the same time. There is one Epson LFP printer which is an exception to this, which is the WT9700 which has White Ink and has split head capability in the firmware.
But Epson desktops the RIP / Driver has to do the Mircoweaing which means we have direct control over which nozzles get used when and by which channel. So its possible on say a 1800/1900/R2000 to print the white first then the color using split head.

So as you can see its abit complicated and not just about the RIP.

Note: We call this Inline printing (white and color in the same pass) and its been around long before garment printing, the first machine I remember was the JV3 from Mimaki with White which allowed you to split the head into 2 or 3 for printing White->CMYK with solvent ink.

Best regards

-David


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## allamerican-aeoon (Aug 14, 2007)

Dtg Aus RIP writer did it. Don SWF wrote many posts about this. He said EU sold few but wasn't a hit. No time to search Don's many posts. AA was planing to follow but did not bother because no market. It was all Epson modified printer. Dtg Aus also dumped this project.
All about the ink also. White ink need time to settle to provide real her color. If mix right away with CYMK color become blurry.
Cheers! Beers are on me all ways.


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

Dave did a great job explaining the software side of how it is done. It is really more than just related to the printing software. To answer Jeff's questions, all the print heads are in a single print head carriage. If you have seen a GT-541 printer, basically duplicate the front 4 print heads and flip them around on the back. So the two or four white heads (depending on the model you select) are mounted on the back side of the print head carriage and the CMYK heads are mounted on the front side.

The other thing I will add goes off of what Peter was saying about the previous attempts to print inline or in one pass. The issue with printing inline was the white ink was being printed at the same time as the color ink and it was a low viscosity of ink. The lower viscosity of inks need a longer gap between the white and color being printed to allow the white ink to start to gel. I saw an inline print from DTG Digital and saw what this does to bright colors. Alternatively, Brother uses a higher viscosity of ink that does not need as long to gel before the color inks are printed on top of it. Thus allowing them to get a wider range of bright colors than an Epson 4880 printers when doing inline printing.

When I first heard they were going to do inline printing, I was pretty skeptical about it based on my previous experience stated above. After being able to play with the printer for 2 shows over the past 3 months, I can say that you can do this for a majority of the designs. There may still be some designs that a user will want to print the white underbase separately to achieve maximum color brightness. All inline printing does is give you an option.

Mark

P.S. Who is the guy in the second video?


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## Stitch-Up (May 26, 2007)

I recall the European version of the DTG K3 introduced the 'One Pass Fast' at a show here in the UK. I understand it wasn't released in the US because the result of printing the white & colour in 'one pass' provided a change in the colours - they became more muted/pastel shades.

I don't know whether the 'One Pass Fast' caught on in the UK as it would seem impossible to produce a good colour match for artwork supplied by the client.


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## cavedave (Dec 5, 2006)

You cant print the white and then the Color on a 4880, its just not possible.
When DTG do this on the Viper they print the white and color at the same time.

We offer this as an option in our RIP and some do use it.

In theory splitting the head on a desktop machine should improve things, but by how much I am not sure.

The real advantage is registartion as with an Epson head if you split it then for the same resolution you print twice as slow, so if you do the white still at 1440x1440 then you are twice as slow so the overall print time is slower than using the whole head for a 1440x1440 pass of white and then color at say 720x720 for the color.

the way to do this properly is stagger the heads as Brother have done.

Best regards

-David


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## davitos (Sep 5, 2007)

nice videos and the right step forward for brother. 

we are in the market for a new machine this year but brother is not an option:
a) takes longer than other models in the market
b) low dpi = lower quality (is it still only 600dpi?)
c) rip process (how do you make a choke?)
d) ink prices
e) wear parts (cost of printheads etc...)

while a/d/e are the most decisive factors. if brother were to reduce the ink prices to a competitive level, the machine might make it to our list. seriously, how is anyone making money on the 782 printer and now the new one? ok, granted, if you sell a design for $20-25 min - but in reality this is a very tough sale....


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## allamerican-aeoon (Aug 14, 2007)

davitos said:


> nice videos and the right step forward for brother.
> we are in the market for a new machine this year but brother is not an option:
> a) takes longer than other models in the market
> b) low dpi = lower quality (is it still only 600dpi?)
> ...


Very good points you addressed. However I think you may want to consider few more,
A. Reliability. Brother is One of the best in the industry.
B. Service. I am not sure. Did not read seriousness in TSF. If machine is well built = less service. It will make company service rate higher. If machine is not well built no matter how good service mfg provide it will end up with bad service rate tag.
C. Company reputation, Ethic and History and age( often they add years even they were not active) dirty play, steal, back stab, bottom feeder --- etc.
IMHO. 
Ink price? Yes I agree 100% I heard $700/liter? If you use 1 liter per months your saving is $4-500/month. You can pay lease payment on many printers out there. I am sure Brother understand very well on this.
Cheers! Beers are on me always.


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## davitos (Sep 5, 2007)

i agree that reliability and service is a very important factor. i was only adressing why we cannot justify the brother if the ink price stays that high. in our market segment, we cannot sell a shirt for $20 and up. we are in the market to actually make money. i dont see how that is working out with the brother.

they certainly build rock solid machines, they just dont fit our business model (wondering whose they fit printing white ink anyway)...


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## skdave (Apr 11, 2008)

How can I watch the private you tube movie?


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

Dave,

The video was shot by Axiom and I guess they switched it from public to private. So you will need to contact your Axiom rep to get the direct link to the watch the video.

Mark


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## skdave (Apr 11, 2008)

Thanks Mark, Congrats to you and Matt on the new printer.


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## DAGuide (Oct 2, 2006)

Dave,

Other than my comments (which are probably viewed as coming from the peanut gallery most of the time), I really had nothing to do with development of new Brother printer. Brother has asked me to assist in the technical support documentation that I am currently working on with them... so I will take some credit for that when it is finally released, but the rest of the credit for the printer goes the team at Brother USA, Brother Japan, other Brother entities in other countries and their GT users that they spoke with in the past couple of years that provided the input on what they wanted in the next printer.

Mark


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## skdave (Apr 11, 2008)

Mark, it looks like the perfect printer, Good job to everyone @ Brother.


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