# Is Stahls now providing DTG services?



## Liberty (Jul 18, 2006)

On page 19 of the little 20 page Digital Decorator insert it clearly says "Let us DTG it" but I find no references on their web site.


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## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

A simple call to Stahls should give the correct answer


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## Liberty (Jul 18, 2006)

I tried, got a non answer, but it was more enlightening than your response, thanks 

They have a department that does decorating services like applying transfers, I'll call them tomorrow...


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## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

did not mean to be a smart a$$....just that a call seemed appropriate ... had you said you tried and got no response..my post would not have been made


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## jocari (Apr 28, 2008)

I believe everyone is moving towards offering DTG printing for the simple fact that there is a huge market out there for it. It's expensive to get into but what isn't in this industry.


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## Jodi W (Mar 7, 2012)

Liberty said:


> On page 19 of the little 20 page Digital Decorator insert it clearly says "Let us DTG it" but I find no references on their web site.


 Liberty, thank you so much for inquiring about DTG services. I'm sorry that you did not get the information you were looking for. I've sent you a PM to follow up.

Stahls’ ID does now offer DTG services as a part of our Digital Decorating Service. As this is a very new offering for us, we have not yet added this information to the website. If you are interested in further information, please contact customer service at 1-800-4STAHLS, and ask to speak with a Custom representative.


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## Liberty (Jul 18, 2006)

Thank you Jodi, I will call tomorrow when I get back to the office


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## allamerican-aeoon (Aug 14, 2007)

OMG!
Jodi, I want to be nice for your first post but~
What a news! It is bad. Has nothing to do with me but I need Pepto bismol.
It will be same as AA runs printing shop! Compete with own customers.
Majority of Sthal heat press users are digital printers. Big boy like them are jump in to printing service? I see the grown man stick his fingers, no whole fist into kids mouth and try take candy out of her. 
Not too late! Stop please. I may will give you part of money you want to make for no condition. Did you see Apple makes plastic phone cover? does GM makes car polish? Does goverment runs super market? Direct or indirect way you will take away Tsf dtg members business. I want to say shame on you but I will not. I hope not many digital shirts printer will refuse to buy your products.
Cheers! You need beer money too? Come and get it. Those are on me always.
Peter,Peter, Peter big mouth! I just can't pass something is not right.
Can I have money back for all the presses I have in stock? I just check my inventory we have 29ea.


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## royster13 (Aug 14, 2007)

allamerican said:


> Majority of Sthal heat press users are digital printers.


Sorry Peter but I do not believe that.....IMO most Stahls clients have nothing more that a heat press....Some might have a plotter and/or inkjet printer but I suspect they are very much a minority....


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## apipromo (Nov 4, 2010)

I think one point Peter was trying to make is that many DTG owners also own/use a Stahls heat press, which is prob very true. Is that the majority of Stahls heat press customers, no. But still, it is a grey area of selling heat presses and than going into the DTG business which will be directly competing against contract digital garment printers. I wounder what many of the current contract printers will think of this?


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## allamerican-aeoon (Aug 14, 2007)

royster13 said:


> Sorry Peter but I do not believe that.....IMO most Stahls clients have nothing more that a heat press....Some might have a plotter and/or inkjet printer but I suspect they are very much a minority....


Let say if it is not majority(until somebody study no one can say it but sthal)then are you agree digital printers are still their customers? If so they will not hurt someone who spend money to them?
Another words you do not need Pepto Bismol. Huh. You have good stomach. I ate anything and digest all when I was trained for Vietnam war. Maggot, bugs, wood skin, snake was treat but they Never feed us candies from kids mouth. They know Rangers cannot digest that.
Cheers! Jim beam are on me! We pure these to cool down And drank.


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## Cara_Cherry (Feb 16, 2009)

Hi Peter - I’d like calm your fears. We at Stahls’ are not taking business away from our dealers. We have absolutely no plans to offer decorating services to end consumers. Our Digital Decorating Center was opened to help dealers during their busiest times. I’m sure you’ve found yourself swamped by orders with no time to decorate. That’s where we come in. You can send us your artwork along with the item you wish to decorate and we’ll create your full color CAD-PRINTZ™ Digital Transfer and then heat press it on the item before sending it back to you. If you have something with super fine detail or you’d like a softer hand than what CAD-PRINTZ™ can provide, our custom reps will offer the DTG service as an alternative. 

It’s just another way for us to help you and all TSF members continue to be successful decorators. If you have any more questions about our services or pricing, please feel free to send me a PM or call and speak with any of our wonderful custom service reps at 800.478.2457. Thanks!


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## allamerican-aeoon (Aug 14, 2007)

Cara_Cherry said:


> Hi Peter - I’d like calm your fears. We at Stahls’ are not taking business away from our dealers. We have absolutely no plans to offer decorating services to end consumers. Our Digital Decorating Center was opened to help dealers during their busiest times. I’m sure you’ve found yourself swamped by orders with no time to decorate. That’s where we come in. You can send us your artwork along with the item you wish to decorate and we’ll create your full color CAD-PRINTZ™ Digital Transfer and then heat press it on the item before sending it back to you. If you have something with super fine detail or you’d like a softer hand than what CAD-PRINTZ™ can provide, our custom reps will offer the DTG service as an alternative.
> 
> It’s just another way for us to help you and all TSF members continue to be successful decorators. If you have any more questions about our services or pricing, please feel free to send me a PM or call and speak with any of our wonderful custom service reps at 800.478.2457. Thanks!


It is funny that you use word fears! Extreamly funny! Especially to Peter? Lol.
You don't know me well yet.. My master thought me "strong to stronger weak to weaker" I live by this whole my life.
No time to print(deco)? No desire to print is big different. I respect people who spend $1 to me while you do not. What's so hard to understand? My English again? I need translator here.
So many digital printer are looking for jobs to print. You are not helping here. Can't it be easier to understand? What is your education level? Even element school diploma holder can understand me.
End user? Define this. Most digital printers customer are resellers. They order to resell to retail or contacts.
Even though you define them it is wrong. Wrong can not be right any which way put together. You have enough for not to disturb small businesses here. Talk to Mike. Wrong plan.
What am I gain? Nutting but save money on Pepto Bismol.
Cheers! Beers are on me always.


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## allamerican-aeoon (Aug 14, 2007)

I smell whoever thanks to your post has something to do direct or indirect. Same category. so easy to define families. Lone some dove, my debate will never ends. I do believe myself on left or right. Leave them alone. I need whole bottle f Pepto when i hear you charge xxx while small businesses are charging xxx. You have purchase power much greater than most here.
Cheers! Beers are on me always.


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## allamerican-aeoon (Aug 14, 2007)

Cubedecible! Thank you for your support. I thought i am lone some dove. I hope we raise voice to change their course. They are already rich,need more to be richer. Nothing wrong with it as long as they will not take candy out of kids mouth and never compete with who spent money to them. There was the guy who owns 99 horses but he still wants neighbors 1 horse to make it 100. Instead give mate to make ponies. I will because it is fundamental Condition of be as human being.
Cheers! Beers are on me always


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## Don-ColDesi (Oct 18, 2006)

Perhaps we are seeing the end product of the flurry of Stahl's activity in the Belquette booth at SGIA. Time will tell.


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## allamerican-aeoon (Aug 14, 2007)

Don-ColDesi said:


> Perhaps we are seeing the end product of the flurry of Stahl's activity in the Belquette booth at SGIA. Time will tell.


I don't see any wrong picture there. We can buy guns all day long. How and where to use is the problem I see by owner. Gun point to who help you to stay in business or gun point to protect our friends and customers.
AA never print one shirts for money and never will. I will die by hunger rather than gun point to friends.
Cheers! Beers are on me always.


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## Liberty (Jul 18, 2006)

Wow, talk about hijacking a thread... all this talk of eating bugs in the Nam and who is pointing guns at who... seriously?

Look at it this way Peter. We've been in this trade for over 20 years. And at every juncture where we felt the need to take the plunge and expand our service offerings, we have ALWAYS contracted out those services first. IF after a period of time it looks like a profitable market segment that we want to bring in house, THEN we go out and buy the equipment, hire the operators etc.

We did the same thing 20 years ago with Stahls, we bought custom cuts (I think that's what they called it.) After a while we added our own plotter and all I buy from Stahls is roll goods. Same with kiss cut appliques, now we have our own laser and do our own digitizing. Same thing with embroidery, contracted it out, then bought one machine then more. And we still contract out some orders when it is better for us to do so.

Right now we want to venture into DTG. And once again I want to contract it out for a period of time before I spend the big bucks and hire another employee. My Rule #1, all contract service providers must be contract to the trade only. And I'm confident Stahls fits that requirement.

You know, you could have been proactive in helping your customers by offering up a few who do indeed provide contract only DTG services, now that would have been a positive thing to do.

But alas, I don't see where your little Pepto Bismol rant accomplished anything except to scratch AA off the list of potential suppliers if and when we do decide to buy. But hey, all the best to you and yours.

And thanks Jodi and Cara, I didn't mean for this to get weird, I just wanted to know if you were offering the services.


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## Hegemone (Oct 18, 2011)

People will prolly blast me for this but... Congrats to Stahls for building a biz that is successful enough to support this type of decision. I know they won't be able to reach into my local market and build the personal relationship that I can with my customers. To be able to offer this service to their press owners makes a lot of sense. It makes them a more well rounded operation. As a screen printer I would consider using this service if someone like ryonet were to offer it. I would encourage any Dtg apparel decorator that feels threatened by this to continue to reinvest in their own company, seek the most economical and efficient methods, and continue to to explore creative methods to expand their own markets and business. 

In general I feel that taking an aggressive and negative tone in public forums does nothing to boost the reputations of the posters and that seems to be all I see when it comes to people posting responses to consumers asking questions seeking answers to legit questions. Personally it has kept me from even having the desire to research it and get into it. I don't like the feel and durability of digitally printed heat transfers and I don't like the Dtg technology as it stands now. Both will improve with time but for me, they still both look pretty cheap and feel bad. Is there money there, yes but there is also a lot of shady people doing shady ****. 

Till that changes I will do what is good for my biz and what is good for my customer. Just like all of you should be doing instead of slinging all this political poop and undermining the generally positive and supportive nature of tsf.

My two cents, toss 'em in a well and make a wish.


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## proworlded (Oct 3, 2006)

Mark and Mikel. I think you are ‘right on’.

Peter. I think you are missing the boat here. First, we are all in business to generate sales that make a profit that enables us to provide satisfactory incomes to ourselves and our families. It’s nice to be altruistic and try to convince others that the real motivation of being in business is to provide products and services to others just so they can satisfy their needs, before our own. I don’t think that Ted Stahl, or many of us, began our business with that goal in mind. Did you?

Sure, we also offer DTG printing to the trade, and we sell heat presses, custom and stock transfers, and a myriad of other products. Our main focus is to obtain sales by offering quality products, and unbeatable customer service. I’m sure that Stahl’s goals are similar.

As an example, many of us distributors offer Hotronix machines, yet we have to compete with their own company. Same for the stock transfer industry. There isn’t a day that goes by that one of our suppliers isn’t trying to convince our customers to buy from them rather than us. We just have to accept the fact that this industry, and probably others, play on the same field
. 
Is it any different than Macy’s selling the Ralph Lauren brand and Ralph Lauren selling the same merchandise in both their stand alone retail and factory outlet stores? I don’t think so.


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## allamerican-aeoon (Aug 14, 2007)

I read many are look for decent service. Look around there are plenty of them who will fit your needs. I witnessed so many digital printers are closing down because of shortage of work. They will take your job anytime. Services are exist already not creating and many are hungry. Sadly small shops do not have idea and money to promote them. Now this is good chance here. If you need service which stahl will provide to you post here with your needs. You will have tons of PMs in a heart beat. This is exactly what I mean. Hungry printers out there who did business with Sthal need your business. Sthal do not need to make their horse count 1000 while they have 999 and take away small businesses life line. One of Fundamental of economy is someone gain someone will lose somewhere somehow.
Remember hardware stores at every corners? Now what do you see? I am not a socialist. I just against rich people pay less tax big gets bigger with wrong consciouse. Seems like food wholesaler open up super market where all little grocery shops are around and who are their customers. I have no idea why I get excited over not my fire. Because it is just not right.
Cheers! Beers are on me always.


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## monkeyinadryer (Sep 29, 2006)

Does this mean then that you only offer this service to screen printers or embroiderers or heat transfer businesses? My problem with so many distributors going into the business of printing, embroidering, DTG, etc. is that they will offer their services to anyone who has a tax id number. Even if it's not in the trade. Rivers' End Trading, which is in my neck of the woods, has done this and it's maddening.


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## proworlded (Oct 3, 2006)

Andrea. Are you asking Stahl's or Pro World? We do not intentionally sell to anyone who is not in the 'trade'.


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## monkeyinadryer (Sep 29, 2006)

proworlded said:


> Andrea. Are you asking Stahl's or Pro World? We do not intentionally sell to anyone who is not in the 'trade'.


I was asking about Stahls but good to know about Proworld


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## allamerican-aeoon (Aug 14, 2007)

monkeyinadryer said:


> Does this mean then that you only offer this service to screen printers or embroiderers or heat transfer businesses? My problem with so many distributors going into the business of printing, embroidering, DTG, etc. is that they will offer their services to anyone who has a tax id number. Even if it's not in the trade. Rivers' End Trading, which is in my neck of the woods, has done this and it's maddening.


Take it to the bank. It will never happen as you dream, if anyone raise issue, oppos! Or no intention but slipped, oh did not know endless.
Ed, how are you? Thx for email this morning about your sequin supply.
Am I missing a boat? No I passed those boats countless times and knowing I exist for the customers not against them. Whoever post here from Sthal is not like owners as you and I. Not final caller I mean. They have jobs to do whatever it is. Owner of Sthal will never post here. He is super rich million times you and I put ogether but he still need do this. Do not know the word pass. Lol 
In your shoes more suppliers are better since you do not produce but when i think where my friends and families are its not a ethical business. It is strange that small Dtg owners see any issues. I guess I am lone some dove as always which I do not mind.
Cheers! Beers are on me always!


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## stix (Feb 3, 2008)

Disclosure: I do not own a garment printer than prints white ink.

If given the choice to order a dtg print from Stahls or blah blah Printing. I'm going the Stahls route. I don't knock Stahls for their decision. Business is a doggy dog world. I think George Knight will have an increase in heat press sales.. haha


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## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

boy has this thread gone off road....this was not about the wisdom or lack thereof concerning a new feature from Stahls....
So to answer the original question...I think the answer is yes...they do offer...end of story


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## stix (Feb 3, 2008)

I concur I believe they are offering DTG services. Life is too short.. certain things really aren't that serious.. geeesh.


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## allamerican-aeoon (Aug 14, 2007)

stix said:


> Disclosure: Business is a doggy dog world.


Chris! I thought you will be the last person who will say this. Business should not be this way. We are not dogs. 
We donate money for goodwill if it is $1mil with not ethical money it is not worth as widows $1. I just did to old citizen help org with my honest dollars and i feel good.
please do not be dogs because others are. Let's make money with pride.
Cheers! Beers are on me always.


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## stix (Feb 3, 2008)

Peter, 

Big corporations care about profits.. Small business care about feeding their families. Micro*ft could get less how G**gle feels or better yet a software startup. If given the choice to buy a machine from All American or Joe Blow Manufacturing.. I'm going with All American. That is who I feel comfortable as my strategic partner.


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## apipromo (Nov 4, 2010)

Peter,
This is business as usual in America these days. In the embroidery side of things companies like Holloway, Heritage, Ash City, Landway and many others began embroidering the apparel they wholesale. 

Think of it this way, your a large clothing wholesaler and you want to increase profits. If you purchase some embroidery machines and began selling embroidered services along with your clothing, instant increase, and you already have a target audience. These companies already know who purchases form them, and its not the contract embroiderer, its their customer. So the only person they are hurting is the contract embroidery business that didn't buy from them in the first place. I'm sure Stahls is looking at it the same way, the contract DTG business is not purchasing from Stahls. Who is... I'm going to guess the vast majority own a heat press and maybe a vinyl cutter. The rest of us may purchase some material, and own a heat press from them, but the main bread and butter I'm sure are the heat press owners who count on Stahls for all their printing and cutting.

I honestly wouldn't worry too much. Your printer turns out incredible quality. The people who own your machinery will be able to beat any price that a third party selling a Stahls DTG item can do. Some are really good at contract printing, and I'm sure they will continue to do well. 

I'll try to look at the good and think maybe with all the advertising, more and more people will learn what digital garment printing is and it will become more widely accepted and understood. Maybe it will increase the sales of the inhousers who turn out some really good quality. It would be nice if people seeked out DTG like they do screen printing instead of having to have it explained to them... But maybe I'm being optimistic. 

Your enthusiastic attitude towards the little guy is always accepted here Peter


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## Mabuzi (Jul 3, 2007)

*Suppliers selling to end users is becoming more common now as the internet has become a level playing field.*
I see more and more customers turning up to our shop with shirts they bought direct from the wholesaler/importer asking me to print. Thats of course if the supplier is not offering them printing too.

American apparel started this in Australia. We were buying shirts in wholesale and suddenly found customers bringing boxes of AA shirts to be printed at the same price we bought them at. Ditched AA and now AS Colour does it too. This stratgey makes you enemies and causes your business to fail in the long term.

In Australia some garment suppliers are now offering print services too. Just lost a job to my supplier on price. Yep my garment supplier under sold me when I sent the customer to the link of the shirt on their website. I did not know they offered embroidery and my customer went direct. So we had to build a catalogue and point the customers to our site. 

Now vinyl and printable media suppliers are onto this too. I have a vinyl and printable vinyl importer now selling direct to the public and offering heat pressing. Talk about wanting to corner the whole market.

Not cool guys. I just stop buying from you. But this is now becoming more and more common. 

The issue is they buy the shirts at wholesale prices(cheap) and get a shock when the printing costs more. 

Where you loose out on the margin of the shirts you need to make it up elsewhere.


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## allamerican-aeoon (Aug 14, 2007)

Mabuzi,
I am so sorry to hear your story. Your case is worse than Sthal's. 
Damm no good dogs since i am a dog lover.
There will be similar case will happen in USA by Sthal. Small guy cannot compete big guy head to head.
This is true story,
Sam Sung Korea want to open Tofu and Kimchi factory once. Korean people went crazy about their plan. Gov' had no choice but stop them with create many regulations. I made unique machine of Sequin motif auto machine as a small business scale in Korea. SWF, Sun Star Korea copy my idea and start to mass produce and dump the price. SWF East (Col Deci) was their distributor for little while. We were filing Patent violation suit and complain to Gov' Small business protection dept'. It was not take long to them to moved on. Much faster than Patent lawyers. Meanwhile their copied machine did not work. All were returned and starting to have lots of troubles by dealers and end users. So they shut down that department. We do not need to pursue all the way but Gov' did contact them. Another small guy did copy mine again NC Korea (same size as me) which MESA distribute in USA along with Rhinestone machine. I could not do anything but compete. Lucky me again, their machine was not work too. They shut down and lost lots of money. Now MESA TX does not have this machine line. USA should have similar gov' regulation to make small business can survive. Before anything, individual's family education of wrong or right should be there. This story tells us big guy with no moral has big chance to collapse. 
Cheers! Beers are on me always.


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## Corel Whisperer (Sep 1, 2010)

Ok, Peter, we understand you point of view, and everyone has their right to voice their opinion and you have voiced yours here. I hope what I am about to post will not start another flurry of posts. 
So you are for the little guy, the small business, the person just trying to put food on the table. 
Wonderful! 

I know of a company that started just that way, working out of a garage, trying to put food on the table for their family. Wife left at home with three small children, her husband off fighting in a war for his country, the United States of America. She did everything she could think of to keep her family going and food on the table, working long hours, sometimes only making a very small amount of money a week. But she kept going. The business kept going. She believed in the America Dream, she could make it with hard work and long hours. She kept things going, making letters for garments, getting orders out to her Customers. She created a very successful business and company. She saw a need and made a company out of that need. As time when on she taught this business sense to her sons so they could continue to keep the business going. 

Fine a need, fill a need. 

She was the little guy you are now talking about. 

However, the company she started all those years ago, is also the company you are now complaining about. 

So, my question to you, in 70+ years will someone be voicing this same concern about your company?


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## davidmford (Jan 14, 2012)

CW

It's not about growing your business, it's about stepping on the ones that helped you grow it.

David


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## allamerican-aeoon (Aug 14, 2007)

CW,
Obviously you are not one of who invest ten plus thousands and bought Sthal press and you are other side of river of fire like I am. While I feel bad and jumping around you bring out beer and lawn chair and watching.
If she is from beautiful story you tell here she should known better about small businesses. I am small business but not small as you think. I may be much better off than you are. I am pretty sure. I mean small business here mean above investment could be risk their success of fail. Life time savings.
I made my American dream as she did. Actually much harder. I made money without any shame or guilt. God gave me more than I deserve. I thank all the time. I hate people who own some and act like they are god. I hate people who forget past and used to only now.
Divid C and his father walked into my office few years ago and wanted buy printer. He had lot of sharp questions while father is listen to us. I answered with my best. After long hour, He said he will buy it now. He pulled out his check book and write 1/2 of money and he open his brief case took out brown bag. Bag with cash.
He starting to recount and hand to me bunch by bunch. When we are almost at the end of stacks I saw few bunches was yellowish and redish. I said why it is stained? I ask kindly. David said "those are money my father saved for me in refrigerator inside of chicken for years". I almost cry, my eyeS were watery. I am father too. I gave hthem best deal possible. Still we are best friend. It is the people I SAY SMALL BUSINESS PEOPLE CW!!! I don't know who you are but you never skip meals you never worried where going to sleep every night. Salvation army is only place to shop. You do not know what is small means you do not know what is share is you do not know what is pain is. Lucky you. Get some wisdom of change your shoes for others. I hope it will give you a time to think about you ----. When was the last time you share your luck seriously! Not dollar to street people. Ask yourself. You are typical people of ego. Because I will not lose any, because I do not produce, because they are friend/ partner ( if they are real heart friend you should be stop them), you maybe a their slave. Who knows. Maybe you know who I am. If you do please ignore me if we get chance to meet. In my book you are worthless to know while I am friend crazy person. 
Second thought? You maybe be one of who is involve in ugly project, hhaa!
Cheers! Beers are on me always. But Never with you. Go to heaven.


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## dazzabling (Sep 21, 2011)

I don't have any equipment from Stahl's or All American but I can tell you my experience with both companies are far different. For one, I know which company I would trust and stand behind in a heartbeat without 2nd guessing for a second if I was doing the right thing.
Peter's statements are heartfelt and real. If you ever get the chance to meet Peter and All American traveling team of Tigers you would understand his statements and where he is coming from. He isn't complaining, he is seeing something no one else sees and that for me is a cause of concern. Peter doesn't print shirts or sets up printers at shows he has a talented team doing that. But that same team isn't selling a printer to a small business and then going back to the shop to print and sell tshirts. That would be wrong! 


Props to success and good fortune but look at the bigger picture and see what it looks like from the other side of the street.


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## Rodney (Nov 3, 2004)

Closing out this thread. I think the original question has been answered and people have shared their different viewpoints on the service offering. Things seem to be getting out hand a bit. It's up to each company to decide what is best for their business.


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