# Dip tank solution



## williekid (Apr 22, 2009)

I currently am not using a dip tank, but have one that's been sitting aside for a while. It is a 30 gallon I believe. 

If not mistaken, I need 10 gallons of stripping solution. I priced it and seemed like a good small investment. 

Any advice on how to set up for dip tank process would be greatly appreciated. Maybe an affordable suggested vendor would help.

Also curious to know what kind of production is needed to use the dip tank. I mean I don't struggle with the way I'm doing it now, I would want to get the absolute most out the dip tank process if I decide to continue with it. 

I'm debating whether it is worth the investment as to the system I am currently using.


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## TLK (Jan 15, 2013)

We've been using a dip tank for just over a year now. It's a Ryonet tank that holds 6 - 23 X 31 frames at once. 2 mins in the tank. Get them out, spray them down and they're ready for haze removal / degreasing. It's saved us loads of time. I reckon it's more costly to use sprays vs chemicals that go into the tank, although I haven't taken the time to workout the savings yet.


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## Celtic (Feb 19, 2008)

I think using your diptank is well worth it. 
In the big picture, it is cost effective.
And, it's a big time saver.


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## williekid (Apr 22, 2009)

TLK said:


> We've been using a dip tank for just over a year now. It's a Ryonet tank that holds 6 - 23 X 31 frames at once. 2 mins in the tank. Get them out, spray them down and they're ready for haze removal / degreasing. It's saved us loads of time. I reckon it's more costly to use sprays vs chemicals that go into the tank, although I haven't taken the time to workout the savings yet.


How many psi is your pressure washer and which solution are you using if I may ask?

So about 30 mins to clean 6 screens? 
Do you still degrease after?


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

The CCI stuff Ryonet sells is not the best stuff. If your not going though a bunch of screens it looses its potency even if it's not used. The Saati Chem stuff seemed to stay much longer but I ended up using it as suggested with the IR18 for a 1 step manual removal. The Franmar one step seem to be ok. I am busy from late spring to late summer/fall. If your quick at doing screens one can do screen as fast just less work. Another thing is you have to time the soak correctly as you need to remove before all the emulsion starts falling off. Also the emulsion cones off more in clumps so if you filtering the drain water the filters clogged faster. There is definitely good and bad and if I did more in the winter and had the room I would consider using again. I use my dip tank as a developing tank 

It actually cost me much less per screen chemical cost to do manually. It is more labor though


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## Ripcord (Sep 2, 2006)

When your dip solution begins to weaken, dump in half a gallon of new stripper and it will recharge. I've had my dip tank for going on three years and haven't drained it yet.

Don't listen to the promotional materials that would have you believe it takes off ink and emulsion at once. Get the ink off the screen before you dip it or you will eventually end up with a gooey mess at the bottom of the tank that gets all over your frames.


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## beanie357 (Mar 27, 2011)

love our dip tank.
100 plus screens a day. 2.5 min soak, washout booth, drying oven, shelf.
6 months on original easiway supra at 4-1, added 4-1 until really needed to replace. We think some idiot contaminated it though with 701.
Pulling before anything falls off is the key to this working. Let stuff fall off and reactions continue till fluid is inert and useless.
Go for it.


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

Ripcord said:


> When your dip solution begins to weaken, dump in half a gallon of new stripper and it will recharge. I've had my dip tank for going on three years and haven't drained it yet.
> 
> Don't listen to the promotional materials that would have you believe it takes off ink and emulsion at once. Get the ink off the screen before you dip it or you will eventually end up with a gooey mess at the bottom of the tank that gets all over your frames.


 The good formulas do remove residual ink but a screen should be wiped of all excessive ink. Good tanks have stand offs in the bottom that allow 2-3 inches of debris. Enough room so that it never touches before a change is needed. 

I'm still up in the air though as even though its less labor intensive it still takes me about the same time. with my process of dehazing if needed and then degreaser I did notice that I was dehazing more often which I try to do little as possible but it seemed the exposed areas became stained and I wasn't using a all in one tank solution and ALL ink was removed and screens rinsed before dip tank. this was the CCI stuff that came with the tank.

The Saati stuff I have only used as the Dip Tank In a Bottle combining it with the IR18 as directed. I only had a sample but when I run out of the ER-2 I will be buying a 5 gal but that will be a while as the qt of ER-2 is super concentrated and I have done 600+ screens and still of half the qt remains.


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## Biverson (Oct 20, 2014)

I've got one worth Saati's stuff and it works well. I've found that you need to spray it off immediately after you pull it out and not let it dry or your emulsion is likely to get locked up, or whatever the official term is. 

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## dhoffroad (Oct 21, 2010)

its not 10 gallons of "stripper" its 3 gallons, at least thats what I've seen for the 30 gallon units. 

as for time, I just finally broke down and got a dip tank, we have been having a hard time with our emulsion remover working lately, so we decided to try a dip tank, well its certainly faster. Do a quick ink removal, soak for 2min and blast off emulsion, dehaze/degrease and put in drying rack ready to coat. Reclaiming screens is one of my wifes jobs and she was way happy after the first use of the dip tank....LOL


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## Ripcord (Sep 2, 2006)

sben763 said:


> The good formulas do remove residual ink but a screen should be wiped of all excessive ink. Good tanks have stand offs in the bottom that allow 2-3 inches of debris. Enough room so that it never touches before a change is needed.


Mine (Easiway) will remove some ink on the emulsion but not the open areas of the stencil. Since I need to wipe the screen anyway I might as well do it first. I just have the basic tank and the bottom gets gooey if I don't do that. Also I don't like wondering what I'll do with that gooey sludge when I eventually drain it.


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## williekid (Apr 22, 2009)

sben763 said:


> The CCI stuff Ryonet sells is not the best stuff. If your not going though a bunch of screens it looses its potency even if it's not used. The Saati Chem stuff seemed to stay much longer but I ended up using it as suggested with the IR18 for a 1 step manual removal. The Franmar one step seem to be ok. I am busy from late spring to late summer/fall. If your quick at doing screens one can do screen as fast just less work. Another thing is you have to time the soak correctly as you need to remove before all the emulsion starts falling off. Also the emulsion cones off more in clumps so if you filtering the drain water the filters clogged faster. There is definitely good and bad and if I did more in the winter and had the room I would consider using again. I use my dip tank as a developing tank
> 
> It actually cost me much less per screen chemical cost to do manually. It is more labor though



Your good at what you do man, I understand exactly what you mean, I never had experience with dip tank but I can see exactly what you say. I have a stystem that allows me to reclaim screens 2 minute per screen degreased. I don't think a dip tank would beat me, if all prolly just little less labor by not by very much.

I agree I do not like ryonet's products too much. I actually have a green solution that works amazingly great. I dont know what it is though i tried looking it up long while back and found no luck. Its made by fijifilm i believe and its very great smelling no harsh at all. Like a citris. I have used the all in 1 solution from ryonet and i did not like that stuff at all


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## williekid (Apr 22, 2009)

Ripcord said:


> When your dip solution begins to weaken, dump in half a gallon of new stripper and it will recharge. I've had my dip tank for going on three years and haven't drained it yet.
> 
> Don't listen to the promotional materials that would have you believe it takes off ink and emulsion at once. Get the ink off the screen before you dip it or you will eventually end up with a gooey mess at the bottom of the tank that gets all over your frames.


Awsome tip. Thank you 

Im thinking about what sben said and i'm thinking maybe i'm still small fish in production for a dip tank.


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## williekid (Apr 22, 2009)

Yall people are the greatest, I love T-Shirt Forums lol. 

I'm going to see if I can get the name of the green formula if one of you all would like to try it. This stuff takes off emulsion, ink, haze and i believe it might even degrease all in one and smells like orange citris. Might be pretty pricey though. 

It's interesting how everyone works differently and uses different products. 

Thanks a ton you guys.


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## Printor (Apr 16, 2015)

I've found the same results as Sean. You should be able to treat 6 screens with remover in 2 minutes. If I'm treating manualy, I treat a batch of 20 at a time. Costwise, I spend a little less on remover treating manually. I've found using remover only, lasts waaay longer than the all in one stuff. It really seams like ink kills your chems. I also think different cleaning chemicals must have different effects on how long it lasts. The all in ones make a real mess of your tank, frames and just the whole area, with that grey sludge. I mainly use my tank because I often have to drop what I'm doing and answer the phone or go talk to a client. Sucks when you mind is focused on " CRAP! Am I destroying hundreds of dollars worth of screen right now?" when I should be focused on the client, pleasing them and makin some more $$$ And you Vets know what it's like to fry your pressure washer after the hardware stores close, and had to go to bed thinking about how you just froze $300 worth of 305s cuz you couldn't get your mits on a $100 pressure washer.


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## williekid (Apr 22, 2009)

Printor said:


> I've found the same results as Sean. You should be able to treat 6 screens with remover in 2 minutes. If I'm treating manualy, I treat a batch of 20 at a time. Costwise, I spend a little less on remover treating manually. I've found using remover only, lasts waaay longer than the all in one stuff. It really seams like ink kills your chems. I also think different cleaning chemicals must have different effects on how long it lasts. The all in ones make a real mess of your tank, frames and just the whole area, with that grey sludge. I mainly use my tank because I often have to drop what I'm doing and answer the phone or go talk to a client. Sucks when you mind is focused on " CRAP! Am I destroying hundreds of dollars worth of screen right now?" when I should be focused on the client, pleasing them and makin some more $$$ And you Vets know what it's like to fry your pressure washer after the hardware stores close, and had to go to bed thinking about how you just froze $300 worth of 305s cuz you couldn't get your mits on a $100 pressure washer.




I'm really feeling now as the tank is a waste of money, a larger investment and takes a certain production possibly with an employee strictly doing that putting it to use on time as I completely understand what you mean by dealing with customers printing and all. I'm a one man team but I have worked for companies as shop manager running it all, with employees but i have created a system that allows me to eliminate employees. 
I only use emulsion remover and degreaser as solutions. Prolly takes me about 1 minute per screen to reclaim on a fast scale. I typically clean about 10-20 at a time. Doesn't take me much longer than a hour. 
I rarely use haze remover.

I have all sorts of product solutions, people always contact me asking if I would like to purchase their stuff. Not sure why but they do.

One thing i never took into factor was that you have to remove the screens prior to emulsion falling off it sludge up in the tank.


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## williekid (Apr 22, 2009)

Now that i think about it, I used that stuff from ryonet and it worked good for emulsion but didn't like how it removed the ink. I had read bad reviews on it already but the solution was given to me so figured why not use it. 

If i had to guess, im sure ryonet would say clean the screen free of much ink as possible, which now that i have grown i would agree. In that case doing them manually is most efficient.


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## Biverson (Oct 20, 2014)

I've also found that CCI Envirohaze takes off the emulsion even if the screens been locked tight in emulsion. I've had to treat screens up to 3 times, but worth getting it back into production. Even if my reclaimer doesn't do it the Envirohaze does. When I first started out a lot of my screens were underexposed and were a pain to reclaim, but Envirohaze is the best. 

If you use hot water that helps too for tough screens. 

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## williekid (Apr 22, 2009)

Biverson said:


> I've also found that CCI Envirohaze takes off the emulsion even if the screens been locked tight in emulsion. I've had to treat screens up to 3 times, but worth getting it back into production. Even if my reclaimer doesn't do it the Envirohaze does. When I first started out a lot of my screens were underexposed and were a pain to reclaim, but Envirohaze is the best.
> 
> If you use hot water that helps too for tough screens.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


I have heard of screens locking in the emulsion, unfortunately in my entire years I have never had the opportunity to experience it. I spray emulsion remover and have left for 3 hours or even a day or 2 come back and just spray more on it and pressure wash it and all comes out. Maybe has to do with the solution or maybe im just doing something right i dont know about. 

hmm, who knows 

Could be also that i dont leave screens for too long. I only leave screens for super repeat customers and for multi color orders that are for repeats. Even then they only last so long as I like great tension on my screens.


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## Printor (Apr 16, 2015)

Biverson said:


> I've also found that CCI Envirohaze takes off the emulsion even if the screens been locked tight in emulsion. I've had to treat screens up to 3 times, but worth getting it back into production. Even if my reclaimer doesn't do it the Envirohaze does. When I first started out a lot of my screens were underexposed and were a pain to reclaim, but Envirohaze is the best.
> 
> If you use hot water that helps too for tough screens.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


interesting.....I have not heard of this black magic.
 I must investigate....


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

Biverson said:


> I've also found that CCI Envirohaze takes off the emulsion even if the screens been locked tight in emulsion. I've had to treat screens up to 3 times, but worth getting it back into production. Even if my reclaimer doesn't do it the Envirohaze does. When I first started out a lot of my screens were underexposed and were a pain to reclaim, but Envirohaze is the best.
> 
> If you use hot water that helps too for tough screens.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


You mean this stuff!!!

I also have never locked a screen and although I use all rollers I would want to have to remesh them. 

Most dehazers especially the nasty one will remove locked emulsion. Bleach also if soaked. I bought a lot of 100 roller screens and a lot of them where locked. After about 5 I picked out the best frames, cut the mesh out and sold the rest. They were 18x20 and I sold for $7 and still made $$$


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## Biverson (Oct 20, 2014)

sben763 said:


> You mean this stuff!!!
> 
> I also have never locked a screen and although I use all rollers I would want to have to remesh them.
> 
> Most dehazers especially the nasty one will remove locked emulsion. Bleach also if soaked. I bought a lot of 100 roller screens and a lot of them where locked. After about 5 I picked out the best frames, cut the mesh out and sold the rest. They were 18x20 and I sold for $7 and still made $$$


That's the stuff! I use all Saati's except for the Dehazer. I have some Saati hr3 but the CCI blows it out of of the water. 

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## williekid (Apr 22, 2009)

sben763 said:


> You mean this stuff!!!
> 
> I also have never locked a screen and although I use all rollers I would want to have to remesh them.
> 
> Most dehazers especially the nasty one will remove locked emulsion. Bleach also if soaked. I bought a lot of 100 roller screens and a lot of them where locked. After about 5 I picked out the best frames, cut the mesh out and sold the rest. They were 18x20 and I sold for $7 and still made $$$


Is dehazing really neccessary, I use to have ghost stains but that was before i had the set up i have now. I rarely get a screen to stain, and if i do its because i left the ink, which is a habbit i broke.

I have like 3 types of dehazing but rarely use them.


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

Biverson said:


> That's the stuff! I use all Saati's except for the Dehazer. I have some Saati hr3 but the CCI blows it out of of the water.


That's what funny about chemicals. I have the exact opposite results. I have extremely hard water and my screens become discolored. With the HR3 I apply to a dry screen and almost instantly it removes all discoloring. The enviro haze removes also and can be applied to a wet screen but then oddly after degreasing the stains show up lightly with all but the HR3. 



williekid said:


> Is dehazing really neccessary, I use to have ghost stains but that was before i had the set up i have now. I rarely get a screen to stain, and if i do its because i left the ink, which is a habbit i broke.
> 
> I have like 3 types of dehazing but rarely use them.


Only as needed. I can go 2-4 screen cycles before dehazing is needed. I honestly hate the term ghost image. Cause a ghost image to me is the image you can see but doesn't contain any color. This is due to the abrasion on the screen in the open area. The ink stains and water deposits can effect the screen and the only time I dehaze. Dehazer will loosen glue on statics if allowed touch the bonding area. 

The only thing that will lighten or remove a ghost image is abrading. A true ghost image will not effect the screen and besides maybe a new screen abrading isn't recommended and will shorten a screens life. If doing some high end images with halftones abrading can help you hold dots and even allow one to expose higher LPI on lower mesh. Under a microscope the abrading make tiny hairs. 


As for the original subject. I am not lazy and don't mind a little work. Plus I use all roller frames and after years of refurbishing others dirty frames I make sure every time my screens are clean. The time I was using the dip tank I found some of the stuff was getting behind my mesh protector tape and in the creases. I don't discourage anyone from trying and honestly I really like my developing tank. I expose screens and throw them in the tank and let sit for several min. 90% of the time I can washout with almost no pressure so I don't regret trying the tank and if I ever get more space I may try another tank with different chemicals but I have no intensions of ever elimanting the developing tank.


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## williekid (Apr 22, 2009)

sben763 said:


> That's what funny about chemicals. I have the exact opposite results. I have extremely hard water and my screens become discolored. With the HR3 I apply to a dry screen and almost instantly it removes all discoloring. The enviro haze removes also and can be applied to a wet screen but then oddly after degreasing the stains show up lightly with all but the HR3.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I agree as needed, i'm the same way, I love the small labor behind all that I do so i can understand. If I had to put some thought into it all, I would say the difference is that you have roller frames which are reusable until the mesh tears. I on the other hand, use a high pressure washer which i'm aware that it's too strong and I notice it takes the tension of my screens out slowly but surely. I have found a place that restreches my aluminums for a very affordable cost or purchasing a new one and well somehow it just seems to work for me at the moment until I am able to improve. I had already purchased it for $600 before I developed this current system that works great i'm just always open to efficient progress. It does beat electric pressure washers as I have had so many in the past and they are not dependable. I use haze remover once in a blue moon due to the final results of my screens being like new. 

I do credit you on the knowledge of science that you know well behind the process of it all. I have seen you in many threads and you are very talented and take what you do seriously as I can see.

I do see potential in a dip tank just maybe for me it isn't the time for one although I do own one and can hold onto it for a bit much longer until put into use. I'm growing yearly and this year have grown more and its becoming to where eventually I will be forced to hire someone possibly to work my screen dept. 

I'm always willing to learn so I like to ask questions to learn. I realize that this line of business isn't too bad and I really enjoy it other than the profit generated from it. 

I don't know everything so all advice is very appreciated from you and all other members.


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## sben763 (May 17, 2009)

Any pressure washer as you use a wider tip reduces the pressure. A 0 bit creates the max pressure so if it rated at 2500psi it will be around that pressure. A 60 degree bit may only produce 1200 psi on a 2500 psi pressure washer. 

I like screen print. It give me a avenue to art. I couldn't draw a stick figure corectly. My brother can draw, sculpt, and paint. I have always wanted to be able to do some type do art. 

The technical side of me comes from years in other industries. I did develop a exposure unit and in doing so learned more then I ever wanted to about the technical aspects of screen(mesh), emulsion, film, light and so on. Now that it's almost complete I look forward to getting back to printing more again. I have 2 clothing lines that I've only done a few test prints and many designs ready some that have been on hold for years.

This was my last test print. After the run up test prints only 1 garment was made. This was plasticharge white, red, yellow.


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## williekid (Apr 22, 2009)

sben763 said:


> Any pressure washer as you use a wider tip reduces the pressure. A 0 bit creates the max pressure so if it rated at 2500psi it will be around that pressure. A 60 degree bit may only produce 1200 psi on a 2500 psi pressure washer.
> 
> I like screen print. It give me a avenue to art. I couldn't draw a stick figure corectly. My brother can draw, sculpt, and paint. I have always wanted to be able to do some type do art.
> 
> ...



That's very amazing results and skills. Unfortunately I have not reached that level in screen printing but do hope to do so possibly during winter when business slows down if it does as I began this past year getting many hoodies ordered along with long sleeves. 

I understand I did not learn the little I know yesterday, it has taken me years, trial by error, working for shops and meeting many. 
I am the same way I cannot draw for nothing, but have gained lots of experience in working with photoshop and knowing the software well. 

I have a weird way of creating my vector files but it works great and fast for me so it's what matters for the time being although I would love to eventually expand my skills in learning it more intense with proper understanding. 
I recently began networking and have met many artist including a brother of mine who is extremely talented with art, airbrush, canvas and much more just doesn't have much time on his hands to help me out.

I enjoy screen printing, vinyl, and all that I do with all I got. I'm still young and don't plan on stopping ever. 

I been working on my shop one day hoping to share with all. 
Running is a business is hard work but all worth it. I really enjoy it just as I get to see so much art and crazy ideas that people come up with and just learning the science behind it all. 

I soon need to understand art seperations due to wanting to try different printing processes. Also yea, I know about the pressure washer, mine is actually 3000 psi which is the full force at 0 degree tip. 

Just got tired of all the electrical ones and I could of went lower budget but at this time and of need it was the only decent one with a honda motor. 

Maybe another reason why takes so less of work and solutions to reclaim screen for me.


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## Biverson (Oct 20, 2014)

sben763 said:


> That's what funny about chemicals. I have the exact opposite results. I have extremely hard water and my screens become discolored. With the HR3 I apply to a dry screen and almost instantly it removes all discoloring. The enviro haze removes also and can be applied to a wet screen but then oddly after degreasing the stains show up lightly with all but the HR3.


Ahhh, I've always used it on a wet screen. I'll give her a go one of these times on a dry one and see if I get better results. Since I'm home based my water is soft too. 

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