# Looking to start dye sublimation side business...



## jwaldmann (Aug 12, 2012)

Hi guys,

I'm looking to start printing dye sublimated iPhone covers. Can you guys lend me a hand in figuring this thing out? I know it is a lot but I really appreciate the help.

I will be purchasing from Conde.
DyeTrans™ SG 3110DN Printer & Ink Set
Get in business for only: $ 525.00 - NEW LOW PRICE!
209221 - SubliJet-R Ink,Black,SG3110DN
209222 - SubliJet-R Ink, Cyan, SG3110DN
209223 - SubliJet-R Ink, Magenta
209224 - SubliJet-R Ink, Yellow,
405750 - Printer,Ricoh SG3110DN, GelJet
F3U133-10 - Cable, USB A/B Connectors, 10'
TP-8511R - TexPrintR Ricoh Sublimation

Is this a good package? I know I need to add the iPhone cases.
I have a basic heat press is that sufficient or do I need one with a digital pressure output or is soft/medium/hard (by hand kind of feel) good enough?

The ink has 42ml in it. How long does that really last for? I know it depends on the colors that you print in an image, but is it 10 prints of 50 prints or 100 prints... Since it is around $100 for black and $70-80 for the other colors it kind of should last a little while...


I saw that the ink has an expiration date.... How long does it usually last for? Is that once it is opened and installed or is it a date from when it was manufactured.


I know that you can print one 100% poly light color garments. Can you print on 100% dark poly garments? What about 65%poly 35% cotton? What kind of washout will you get (can you include and image)?


Is there any other information that I need to start?

This is the process of dye sublimation printing (to my knowledge). Please correct me if I am wrong.

1) Print artwork onto dye sublimation transfer paper using special ink and printer
2) Apply sublimation paper to aluminum backing (for the iPhone case) using a heat press for a specific amount of time/ pressure and at a certain temp.
3) apply aluminum backing to iPhone case.
4) Enjoy.

Is there a step that I am missing? Or any other information?

I really appreciate this and am looking forward to your answers.

Jonathan.


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## greenmonkey (Aug 18, 2012)

Hi Jonathan,

The package from Conde is very good! I highly recommend Conde Systems for products and support (I'm sure some will disagree).

Your ink usage will determine how long it really lasts. The Ricoh printers are very good about not wasting ink.

David at Conde Systems can give you more info on the expiration dates on the ink carts....but I would not be afraid to use an expired cart as long it's not too long past the date. Others may have a different opinion.

Sublimation on garments works best on 100% polyester, light colors only (white, ash, light pastel colors).

You can sub onto 50/50 cotton/poly blends but keep in mind the ink will NOT bond with the cotton fibers, only the poly so you will have some washout. This gives a "vintage" look to the image. The more poly you have in the blend, the more vibrant the image will be.

Sublimating dark garments is not possible.

Printing white is not possible. In sublimation, the color white is an "absence of color." Meaning wherever you have white in your image, this will become the color of the garment or substrate your are imaging.

Your steps on sublimating procedure is correct (using the the iPhone example).

Hope this helps get you on your way!
Allen


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## pisquee (Jan 8, 2012)

Technically, you _can_ sublimation print onto a dark garment, but you won't see the image, as you are dying the fabric - you can't dye fabric lighter than it is - so your ink will be there, just not really visible - think what would happen if you used felt-tip pens on a black t-shirt or black paper. White t-shirts are best, and then the more colour the t-shirt itself has in it, the more it will affect the visibility (and resulting colour) of your image. 

I would add to the comment about the Ricohs being "good at not wasting ink" that this depends on your point of view - to stop them clogging with ink they automatically run head cleans to a schedule using your expensive ink to do so.


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## greenmonkey (Aug 18, 2012)

pisquee said:


> Technically, you _can_ sublimation print onto a dark garment, but you won't see the image, as you are dying the fabric - you can't dye fabric lighter than it is - so your ink will be there, just not really visible - think what would happen if you used felt-tip pens on a black t-shirt or black paper. White t-shirts are best, and then the more colour the t-shirt itself has in it, the more it will affect the visibility (and resulting colour) of your image.
> 
> *Technically, you are correct. I use the Sharpie on a black t-shirt as a example when explaining to customers about subbing a dark garment. Back in the 90's, I used a "carrier" base for the sublimated image. Was like a "patch" of white material that was pressed onto the shirt. Was okay..but not desirable.*
> 
> I would add to the comment about the Ricohs being "good at not wasting ink" that this depends on your point of view - to stop them clogging with ink they automatically run head cleans to a schedule using your expensive ink to do so.


*I have had nothing but a great experience with my Ricohs so far. In my opinion, better the printer maintain itself than me having to worry about nozzle checks and head cleanings, none of which I have had to do on my Ricohs since I've had them. My prints always turn out great  YMMV.*


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## Max Dos (Aug 28, 2010)

Here in Mexico, Epsons dominate the field, and you have to keep an eye on them to avoid clogging. As others have stated the key to maintain the printers trouble free is to print often. MGParrish pointed, in another thread, to an application that automatically prints patterns on user defined intervals.

This is the link: 

Print head cleaning the easy way. No more clogged inkjets with Harvey Head Cleaner.

Good luck!


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## paintersspouse (Jul 26, 2012)

I have an Epson and using Harvey head cleaner. works great for me.


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## pisquee (Jan 8, 2012)

We print fairly often, but are normal people who go on holiday for a few weeks, and take days off, or have quiet periods. We don't use an auto cleaning program. Our printers run fine, though only time we had a problems which took a few head cleans to sort out, was when we moved 250 miles north, with the printers sitting in a delivery truck, and then in a cold garage for a couple of weeks, before being put back into use. In this case the pigment ink printer was worse than the sublimation. Both Epson Stylus Pro (wide format) printers. Ricohs don't go big enough for us.


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## greenmonkey (Aug 18, 2012)

I know there is a BIG difference of opinion on Ricoh vs Epson on this forum..but that is not what the OP asked about. He inquired about the Ricoh package from Conde. I was not trying to get a "my printer is better than your printer" war going (which is the way is seemed to be headed).

I'm a one-man-shop and I print nearly every day so I have not yet experienced any problems with my Ricoh printers (knock on wood). For me, Ricoh is the best solution for now. Until something better comes along, I'll stick with it.

My current system is far better than what I was using in the 90's. I had two Seiko printers, a ColorPoint 7204 and a ColorPoint 5504. They were ribbon printers and were excellent for their time.

Whichever system you choose Jonathan, may you have the best experience with it. I hope the comments here have helped.

Allen


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## Riderz Ready (Sep 18, 2008)

Today the issue isn't really Epson vs Ricoh as it appears that regardless of the printer you need to use them both frequently or you will have issues. "Clogging" is a ink issue not a printer issue thus the main difference between an Epson and Ricoh is cost of the printer.


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## paintersspouse (Jul 26, 2012)

Riderz Ready said:


> Today the issue isn't really Epson vs Ricoh as it appears that regardless of the printer you need to use them both frequently or you will have issues. "Clogging" is a ink issue not a printer issue thus the main difference between an Epson and Ricoh is cost of the printer.


The cost of the ink was the big factor for me.


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## pisquee (Jan 8, 2012)

... and with Epsons (and Brothers) you have a far greater choice of inks to find the best quality and price, whereas with the Ricoh you are pretty much tied to Sawgrass.


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## Riderz Ready (Sep 18, 2008)

pisquee said:


> ... and with Epsons (and Brothers) you have a far greater choice of inks to find the best quality and price, whereas with the Ricoh you are pretty much tied to Sawgrass.


As anyone who has been on this forum in the past knows I am far from a fan of Sawgrass and their business practices BUT for someone new to dye sub it is critical they have someone to hold their hand through the learning process. A Johnson Plastic, Costal, Conde are critical to people starting out in this industry.

Have to suck it up and pay the price upfront while you learn. Furthermore for people doing mugs, iPhone cases and the likes the ink cost is nothing unless they are doing 1000's a month.


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## Max Dos (Aug 28, 2010)

Riderz is spot on. Down here we had almost zero support and had to learn by trial and error. Lots of waste on materials.


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## pisquee (Jan 8, 2012)

buying from a supplier that will support you doesn't mean you have to buy from Sawgrass.

Whilst I do agree newbies need support in getting set up and learning things, and buying from a big reputable supplier can be a safe way to go, going the Ricoh route pretty much locks you in long term to Sawgrass ink (which is why I guess they are pushed more so than Epsons) If a newbie got a Sawgrass supported Epson, then they have the option when/if they want of sourcing better inks and switching over.


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## paintersspouse (Jul 26, 2012)

I agree my supplier is not Sawgrass and they support me just fine.


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## Riderz Ready (Sep 18, 2008)

Max Dos said:


> Riderz is spot on. Down here we had almost zero support and had to learn by trial and error. Lots of waste on materials.


People need to realize dye sub is part art part science. Heck even with support and experience new stuff is hit and miss. You are going to toss a lot of stuff out while you are learning.

As stated before ink cost should be the last thing one is worried about when first starting and again if you are doing iPhone cases and mugs you can double the cost of Sawgrass ink and it still will not effect whether you are successful or not.

If someone is getting great support from a non Sawgrass ink distibutor do not just talk about - share the information. Does little good to mention such without assisting others with the information.


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## Sues Shirts (May 17, 2011)

We use Condie, there customer service is great! There technical addvice is also great! We have been using them for about 2 years now.

Sent from my SCH-I800 using T-Shirt Forums


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## paintersspouse (Jul 26, 2012)

Why is it that you seem you get so upset with others that share information on sublimation inks for small format that are not are not Sawgrass?

You are perfectly aware that the advertising of such inks could cause the supplier grief because of a ridiculous patent and the price gouging that goes along with it.

I found my supplier here because others shared the info in and I am very glad they did.

There is a sublimation learning curve but the ink and printer choice is a small part of it. Dwell temp and time are much bigger problems than ink choice.


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## 343paul (Jan 1, 2012)

Got a ricoh 7700 from Conde and it was my first ever venture into dyesub. Worked with Michele for the purchase at phone x229 and she was outstanding. I'd have to say that Conde has the best how to videos for all their products. They also have photoshop templates for printing iphone covers etc. If you are just starting out in dyesub go with Conde you wont regret it!


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