# Cost for a good automatic press



## Alan (Jul 7, 2007)

Hi guys,

I'm looking into an automatic screen press but can't find prices anywhere. Can anybody throw a rough figure for what to expect? At least six color, semi to full auto. Is it a lot more than DTG?


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## Alan (Jul 7, 2007)

Nevermind, I finally found a price. Anybody here heard of the Lawson Automatic Trooper?


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## SLGProduction (Jun 10, 2007)

I have heard of Lawson, dont know too much about them. Just contact the company that makes them, they will give you a price. We have M&R and love them. Some other companies right off the top of my head are MHM, Anatol, Workhorse, Tas, Hopkins, Progressive.


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## Calibrated (Oct 26, 2006)

I think that you really need to ask yourself, before spending any money why you NEED and automatic press?

Your post is comparing a direct to shirt machine(very low production) with automatic printing equipment that will require you to have many other pieces of equipment that compliment it just to make it work.

While I will argue that dollar for dollar no company can offer a better entry level automatic press than the Anatol Horizon Press, its certainly not even in the same ballpark to make a comparison to a DTG machine.

Each has its place, and use. but while the Anatol will produce upwards of 600+ shirts an hour, you would NEVER get those numbers with an ENTIRE day using a DTG. 

You need to re-assess your needs, and compare apples to apples when deciding what to purchase.


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## Alan (Jul 7, 2007)

Oh, I was just using the DTG's for a price comparison. I'm definitely not looking for a DTG.

I found one for about ten thousand which, extra gear included is about the same ballpark as a 15,000 DTG. Is there some extra equipment I'm not thinking about? (I factored in conveyer dryers and darkrooms, etc.) Are you using an automatic yourself?


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## printandprint (Sep 24, 2007)

Alan said:


> Oh, I was just using the DTG's for a price comparison. I'm definitely not looking for a DTG.
> 
> I found one for about ten thousand which, extra gear included is about the same ballpark as a 15,000 DTG. Is there some extra equipment I'm not thinking about? (I factored in conveyer dryers and darkrooms, etc.) Are you using an automatic yourself?



Planting a $5 tree needs a $20 hole. 

The collateral expenses depend on your level of press and volume of business. 

Of course there is the garment dryer for plastisol inks. The dryer needs to be rated to keep up with your press. If it is gas, you need a enough feed. 

Does your equipment need 3-phase power? That costs a lot to install. If it is 220v single phase, 200 amps can run out very quickly.

Does your press use air? A good air compressor like a Gardner Denver or a Quincy costs $2000 or more. A $200-$250 compressor (50% duty cycle rating) can last a while, but we've blown a head gasket, a reed valve, an oil seal, a piston rod, and contactor all within a 1.5 year span. Sometimes 2 out of 3 of these lighter duty compressor are out of service. 3 units to support 1 press.

With an automatic press and the ability to print several colors & underbase and by printing 6-10 jobs per day, screens and the supply of fresh coated screens becomes an issue. We wear out screens often enough, so our screen budget at $40 a pop is significant. Even with 150-200-300 screens, it is never enough. You should have a supply of various mesh screens for various jobs.


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## shersher (Jul 25, 2007)

Yes, we just got an M&R and it is working out great. The good thing about them is that they custom build on your shop so the press can fit well


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## printandprint (Sep 24, 2007)

shersher said:


> Yes, we just got an M&R and it is working out great. The good thing about them is that they custom build on your shop so the press can fit well


Another thing about M&R which I really love (aside from being workhorse quality equipment) is that every wire in there or every fork terminal is labeled with a number. The corresponding wiring schematic matches exactly. There is also a metal plate giving you the wiring schematic number so you can get the right diagram to match your machine. (Sometimes the same machine might have several revisions.)

*So* much easier to troubleshoot when you have a good schematic, especially when there is more than 1 problem at the same time. This happened to me recently with a flash unit that had a bad fuse, a bad sensor, and a bad relay. Traditional scientific method of replacing one thing and trying to observe a change wasn't working. After they emailed the schematic, I figured things out rather quickly.

Their support is generally good. Some hit and miss, but you can draw out a lot of valuable information from them if you are persistent. 

For the non M&R equipment, the nightmare continues. Some of it is labeled ok, but the support isn't there.


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## mk162 (Sep 24, 2007)

Or you could be like us and get a lemon M&R. It works pretty well now, it's about due for a good service call. We had some HUGE problems in the beginning. All under warranty.

Personally, I am done with M&R. Our next press will be an Anatol.


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## staned (Feb 25, 2007)

iv'e seen alot on the boards about how much volume you have to have going before you can go auto. this is a load of b/s. there is no reason to even start using a manual. if you are going into the lawn cutting service, do you start with a push mower? the plan says no gas mower untill you get 20 yards to mow, but at 15 yards it's taking all your time and your to wore out to look for more work. besides your lawn cutting jobs are looking kinda like someone used a push mower and your starting to lose interest in the whole lawn cutting deal. who says you can't start with a auto. it's learning curve is shorter and frees up your time(something the manual printer doesn't seem to value) i sold my hopkins 8/8 manual yesterday, hadn't used it in years and didn't shed any tears. printing on a auto is a kick in the *** and worth every dime of 40k. go to the iss show longbeach ca jan.2008. thats the best place on the planet earth to buy a auto. oh yeah, when you go to longbeach take a car because walking will take to long, your feet might start hurting and you could lose the drive that made you start out on your journy. thats my bong load. stan


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## brent smith (Oct 15, 2007)

M&r Automatics Are The Best For The Money!!! User Friendly, Good Support,fast Print Capabilties,ect. Everyone Else Only Tries To Duplicate M&r Technologies. We Have A 12 Color 14 Station, A 6 Color 8 Satation, A 14 Color 16 Station, Two 8 Color 10 Station, And A 12 Color Fourteen Station Antol. All M&r Exept For The Anatol. I Have Also Worked On American Presses, M&r By Far The Best Out There.


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## printandprint (Sep 24, 2007)

staned said:


> iv'e seen alot on the boards about how much volume you have to have going before you can go auto. this is a load of b/s. there is no reason to even start using a manual.
> 
> <snipped>



Time is one thing of value, but money is another. Banks repossess your press when you can't pay.

The M&R press we use was nearly $80,000 which does not count all of the supporting actors (dryer, air, electric refit, blah blah). The presence of an automatic press doesn't negate the need for a manual press, which is why we bought an M&R chameleon in addition. (The old manual would not fit the same screens) 

The auto is booked most of the time, but the manual keeps turning too for the jobs that it can handle. No sense in wasting the valuable time of the auto when it is a funky placement or tiny order. Just to setup all the ink, trilock and test print a 1-color job can take as long as turning it out on the manual. Some items we print (like blankets) are impossible on the automatic press.

I don't know that an underwriter is going to grant $100K+ to an upstart screen printer in an industry where the turnover is high and good credit is hard to find. You need an established customer base and a basis to prove future returns.

If you have enough cash to buy one outright, then you are brave to be entering this industry I think.

The requirement of leverage and liquidity is a limiting factor of most any company out there. Dow, Nasdaq, S&P members; they all have these challenges. Even Trump got into a financial squeeze once.

This is why so many advise to start small and work your way up when you can. It's why I had to rent before I could buy. It's why my first car was really old and cheap.


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## staned (Feb 25, 2007)

okay, so you ended up talking wall street and trump. example#2- so mowing lawns with the push mower didn't pan out, because you couldn't overcome the strangle hold of your rigid plan. so now your thinking about a embroidery company. using your way of thinking start up should be very low, right? just a handful of needles some thread and walla your up and running! don't want to start to big, might not work. besides plan says you must be doing more volume before you can get that machine. so your stitching away by hand and it looks like it. stay down and pay your dues until the plan deems you worthy of a auto. i'm pretty sure this isn't the plan trump made his money on. buy the dammm auto or YOU ARE FIRED !!!


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## Solmu (Aug 15, 2005)

These examples are stupid, and hardly comparable. Is an auto better? Obviously. So what? Frequently the choice isn't manual or auto, it's manual or *nothing*. So it's not a matter of "How frigging great is my automatic press? I want to marry it, but that's only allowed in Tasmania " It's a matter of "Should I buy a manual to get me started, and aspire to an auto? Or should I just give up now because I can't afford to start at the top?"

Your silly lawn care example makes no sense. You can't have a lawn mowing business with a manual, and an automatic is affordable. With screenprinting you *can* have a successful business manually printing, and not everyone can afford an automatic from the start.

Different businesses have different costs of entry; embroidery is more expensive than screenprinting is more expensive than lawn care is more expensive than a lemonade stand is more expensive than CafePress.

It's a hierarchy, but essentially you're suggesting that if you can't start out the top of the food chain, don't even bother.


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