# CAMS Machine Pricing



## rhinestoneshirts (Mar 15, 2008)

I have the opportunity to buy a used CAMS. I know how much they go for new but I am not sure of the depreciation. I can get an 06 1v-6p for $24000 for everything including the compressor. It was only used for about a year. The owner got sick and no longer has the time. Does it sound like a good deal? She wanted 28 but I was able to talk her down


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## lizziemaxine (Nov 14, 2007)

Call the company that makes the machine and ask them if it is a good price for the equipment.


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## rhinestonetransf (Feb 11, 2009)

Check the stones per minute or find out if it is the cams that uses the shock absorber to stop the head. If it is the 70 spm model I would pass but if your not worried about speed and don't mind replacing a couple of parts every so often the price is in line. Make sure you have a dryer on the compressor or you will hurt the parts in the machine. If they ran the machine for a year without a dryer on the compressor I would make sure that you have a tech look over the machine and make sure the machine is ok.

From what I know they won't honor the warranty if you don't have a dryer on the compressor because of the damage the water in the air line does.


Call SWF they sell the Cam and ask them about the machine they sell it.


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## rhinestoneshirts (Mar 15, 2008)

Thanks. I believe it is the 70 stone per minute model. Is this considerably slower than the new cams 1v-6p models? Are all the old model cams 70 stones per minute? Also, you mention the dryer with the compressor, what kind of problems do moisture in the lines create? It is expensive to fix? I wonder if I would be better off going with the 1v-2p model because that is 150 stones per minute


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## rhinestonetransf (Feb 11, 2009)

I don't know what parts it hurts but I'm sure they will tell you just so you know what to look for. No matter how fast the machine is you will always need it to be faster. I don't know much about the 2 head model what is the transfer size or the plate size. You can always leave the tape down and run the other two colors so if you had a three or four color job you would still be able to do it. I know of someone who bought the 70 spm machine off ebay for $18,995 and after a few months they had to replace some parts because of the water in the line so he runs a dryer with it now. Don't know if any of this is much help but figured I would give you the info I had.


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## lifestar (Mar 18, 2007)

Hi Belle- We own a CAMS and it is awesome. I would ask if the owner had to replace any motors or other parts.... and water getting in to the system is a huge caution as Scott stated. 

Thank goodness we have a machinist on our staff, because the maintenence, and oil change and such is more than our staff could handle (we realized this after we bought it). Our machinist also knew enough to install a special filter between the compressor and machine to filter out the most water possible and still we have to empty. Also, if the machine is under warranty and they purchased the machine from SWF you are in luck... they have AWESOME customer service and will bend over backwards to help with technical issues. After you find out about any repairs or part replacements, you should call SWFMesa.com and ask them what they think about the price.


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## piabows27 (Dec 16, 2011)

just bought a used 1v-2p machine! it is a little over 2 years old. I got it for $9,000, that doesnt include the compressor or chiller! So excited for it to be delivered!


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## ifusion (Jun 3, 2011)

piabows27 said:


> just bought a used 1v-2p machine! it is a little over 2 years old. I got it for $9,000, that doesnt include the compressor or chiller! So excited for it to be delivered!


Congratz! I bought my machine used too. When you get it, make sure you watch the maintenace videos on it.

Make sure you lube up everything, align the plates, poke a paper clip in the nozzles to make sure there arent any jams, whipe off the silicon pads with a damp cloth and dry it to make sure you get a good "grab" on the transfer paper, and hopefully your off!

I had to work through a few adjustments before getting started, but the staff at coldesi was awesome in getting me up and running.


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## piabows27 (Dec 16, 2011)

ifusion said:


> Congratz! I bought my machine used too. When you get it, make sure you watch the maintenace videos on it.
> 
> Make sure you lube up everything, align the plates, poke a paper clip in the nozzles to make sure there arent any jams, whipe off the silicon pads with a damp cloth and dry it to make sure you get a good "grab" on the transfer paper, and hopefully your off!
> 
> I had to work through a few adjustments before getting started, but the staff at coldesi was awesome in getting me up and running.


Thank you! Any ideas where i can find some maintenance videos? Should i check youtube? Do you mind if i PM/email you with a few questions?


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## ifusion (Jun 3, 2011)

the videos were on a cd that came with my machine along with the software. I can copy it online for you if I can find the cd. Feel free to PM me anytime.

Oh one more thing, buy a little mini handheld dust vac, like the ones they sell for computer keyboards. Its the easiest way to clear the bowls to change stones. its not like the crystalpress that has an easy eject.


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## ShaggyDog (May 28, 2012)

Do you have a good pick for a vaccum? There are so many out there.


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## ifusion (Jun 3, 2011)

ShaggyDog said:


> Do you have a good pick for a vaccum? There are so many out there.


I have one just like this:
Mini Dirt Devil Dust Buster Detailer Vacuum with AC Supply | eBay

I finger swipe the stones out from the bottom and then give a quick vac to all the stones in the wholes and any excess on the bottom..


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## HotFix Tech (Mar 21, 2013)

By today's prices The old style grey cams like that goes for about $8-10,000 and has a lot of problems


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## EastCoastTeez (Apr 6, 2013)

Just pick up a 2008 1v 6p from beacon funding. Was either a lease return or repo. Got for great price including chiller compressor and computer . Nice thing is 90 day guarantee. Called cole desi and it seems I saved 10 to 12 grand. I get it 
This week. I will keep you posted on if it was worth it.


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## ifusion (Jun 3, 2011)

Congratz. I just saw it on their website... looks like you got the new style, so thats a great find. I'm new myself to this business and picked up my cams 1v2p through the same way, from a bank that had their unit on ebay. Couple of minor maintenance issues on mine (nothing that costed money, just time and aggrevation... call it a learning curve). Good luck with your machine.

I book marked it and maybe one day I'll look there for an embroidery machine.


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## secretagent81 (Mar 1, 2013)

Congrats, that is the best way to go. Used.


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## Londoncrystal (Oct 14, 2009)

Good luck.


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## EastCoastTeez (Apr 6, 2013)

You know what's funny. I really look forward to getting the machine. Don't get me wrong. But if I had to do a simple 1 or 2 color medium run. 10 to 20 . I think I would still use the cut and flock. I have gotten pretty good at that technic and it goes really fast. I can do a 2 color on single piece of flock as long as stone are different sizes. Well. We'll see.


Mark
East Coast Custom
Sayreville, NJ 08872


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## EastCoastTeez (Apr 6, 2013)

3 MORE DAYS. 


Mark
East Coast Custom
Sayreville, NJ 08872


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## ShaggyDog (May 28, 2012)

it will be interesting to see if this is true for you. I have cut one piece of SF since I got my machine, it was a grid to show different color stones on different color t shirts. It seemed easier than changing out 30 colors of stones in the machine.
I think once you see how nice the machine works with the stones, you will be hard pressed to cut flock again.


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## Leg cramps (Feb 9, 2009)

please post all of your experience as you go.


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## BML Builder (Jul 8, 2008)

ShaggyDog said:


> it will be interesting to see if this is true for you. I have cut one piece of SF since I got my machine, it was a grid to show different color stones on different color t shirts. It seemed easier than changing out 30 colors of stones in the machine.
> I think once you see how nice the machine works with the stones, you will be hard pressed to cut flock again.


I have to agree. I haven't cut any SF since I got my machine either. I only have the 2 color machine, but I still have found I like using it better than I did cutting templates. I would love to have the 6 color machine, but one day I will. Good luck with your machine. Even though it is a used machine, I'm sure you will love it as much as a new one.


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## EastCoastTeez (Apr 6, 2013)

Ok. Received today. I might be over my head. We' ll see. Does anyone know someone in central jersey area that could give me some pointers and advice. Thanks


Mark
East Coast Custom
Sayreville, NJ 08872


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## EastCoastTeez (Apr 6, 2013)

Does anyone know what compressor I need for the 1v6p cams if I have an ingasol air chiller already

Sent from my DROIDX using T-Shirt Forums


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## api (Nov 22, 2009)

The CAMS's max. air consumption is 4.2 CFM at 80 PSI. The compressor has to be able to provide that. 

There are different types of compressors:

If the noise is not an issue at your place the cheapest is the *reciprocating* compressor. 

If the noise is a problem, you have to use *rotary vane* ("hydrovane") or *rotary* *screw* compressors. The hydrovane is cheaper than the rotary screw. Both are very reliable and relatively quiet. 

Prices: 

Reciprocating: appr. $1500 or less
Hydrovane: appr. $3000
Screw: appr. $6000


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## HotFix Tech (Mar 21, 2013)

EastCoastTeez said:


> Does anyone know what compressor I need for the 1v6p cams if I have an ingasol air chiller already
> 
> Sent from my DROIDX using T-Shirt Forums


the 4.2 cfm is for the mini-cams the 1V-6P the factory says is closer to 6.7cfm. yes you do want the compressor to be able to do at least twice that so it is not running constantly. At minimum you would want to go with a 5HP with an 60-80 gal. tank. remember that piston compressors while much cheaper do burn a lot more oil and produce a lot more condensation. your chiller should take care of most of the condensation but will not get rid of the oil. I recommend that you put an oil filter after the chiller as well just to be on the safe side.


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## api (Nov 22, 2009)

Unlike HotFix Tech, I am NOT selling rhinestone machines and have NO business connection with any company which does, but I am an engineer and hate incorrect technical statements. 

The official air consumption data for the 1V-6P rhinestone machine is *120 Liters/minute*. The 1V-2P needs *80 Liters/minute*.

· 120 L/min = 4.23 Cubic Feet per Minute *(NOT 6.7 CFM)*
· 80 L/min = 2.82 Cubic Feet per Minute

The second incorrect statement is the following:

_"At minimum you would want to go with a 5HP (compressor)..."_

The HV-02RM (Receiver Mounted) Hydrovane compressor is 2.2 KW which is 2.9 HP *(NOT 5 HP).*

This compressor provides 0.24 m3/min = 240 Liters/min air. It is twice as much as the 1V-6P actually consumes, so the compressor will work 50% of the time. 

*That was the "science", now the practice:*

We have used a HV-02RM Hydrovane compressor for 3 years now with a CAMS 1V-6P and it is

· NOT 5 HP (only 2.9) and 
· NOT running full time (only half of the time).

I understand that you want to help MESA to sell DECOR machines and I don't mind it at all; it won't help or hurt my own business whatsoever, but *please note that your biased, incorrect postings will definitely hurt yours.*

I also understand that the vacuum pump is a better solution for creating a vacuum than the compressed air, and this is the major feature of DECOR if you compare it with CAMS (which is the main competitor) so this is what you have to emphasize, but please do it in a correct and unbiased way.

This forum is about helping each other, not misleading or (selling something to) its members.


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## HotFix Tech (Mar 21, 2013)

api said:


> Unlike HotFix Tech, I am NOT selling rhinestone machines and have NO business connection with any company which does, but I am an engineer and hate incorrect technical statements.
> 
> The official air consumption data for the 1V-6P rhinestone machine is *120 Liters/minute*. The 1V-2P needs *80 Liters/minute*.
> 
> ...


 Sir, I do not know what you think I was talking about. That was not a biased post. I did not mention anything about vacuum pumps or try to convince him to buy one. Did you fully read the post before you decided to reprimand me? Yes, the forums are here to help each other. I was sharing what I have observed while working on hundreds of these machines throughout the past several years to work well. I in no way advertised the machines that my employer sells in that post, nor did I put down the brand of machine that East Coast Teez purchased. I am not sure where you got your information about the air consumption for the two machines, maybe off of a website or advertisement pamphlet. I'm not sure. If you are right then that's fine. The information that I stated is just what I was told when I was at the Youngnam factory, that makes the Cams machines, by the chief engineer who designed the machines. I assumed he would know. If I received wrong information then I was misinformed and posted wrong information. 
When I posted at minimum you would want to go with a 5hp compressor, I did not clarify myself. I was referring to a 5 hp reciprocating compressor. If you have the luxury of going with a rotary screw compressor, than that would be the best way to go. I did not dispute that the Hydrovane was a better compressor. I think it is, but it is a whole different kind of compressor. They are much more efficient and do not require near as much maintenance as a regular piston type compressor. I would say a good 70% or more people that have any kind of rhinestone machine end up going with a reciprocating compressor just because of the price. Now when it comes to compressors for rhinestone machines I am a firm believer in over kill. The whole 50% duty cycle rule of thumb is a minimum. The less percent of time your compressor stays running the better. Will the machine run off of a slightly smaller compressor? Yes, it will but the smaller compressor you go with, the duty cycle will increase. The last thing you want is an undersized compressor.
I hope there is some good information in these posts that someone can benefit from. I do not believe that I have misled anyone in my post.


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## api (Nov 22, 2009)

Sir, you had 2 statements:

1.) "_The CAMS 1V-6P uses 6.7 CFM_." 

It was incorrect; it uses 120 LPM = 4.2 CFM only. This is the air consumption data SWF (now Col-Desi) gave us when we purchased our compressor. The data (120 LPM) was absolutely correct. We have a compressor now with 240 LPM and it runs 50% of the time (or even less). The chief engineer at Yongnam factory has misled you.

2.) _"At minimum you would want to go with a 5HP (compressor)..." _

No, you don't have to. This is also incorrect, unless you leave out both the hydrovane and the rotary screw compressors which types are also readily available (and purchasing them can make a lot of sense).

That's all I wanted to point out in my previous post. I rest my case... 

Regards,

Api


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## api (Nov 22, 2009)

Apropos Hydrovane compressors:

The price difference between a piston type compressor and a hydrovane is appr. $2K. 

BUT!

The hydrovane is much quieter, much more efficient, needs much less maintenance than the piston type. Also: direct drive, reliable, long lasting (up to 100,000+ hours). It actually "wears-in over time – whereas other compressor technologies wear out".

If you are interested:

Hydrovane > Why Hydrovane > Product Benefits

Hydrovane > Why Hydrovane > The Facts

If you can afford it, spending $2K extra for a much better compressor when you are buying and using a $35K - $40K machine, can make sense...

(I am NOT selling hydrovane compressors either.)


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## HotFix Tech (Mar 21, 2013)

api said:


> Sir, you had 2 statements:
> 
> 1.) "_The CAMS 1V-6P uses 6.7 CFM_."
> 
> ...


You just said the same thing I did, only in your own words.


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## EastCoastTeez (Apr 6, 2013)

Just want to thanks all. I talked to techs at coldesi. He gave me a complete parts list with diagrams and video links. Compressor was reasonable priced, just needs oil filter on to clean ail before it goes into chiller. I looked into all options and when the money is there i will invest in a better more quiet compressor . For now, this will work. So here comes the fun part. Learning how to use it. Boy, I thought this was going to be easy. Was I wrong. I will keep you posted.


Mark
East Coast Custom
Sayreville, NJ 08872


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## BML Builder (Jul 8, 2008)

Mark,
I don't think is that hard to run the machine, but it is very helpful to get some training. I think the hardest part of the machine is making sure everything is aligned right and learning all the things that needs to be done for maintenance and when. Coldesi does have a video of how to do a lot of the maintenance and operation of the machine. You can either call them or go to their website and find the video. This was a big help to me as was the day of training with the Tech.


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## Don-ColDesi (Oct 18, 2006)

Thanks Marilyn,

You can find all kinds of helpful videos, pdfs, etc. here on the ColDesi Support Site:

https://support.zoho.com/portal/coldesi/HomePage.do

You can also register your machine through here as well.


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## rhinestonetransf (Feb 11, 2009)

It took us about two weeks before everything clicked and we knew how to align the pots so the stone were centered. Once you run the machine for a couple of weeks it is very easy to trouble shoot. Once of the easiest machines to maintain! You will turn the machine on one day and everything will come easy to you - just give it a couple of weeks and watch some of the videos and ask questions everyone here will help.


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## EastCoastTeez (Apr 6, 2013)

I will take my time and learn. That's the fun part. Ok one last question. The wheels. coldesi wants 300 a pop. Is there a place where you can get them used. Not after market, but OEM parts. The machine only came with three 6mm and three 10 mm. And of course I have many 16 and 20mm stones from the cutting days. If not I guess I will have to shell out more $. It's like the money pit. Ha ha


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## ifusion (Jun 3, 2011)

EastCoastTeez said:


> I will take my time and learn. That's the fun part. Ok one last question. The wheels. coldesi wants 300 a pop. Is there a place where you can get them used. Not after market, but OEM parts. The machine only came with three 6mm and three 10 mm. And of course I have many 16 and 20mm stones from the cutting days. If not I guess I will have to shell out more $. It's like the money pit. Ha ha


You can check ebay. Every once in a while someone sells their wheels. Other than that coldesi and maybe mesa have them. Thats about it.


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## EastCoastTeez (Apr 6, 2013)

Thanks. MESA has for 60.00 cheaper. I also was playing with my drawings pro 6. And it works with the cams. I don't have to pay the 500.00 extra to make my design era work with the cams. It keeps getting better and better. 


Mark
East Coast Custom
Sayreville, NJ 08872


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## ifusion (Jun 3, 2011)

For software, everyone has their own preference. I'm mainly doing my work in Coreldraw with easystone macro and exporting out adobe illistrator to gemmaster to send to the machine. I also bought winpc sign early on and I use that sometimes too. (to ultimately send to coreldraw and export out an adobe illustrator file).


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## rhinestonetransf (Feb 11, 2009)

drawings pro 6 - How do you send the file to the machine? Does it save a .YNG file?

Thanks

Scott


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## rhinestonetransf (Feb 11, 2009)

thanks for the info that another program sends to the cams


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## EastCoastTeez (Apr 6, 2013)

No. There is a direct send command in file menu. Works great. I was crazy busy but I was able to make my first design in about 10 min. I use corel draw to center line trace the shamrock and did the text in drawings. 


Mark
East Coast Custom
Sayreville, NJ 08872


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## Leg cramps (Feb 9, 2009)

looks awesome mark. Looks like you are off and stoning!


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## EastCoastTeez (Apr 6, 2013)

Ok, finally had a minute to get to know the CAMS. It's awesome. I didn't have to adjust or tweak. Hooked up compressor. Made some simple designs. Works great. I have to say the drawings pro 6 works great with it. The only thing I seem to be running into is some of the stones get set upside down. Any way to fix this?


Mark
East Coast Custom
Sayreville, NJ 08872


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## ifusion (Jun 3, 2011)

The reason why your getting up side down stones is because you did't adjust it yet! 

I have the 1v2p and 80% of the time I get upside down stones is because the adjustment is off. 15% of the time is because I have to lube the o-ring on the setter gun and 5% of the times its because I have to adjust the valve on the air pressure behind the swing gun.

Watch the video on adjusting the plates if you have it, and then get a bright light and get familar with adjusting it... then your upside down stones will go away.

steve


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## EastCoastTeez (Apr 6, 2013)

Ok, I will check those things. But what I've been noticing is the stones are setting in the wheels upside down. It's doesn't seem be happening when it's setting.


Mark
East Coast Custom
Sayreville, NJ 08872


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## ifusion (Jun 3, 2011)

well if the stones are in the bowls upside down, then chance are its your stones.I have 3 different vendors I've used for stones and I've never really ran into any issues with stones sitting in the plates upside down. I had that issue with the ioline crystal press, but never my cams.


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## ifusion (Jun 3, 2011)

one more thing that came to mind... each wheel is double sided. 1 side for rhinestones and one side for nail heads (I think... never used them)... anyway...

If you look at the wheel where the little push pin is... there is a circle cut into 1 side of the push pin. That side is the side you should see up for rhinestones. If you have the wrong side up, that may explain while the stones arent falling into place.


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## HotFix Tech (Mar 21, 2013)

Also you want to check your brushes that are on the hopper cover, it is it's function to knock out stones that are upside down in the holes. If the brushes don't go all of the way down and touch the plate, then you might want to consider replacing them.


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## api (Nov 22, 2009)

HotFix Tech is right. It is probably a brush problem.

Don't forget that you have to remove the hopper cover (with the brush on it) every time you change the stones. It can happen that sometimes you don't put the cover back properly and because of that the brush cannot swipe out the upside down stones.

If your brush is too short, you have to replace it. A new brush is about $15 but you can also adjust the position of the old brush with an allen screw in the hopper cover.


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## ifusion (Jun 3, 2011)

The brush actually serves a purpose? When I purchased my machine used it didnt have the caps with brushes. I've been using my machine (1v2p) for a year and a half without them and never had an upside down issue.


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## api (Nov 22, 2009)

You are very lucky. 

The brush is important. When the stone is upside down, it is "waggling" on its curvy glass top. The brush can swipe off these stones easily. 

When the stone is in the right position, it "sits" on the flat glue surface inside the flat-bottomed hole of the wheel, so the brush cannot swipe it off.


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## EastCoastTeez (Apr 6, 2013)

Well. I love it. Making money already. And lets face it. Isn't that what we all want and have to do. I do know this. It takes money to make money. 


Mark
East Coast Custom
Sayreville, NJ 08872


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## BML Builder (Jul 8, 2008)

Great Mark!! Isn't it always great to see an investment pay off!


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