# How much would you charge to screen print 100 thongs?



## djjosephm (Oct 8, 2007)

Hey guys. How much would you chagre to print 1 color on 100 White thongs? The thongs are already bought and would be provided.. Thanks.


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## plan b (Feb 21, 2007)

*Re: How much would you charge?*

Depends on what type of printing and image size


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## djjosephm (Oct 8, 2007)

*Re: How much would you charge?*

Regular screenprinting.. The image size is three wors large enough to to fit on the front of a thong or roughly 3"X2".


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## R1Lover (Jun 7, 2008)

*Re: How much would you charge?*

200.00


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## TeddyRocky (Mar 23, 2007)

*Re: How much would you charge?*

$1.15 per print.


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## Reddawgs (Mar 26, 2008)

*Re: How much would you charge?*

$0.20 per thong screen charge+ $0.30 per Thong shop fee +1.50 per thong for profit + 1.00 per thong for customer supplied goods= $3.00 per thong but im not a contract printer so I make money on the blanks too. to clarify the pricing I based it on one hour and half hours production time, the screen fee was broke down by number of thongs 20/100, overhead is for my shop is about $20.00 per hour so on shop fee 30/100. $1.50 per thong x 100= 150/1.5= $ 100 dollars per hour. Like I said I do not do contract printing, I only do retail so I only sell my shirts or whatever so if I were to do a job like this I would add some amount of money for customer supplied goods. 

Greg


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## jumpman21 (May 17, 2008)

*Re: How much would you charge?*

About $150......


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## djjosephm (Oct 8, 2007)

*Re: How much would you charge?*

I charged $95.. i suck..lol kinda new to the custom job aspect of things


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

*Re: How much would you charge?*

*Sometimes it's far better to push the quality of your service, than to offer a lower price to get the work.*

* You make more profit that way too.  *


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## InkFruit (Jun 27, 2008)

*Re: How much would you charge?*

We all learn as we go along. I have made such mistakes when I started out too.


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## Sheepsalt (Sep 12, 2007)

*Re: How much would you charge?*

Joe,

Did you make profit on the job? What were all your associated costs, & how much time did you spend on the job? Take the $95 minus your hard costs & divide by the hours you spent - that'll give you what you got paid per hour. Was it worth it?

If I charged $95 for the job complete, I'd have covered my costs plus made $42/hour for my time & overhead. This is how I like to look at things, rather than so much per piece... but that may be just just me.

Cost of film, emulsion, ink, supplies: $25
Print film: 10 min
Burn, washout, & tape screen: 15 min
Setup press: 15 min
Print 100 pieces: 50 min.
Unpack/pack: 10 min
Total time: 
1.67 hr.
$95 - $25 = $70
$70 / 1.67 hr = $41.92 / hr.


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## Reddawgs (Mar 26, 2008)

*Re: How much would you charge?*



Sheepsalt said:


> Joe,
> 
> Did you make profit on the job? What were all your associated costs, & how much time did you spend on the job? Take the $95 minus your hard costs & divide by the hours you spent - that'll give you what you got paid per hour. Was it worth it?
> 
> ...


Joe you tell the customer their shirts are going to cost $41.92 per hour? I think just about everyone who does shirts, signs or whatever maps out what the profit per hour is but when I quote a job to a customer I do not tell them its going to X amount of dollars per hour I break the price down by the shirt or sign or cap.

Greg


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## Sheepsalt (Sep 12, 2007)

*Re: How much would you charge?*

No, Greg, nobody said "tell the customer it's so much per hour"! I think you misunderstood me. My point didn't have anything to do with how I communicate with a customer, but rather how to determine what to charge per piece for such a job. I was giving Joe a TOOL to help him decide whether doing the job for $95 was worth it to him or not. He apparently thinks he blew it, but how can he know whether to feel good or bad about the money he made unless he knows what he actually did make? Putting things in perspective can help him decide whether he's right or not.

The breakdown is just for your own information to bring clarity to how much money you're making by charging $1 per unit. What good is it to say "I charge $0.20 per thong screen charge+ $0.30 per Thong shop fee +1.50 per thong for profit + 1.00 per thong for customer supplied goods= $3.00 per thong..." if you don't know whether or not you're making a profit and how much profit you're actually making? If it takes you 10 hours to do the job, it's probably way to little. If it takes you one hour, you're probably paying yourself more than nuclear technicians.


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## Reddawgs (Mar 26, 2008)

sorry Joe I just misunderstood your post.


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## Sheepsalt (Sep 12, 2007)

np! I re-read what I wrote the first time and I can see how you might have read it that way. I hope I didn't sound TOO defensive.


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## R1Lover (Jun 7, 2008)

*Re: How much would you charge?*



Sheepsalt said:


> Joe,
> 
> Did you make profit on the job? What were all your associated costs, & how much time did you spend on the job? Take the $95 minus your hard costs & divide by the hours you spent - that'll give you what you got paid per hour. Was it worth it?
> 
> ...


You forgot your overhead cost's though


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## Sheepsalt (Sep 12, 2007)

*Re: How much would you charge?*



R1Lover said:


> You forgot your overhead cost's though


Umm...



Sheepsalt; said:


> _...$42/hour for my time & overhead_...



???

The actual numbers were merely an example. Are you asking me to share what all my actual overhead costs are? I think that'd be a different topic... Joe wanted to know if he charged enough for the job. It's not for me to say whether $95 was enough or not, but if he breaks it down he can decide for himself.

By the way, the shop rate on which I base all my pricing is higher than $41.92... that's the hourly rate that Joe would have earned by charging the $95 he say's he charged if his actual labor time was 1.67 hours... just an example. Take any one of your jobs and plug in the real numbers to decide if you're covering your overhead or not.


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## TeddyRocky (Mar 23, 2007)

ImageIt said:


> One problem with thongs is that any amount a platen adhesive is considered too much! No woman wants to buy a set of sticky panties and maybe reluctant to purchase ones that have been washed.
> 
> 
> fred


How do you know?  I don't think anyone wears under garments straight from a retailer...well I least I hope not. I hope people know that people return underwear back to the store all the time...Gives me chills.


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

*Now there just HAS to be a marketing opportunity here.*

*"You won't get sticky with our thongs"*

*"No big hand on our thongs"*

*Of course they'd have to be in the industry, to understand the comments.  *


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## R1Lover (Jun 7, 2008)

*Re: How much would you charge?*



Sheepsalt said:


> Umm...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's not what I was saying... I guess if you are working out of a garage and the equipment was all free it's ok with the numbers above.

You have to account for all cost's of doing business or your just fooling yourself. With this I mean.. Rent or lease, cost of equipment, phone bills, internet connection, insurance...etc Those items are "overhead", ink, screens, packaging, etc are not imo and are known as supplies and consumables. 

That's all I was trying to say.


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## Sheepsalt (Sep 12, 2007)

R1Lover, you are exactly correct, and that was exactly the point my original post made - at $95 for the job, once you subtract out the hard costs ("supplies and consumables") you're left with $41.92 an hour to cover "TIME (labor) AND OVERHEAD". It's up to each individual business to know what their overhead costs are and know whether or not that number is enough to cover it.

I guess I take for granted that someone in business would know what his or her overhead is and whether $41.92 an hour will cover it. 

I think every person would be miles ahead if they'd take a couple business finance classes at their local community college. I see so many who set their prices by stabbing numbers at per color or per piece, but you'll never know what you're making unless you break it down completely. You need to know WHY it's so much per color or so much per piece, not just "is $1.00 per piece enough?" If you take the time to break down all your costs of doing business and do some time studies to determine how much time it actually takes to do each step, you'll be able to easily decide whether $1.00 each is enough or whether $3.00 each is enough.

In fact, I've looked at some shop's price guides and just been baffled - if you break it all down with time studies they might be making $320 an hour for a 2-color print, but then instead of calculating their pricing based on actual time studies they're just adding $0.25 per each additional color, so an 8-color job might only pay them $100 an hour even though it's the same process.

In my shop we make the same hourly rate no matter what the job is, 1-color, 8-colors, foil... makes no difference; every price is broken down to make sure we're getting our shop rate. That hourly rate is based on overhead spread over a 40-hour week plus labor. Every job is priced based on that hourly rate plus all the hard costs involved in the job plus markup.

So, yeah, we're just not quite connecting for some reason, but we're both trying to make the same point - you need to know your cost of doing business and how much you want to earn on top of that before you can know whether $95 is enough to charge for printing one color on 100 thong panties.


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## R1Lover (Jun 7, 2008)

Sheepsalt said:


> R1Lover, you are exactly correct, and that was exactly the point my original post made - at $95 for the job, once you subtract out the hard costs ("supplies and consumables") you're left with $41.92 an hour to cover "TIME (labor) AND OVERHEAD". It's up to each individual business to know what their overhead costs are and know whether or not that number is enough to cover it.
> 
> I guess I take for granted that someone in business would know what his or her overhead is and whether $41.92 an hour will cover it.
> 
> ...


Exactly, I was not pointing or making fault in your post by any means, I was trying to make it very clear for others mainly. You sound like you know what your doing.  Great thread for picking up some experience on the subject for sure.


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## TeddyRocky (Mar 23, 2007)

So do most of you guys quote based on overhead per day? I would think this would be difficult as it is hard to gauge the sales you will get each day or maybe its just me.

For instance: Lets assume we need to make $500 a day to keep the shop open and feed ourselves.

Now, Lets say yesterday we make a sale of $5000. Today we make a sale of $500. Tommorow we make a sale of $0. Well after calculating the overhead - sales = profit. If you quote each person depending on hourly shop rates, doesn't it get difficult to have "set" prices?? 

As the same customer might come to you one week and get $3.99 a shirt since you had a good week, but the week after, you try charging them $6.99 since you had a bad week.


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## TeddyRocky (Mar 23, 2007)

ImageIt said:


> I refuse to compete for price. There will always be an upstart looking to give jobs away for next to nothing.
> 
> fred


I agree there are start ups who do print jobs almost for free. But if you don't compete with price, how do you stay competitive?


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## R1Lover (Jun 7, 2008)

TeddyRocky said:


> So do most of you guys quote based on overhead per day? I would think this would be difficult as it is hard to gauge the sales you will get each day or maybe its just me.
> 
> For instance: Lets assume we need to make $500 a day to keep the shop open and feed ourselves.
> 
> ...


That's a give and take issue, if your busy and have plenty of work then you hold your prices or start climbing.... if your slow and doing nothing, sometimes it's better to keep the cash flowing rather then sitting doing nothing. You will find if your good and take care of your customers that you will always be busy though.


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## Reddawgs (Mar 26, 2008)

> I agree there are start ups who do print jobs almost for free. But if you don't compete with price, how do you stay competitive?


In February I meet with a lady from a local middle school she asked for prices on some drawstring backpacks and samples she said she could get 500 of them for a dollar per backpack off the internet I just thanked her for her time and left a card and guess what the bags she got was junk and busted so she just ordered 100 from me at $4.25 per bag PRICE does not always get the job. offer quality products and quality service.

Greg


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## Sheepsalt (Sep 12, 2007)

TeddyRocky said:


> I agree there are start ups who do print jobs almost for free. But if you don't compete with price, how do you stay competitive?


Right. If someone complains about the price, I never drop the price - I make suggestions on how they might save some money such as less expensive blanks, fewer colors in the graphic, fewer print locations, whatever, but once you give someone a quote NEVER lower it. 

For example, I have a supplier I work with who has offered me better than advertised prices in the past, so every time I call him now I say something like, "Wow, you're kidding! Can't you do any better than that?". He drops it every time, so I push it every time. If the very first time he had said, "No, that's the price, but maybe you could go with a less-expensive product", I'd never have asked again. You really don't want your customers doing that to you.

If you go through and figure out what it costs you to do business and set your pricing accordingly, you'll know you can't afford to drop your prices anyway, so you'll be able to say with confidence, "nope, that's the price".


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## TeddyRocky (Mar 23, 2007)

Thanks for all of your replies. It just seemed like most people are mostly about price and comparing who is cheaper. But I think building a good relationship is very important as well.

While we're at it, what do most of you printers look for in profit based in percentages?

For instance, someone orders 100 t-shirts 1 color impression, $500 order, cost of shirts about $200, maybe $5 of ink, $10 of electricity misc supplies etc. That leaves $285 which is 57% profit. Do you look to at least average 50% profit? More? Less? 

I know that in other business's such as a small grocery store only make about 20-30%% of their sale as a profit, but of course they have a higher volume of customers, yet in the end, a screen printer who has made $1000 in a day with 50% ($500) profit, and the grocery store selling $2000 a day has only made 20% ($400).

Did I just confuse myself??!?!?!


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## wormil (Jan 7, 2008)

TeddyRocky said:


> Thanks for all of your replies. It just seemed like most people are mostly about price and comparing who is cheaper. But I think building a good relationship is very important as well.
> 
> While we're at it, what do most of you printers look for in profit based in percentages?


In every market there is going to be an acceptable price range. Lots of people are going to say they don't compete on price but unless they have a monopoly, they have to stay within that acceptable range. What they are really saying is that they aren't trying to be the cheapest guy in town. But when starting out you have to offer incentives to earn new customers.

Years ago I naively stopped by a local cabinetmakers shop to get some simple birch cabinets made for our kitchen. What I didn't know was that that local fellow had been written up in quite a few homebuilding magazines and was considered among the elite in his field. The man was very nice, invited me onto his front porch and his wife served us lemonade while he explained why he wasn't going to build our cabinets. Then another fellow came by, mentioned that he was building a new home and absolutely had to have this guy do the cabinets and millwork. So the old guy told him he didn't want the work. The guy said he would pay whatever. The old woodworker told him to triple the highest quote he had. The young man was flabbergasted but wasn't giving up. Eventually the cabinetmaker told him to go away. After the guy left, he got up and said that his son would stop by our house to measure for the new cabinets which he built at cost. True story. I don't know what it means but there must be a lesson in it.

As for calculating profit, that is going to vary according to your business. Read up on cost accounting for a good starting point. I'm a one man shop, some things I do myself and for other things I am just a broker. When I'm brokering it's all about percentages but when I'm actually laboring I charge my hourly rate + materials. The real key is to know your true cost in everything and make sure you get paid.


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## TeddyRocky (Mar 23, 2007)

I guess a good example would be... a local guy started a screen printing business here and the company name was called "DIRT CHEAP PRINTING." lol I've seen him advertise for about 6 months, and disapeared.


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## A Perfect Pixel (Jul 4, 2008)

printing on thongs sucks... do you have a special platen or do you just use a lot of spray adhesive?


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## CUSTOM UK (Jun 28, 2008)

*Hi. As regards pricing, I don't do ANY job of ANY description, unless there is 100 percent profit in it. I prefer to sell on quality and promoting excellent service, rather than price alone.*

*It is usually the cheap discount operations that tend to go out of business, rather than the companies that offer good service.*

*"The quality of your work is remembered long after the price has been forgotten."  *


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## wormil (Jan 7, 2008)

ImageIt said:


> Nope, that's not what i'm saying at all. If you offer incentives to get customers, those customers will expect to always get those incentives.
> 
> Profit is best measured by the bank account. If the bank account is increasing, the business is making a profit. It it is shrinking, the business is running at a loss. Making a profit on any single job, must be weighed against the the bigger picture.
> 
> ...


I have no interest in bulk commercial printing either, having come from that field. I'm guessing you've had some bad experience with poorly run business. It's unfortunate you never had the opportunity to work with someone who knew what they were doing. I've worked for several people who run their businesses into the ground despite increasing sales. But commercial printing can be very profitable. I managed jobs that took over a year of constant production to finish and in every case, the larger the job, the higher the profit. True the profit margin is slimmer but large production jobs also tend to be much more efficient and easier to run.

Targeting niche markets is a great idea. But if the market is of any significant size it's unlikely you will have a monopoly for long. Then you'll find yourself competing against others who may offer the same level of quality and service but at a lower price.

Anyway, to bring this back on subject... it would seem to be easier to use transfers and a hat press to do thongs rather than trying to screenprint them directly.


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## wormil (Jan 7, 2008)

ImageIt said:


> It will be like owning a store and walmart comes to town. Go ahead and try to compete with price.
> 
> fred


It's an interesting discussion, maybe we can continue it sometime in a more appropriate thread.


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## wormil (Jan 7, 2008)

ImageIt said:


> The discussion is one of pricing. Competing by price is one of the worst traps of the printing business.


If you are in business you are competing, by service, by quality and by price.


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