# "Embroidery isn't worth the money"



## Humerus (Nov 10, 2012)

Hello folks  I've got a question.

So I have a business selling monogrammed items that are dye sublimated (phone cases, compacts, luggage tags, etc). I do pretty well with it, it supports my family and I'm looking at next year's growth plans. I am adding heat transfer vinyl products this year, but looking ahead to 2016.

I mentioned to my sister that I was considering getting an embroidery machine so I can do embroidered monograms and she told me it was so totally not worth the money, that the time spent doing embroidery just wouldn't pay enough. SHe has a pretty nice embroidery machine and so has been doing it on a personal level for a while.

NOW - my sister is, how shall I say, not business minded. I'm also not afraid of charging a living wage for my time.

So I guess my question for you all is - would it be worthwhile to get a small embroidery machine next year to do monograms? Or in other words, how long would it take to do, say, a 2-3 inch monogram on a product? 

I wouldn't be doing any huge setup - this is just me, working about 30 hours a week right now, so I'd need probably a hobbyist machine (no way could I afford a commercial machine) so I'm just curious if anyone else has started out really small and found it worthwhile? 

I keep thinking it would be, especially if I got high end blanks like leather purses, high quality linens, etc. but I don't want to make an investment into new equipment unless I know it's going to be worth it (I'm a single mom, supporting my three kids, so can't take lots of risks).


----------



## SHORTDOG (Dec 15, 2014)

Bethany, I have been asked about embroidery and since I myself do not do embroidery....I just outsource the jobs and I am able to make a pretty good profit considering that I do not have any labor hours into doing these jobs. 

Maybe you can start by offering the service, then outsourcing the work to your sister to see how the demand would play out... then that might give you a better idea of wether or not the investment would be worth it to buy your own machine.


----------



## killroy (Feb 16, 2014)

Build a Business model first!! Prove it can make money, than look at the potential of buying equipment. I would also look at other companies for the contract work. Working with family can create problems. They almost always carry over to your personal life. Besides that, you'll more than certainly get a better price elsewhere. Never gauge your success on others. You can make a nice living selling cow poop if it's marketed right.


----------



## SHORTDOG (Dec 15, 2014)

killroy said:


> You can make a nice living selling cow poop if it's marketed right.


 Now there's an idea....why didn't I think of that?  lol!


----------



## ShirlandDesign (Nov 29, 2009)

If all you are going to do is monogram, you can get a low end Brother for little of nothing and work towards a better machine. I have $1000 hours.. that's profit not gross on the Tajima, there's real money there.


----------



## Humerus (Nov 10, 2012)

Yeah there is nothing on this world that would make me enter into any kind of business deal with my sister. I'd rather go out of business first.

I think my main question is, would I be paying myself $7/hour to do it? Because I won't do anything that will pay less than $25/h which is the minimum I make with sublimation. and I think Shirland answered that question pretty well  There is a local place that does embroidery where I could potentially test the market (for the cost of the blanks), I just assumed it would be more expensive than worthwhile to outsource but you know, I REALLY SHOULD just call and find out, huh?  

I like this discussion. Because as much as I think people will love glittery iron on monograms, I think there is something so timeless about an embroidered one, especially if I'm doing really fancy things. I feel like I couldn't really go where I want to go, as a business, without offering it in the long run.


----------



## skits (Jun 24, 2009)

You are asking the forum if it will be profitable?

Its like me saying I'm in screen printing and want to start embroidery....will I make money?

How does the forum know your market in your town / city?

Are you going to work hard or be laid back?

Are you going to be competitive?

Are you going to provide fast quick service?

How many embroiderers are in your town?

Don't you think these would be more relevant questions that will affect the success of your business then asking how much return it will have?

Shortdog put it straight to the point and thats the only way you will know what the market is like. No point selling water in the dessert when there is nobody to sell it to.


----------



## PickItStickIt (Sep 20, 2013)

I own one, and source out the work still. It takes a lot of time, if you dont do it everyday.


----------



## Humerus (Nov 10, 2012)

skits said:


> You are asking the forum if it will be profitable?
> 
> Its like me saying I'm in screen printing and want to start embroidery....will I make money?
> 
> ...


Well - I already know there's a demand for it from my existing customers, since I'm already selling mostly monogrammed items. The service and business aspect isn't really what I was wondering about, since I have already evaluated the market and determined that my customers would most definitely be interested in embroidered monogram products in addition to the vinyl/dyesub monogrammed products I already sell.

My question was only about the time spent, especially since I'm not looking at bulk/wholesale orders but more one-offs. Assuming there is enough demand, is it worthwhile? I think which boils down to - how much time does it take? Is embroidering one-offs even worth it time-wise or is it only worthwhile when you have 50+ items to monogram?

But, again, I'm going to take Shortdog's advice and check into my local embroidery company to see how much they would charge. It would be a pain to have them do one item at a time, especially since it's doubtful they would dropship which means I'd have to drive into town for each order (I live way out on a mountain) but it would be a very effective way to test the market without buying equipment for sure.


----------



## twinkey121 (Apr 7, 2009)

Bethany I live in a little one horse town and my machine has been running all day for the last 3 months doing full front monograms.. It's something that's realy going strong right now.. What mountain do you live on


----------



## Humerus (Nov 10, 2012)

twinkey121 said:


> Bethany I live in a little one horse town and my machine has been running all day for the last 3 months doing full front monograms.. It's something that's realy going strong right now.. What mountain do you live on


That's good to know! We're also a one horse town. or, more accurately, a gas station and nothing else town up in NE WA  I don't think my mountain has a name, truth be told it's more like a little foothill but the closest one is Dunn Mountain.


----------



## ShirlandDesign (Nov 29, 2009)

> a gas station and nothing else town up in NE WA I don't think my mountain has a name, truth be told it's more like a little foothill


God I envy you


----------



## killroy (Feb 16, 2014)

Your Market doesn't have to be in your backyard. I have mixed feelings about dealing with a local competitor. That's potentially what He or She will become. Not everyone plays by the book. Chances are their contract prices won't be worth it. Shop National Companies that are setup for contract work. If I was just starting embroidery I wouldn't go after the 1 up's. I would target people that ordered 100 or more pieces. With contract prices you have to get quantity to get deep discounts. When you get to 100 or more you can be very competitive.


----------



## Humerus (Nov 10, 2012)

ShirlandDesign said:


> God I envy you


You're just lucky I didn't post pictures of my place  



> Your Market doesn't have to be in your backyard. I have mixed feelings about dealing with a local competitor. That's potentially what He or She will become. Not everyone plays by the book. Chances are their contract prices won't be worth it. Shop National Companies that are setup for contract work. If I was just starting embroidery I wouldn't go after the 1 up's. I would target people that ordered 100 or more pieces. With contract prices you have to get quantity to get deep discounts. When you get to 100 or more you can be very competitive.


Well, like I said before, I'd be integrating into my existing business which is 95% online and one-off retail... I don't think it would make sense for me to go into an entirely new market of large quantities or local orders. Even though the local competition is actually just a sporting goods store that just so happens to do embroidery too... I don't think I would have known they did that if my brother in law hadn't gotten a job there. I don't think they even advertise it.

I'm still on the fence on whether I want to grow so big that I'd need employees or stay smaller and have it just be me. I think if I do end up growing bigger and needing help that those larger orders would be key to growing that way. But then on the other hand, if I stay small, then it's still just me here up on the mountain, I wouldn't have to worry about facilities and managing people, etc. Who knows. But maybe outsourcing it would be the key there - not as much money as if I did it myself, but hey, I wouldn't have to spend my time doing it either. It's also either that or do some really high end merchandise where I could charge a lot more... so like a satin clutch purse vs. a plain regular t-shirt.


----------



## tfalk (Apr 3, 2008)

The problem with taking one-off jobs to a competitor will usually be "set-up charges". If they charge you to set up the job, you are not going to make any money, they will make all the money on their setup-charge. 

You could either look into a sewing/embroidery machine or a dedicated embroidery machine. If *all* you are going to be doing is one-off mongrams, you could probably get away with a single needle machine to start. If you have any intentions of doing anything other than monograms, skip the single needle and go straight to a 6+ needle machine - we started with a Brother PR600 and 8 years later, we are finally selling it because we've upgraded to the new 10 needle machines and I really don't need 4 single head machines right now. Most of our work is the same design on 100+ shirts but they all have to be run individually, no way to run them on a multi-head, but it works for us.


----------



## Posylane (Mar 3, 2011)

> My question was only about the time spent, especially since I'm not looking at bulk/wholesale orders but more one-offs. Assuming there is enough demand, is it worthwhile? I think which boils down to - how much time does it take? Is embroidering one-offs even worth it time-wise or is it only worthwhile when you have 50+ items to monogram?


In my opinion, it is not worth buying an embroidery machine just to take on-off jobs from outsiders. But our business is about half selling one-off embroidered items from our own inventory, and we work for ourselves running our business.

We charge $8 for the embroidery, but each sale involves the profit on the underlying item so it is totally worth it. One of us (we are a husband/wife team) can embroider $6,000 in retail sales in one day. There is cleaning the embroidery and shipping the items, but we make far more than $7 an hour.

We have three commercial embroidery machines. You already have some idea of what your customers will buy. I love ETSY for doing market research. Find shops selling embroidered items, and then look through the reviews. The reviews show what is actually selling. No other retail platform gives insight into what is actually selling for competitors.


----------



## Humerus (Nov 10, 2012)

Posylane said:


> In my opinion, it is not worth buying an embroidery machine just to take on-off jobs from outsiders. But our business is about half selling one-off embroidered items from our own inventory, and we work for ourselves running our business.
> 
> We charge $8 for the embroidery, but each sale involves the profit on the underlying item so it is totally worth it. One of us (we are a husband/wife team) can embroider $6,000 in retail sales in one day. There is cleaning the embroidery and shipping the items, but we make far more than $7 an hour.
> 
> We have three commercial embroidery machines. You already have some idea of what your customers will buy. I love ETSY for doing market research. Find shops selling embroidered items, and then look through the reviews. The reviews show what is actually selling. No other retail platform gives insight into what is actually selling for competitors.


See, that's about what I'd be doing as well. I have tons of products that I'm going to be adding this year and so it obviously depends on that. Your number is very insightful - the most I've ever made doing sublimation was one day during Christmas and I was banging out orders I believe I was at around $75/hour in profit (which included packing/shipping time) but I'm glad to hear you do even better than that. I agree on the Etsy - there are some products I've wanted to try but realize that they just aren't selling, and i think I've avoided some mistakes because of that.


----------



## Posylane (Mar 3, 2011)

My target number when considering any work is $100/hr. My walk away number, even if I have no orders to work on, is $50/hr. At less than that, I am better off doing business development, or getting some time off.

I hire out the packing and shipping. I outsource things that need done but either are so specialized it would take me a long time to learn and even then I would be mediocre (so basically everything related to web development), or are so easy to do and inexpensive to hire like shipping.

My wife and I run the machines, because that is harder to hire and do the photography because that is expensive to outsource. We also have a vinyl business that takes time.

One of the the biggest hangups I see in other businesses is the refusal to outsource the $12/hour packing job so the owner can focus on the $100/hour work.


----------

