# Brother PR-650



## uscfsales

This week, I plan on buying a Brother PR-650 Embroidery Machine.

Before I take the plunge, can anyone tell me any reasons why I shouldn't buy this machine?

Or, is there anyone with a Brother PR-650 who can tell me why I should buy it? It's a major purchase so I'm a bit anxious.


----------



## tfalk

Does it suit your needs? If so, buy it. If it doesn't suit your needs or you are not sure about it, then don't buy it. Without more information on intended use, it's impossible for anyone to tell you if it's the right machine for you or not.

That said, I have 2 of the PR-600II's which are 2 models earlier than the 650. They are complete workhorses... one has almost 50 million stitches on it, the other has around 38 million. Never had anything replaced on them other than the automatic threader end. I get them serviced every 6 months and they just keep on running. Our only complaint with them is I wish they had a bigger sewing field.


----------



## LUV DEM TIGERS

The quality of the embroidery is just as good as any of the good "commercial" machines. The MAIN difference is the speed at which it runs and the time it takes to ramp up to full speed and ramp down from full speed and the trim time. Just because a PR-6?? will say it stitches at 1000 spm, it rarely will stay at the max. speed. It varies a lot while sewing. Also the ramp up and ramp down times are 2-3 times that of a true commercial machine. They are GREAT starter machines and embroidery very high quality. I have a PR-600 and a Tajima Neo-2. The quality is great from both, but my Tajima will smoke my PR-600 even if I set them at the same run speed.


----------



## taricp35

I was looking at the Neo2 and the PR-650 as I am buying one this month. The Neo-2 has a larger sewing field correct?

Tari


----------



## LUV DEM TIGERS

Yes, the NEO-2 does have a larger sewing field, but you must know that the largest sewing field "listed" is only if you have a "border frame", I think that is what you call it. But even without it, the sewing field is larger on the NEO-2.


----------



## taricp35

LUV DEM TIGERS said:


> Yes, the NEO-2 does have a larger sewing field, but you must know that the largest sewing field "listed" is only if you have a "border frame", I think that is what you call it. But even without it, the sewing field is larger on the NEO-2.


Is it a machine you can carry around or is too bulkly and needs to be stationary? I will be doing fairs and attending trade shows and wanted to carry it with me. Currently when I do these I have to have the embroiderer do the shirts before hand but sometimes people want different suff on the shirts. 90% of the vendors that also attend have at least two machines with them so I definitely want a unit I can carry with me. Last year the guy in the booth next to me had two Brother Pr-600 which is why I was looking at the PR-650 but I like the larger sewing field on the Neo-2.


----------



## LUV DEM TIGERS

It takes two "men" to carry the Neo-2 but it can be carried. My son and I have carried mine to a couple of shows before? My PR-600, I can carry it myself.


----------



## oldkush

Both the Brother 650 and Tajima Neo are very good machines. Either machine is capable of producing quality stitching [assuming a quality design is used and the machine is properly maintained]. The 650 and Neo have both proven to be good reliable performers.

It is important however to realize that they are a different class of machine and comparing the two is like comparing apples and oranges. The 650 is an intermediate machine and the Neo is a commercial machine.

Brother 650 advantages over the Neo include:
- lower investment cost
- somewhat easier to use for a beginner
- easy 1 person portability
- auto needle threading

Tajima Neo advantages over the 650:
- steel vs. plastic
- less prone to vibrations during stitching
- much larger sewing fields
- larger variety of hoops / accessories
- more needles. Which means less thread color changing [some often used colors like black, red, white, etc. never come off the machine] 
- faster practical stitching speeds
- ability to stitch larger bulky items

Which machine would be a better choice really depends on the purchaser's needs, target market, budget and long term business plan.

Bob


----------



## oldkush

Should also have mentioned that if anyone is considering the Brother PR-650, also check out the Babylock Professional. Except for control panel and software, they are the same machine.

For those looking at the Tajima Neo, also consider the Toyota ESP 9100. Other than software refinements and cosmetic plastic, the Neo and 9100 are the same machine. They are both manufactured in the Tokai [Tajima] Sewing Machine factory in Japan.

Bob


----------



## taricp35

Thanks for the tips. I was ready to make my purchase but now I have more to look at. 

Tari


----------



## alfargo

What is more important to you? Professional embroidery machine that is harder to move around, or a simi pro that you can move around easy? Remember the best of the best is not always what is best for your needs. Myself I dont move much so I would spend a little more and get the professional machine. good luck


----------



## LUV DEM TIGERS

oldkush said:


> Should also have mentioned that if anyone is considering the Brother PR-650, also check out the Babylock Professional. Except for control panel and software, they are the same machine.



Actually, I think the only difference is the decals. I ACTUALLY have a Babylock EMP-6 which is the same as the Brother PR-600. I have looked at both and the only difference I could see was the decals. I started with that, and then I added a Tajima NEO-2.


----------



## taricp35

I have to have a unit that I can travel to shows with. To start out, I will be only doing Greek designs. The few Organizations that I have a license to are only two colors so I am thinking that to start a 6 or 9 needle would be perfect. I like the Neo-2 because it can be networked so when things get very busy I can always keep adding machines. I like the fact that the Brother is lighter and can be moved much easier. But I also like the fact that the Neo-2 has a bigger sewing field. I am leaning towards the Neo-2

I received an order to place greek lettering on the back of a leather coat. I passed it on to a local Embroider but are both the PR-650 and Neo-2 capable of handling a job like that?


----------



## LUV DEM TIGERS

Neo-2 Definitely.

PR-650. I think max sewing field is 7.75" x 11.75" (or very close to that).


----------



## uscfsales

How much does a Neo-2 cost (in USD?)

Thanks


----------



## LUV DEM TIGERS

I think they run about $11,000, but I haven't priced one in the last year or two, but with the economy the way it is, I am sure you can get a deal.


----------



## frankiko

i just attended a 1 day crash course on Brother PR650 today and i found it as an amazing machine. i think this is a good entry level machine for a serious embroidery business. those 6 threads make life very very easy. before this course, i was leaning toward a single thread machine as an initial investment but now that I saw this PR650, i am now dreaming on this one.

GUNOLD was also there to talk/demonstrate about materials and supplies... do you guys use this company? They said they are worldwide and one of the top suppliers.

I am new to this embroidery so i'll be watching on this side of the forum


----------



## Buechee

I love my PR 600 and I'd love to get the 650. just looked at it the other day. I liked it.


----------



## lizziemaxine

frankiko said:


> i just attended a 1 day crash course on Brother PR650 today and i found it as an amazing machine. i think this is a good entry level machine for a serious embroidery business. those 6 threads make life very very easy. before this course, i was leaning toward a single thread machine as an initial investment but now that I saw this PR650, i am now dreaming on this one.
> 
> GUNOLD was also there to talk/demonstrate about materials and supplies... do you guys use this company? They said they are worldwide and one of the top suppliers.
> 
> I am new to this embroidery so i'll be watching on this side of the forum


Gunold has good products. Whatever brand you decide to use - Madeira, Isacord, Glide, etc. - make sure that you can buy it wholesale. Paying retail will cost you a fortune.


----------



## mphb3

hi just to tell you that i have bought a brother pr 650 12 months ago and have never looked back it is fab so go for it you will be amazed with its performance nothing to say bad about this embroidery machine .................


----------



## kylerogers

Where does Brother hold these classes? I have seen on their website where the have three different 1 day classes, but I couldn't find anything about where they are held.

I found a local woman selling a used pr-650 and thinking of buying.



frankiko said:


> i just attended a 1 day crash course on Brother PR650 today and i found it as an amazing machine. i think this is a good entry level machine for a serious embroidery business. those 6 threads make life very very easy. before this course, i was leaning toward a single thread machine as an initial investment but now that I saw this PR650, i am now dreaming on this one.
> 
> GUNOLD was also there to talk/demonstrate about materials and supplies... do you guys use this company? They said they are worldwide and one of the top suppliers.
> 
> I am new to this embroidery so i'll be watching on this side of the forum


----------



## JohnBee

kylerogers said:


> Where does Brother hold these classes? I have seen on their website where the have three different 1 day classes, but I couldn't find anything about where they are held.
> 
> I found a local woman selling a used pr-650 and thinking of buying.


find a Brother authorized dealer in your area. they normally hold training or classes about this machine.


----------



## hlbalben

Hi...I am new to the site and not really sure how to get around on here. I accidentally found it. What caught my eye was the discussion about the PR-650. I am a Janome user for quilting (sewing blocks, etc.). I have a Gammill for longarm quilting. I had a Janome 11000SE for embroidery, but it was a combo unit with sewing. I never used the sewing on it at all. I sold it and decided to get an dedicated embroidery machine. Naturally I looked to Janome (MB4) first, but as I look around I came upon the Brother PR-650. As I look at this Brother, wow, it does so much more than the MB4. I just have a few questions. Can someone tell me the difference between the 600 and the 650? This is where I'm confused. I had an offer from a dealer to purchase the 600 for $6,500. Is this a good price? Would I be better off purchasing the 650?
Thank you so much. I was so happy to find a site who really knew the Brother machine. Heidi
P.S. I hope I can find my way back to this site, but if I can't can you possibly cc me to my email? [email protected]
Thanks again so much.


----------



## hlbalben

Buechee said:


> I love my PR 600 and I'd love to get the 650. just looked at it the other day. I liked it.


What is the difference between he two machines? (PR600 vs. PR650)
Heidi


----------



## hlbalben

mphb3 said:


> hi just to tell you that i have bought a brother pr 650 12 months ago and have never looked back it is fab so go for it you will be amazed with its performance nothing to say bad about this embroidery machine .................


Thanks so much. I need to know the difference between the two machines. (PR600 vs. PR650). I have to decide which one to get. Like I said, the dealer offered to sell the PR600 for $6,500. I guess he wants to get rid of the older model.


----------



## jean518

He is selling new 600s? It was the first of the 6 needles and was introduced several years ago. There have been a few models since. There is now a 10 needle out. Sounds a bit high to me! Good machine though. What is he offering as far as addons for that price?


----------



## tfalk

$6500 for a PR600, even if it has never been used, is WAY high... I bought mine brand new 4 years ago for $5500. You can find them on digitsmith.com or several of the other embroidery machine sites for much closer to $3500. Personally, I would not buy one unless I could see it run in person.

If I remember correctly, the main differences from the 600 to the 650 was the addition of the cylindrical frame and a slightly taller hat frame. Other than that, they are basically identical. I have 2 PR600's with over 35 million stitches on them, they are great little machines. The only time they've been in the shop is for regular maintenance and to have the automatic threaders replaced.


----------



## dan-ann

I agree the price is way high for a 600. I have two and they are 5 yrs old and just keep running.my dealer won't take a 600 on a trade in as she will not be able to resell. I do believe they have discontinued making some parts for the 600's also. I was told if s ome thing major goes wrong keep the machine for parts of the other one, look into that before you buy

I think the 650 has a light over the needles to see better when threading it does go off when sewing . 

I dream of having the 10 needle.


----------



## hlbalben

tfalk said:


> $6500 for a PR600, even if it has never been used, is WAY high... I bought mine brand new 4 years ago for $5500. You can find them on digitsmith.com or several of the other embroidery machine sites for much closer to $3500. Personally, I would not buy one unless I could see it run in person.
> 
> If I remember correctly, the main differences from the 600 to the 650 was the addition of the cylindrical frame and a slightly taller hat frame. Other than that, they are basically identical. I have 2 PR600's with over 35 million stitches on them, they are great little machines. The only time they've been in the shop is for regular maintenance and to have the automatic threaders replaced.


I called the dealer this morning. I made a mistake. It is the 650 for $6,500. If I want the 650e it is another $800. on top of the $6,500. Sorry to give you incorrect information, but I'm not tuned into Brother machines yet and I still get the m=numbers mixed up. So, with all that said...is $6,500. a good deal for the Brother PR650??
Again, you guys are great. Thank you so much for helping me make this decision.
Heidi


----------



## jean518

Still sounds high to me. Especially if there is an upgraded version. I did not think any dealers had any new ones of the older models left. Are you sure it is new? My 2 cents worth.


----------



## hlbalben

jean518 said:


> Still sounds high to me. Especially if there is an upgraded version. I did not think any dealers had any new ones of the older models left. Are you sure it is new? My 2 cents worth.


Yes, they are a dealer who sells new machines. You still think it's too high? Hum...I offered him $6,000, but he said no. I guess if I called him and said I'll buy it for $6,000, if you change your mind, let me know. 
What kind of price should I be looking for?


----------



## jean518

Maybe it isn't but just seems high for a machine that if as was stated before parts are not going to be manufactured for. Is he throwing anything in? I would offer him that for the updated one. If he wants to get rid of it bad enough, he will go for it. I know he needs to make money. I don't think they went for much more than that when they were introduced. Do you know the manufacture date?


----------



## hlbalben

jean518 said:


> Maybe it isn't but just seems high for a machine that if as was stated before parts are not going to be manufactured for. Is he throwing anything in? I would offer him that for the updated one. If he wants to get rid of it bad enough, he will go for it. I know he needs to make money. I don't think they went for much more than that when they were introduced. Do you know the manufacture date?


I got the price down to $6,800. for the 650e and they deliver it to my condo in Florida. It is new in the box according to him. I am so excited. I live in Ma and Fl. I go down to Fl January 16th. I am on the edge of my seat excited about playing with this new machine. 
Thank you all so much helping me through all this. I couldn't have made a good decision if it were not for this forum helping me. 
I'm getting my new Brother 650e!!!! YES!!!!!!


----------



## jean518

There is a yahoo group for the machine also that covers the 600 through the 650. I think it is pr600. Join it. A lot of really nice and helpful people. Congrats and enjoy!


----------



## dan-ann

Make sure they set it up and show you the basicsto get started . Do join the yahoo group. It is a wealth of info. I have been on it for years.


----------



## Wrightdesign

Is this your first machine other than a home sewing machine that uses one needle . if you have the money buy the commercial machine. You wont be sorry. your commerical machine will smoke out the brother or babylock any day. just my 2 cents worth.


----------



## NavyGuy

The "e" has a new hd lcd monitor that is used on the PR650e and PR1000e. Since the PR650 series doesn't have a video camera for alignment it wouldn't be worth $800 for me.


----------



## Ppf graphics

hlbalben said:


> I called the dealer this morning. I made a mistake. It is the 650 for $6,500. If I want the 650e it is another $800. on top of the $6,500. Sorry to give you incorrect information, but I'm not tuned into Brother machines yet and I still get the m=numbers mixed up. So, with all that said...is $6,500. a good deal for the Brother PR650??
> Again, you guys are great. Thank you so much for helping me make this decision.
> Heidi


Hello Heidi, 

Do you mind sharing your dealers name as I am in the market to purchase a PR650?


----------



## brianrudie

is the pr650 good for commercial use ? from 50 to 100 pieces per job?


----------



## Wrightdesign

brianrudie said:


> is the pr650 good for commercial use ? from 50 to 100 pieces per job?


IMO I say no! It overheats and will not stitch. It is not made for commercial long hours of stitching. My SWF can hum all day & night and has never had a problem with overheating or failure. Where the babylock or brother machines i know for a fact have overheated,gone in the shop & stayed for 4 months to get fixed. This has happen to many of my friends and mine. I use mine now only for applique & play.Why invest in a non commerical machine if you are thinking of doing commerical work? My friend, Jen just called last week her babylock machines are down with overheating & she has many orders to get done. Hope this helps.Ann


----------



## brianrudie

What machine in the uk do you recommend for around £4000


----------



## tfalk

Wrightdesign said:


> Where the babylock or brother machines i know for a fact have overheated,gone in the shop & stayed for 4 months to get fixed. This has happen to many of my friends and mine.


Interesting to hear this Ann... I have 2 PR600's that have only been in the shop for maintenance and to have the auto-threaders replaced. One has over 50 million stitches, the other has north of 30 million and they've been dead solid reliable... I'm wondering if the environment has something to do with them overheating?


----------



## mamaof3cowboys

where can i see details and prices on both these machines. ive yet to find cost!


----------



## brianrudie

brianrudie said:


> What machine in the uk do you recommend for around £4000


Approx how many hours use do you get before a service is needed and how much does a service usually cost?


----------



## buehrle

i also have 2 pr600's and never had a problem (had them 2 years) with them and i use them everyday. never had them overheat (only me). i don't run them 24/7 though.


----------



## dan-ann

2 pr 600's here also 5yrs old i sew 6-7 hrs a day on them 4-5 days a week. Had one problem in 5 years. As with every maccine you must. Clean oil etc maintain them.

Please don't tell my machines they can't run with the big dogs


----------



## Wrightdesign

tfalk said:


> Interesting to hear this Ann... I have 2 PR600's that have only been in the shop for maintenance and to have the auto-threaders replaced. One has over 50 million stitches, the other has north of 30 million and they've been dead solid reliable... I'm wondering if the environment has something to do with them overheating?


 are you using yours from the time you get up in the morning non stop and ending at evening? I am not talking about running them for 4 hours or so , i am talking non stop for 8 hours or more. it is warm here but cool in the shops. I just know from many of my friends that these machines can not keep up with true industrial machines like, swf, or tagima, or bardum??


----------



## Wrightdesign

dan-ann said:


> 2 pr 600's here also 5yrs old i sew 6-7 hrs a day on them 4-5 days a week. Had one problem in 5 years. As with every maccine you must. Clean oil etc maintain them.
> 
> Please don't tell my machines they can't run with the big dogs


maybe my friends just lemons in tx. they just use them all day long 6 days a week& they have been in the shops for months. 
yall must of got the great ones.


----------



## valleyboy_1

do the brother pr 650 do applique twill??


----------



## Wrightdesign

I was just going on what my friends and what i have seen. I am so glad T shirt forums is working on my email now. Thank you,


----------



## Wrightdesign

it might be part of the country I am in or my friends are in. In Dallas it is hot and humid and where i am it is HOT HOT HOT> but my friends keep their houses cool . I am glad to hear yours is workhorse like mine.


----------



## tfalk

Wrightdesign said:


> are you using yours from the time you get up in the morning non stop and ending at evening? I am not talking about running them for 4 hours or so , i am talking non stop for 8 hours or more. it is warm here but cool in the shops.


Mine are not used 7 days a week like that but when we get busy, they will run for 10-12 hours straight for a couple of days if need be. Honestly, I've had more issues with my SW/E-1501T than I've ever had with the 2 Brothers.


----------



## A1WHITES

Here my two cents . I have a baby lock 10 needle for almost 4 years it has been it the shop once for 3 days that it. I just bought a new 6 needle baby lock to help with the smaller jobs. Here is the one thing I base my buying on my repair shop is 40 miles a way. If I need service it's there.


----------



## mpcutter

which hat hoop do I need to do ear to ear embroidery on a brother 650e?


----------

