# Is it possible to make the rhinestone decals WITHOUT using your cutter on the decal material?



## BBB (Jul 12, 2007)

I know, there are a million threads on these bad boys already, and I've read through 'em all. My brain hurts now! 

I think, though, that I'm down to one last question before I jump in and give the decal thing a go.

Is it possible to make the decals WITHOUT using your cutter on the decal material? (I'm planning to use the StickOn material, if that makes any diffference at all!) I have a perfectly lovely cutter, but my goal in life is to streamline the process as much as humanly possible and if there is any chance that I can just press the decals onto a rectangle-shaped piece of StickOn sized to fit around the design, that would seal the deal for me - that I can in fact do this without making myself nuts.

If you make the decals without cutting the decal material to contour the design, I would LOVE to see what your results look like and get any feedback you have on what steps you do take to trim the decal material after pressing (with scissors I am assuming?) - how difficult is it to trim nicely, etc etc etc...

Would love and appreciate any feedback on the whole "custom cut the decal material prior to pressing" vs. "press onto a rectangle of decal material and perhaps trim a bit after the fact if needed" school of thought!!

(I think I already know the answer... that it really does have to be cut to contour. But I'm hoping to hear otherwise... LOL.)


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## katruax (Sep 30, 2010)

It doesn't have to be contour cut... But my question why would you not?... The finished product is certainly going to look better... Cutting the decal material is one of the easiest steps in the process if not the easiest why do you want to skip that step?...

Kevin


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## BBB (Jul 12, 2007)

It's a good question! And the answer is that my cutter hates me. No, seriously, it plots against me when I am sleeping, I'm sure of it. 

I hate to even admit this, but I am totally stumped on how to get the decal material to cut - I use a cutter that has a sticky carrier mat, and I can't figure out how I'd cut the decal material on there without the backing sticking to the mat and never coming off. Plus I picture myself having to use different blade configurations for the decal material vs. my regular template rubber and wasting a ton of both items because I have the blade out too far or in too far - I always seem to have trouble reconfiguring my blade and blade holder if I make any changes or replace the blade, etc - and if I'm trying to switch back and forth regularly between different blade lengths, etc I see nightmares ahead.

Maybe I'm making this more complicated than it really is? (Probably....)


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## katruax (Sep 30, 2010)

Actually you are going thru what we all went thru... 

That is you don't know what the heck you are doing!... But that's to be expected... 

This business is a complicated one... But.... Once you know what you are doing... Well then like most things it's pretty easy...

Your best best is to take the time to figure it out and do it right... There is a reason most would tell you to contour cut... It's the way it's really supposed to be done... Can you press on a rectangle and cut out with scissors... You can... Will it look like crap?... Depends what you consider crap? Will it look like crap compared to doing the right way if you set them side by side?... Almost certainly...

I can tell you a little about what I know... I too have a cutter that takes a sticky mat... Silhouette Cameo.... Honestly for decal material... You will pull your hair out trying to cut the material on a Cameo... As for the material not coming off the sticky mat... Make your mat less sticky... Cover it with sawdust... Throw it in a pile of gravel... LOL... Not really... Just make it less sticky... How?... YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.. Make a Cricut Mat less sticky... Hours of entertainment await...

I cut everything with a single 45deg blade blade depth doesn't change... Only thing I change is the pressure setting... But then I'm not using a Cameo to cut with either... Some cutters may just not be up to the task... 

In the end you and your customers will both be happier once you get the process down... If your current cutter isn't up to the task... Go ahead and use scissors to start until you can get a little better cutter...

I actually have one of the cheapest cutters out there that being a Red Sail from Sign Warehouse... $300 for a 24" but that cutter will do everything I've asked it to and beats my little Cameo hands down... But my Cameo can print and cut which my Red Sail can't... 

Kevin


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## BBB (Jul 12, 2007)

katruax said:


> Your best best is to take the time to figure it out and do it right... There is a reason most would tell you to contour cut... It's the way it's really supposed to be done... Can you press on a rectangle and cut out with scissors... You can... Will it look like crap?... Depends what you consider crap? Will it look like crap compared to doing the right way if you set them side by side?... Almost certainly...


This made me literally LOL. 

Thanks so much for the feedback about the carrier mat thing, as well as the blade. I have a Groove-E from KNK and I am assuming I can use it sans carrier mat but have never tried and am scared...  It's hard for me to even picture it, I'm so used to watching that carrier mat go back and forth!!


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## katruax (Sep 30, 2010)

I too always use a carrier mat... I just think it makes it easier... You have a decent cutter... You should have no issues cutting the material but there is a "magic" to dial in those setting specific to your cutter... But once you figure out the "trick" you're good to go... You could opt for more than one blade holder as well as I know many people do for the various materials they cut...

I've never had a problem with one blade, one blade depth and just varying the pressure but every cutter is a little different...

Years ago... I bought my first embroidery machine... I worked for a construction company at the time... I wanted to make a hat for the owner... I went thru at least 40 damn hats over one weekend... For the life of me I just couldn't get the damn logo straight on the hat!!! It was really PISSING ME OFF!

After going thru all those hats... I finally decided to change the angle of the design on the machine... You see the angle was pretty spot on from hat to hat... It just wasn't inline with the bill... I modified the design to have a 2 degree angle... Years later to this day... Every hat design gets tilted 2 degrees and it comes out nice and parallel to the bill...

Yeah ago I had this Caps 6x6 Screen printing machine... You know how bad I cussed that damn thing getting the registrations setup? Here I thought it was a piece of crap... I had someone come in to look at the machine... Literally 5 minutes my problem was resolved... Seems I left out a few needed bushings and screws during the setup process... OOPS!...

Then from there I wanted to do Screen Printed Transfers... Another entire process to learn... Lots of ink wasted even more time wasted and transfer paper wasted... But..... I eventually got past all that...

So for now it's all a process you have to master... I'm still trying to figure out the whole Rhinestone thing myself... I'm learning though...

Kevin


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## dan-ann (Oct 25, 2007)

I felt the same way. I hand trimmed my first two decals that I was using for a test run. They have been on my car for most of the summer and all winter(stick on) now that I I know they last I am contour cutting. The originals do not look professional up close.

By the way they have been thru a brush car wash 4 times( dear hubby) and have lost only one stone
Sally


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## allhamps (Mar 15, 2007)

I do not contour cut my decals and I never have. I always hand trim, and they DON'T look like crap. Actually, I don't trim anything, my son does. lt's how he earns his gas money.

In any event, whatever works for you and your customers.


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## BBB (Jul 12, 2007)

allhamps said:


> I do not contour cut my decals and I never have. I always hand trim, and they DON'T look like crap. Actually, I don't trim anything, my son does. lt's how he earns his gas money.
> 
> In any event, whatever works for you and your customers.


This gives me hope that there is a backup option if contour cutting makes me want to thow my cutter out the window...


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## Rodney (Nov 3, 2004)

:: edited thread TITLE to be more descriptive  ::​


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## hi-nrg-joe (Jul 19, 2008)

Are you buying prestoned transfers or making the templates/trasnfers yourself? As mentioned above, cutting the decal material is probably the easiest part...besides pressing. If you can make a rhinestone template, then you can definitely contour cut a decal.


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## BBB (Jul 12, 2007)

hi-nrg-joe said:


> Are you buying prestoned transfers or making the templates/trasnfers yourself? As mentioned above, cutting the decal material is probably the easiest part...besides pressing. If you can make a rhinestone template, then you can definitely contour cut a decal.


Making templates myself - I have no problem with those! I think I need to try cutting something without that carrier mat - once I see that it is in fact possible, I think I'll feel more confident in this entire endeavor!


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## SandyMcC (Jul 23, 2009)

BBB said:


> Making templates myself - I have no problem with those! I think I need to try cutting something without that carrier mat - once I see that it is in fact possible, I think I'll feel more confident in this entire endeavor!


Let me help you with that. It's very easy but there are a few tips that will make things easier. Send me a PM and we can set up a time to talk by phone next week.


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## mamag (Feb 17, 2012)

Okay, I have a question related to the pressure....I have OOBling Pro, can make my own rhinestone transfers for t-shirts, etc but when I try to contour cut the stick-ons decal material, the cutter goes right thru...!! What should the pressure be on? I am using a 45 blade in my Puma III. What am I doing wrong?

And, I would like to make vinyl decals, too. What kind of vinyl do I need? And, are they removable/re-positionable or permanent once placed on your window?

And, do decals need to be applied wet or can they be applied dry? I want dry - seems easiest for the customer to me.

Thanks, Lisa


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## ChefScott (Nov 25, 2011)

What is the pressure that you are using now? How far out is your blade? I cut the Rhinestone StickOns material with a downforce of 60 grams using a 45 degree CleanCut blade on my Puma III.


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## mamag (Feb 17, 2012)

Hmmm...now I will sound like the newbie I am (been doing this since April)...when I turn the cutter on and go off-line for system set up, the force says 4.23 oz. I have changed it to 3.something when I was trying to cut but not more. I did a couple test cuts, seemed ok but not when I tried the entire decal contour. The stick-ons material seems to buckle up or move under the rollers, as well, not staying completely flat. 

I am using a 45 degree blade as well, it's about a credit card width out.

Any help - thanks!!

Lisa


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## ChefScott (Nov 25, 2011)

I would suggest changing the units that the Puma III uses back to grams. To do this press the on/off line button to take the cutter offline, press the Misc. button and scroll to Select Unit and choose metric. Then exit out.
3 oz. is roughly 85 grams.
The StickOns material will "talk" to you, as it is doing for you now. Set your down force to 60 grams (about 2 oz.). Watch it as it cuts, if it still seems to buckle, adjust the blade in a little bit. You will have to fiddle with it a bit (both blade depth and downforce), but that should put you in the ballpark.
Recommended pressure for the StickOns material is between 50 and 70 grams of downforce.


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## katruax (Sep 30, 2010)

I don't know if will help but it might not hurt to try?... 

The StickOns material has a very thin liner... It's my one complaint with the material... I can't hink how a thicker liner would hurt?...

Anyhow I cut basically everything on a cutting mat... I wonder if it would help with the buckling of the material if you used a cutting mat?... 

If you don't have a cutting mat you can get a Cricut Mat at about any WalMart or Hobby Lobby, Michaels whatever for $15.00 or so... 

Like I say I use my cutting mat for everything pretty much... Larger rols of vinyl no.. .But rhinestone template material, decal material smaller vinyl jobs... Always I use a mat...

Kevin


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## DivineBling (Sep 14, 2010)

Actually, she doesn't need to do that... She can change the settings for her cutter right in OOBling Pro, no matter what her cutter settings say, the cutter is set to accept software settings which override what she puts in her cutter.

So Lisa, change the downforce in OOBling by going to Cut > Tool Options and make sure Grams is checked and change your downforce to about 60.

Let me know if that helps!


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## katruax (Sep 30, 2010)

Stephanie... Do you think cutting on a mat would help or not?... I've always cut on a mat because I thought that was the preferred method?....

Kevin


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## mamag (Feb 17, 2012)

Okay, I'm getting there. Do I want the blade to cut thru both the stick-ons and the backer piece it's on or just the decal part (top)? Some places the blade has gone all the way thru both pieces. 

I've adjusted blade depth in, force to 60, 65.

Now gonna try 65 w/ blade depth a little farther out - going for half-way from where I started to where I am now!

Thanks so much for your help!!

Lisa


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## katruax (Sep 30, 2010)

mamag said:


> Do I want the blade to cut thru both the stick-ons and the backer piece it's on or just the decal part (top)?


The decal part... Not the liner the decal is one... But the liner is thin so there is not much wiggle room.. Takes a bit to get it just right...

Kevin


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## mamag (Feb 17, 2012)

Okay - you all are fantastic! I am almost there...

just a couple more tweaks.....the cut seems to be going more smoothly, very little if any buckling of the stick-ons material, BUT.........
when I weed, there are a few parts that have not been cut thru, causing me to pull, stretching the material. Do I adjust the blade or the force? 

Uggh....

And, are these clings permanent? Applied wet or dry?

thank you!!!!!!!!!

Lisa


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## DivineBling (Sep 14, 2010)

mamag said:


> when I weed, there are a few parts that have not been cut thru, causing me to pull, stretching the material. Do I adjust the blade or the force?


I was once told that it's more important to keep the blade as shallow as you can and better to adjust the force.

And you should apply the rhinestone decal material dry, not wet.


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## BBB (Jul 12, 2007)

katruax said:


> Like I say I use my cutting mat for everything pretty much... Larger rols of vinyl no.. .But rhinestone template material, decal material smaller vinyl jobs... Always I use a mat...
> 
> Kevin


Just bumping this back up - Kevin, how do you adhere the decal material to your cutting mat prior to cutting?


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## katruax (Sep 30, 2010)

BBB said:


> Just bumping this back up - Kevin, how do you adhere the decal material to your cutting mat prior to cutting?


I just use scraps of sign vinyl along the edges of the decal material and a non sticky cutting mat.... You could use a sticky cutting mat as well...

Kevin


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