# What I need to start dye sublimating t-shirts



## pegdoug (Jun 18, 2011)

I've been trying to start selling t-shirts with a bible verse on them to raise money for needy children around the world. I have many designs and I want to dye sublimate them. I have been working with someone who is willing to do the sublimating, but the turn around time and dependability is not good. I have been wanting to make the shirts myself. I have a list of things to buy:
Ricoh GXe3300N GelSprinter Printer 405679
PRO Transfer Press Sublimation Machine 16X24
A4 Sublimiation Inkd Press transfer paper
16X20 teflon sheet

What else do I need and can I do these shirts myself without any experience?


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## SweetExpression (Apr 22, 2009)

First, be sure to find a good supplier. I would recommend Conde and/or Johnson Plastics from personal experience, but who you choose should be local(1 or 2 day ship at most). 

If your designs are not full color to take advantage of the color range of dye sub, then you probably should look at doing plastisol transfers or vinyl for your bible verses. 

With dye sub, you can only print on white or light colored 100% poly for best results or 50/50 shirts for a vintage look. If you plan on doing dark shirts, that would require a full cut-and-sew setup, dark-color transfers, or vinyl.

The Ricoh 3300 can do up to legal size paper, so it is OK for shirts up to an adult medium. Your list is pretty good for start-up. You will need dye sub inks for your Ricoh and I would suggest butcher paper from Sam's Club to protect your heat press from getting permanently stained from the dye sub gases. You need to allow for a lot of waste shirts when you first get started, because it takes some practice to get good at doing shirts without crease lines and ghosting.

Also keep in mind that 100% poly shirts run $5-7 per shirt wholesale, so I'm hoping that you can retail your finished shirts high enough so you can pay for your equipment, future ink costs, and still have money left over for needy children.

Hope this helps.


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## LB (Jul 25, 2009)

pegdoug said:


> I've been trying to start selling t-shirts with a bible verse on them to raise money for needy children around the world. I have many designs and I want to dye sublimate them. I have been working with someone who is willing to do the sublimating, but the turn around time and dependability is not good. I have been wanting to make the shirts myself. I have a list of things to buy:
> Ricoh GXe3300N GelSprinter Printer 405679
> PRO Transfer Press Sublimation Machine 16X24
> A4 Sublimiation Inkd Press transfer paper
> ...


I have a Ricoh 3300 also. It's a good little printer, however, I'm not sure I would do that again. I bought it as starter system. If you are doing a volume business you might not be happy with the ink costs. You are limited to 8.5" x 14 sizes too. I have no affiliation whatever but I am considering Cobra Ink Systems for my upgrade, probably their Epson 1100 system .:: Cobra Ink Systems::. This is where the term CIS began


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

pegdoug said:


> I've been trying to start selling t-shirts with a bible verse on them to raise money for needy children around the world. I have many designs and I want to dye sublimate them. I have been working with someone who is willing to do the sublimating, but the turn around time and dependability is not good. I have been wanting to make the shirts myself. I have a list of things to buy:
> Ricoh GXe3300N GelSprinter Printer 405679
> PRO Transfer Press Sublimation Machine 16X24
> A4 Sublimiation Inkd Press transfer paper
> ...


As others point out that printers output is only up to legal size. Also, see this thread first. _Some_ users are having a lot of pain with Ricoh reliability. 

http://www.t-shirtforums.com/dye-sublimation/t132123.html#post780138


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## pegdoug (Jun 18, 2011)

Thanks for the info. I am thinking that maybe I should just buy a heat press and the shirts to start and let someone else print the images. How does this sound?


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

pegdoug said:


> Thanks for the info. I am thinking that maybe I should just buy a heat press and the shirts to start and let someone else print the images. How does this sound?


Several here print transfers for others. Safe way to start, but eventually you can make more money by DIY.


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## LB (Jul 25, 2009)

pegdoug said:


> Thanks for the info. I am thinking that maybe I should just buy a heat press and the shirts to start and let someone else print the images. How does this sound?


That might work out for you, but you have already said that you were having trouble doing that. Problem with that is that you lose control of your business. Your dependent upon someone else for you to be able to supply your customers that may present you with deadlines and other issues that make doing this with an offsite printer difficult. You might also look into finding a reliable screen printer that would give you good service, but again, lack of control is what I don't like. Good luck with whatever you decide.


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## pegdoug (Jun 18, 2011)

Lack of control is definetely what I don't like also. I want things at a certain time and a certain way. I just am not too sure about what I need with the different inks and keeping it up and running properly. Any advice.


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## LB (Jul 25, 2009)

pegdoug said:


> Lack of control is definetely what I don't like also. I want things at a certain time and a certain way. I just am not too sure about what I need with the different inks and keeping it up and running properly. Any advice.


Peggy, that part is not difficult. Granted the Ricoh is an easy fix for that (if you can keep it working and afford the ink). I suggest you call and speak with Cobra inks. The owner, Richard, has really good reviews on here for helping customers with their needs. Talk with them, let them make a recommendation to you. That 1100 system, using their profiles is getting good reviews and it is less than $400.00. If your going to be printing a good bit of stuff, I doubt you would have any clogging issues.

Read this thread http://www.t-shirtforums.com/dye-sublimation/t160848.html


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## pegdoug (Jun 18, 2011)

Thanks so much!


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## bungy (Aug 24, 2006)

mgparrish said:


> Also, see this thread first. _Some_ users are having a lot of pain with Ricoh reliability.
> 
> http://www.t-shirtforums.com/dye-sublimation/t132123.html#post780138


Those problems mentioned in the thread only relate to the 7000, the 3300 does not have the same issues.


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## inurdreams (Nov 6, 2009)

We do sublimation. We started way back with the old Xpress System and initially purchased it for awards.
So with some planning before your purchase there are many products that are sublimatable.

We do Full color Photo shirts, mugs, license plate, key chains, dash plates for car rallys, plaques and is great for full color name badges. So it opens up other markets and gives a business some diversity.

But for larger quantities with not much color in the design screenprint is the way to go if your trying to offer a better price and increase your margins.

We use CESCO which is Canadian but for a good look at the different ideas trying visiting their site - google CESCO (Canadian Engraving Supply Company)

Cheers


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

bungy said:


> Those problems mentioned in the thread only relate to the 7000, the 3300 does not have the same issues.


There is a 3300 with the same defect claim in that thread. I have seen others on other forums reporting this before, just fewer than the 7000.


http://www.t-shirtforums.com/dye-sublimation/t132123-11.html#post957678


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## texasjack49 (Aug 4, 2008)

pegdoug said:


> Thanks for the info. I am thinking that maybe I should just buy a heat press and the shirts to start and let someone else print the images. How does this sound?


I think you intuition is correct, your goal is raising funds and a certain design, not sublimating. I think your best option from where you are right now would be to have somone like Transfer Express or Versatran make transfers for you. depending on your designs you can gang them on a sheet. That opens up being able to do 100% cotton shirts which lowers your cost and opens up other possibilities. also, you can print as you need without worrying about inks, ICC profiles, printer issues which distract from your real goal.


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## texasjack49 (Aug 4, 2008)

mgparrish said:


> There is a 3300 with the same defect claim in that thread. I have seen others on other forums reporting this before, just fewer than the 7000.
> quote]
> 
> I don't think any printer has ever been made that someone hasn't complained about but I have owned the 3300 in the past and IMHO it is the most reliable, least maintenance sub printer I have ever used. Considering how many 3300's are out there I think it has a pretty good track record.


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## binki (Jul 16, 2006)

Conde has a print service as well as ace transfer. You could use either of those or buy plastisol transfers and a heat press and diy. 

I would not do dyesub myself on shirts. The cost is far too high and the problems are far too great unless you are going to print daily.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

texasjack49 said:


> mgparrish said:
> 
> 
> > There is a 3300 with the same defect claim in that thread. I have seen others on other forums reporting this before, just fewer than the 7000.
> ...


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## skdave (Apr 11, 2008)

Poly shirts are a few bucks higher than cotton but after that the cost are very in line, if not lower, than DTG and small runs with a good Screener.

You do not need to print your own transfers you can buy them with your art or stock art for .50 to $1.25 16x20 print.
If you own a Heat press you have all the equipment you need. Heat press's are cheap $300. and up. I have used a Iron for dye sub thasfers under 4" in size.

The up side to dye sub is, no limit on the amount of Bright colors, no hand/feel. Your press size is the only limit to print size. One off's or longer runs are easy to press, and will never wash out like ALL other types of printing we do on this forum. NO CLEAN UP. With the latest dri fit shirts that have a much higher precieived value than cotton. Vapor has a cotton feel 100% poly for those that do not like the feel of poly.

All these plus's for a couple of bucks more for a shirt. Think about it and try a few.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

skdave said:


> Poly shirts are a few bucks higher than cotton but after that the cost are very in line, if not lower, than DTG and small runs with a good Screener.
> 
> You do not need to print your own transfers you can buy them with your art or stock art for .50 to $1.25 16x20 print.
> If you own a Heat press you have all the equipment you need. Heat press's are cheap $300. and up. I have used a Iron for dye sub thasfers under 4" in size.
> ...


I agree on your post except that doing ink jet pigment inks and using a quality paper, those do not wash out and virtually zero fade and virtually no hand after years of washing.

Sublimation is still king for no hand and no BG window though.


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## BHD (Oct 31, 2007)

Peggy, what a great project you have undertaken! Every noble endeavor begins with a seed.
Personally, I would go with screenprinted transfers. I do both sublimation and transfers, and 
the plus side I would see, is you could print them on any color shirt, you can have a store of them, the learning curve is a bit easier than sublimating shirts, and you would probably be able to contribute far more to your cause. I have used Ace Transfer since 2007, and they provide a quality transfer product (ask for Kay, she is very helpful). Hoping you have great success!


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## LB (Jul 25, 2009)

A lot has been said here. All of it good information and advice. I guess it all boils down to what you want to do, take the easy route and let someone else provide your transfers or print them yourself. Some say, oh, let someone else do it, well when you do, you give up the learning experience and the satisfaction of producing something that YOU did. Consider, that if you have a dye sub setup, even if it is the smaller Ricoh, you have the opportunity to learn from it and your NOT LIMITED TO DOING SHIRTS. 

My wish is that there was a Ricoh gel ink system that used something other than SG inks and had a 11x17 or larger print capability. The cost would be more reasonable than $1300 too. I could not be happier with my 3300 at the moment and as I have stated though, I doubt I would buy the 7700. Too many problems and too expensive.


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## texasjack49 (Aug 4, 2008)

mgparrish said:


> texasjack49 said:
> 
> 
> > There are fewer complaints I would agree. But the post I was commenting stated no 3300 reports on that thread. Also, as others have pointed out the 3300 is too small for tshirts. It can do tshirts of course, but business reality is that you really should have 11 x 17 for the larger shirts, and you can make more profit from those.
> ...


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## Riderz Ready (Sep 18, 2008)

texasjack49 said:


> mgparrish said:
> 
> 
> > Steve just made a general statement which should be OK on a post like this since it was not the specific topic. He is 99% correct since the post in question is about 99% to do with the 7000. The original poster did mention that he is thinking about buying the 3300 Not the 7000. Steve was just supporting his thoughts. Like I said it was just my opinion about the 3300 reliability but I also own a WF1100 so I have had both side by side, again, not a challenge, just my opinion after using both printers. The OP said he wanted to print verses on T shirts, the 3300 would work for that with the 8 1/2 X 14 sheets. I'm not sure I understand the "more heads, more clogs" I also use an 8 color 4800 to sub, it only has one printhead and doesn't clog any easier than a 4 color. It is a larger printer so the ink lines are longer. So far(after 4 years)If it does get a clog it is always in the print lines, not in the printhead. The ink lines are about 2 feet long. Is each color considered a printhead? it looks like one solid part, I know it is sold as 1 part. At one time I thought I might be buying one until I found the clogged line.
> ...


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## texasjack49 (Aug 4, 2008)

Riderz Ready said:


> texasjack49 said:
> 
> 
> > Just curious - if you are using a 4800 why also Ricoh 33 and a WF1100 to dye sub?
> ...


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

texasjack49 said:


> mgparrish said:
> 
> 
> > Steve just made a general statement which should be OK on a post like this since it was not the specific topic. He is 99% correct since the post in question is about 99% to do with the 7000. The original poster did mention that he is thinking about buying the 3300 Not the 7000. Steve was just supporting his thoughts. Like I said it was just my opinion about the 3300 reliability but I also own a WF1100 so I have had both side by side, again, not a challenge, just my opinion after using both printers. The OP said he wanted to print verses on T shirts, the 3300 would work for that with the 8 1/2 X 14 sheets. I'm not sure I understand the "more heads, more clogs" *I also use an 8 color 4800 to sub, it only has one printhead and doesn't clog any easier than a 4 color. It is a larger printer so the ink lines are longer. So far(after 4 years)If it does get a clog it is always in the print lines, not in the printhead. *The ink lines are about 2 feet long. Is each color considered a printhead? it looks like one solid part, I know it is sold as 1 part. At one time I thought I might be buying one until I found the clogged line.
> ...


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## LB (Jul 25, 2009)

How could you possibly NOT get clogging problems with dye sublimation? After all, what your doing here is taking a dye (which is a solid) that is suspended in liquid and forcing it through a microscopically sized orifice. I am beginning to believe that the printers have little to do with it, I think it is inherent in the process. I suspect the only preventative is regular printing and flushing of those microscopic openings. I would think that environmental conditions could possibly effect the solids in the ink and cause problems also. Just my opinion.


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

LB said:


> How could you possibly NOT get clogging problems with dye sublimation? After all, what your doing here is taking a dye (which is a solid) that is suspended in liquid and forcing it through a microscopically sized orifice. I am beginning to believe that the printers have little to do with it, I think it is inherent in the process. I suspect the only preventative is regular printing and flushing of those microscopic openings. I would think that environmental conditions could possibly effect the solids in the ink and cause problems also. Just my opinion.


Humidity as an environmental condition is definitly a factor printing. Ink "viscosity" is also effected by temperature.


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## LB (Jul 25, 2009)

mgparrish said:


> Humidity as an environmental condition is definitly a factor printing. Ink "viscosity" is also effected by temperature.


Yes, and who knows what kind of places the printers are in that are coming up with these problems. Not saying that's the cause, but more than likely a factor. I keep my equipment under air conditioning and heat. I have a laser engraving machine and it don't like heat. Warranty is voided if operated in over 90 degrees. It is a $25,000 machine and not a $200 printer, sooooo, necessary we keep it cool and dry.


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## texasjack49 (Aug 4, 2008)

mgparrish said:


> texasjack49 said:
> 
> 
> > By your logic then a desktop 4, 6, or 8 Epson desktop color printer could _never_ have a clog since _there are no long line._
> ...


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

texasjack49 said:


> mgparrish said:
> 
> 
> > I did state that "*I'm not sure I undersand"* what that means is the Im not sure I understood what you were saying. I also asked a question"is each color considered a printhead?, that is what the (?) means. Didn't realize it would offend so much. *This is a fact.(*now you have me talking in Bold)
> ...


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## pegdoug (Jun 18, 2011)

Wow! A lot to think about. I like the feel and look of the dye sublimation. My prints all have a lot of color to them. I like the feel of the polyester shirts and they seem like they are a much nicer shirt to sell. I would like to sell the shirts at the Christian music festivals in the summer, but the majority of the customers would probably be teens and they like the black or darker shirts. I was thinking about the workforce 1100 with Cobra ink. Does it matter what kind of heat press one buys?
Thanks to everyone for all the good information and ideas!


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## LB (Jul 25, 2009)

pegdoug said:


> Wow! A lot to think about. I like the feel and look of the dye sublimation. My prints all have a lot of color to them. I like the feel of the polyester shirts and they seem like they are a much nicer shirt to sell. I would like to sell the shirts at the Christian music festivals in the summer, but the majority of the customers would probably be teens and they like the black or darker shirts. I was thinking about the workforce 1100 with Cobra ink. Does it matter what kind of heat press one buys?
> Thanks to everyone for all the good information and ideas!


Peggy, the heat press needs to be the best one you can afford. There are cheap ones out there and may be OK. I think the main thing is to get one that can maintain an even temperature. I happen to have a Hotronix Swinger that I have had several years. It cost $1400 or so new,but I have not regretted spending the money because it has been very reliable. I'm sure there are people here that can recommend a brand that isn't as much money, as, like I said, they are cheaper ones out there. The heat press in the sublimation process is just as important as the printer and ink.


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## pegdoug (Jun 18, 2011)

A couple more questions: Would either Hix Hobby Lite 9 xx 12 swimger or a Geo Knight Jet Press swinger be okay to get?
I am looking at CorelDraw Graphics Suite5 On ebay it sells for $70. and through the company it is $399. What is the difference? The one on ebay states that it is a complete program.


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## LB (Jul 25, 2009)

pegdoug said:


> A couple more questions: Would either Hix Hobby Lite 9 xx 12 swimger or a Geo Knight Jet Press swinger be okay to get?
> I am looking at CorelDraw Graphics Suite5 On ebay it sells for $70. and through the company it is $399. What is the difference? The one on ebay states that it is a complete program.


Consider those presses carefully. You want to be sure you get one that is big enough. Read this and do a search on here for the other one, then make your decision 
http://www.t-shirtforums.com/heat-presses-equipment/t146055.html You need a 16x20.

On the Corel. First, I passed on upgrading to X5 because of the bugs in it. I use X3 today. It is pretty much accepted that X4 and X3 are better and X3 being the most stable. When your purchasing these cheap copies of Corel, you have to be extremely careful. Some vendors will palm off academic versions on you as full versions. If it were me, I would try and find either X3 or X4, full licensed version and buy that rather than X5.


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## D.Evo. (Mar 31, 2006)

I'm of the same opinion as Larry - get the best equipment you can afford: especially, if it's a business, not hobby. Bigger heat press gives you more versatility. I have never heard anyone saying "I should have bought a smaller press", while the opposit happens all the time


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## mgparrish (Jul 9, 2005)

pegdoug said:


> A couple more questions: Would either Hix Hobby Lite 9 xx 12 swimger or a Geo Knight Jet Press swinger be okay to get?
> I am looking at CorelDraw Graphics Suite5 On ebay it sells for $70. and through the company it is $399. What is the difference? The one on ebay states that it is a complete program.


I'm with the others on getting a high quality press. Those hobby presses are not meant for long duty and if you are sucessful you will outgrow it very quickly.


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