# Merch by Amazon?



## treefox2118 (Sep 23, 2010)

Was glancing at Merch by Amazon and had a bit of a heart attack browsing their FAQ.

15" x18" printed tees for $8.10. With white ink. They choose DTG, screen or hybrid. Free prime shipping, free returns.

Questions:

* Who does their fulfillment?
* What DTG Printer?
* What ink supplier?
* The hybrid is a screen printed white underbase and a DTG CMYK second pass. Who does this?
* Anyone receive a shirt from a Merch by Amazon vendor? How's quality?

I tried to see if I could even get a 15" x18" WUB print on 100% cotton down to $8.10 and it would be difficult if not impossible.


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## atarizzz (Dec 17, 2015)

treefox2118 said:


> Was glancing at Merch by Amazon and had a bit of a heart attack browsing their FAQ.
> 
> 15" x18" printed tees for $8.10. With white ink. They choose DTG, screen or hybrid. Free prime shipping, free returns.
> 
> ...


If their base cost to you is $8.10, that could be very hard to beat for on demand printing of your designs. Does that include amazon selling and referral fees? Or is that if you are direct linking a customer to the merch url for your design? 

If all is included in the base price - anyone wanting to buy a DTG to start printing their own designs, should pause for a moment to really consider that number. If it costs you say $7 a shirt total to print on your own, how much would you pay for someone to do EVERYTHING for you? Would that be worth $1.10?? Crazy.


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## atarizzz (Dec 17, 2015)

Here's the details on the cost breakdown:
https://merch.amazon.com/resource/201858580


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## DTGmart (Apr 24, 2015)

$8.10... Price that low I'm pretty sure Amazon is using woot.com (one of their subsidiaries).


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## treefox2118 (Sep 23, 2010)

Makes sense that it would be Woot doing fulfillment.

That $8.10 cost appears to even include free prime shipping, which is even more incredible if you do the math.

Wonder how fast they actually print and ship. If it includes 2-day delivery, that means they're printing in practically real time.


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## Justin Walker (Dec 6, 2006)

More importantly, I wonder what quality garment and what print settings they are using to hit that price point...


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## JosephRegan90 (Dec 26, 2015)

agree with you may be its woot


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## atarizzz (Dec 17, 2015)

Justin Walker said:


> More importantly, I wonder what quality garment and what print settings they are using to hit that price point...


Anvil or American Apparel for $1-something more. If they run out of Anvil in specific size, they'll upgrade to the AA version for free.


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## treefox2118 (Sep 23, 2010)

As mentioned it is usually Anvil but AA is only $1.50 more.

I had a few clients show me the quality they received and it's very high quality with no pretreat lines and a solid white underbase.

The ability for customers to get a refund is also a difficult service to match. I don't get many requests for refunds (ever) but consumers obviously like the service as a reason to buy.


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## Smckee21 (Jul 23, 2010)

It looks like there is also a $3.00 Amazon listing fee as well, all volume discounts ended 1/1/16 so the base price appears to be $11.10 each, single side imprint.


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## treefox2118 (Sep 23, 2010)

Smckee21 said:


> It looks like there is also a $3.00 Amazon listing fee as well, all volume discounts ended 1/1/16 so the base price appears to be $11.10 each, single side imprint.


I didn't catch that, nice find!

Do you know if the listing fee is applicable if an end designer just buys his own garments to sell locally?

$11.10 is easier to challenge and compete with, except for the free shipping and free returns. I've already lost a few customers to Merch by Amazon and I'm looking for ways to win them back.


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## danslave (Jun 26, 2013)

I wonder what's it like to not have to make a profit. AMazon gets to play by a totally different set of rules than the rest of us.

That being said, there do seem to be some limitations to the program. Content needs to be approved by them and there is a limit to the number of designs you can have (or so it seems).

You could probably set up your own Amazon store, assuming you could get ungated for apparel sales, and offer people a very similar royalty only deal for people, but not with the same margin.


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## jglovier (Aug 29, 2016)

Interestingly enough, Amazon was cited to be in talks to buy American Apparel in today's news. This would make a lot of sense for them given what they could become in the on-demand apparel industry. Think of all the folks selling ****ty t-shirts that capitalize off of pop-culture crap. That industry alone is probably multiples the size of the custom t-shirts industry we know and love (i.e. for love of the craft). That would be a brilliant business move for Amazon, and for those of us who just "love the craft", it could be a huge windfall too.


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## NoXid (Apr 4, 2011)

jglovier said:


> Interestingly enough, Amazon was cited to be in talks to buy American Apparel in today's news. This would make a lot of sense for them given what they could become in the on-demand apparel industry. Think of all the folks selling ****ty t-shirts that capitalize off of pop-culture crap. That industry alone is probably multiples the size of the custom t-shirts industry we know and love (i.e. for love of the craft). That would be a brilliant business move for Amazon, and for those of us who just "love the craft", it could be a huge windfall too.


Ha! Thanks for mentioning that, as that is the first I had heard of it. I didn't realize that anyone other than Gildan was in the game.

From a quick Google:


> Amazon and Forever 21, as well as California-based apparel maker Next Level Apparel and brand licensor Authentic Brands Group LLC, are in talks with American Apparel and its financial advisers about submitting offers ahead of a deadline on Friday, the people said.
> 
> Any successful offer would have to top a $66 million stalking horse bid by Canadian apparel maker Gildan Activewear Inc, which American Apparel agreed to when it filed for bankruptcy in November.


The prospect of Gildan buying AA was not thrilling ... except maybe my local distributor would start carrying AA.

Amazon though ... I don't know. They damn well might make it so that Amazon is the ONLY way consumers can buy AA, with the only "wholesale" route being Merch by Amazon. **** that ... but just my wild speculations


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## AZArt (Dec 20, 2016)

The break-even point for a shirt on Merch is $10.98. Above that, you pay the equivalent of the Amazon selling fees. What you are actually getting is a royalty and Amazon is the seller on record. 

While Merch is successful, it is very badly run and its success is purely down to Amazon traffic. They have basically grown too quick and have managed that growth badly and not planned for the issue of copyright and trademark infringements well. 

Originally, it was intended for gamers to be able to create t-shirt designs for their games, but it grew into something much bigger much quicker. At one point, there was in excess of 1/2million Merch Designs on Amazon. Merch now deletes any designs that hasn't sold in the first 60 days.

Some problems with Merch from a content providers view:
- You can get kicked off of Merch and have your payments withheld without being given any information other than "some of your designs violated our T&C's".
- Rampant theft of designs (pixel for pixel copy). A group in Malaysia brag about how they have hundreds of accounts and when one gets shut down they just use another. That resulted in Amazon shutting down inactive accounts, and people who had an account for just a couple of weeks logged in to find their account was terminated but they could reapply if they wanted to. Its also been reported that some people will steal your designs and then report YOU for copyright infringement. 
- They also keep part of their T&C's secret. No one knows if a trademark application has to be finalized or if Amazon will act on anything that has been filed and is going through the process. You would think they would share this information but Merch can be a minefield when it comes to knowing what you can and cannot do. 

In the past, when you opened an account, you could upload 25 designs. When you sold 25 you got tiered up. When you hit the next number, you got tiered up again. You could get up into the thousands. But that has stopped. Merch is trying to throttle things because they are struggling to keep up. IIRC correct, they start you on 10, and you can upload 2 a day. They also have suspended the ability to upload designs and right now only a few sellers can actually upload new designs. 

They have also been known to throttle demand by withdrawing colors and sizes. They were not offering black t-shirts although its not known if this was part of their throttling or if they just ran out.

Woot has nothing to do with Merch. Merch is its own program. I have heard from a third party that they have huge DTG machines the size of a car that require 2 people to operate and they have a facility the size of a football field with these machines.

If you are planning to join Merch, don't expect to be able to go in guns blasting anytime soon. You will need to take it slowly. But the traffic you get on your designs blows the competition out of the water. Just stay away from designs like "pug life" as designs like that are seriously saturated and there is no way to promote your designs within Amazon itself.


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## NZACO (Jan 21, 2012)

treefox2118 said:


> Was glancing at Merch by Amazon and had a bit of a heart attack browsing their FAQ.
> 
> 15" x18" printed tees for $8.10. With white ink. They choose DTG, screen or hybrid. Free prime shipping, free returns.
> 
> ...


I have just looked at the site and am amazed how blatantly copyrighted images (superman, batman, rolling stones) are been sold. 

It is important to also note that most of the people selling seem to have started their storefronts very recently and all the reviews are from the last day or two. 

Unless every seller is selling huge amounts I think the reviews have been made-up.


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## HappyHaole (Jan 12, 2015)

I went through the process of getting my brand registered with Amazon.
It's not easy, they are very strict with their clothing sellers, so I doubt anything on there is fake, meaning it's licensed goods.


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## NZACO (Jan 21, 2012)

HappyHaole said:


> I went through the process of getting my brand registered with Amazon.
> It's not easy, they are very strict with their clothing sellers, so I doubt anything on there is fake, meaning it's licensed goods.


... look at the dates of the reviews for the Storefronts. I looked very early in the morning and all the reviews I saw were for the same date. 

Unless huge amount are been sold for most Storefronts it's hard to believe that every buyer writes a review after 12pm of the day before.


P.S.
HappyHaole I looked at your web site and the page was not found.


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## HappyHaole (Jan 12, 2015)

NZACO said:


> ... look at the dates of the reviews for the Storefronts. I looked very early in the morning and all the reviews I saw were for the same date.
> 
> Unless huge amount are been sold for most Storefronts it's hard to believe that every buyer writes a review after 12pm of the day before.
> 
> ...


 yep, I've since closed my business, my printer and whole set up is for sell. sent the printer in for repair and took 4 months to get it back, the business didn't make it...


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## AZArt (Dec 20, 2016)

HappyHaole said:


> I went through the process of getting my brand registered with Amazon.
> It's not easy, they are very strict with their clothing sellers, so I doubt anything on there is fake, meaning it's licensed goods.


As an experienced Amazon seller, i can tell you this isn't true at all.


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## jmcgurren (Oct 28, 2008)

Funny, I took a DTG job that was 135 shirts double sided for a local Amazon distributor a couple weeks ago for their annual company event.


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## Lookintwobook (Mar 2, 2017)

They are now a complete nightmare. Changed prices on shirts I have had up for months and all but one got rejected for trademark violation. Put them back up same exact descriptions. Some are approved some are not, same design but on different shirts brands. Anvil branded approved, american apparel option rejected; same price same description same design. Huge problems with art being stolen and then sold for cheaper by other Merch account owners. They are a mess and have zero clue about infringement. They refuse to answer and questions. Read their merch forums for more information. Last year they were amazing then December hit and they shut everything down and it has been a mess ever since.


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## Chris109 (Aug 3, 2015)

Lookintwobook said:


> They are now a complete nightmare. Changed prices on shirts I have had up for months and all but one got rejected for trademark violation. Put them back up same exact descriptions. Some are approved some are not, same design but on different shirts brands. Anvil branded approved, american apparel option rejected; same price same description same design. Huge problems with art being stolen and then sold for cheaper by other Merch account owners. They are a mess and have zero clue about infringement. They refuse to answer and questions. Read their merch forums for more information. Last year they were amazing then December hit and they shut everything down and it has been a mess ever since.


Guy I worked for who did mug sublimation for a little while back in 2015. Put them on Amazon. Christmas Eve came and Amazon sent him an email saying they were closing down his store: no reason given. Emails and calls were responded to but it got to the point where one of the head honchos told my guy, "We waited til Xmas eve, so be happy with that. But you can reapply in 90 days." He also received a letter with their T & Cs. What was funny about the T & Cs that he received was, it told him 'what not to do'.


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## proworlded (Oct 3, 2006)

Familiar with this? Kornit Digital signs agreement with Amazon - Kornit Digital (NASDAQ:KRNT) | Seeking Alpha


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## NoXid (Apr 4, 2011)

proworlded said:


> Familiar with this? Kornit Digital signs agreement with Amazon - Kornit Digital (NASDAQ:KRNT) | Seeking Alpha


Yup. Clearly Amazon plans continued expansion of Merch.

And clearly they have recently implemented policies aimed at upping the quality and variety of designs. That's all to the good. 10,000 A$$shats just copying whatever sells well were not adding _*anything*_ of value. One "Best Dad Ever" T-shirt listing is enough (_more_ than enough in my book ).

It is named "Merch by Amazon" for a reason and was not intended to be what it has become. To the extent that masses of people continue to treat it as a get rich quick scheme, Amazon will continue to make rules to discourage them, as it has done, and continues to do, in other categories, like erotic Kindle books


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## allamerican-aeoon (Aug 14, 2007)

Interesting post. I missed many of goodies. 
Price Amazon offering is very good $.
Industrial production cost is way less than Most Forumer's cost. $1 consumable +package+very minimal labor of less than 1 minute + etc(space, power etc) = Your cost.
WorkFlow and Machine are the key component. 
#1. Fast print machine with quality.
#2. 
1st step.
Customer send design to Amazon/you. Machine computer already have Design/s. Zero time.
2nd. 
At your shop: Paper printer kick out Bar-code sticker. Bar code have all information of design, qty, size, address, customer info, $$$ all.
3rd. 
picker picks shirts and stick barcode on shirts.
4th.
on Printer. operator do not need to know anything but Push button.
put into dryer.
5th
bar code will printout shipping label. put into bag. GONE GONE

If anyone want to try this Free WorkFlow Software contact me. 
AA developed(In House) for Aeoon but I always thinking about smaller guys shoes. I have been thinking how AA could help small operations. With remembering that I was the smallest among all.
Set Up Website with Hotfodler, software.
Order Arrive(Reject poor art work). 
Bar code printout.
Scan and pust botton. No Ripping No computer open. No labor and no mistakes.
This bar code works on every machines on floor. 1-50 plus.
Cheers! Beers are on me always/


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## Justin86 (Mar 19, 2010)

allamerican-aeoon said:


> Interesting post. I missed many of goodies.
> Price Amazon offering is very good $.
> Industrial production cost is way less than Most Forumer's cost. $1 consumable +package+very minimal labor of less than 1 minute + etc(space, power etc) = Your cost.
> WorkFlow and Machine are the key component.
> ...


Hey Peter 

Im keen to check out your Workflow software. PM sent


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## allamerican-aeoon (Aug 14, 2007)

Justin86 said:


> Hey Peter
> 
> Im keen to check out your Workflow software. PM sent


Are you using barcode system now? Must!!!!!
I dont think I can help on Kornit system. AA can but require too much work without return. Also, helping competitor(?).
Cheers! Beers are on me always!


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## Justin86 (Mar 19, 2010)

allamerican-aeoon said:


> Are you using barcode system now? Must!!!!!
> I dont think I can help on Kornit system. AA can but require too much work without return. Also, helping competitor(?).
> Cheers! Beers are on me always!


Yes we already run a barcode system that I setup.

That's ok, thanks anyway.


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