# Cloudy image on mug, any suggestions?



## blackshark (Sep 25, 2007)

Good morning all,
I am in the process of trying to run off a few "test" mugs (inkjet sublimation transfers) using a convection oven and a mug wrap. I am putting them in at 400 for 15 minutes, and then immediately peeling the transfer off and putting them in slightly warm water. 
The main issue I have encountered so far, is most have had some cloudiness/ghost-like look to part/all of the image. One or two have come out really nicely with really vibrant/correct colors, so I am leaning more towards thinking it is something I am doing wrong in the actual sublimation/heating process, as opposed to a printing issue.
If anyone has any insight as to if this may be caused by not enough/too much heat time, maybe the pressure of the wrap not being secure enough etc., I would appreciate any tips. 
Thank you for you help!
Gary


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## charles95405 (Feb 1, 2007)

The ghost images in dye sub are mostly the result of the paper moving slightly when taking off the wrap...are you using heat tape for all four corners...making sure the image is smooth,...I tape one side..put the tape on the other side but don't press yet...I smooth the image from the tape side to the untaped side, then let my palm press the tape on the remaining side...confusing??? well that is just me...a confused oldie... and yes you do need a tight fit of the wrap


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## blackshark (Sep 25, 2007)

Thanks for the advice. I also have probably not been as "smooth" with removing the mug wrap as I could be either as I am learning the process  That could have also contributed to some movement of the transfer. I will try and be a little more thorough with my taping procedure and hopefully that will help. Plus, as I get used to the process a little more hopefully the removal of the wrap will be a little more smooth as well.
With being new to the process in general, sometimes when problems like this arrise there are so many things it "could be" it makes it hard to know what to focus on to fix the issue. Knowing it is most likely the transfer moving is a big help. I will just have to refine my taping/removing technique 
Thanks again for the help!!!!
Gary


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## recrisp (Oct 25, 2007)

blackshark said:


> Thanks for the advice. I also have probably not been as "smooth" with removing the mug wrap as I could be either as I am learning the process  That could have also contributed to some movement of the transfer. I will try and be a little more thorough with my taping procedure and hopefully that will help. Plus, as I get used to the process a little more hopefully the removal of the wrap will be a little more smooth as well.
> With being new to the process in general, sometimes when problems like this arrise there are so many things it "could be" it makes it hard to know what to focus on to fix the issue. Knowing it is most likely the transfer moving is a big help. I will just have to refine my taping/removing technique
> Thanks again for the help!!!!
> Gary


Gary,

I'm a newbie at this too, and so far I ahve had pretty good luck, but I haven't done enough to 'really' say yet that I know what I am doing. 

The paper itself definitely needs to be pulled taut, but not overly tight, then taped like what was mentioned.
(Make sure to line up the paper level and the image is centered in the alloted area)

I live near TOG (Texas Original Graphics) and the owner there has been doing this a long time, he showed me a few things, maybe it'll help you.
I am using Cactus Wraps, and Cactus mugs too, TOG ink and an Epson C-88 printer, that may not be your set-up, but that's mine. heh

I was told that if the mug wrap is too long, meaning the red rubber piece, that can 'buckle' on you if you over-tighten it, so if that is the case, just snug it, and 'maybe' just give it a 'little' more tightening, but it just needs to be snug.
(It's a "feel" thing, trials and error type)
My wrap's red rubber piece is lined up with the metal post, so when I tighten it up, there is not a buckle.

I made register marks on my MUG TEMPLATE and and I make my image 3.75"x8.5", this is for a full wrap-around and top and bottom bleed.
(I actually made my template 3.75" with about 'just enough' bleed to go over the rim of the mug to ensure it kind'a folds over it, it's not necessary though.
I use the palm of my hand to gently burnish over the paper to conform to the mug, that helps it kind'a make sure the image goes all the way to the middle of the rim.
(Top and bottom)
It makes small creases in the fold-over part on the rim, but it actually works, so I plan on keeping it up.
This is not necessary either, but I was told that is the way the owner did it, and I felt it wouldn't hurt to try.

I was told to bake the mugs at 400 degrees for 18 minutes, and 20 minutes if I had ten in there...

When the time is up I use a oven mitt to grab the handle so I don't touch the paper, at all...
(I use a timer, and also I use a digital oven, and also an oven thermometer to check to make sure that both are really close,
some ovens can really be off by several degrees)
I use warm water to fill up the mug, (not necessary really) and set it out in my cold garage.
After about a minute or so, I loosen the bolt on the wrap, GENTLY though, heh, then I let it sit until cool.
After it's cool, I remove the wrap all the way, then lift it off of the mug, then remove the tape from the paper.

I did a full-bleed black mug a while ago and it was perfect, well, with the exception of a small cloudy area, and it's on the bottom edge of the mug, but it's not really noticeable.
I am just playing around with them right now, no buyers on these, so although I won't be throwing these out afterwards, as I get more confident and just plain ol' better, I'll save those and see who buys what. heheh

This is just the way I am doing them, it may not be the only way, or the best way, but I can see that it definitely had good possiblities of being a good one for me.

When I am done, and I do get good results, I do plan on making a web page on how to do this, with pictures, I know that when I was looking I got a lot of answers, no pictures, and I didn't know what to do period. heheh
Still, it'll just be the way I'll be doing it, but it may help someone down the line to 'get it', 'cause I sure didn't at first. 

Randy


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## TooGoob (Jul 20, 2007)

blackshark said:


> Good morning all,
> I am in the process of trying to run off a few "test" mugs (inkjet sublimation transfers) using a convection oven and a mug wrap. I am putting them in at 400 for 15 minutes, and then immediately peeling the transfer off and putting them in slightly warm water.
> The main issue I have encountered so far, is most have had some cloudiness/ghost-like feel to part/all of the image. One or two have come out really nicely with really vibrant/correct colors, so I am leaning more towards thinking it is somethig I am doing wrong in the actual sublimation/heating process, as opposed to a printing issue.
> If anyone has any insight as to if this may be caused by not enought/too much heat time, maybe the pressure of the wrap not being secure enough etc., I would appreciate any tips.
> ...


When doing mugs special attention has to be taken before taking the wrap off of the mug. Without the pressure, the image is not contained and can blur outward.

I like to fill the mug with water and cool it down before removing the wrap. The mug stays hot enough to continue to out gas the image placed on the mug otherwise.


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## Cutting_Edge (Jun 30, 2006)

Randy

Thanks for the info from TOG......I have the same set up as you and my mugs are coming out very light......

I have the wrap tight....but maybe I am not cooking them long enuf at 15 min....400 degrees.....I will try the 18 minutes......and the cooling method you described......I have six mug wraps and would like to be able to use them for more than experimentation!! LOL

I look forward to the web page with picture instructions....I, too, am more a visual person.

I will let you know if I get more consistant results with the longer cooking time.

Margaret
Cutting Edge


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## recrisp (Oct 25, 2007)

Cutting_Edge said:


> Randy
> 
> Thanks for the info from TOG......I have the same set up as you and my mugs are coming out very light......
> 
> ...


Margaret,

Mainly, I am not that experienced at all, so my thoughts on all of this is just "thoughts", and what I was told. heh
If I were you, I'd call Bill or Ty at TOG, they'll tell you what you need to know.
To me, the cloudiness seems to be it could be too loose, but what do I know.
It would probably be due to not enough pressure being put onto the mug, I know, it's scary to put pressure on, but Bill told me to use a powered screwdriver (not a drill) to do this, it's easy.
He said that it's not strong enough to put too much pressure (or, it shouldn't be) and that way you can't break the mug.
Now there are different screwdrivers out there, but I know that I have one that has died 'cause I didn't use it 'cause it didn't have enough power, so he must mean 'that kind'. heheheh
I asked him "How tight should I do these?".
He just said that get it snug, then give it a little more.
I read here that it needs to be snug, then tighten it about 1-1/2 more turns, I don't know how true that is, but it sounds about right.

I'll be honest, I haven't tried that many yet, but if I do run into trouble, I just plan on working around it, I'll make designs that have grunge in them, or mottled backgrounds.
I also plan on outlining a lot of them, meaning to remove the backgrounds in Photoshop, that way there's less to get messed up.
I did some already and they came out good.
I am not really planning on doing so much custom stuff as ready-made, so the designs are up to me.
That helps me to make the mug with the best laid out plan that I can, then one design will sell over and over, then on to the next one.
I know you didn't ask about ME, heheh, but I'm just saying that you may want to think along those lines, it may give you an idea on how to circumvent the problem, one never knows.
That's the plan, we'll see. 

I'd definitely go 18 minutes though, and try to rotate the wraps, see if one outperforms another, and do one at a time until you know, you don't want a case of "Christmas gifts" that nobody wants. heheh

Good luck Margaret, and please let us know how it all works out, we won't learn unless we tell others. 

Randy


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## oneeyedjack (Mar 7, 2007)

Gary,
Definately listen to to Recrisp and get an oven thermometer or even put two in.I think if some are coming out with good vibrant color then 15 mins should be fine.If you overcook mugs they can come out blurry,not nice sharp images.Also put your mugs in with open end down.Ive only had one ghosting issue and that was when transfer slipped out of my hand and fell back on to mug.my first convection oven i couldnt get a good mug to transfer and when i got oven thermometer the oven was actually 25-30 degrees under 400.I also tape a piece of paper over transfer in case of some blowout.Like others have said make sure transer if flush against mug or you could get ripple in transfer after putting on wrap or ink could gas out the transfer.Good luck 

oneeyedjack


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## blackshark (Sep 25, 2007)

Thanks everyone. Gave me a lot of new tips to try out. Hopefully will do the trick. Thanks again for everyone's help!
Gary


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## MYDAMIT (Jan 14, 2007)

What ink are using, i think only sublimation process has ghost effect, i have laser process and sublimation. Now i only use sublimation for mug i give up with laser process. To many work in laser process, i need to press them in mug press for 2min then need to bake them again for 10min not like sublimation just press them in 3min then put in a water (easy). Ghost effect is only happen when you press them softly. Me i uesd hard press and 356'F in 3min. I use sublimation ink from China and mugs from coastal.


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## binki (Jul 16, 2006)

we use a spray bottle and wet the paper so it flattens out on the mug. we use a press so i wet the teflon sheet that i wrap it in and that helps to matte down the paper.


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## Cutting_Edge (Jun 30, 2006)

I tried what Randy (Recrisp) has suggested.......he and I have the same ink set up......

IT WORKS!!!!!! I finally got a mug that looks like it should.......bright colors....crisp lines.....WOWWWWWW.

Thanks Randy for the info from TOG.....I have a couple more trial mugs to do before I will offer them to customers.

Margaret
Cutting Edge


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## recrisp (Oct 25, 2007)

Cutting_Edge said:


> I tried what Randy (Recrisp) has suggested.......he and I have the same ink set up......
> 
> IT WORKS!!!!!! I finally got a mug that looks like it should.......bright colors....crisp lines.....WOWWWWWW.
> 
> ...



Margaret,

I'm glad that it worked out for you on that, it's just the way I was told to do it, but a few don't make it a perfect set-up, or, maybe it does. heheh
A little luck is also a good thing, I think that anything that is done by hand is not 100% consistent, that's where the "luck" comes into play. heheh

I know that I am going to try what Binki (Fred) said, wet the paper, that sounds viable to me, even though I am using wraps, it's worth a try. (Thanks Fred!)

Randy


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## ramonchin83 (Apr 23, 2015)

How do you fix the cloudy areas at the bottom of a mug, i am using a press not an oven.


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## Kevb (Apr 29, 2014)

Make sure the paper is taped very tightly to the mug. If the paper is loose, it will wrinkle and cause problems at either the top or bottom. The press should hold the mug firmly, you shouldn't be able to move the mug in the press. Try it out before you heat up the press, just to be sure you have the pressure right and the paper taped down tight enough. If you don't see wrinkles when you close the press, and it's tight enough to hold the mug without being able to move it, you should be ok. Even with the best conditions, it's possible to get it wrong. It's a learning process.


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