# Waterbased Emulsion won't come out of screen



## InkedApparel (Mar 18, 2009)

I have been practicing with waterbased inks the last few weeks , I coated probably 12 screens and reclaimed as many ...but this last batch of 6 screens that I attempted to reclaim wont come clean...1 out of 6 cleaned as usual..the other 5 I think are trash...I was hoping someone would give me a tip as to how to reclaim the screens that have waterbased emulsion still in them....half the screen washed clean the other half still has emulsion in it....
any help? or do I need to order more screens?

Inked


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## chard (Oct 14, 2008)

try not to wet your screen with water first but with emulsion remover first as the water can block the remover from contacting on your emulsion..try to soak it a little longer as waterbased emulsion is more resistant to water it needs more time before the remover can penetrate the emulsion..well, im not 100% sure..^_^


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## jsf (Aug 4, 2009)

Hey inked the emulsion remover is also called a stripper. 

You can also do reclaims with the use of regular bleach. Here's our colleague showing his method of reclaiming @post 12... http://www.t-shirtforums.com/asia/t97255.html


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## RichardGreaves (Nov 7, 2006)

*Reclaim summary*

When you expose your stencil, UV energy reacts with diazo or photopolymer sensitizer and joins - causes a chemical cross-link between the two components that make up the "emulsion". Linked together, and woven in and out of your mesh, the exposed stencil will not dissolve with water (insoluble), and rinse own the drain. What doesn't dissolve is ready for printing when it dries.

Stencil remover attacks these cross-links, releasing the stencil so it can again dissolve with water and rinse down the drain.

In the 'broken down', wet state, IF you let this "soup' of stencil remover & emulsion dry, they form a new chemical bond that is permanent and shackles the stencil to the mesh. When dried, there is no chemical to "unlock" this new chemical combination except the brute force of water pressure.

*Under exposed stencils are harder to reclaim*
Exposure is the only action you have where you control how the stencil will behave. Fully, or even over exposed screens, contrary to popular belief, actually reclaim easier than under exposed screens. They also leave less diazo ghost haze images, don't break down on press, and result in far fewer pinholes.
*
HydroBlaster of Utah*
In the 1980's HydroBlaster of Utah taught the world that 2,000+ psi water doesn't need any chemicals to remove a stencil. Larger volume shops could save enough money on chemicals to actually pay for a HydroBlaster. The downside to high pressure spray was if you had low tension mesh, the pulsing of the water spray made the mesh vibrate and it was harder to blast out the stencil. High tension mesh stood up to the spray and the water force was used on the stencil. If you don't have a high pressure sprayer, there is one at the local car wash. Clean up your mess after.

*Don't Pre-Wet The Stencil*
Most stencils are made with plenty of solvent or water resistance so they can resist water development after exposure or nasty inks & cleanup chemicals. One of the problems of stencil removal is how to get a water based chemical to penetrate into the stencil to attack the cross links holding it in the mesh. 

If you wet the stencil, that water without any stencil remover chemical takes up whatever path there is to the inside, BLOCKING the stencil remover like civilians on the sidewalk blocking firefighters at a fire. Try it. Wet half a stencil then sponge stencil remover on the whole screen.

*May I Cut In?*









Water in the stencil during exposure also blocks the chemical reaction of UV energy with the sensitizer so there is less cross linking than you would like - Under Exposure, the enemy of all screen makers. Strong solvent can also lock up under-exposed stencils because there is un-used sensitizer that can react with the solvent.

*Bleach*
Bleach is the standard chemical for breaking down indirect gelatin stencil films. Modern stencils have much more resistance to bleach than the 70+ year old gelatin technology.
*
Ready-To-Use Stencil Remover Advantage*
The HUGE advantage of pre-mixed stencil remover over concentrated mixes you add your own water to, is that there should also be a wetting agent in the ready-to-use that can't be concentrated. The wetting agent helps the water-based stencil remover penetrate int the water resistant stencil. If you're having good luck with concentrate, GOOD, don't change, but have some RTU in case you have a difficult screen - or see if it works faster. 

*Stronger formula*
Stronger concentration of stencil remover rarely speeds up the chemical action it takes to break the cross links, in the same way that 10 aspirins will not work faster than two aspirins to stop a headache.

Sodium metaperiodate is the basic chemical that is universal in the screen industry. This is a salt that is closely related to household chlorine bleach but works perfectly at breaking the cross links created by exposure to UV-A energy. It's like using a key in the lock of the door to open it, rather than kick it in when you get home.

Yes, bleach will work, but it works with brute force and when used in the strength needed for reclaiming screens, bleach can be very harmful and it will definitely take longer. Don't get any on your clothes or skin. Don't breath much of it into your lungs as you blast the screen with high pressure water, atomizing the bleach into a nice fog all around you face.

The better question is, "Is bleach the most cost effective product for the job?" There will always be those who look for an initially less expensive way to do everything and spend ten times what they would have spent otherwise. When you compare the cost of an industry specific stencil removers, properly mixed is quite economic. It is less expensive to use commercial screen chemistry to reclaim screens.

#RGreclaim


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## BroJames (Jul 8, 2008)

Chard, if you are still using that reclaiming powder, you may want to check with your supplier. Their recommendation is to "moisten" the screen first before applying the mixed reclaiming solution mixed with 1.5 liters of water and not the more concentrated 700-800cc you use or maybe used to use. This is to avoid premature damages of the screen. Sefar, Murakami and other screens can be a little expensive.

That is their recommendation, if I understood correctly, and just thought you may want to check it out.




jsf said:


> Hey inked the emulsion remover is also called a stripper.
> 
> You can also do reclaims with the use of regular bleach. Here's our colleague showing his method of reclaiming @post 12... http://www.t-shirtforums.com/asia/t97255.html


Let me translate in case someone wants to try using bleach

this is my method of reclaiming the screens using (100%) bleach. I reclaimed 7pcs screens in just 1 hour. you need to do it continuously so don't let the emulsion sink (to the floor) when dissolved. Just rub or scrub continuously (with a rag tied to the end of a wooden rod) then immediately rinse with water. Do not let the dissolved emulsion sit on the screen for long because it will harden again (and much harder to remove this time). I do not soak rags with bleach(Some lay the screens over a rag and pour bleach through the screen letting it soak for a few minutes. Some say seconds but I once used a 10% bleach solution for a few minutes). I am using emulsions from pioneer, but screens coated with ready mixed emulsion from tulco is reclaimed the same way.

PS. Mr bebo has posted elsewhere that emulsions with hardeners are easier to reclaim using bleach. 

I hope the translation is accurate enough but use bleach at your own risk.



RichardGreaves said:


> x x x
> 
> *Under exposed stencils are harder to reclaim*
> Exposure is the only action you have where you control how the stencil will behave. Fully, or even over exposed screens, contrary to popular belief, actually reclaim easier than under exposed screens. They also leave less diazo ghost haze images, don't break down on press, and result in far fewer pinholes.
> ...


Greaves, I was once in a hurry to open shop, left a stubborn unreclaimed and seemingly underexposed area(streaks of dark emulsion) for about 2 days, and can't seem to reclaim it using normal methods. Any suggestions?

what do you think of the feasibility of the 2000psi reclaiming method?


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## InkedApparel (Mar 18, 2009)

@ Greaves

thank you for your post...very informative..... I know that bleach isnt the best way to go when reclaiming screens , but I am at a loss as I have already tried my emulsion remover at full strength , this only worked on half the screen....I dont understand why it isnt working...I reclaimed the same screens a week ago using the same remover and power washer, last week it worked , this week it didnt. short of letting the screens soak in a tub of emulsion remover over night...is there any thing else I can try to get this emulsion out or am I beatting a dead horse and should I get new screens?

Inked


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## RichardGreaves (Nov 7, 2006)

Try an experiment.

Coat a small area of a screen.

Expose it using a positive.

Dry it.

Reclaim it.

If stencil remover works, ink or cleaner could be locking the stencil in the mesh.

If it doesn't - I think your stencil is under exposed and there are no cross-links to breakdown.


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## BroJames (Jul 8, 2008)

RichardGreaves said:


> Try an experiment.
> 
> Coat a small area of a screen.
> 
> ...


Any solution? I got this screen I plan to restretch if there is no more solution.


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## RichardGreaves (Nov 7, 2006)

BroJames said:


> what do you think of the feasibility of the 2000psi reclaiming method?


I think it works. That's why I wrote it. Everyone that doesn't have a high pressure washer eventually discovers the power.

2,000+ psi water doesn't actually need any chemicals to remove a stencil, but you have to be careful if you have low tension mesh, you can pop the screen if you get too close.

Be kind if you go the local car wash and clean up your mess.


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## BroJames (Jul 8, 2008)

Now I wished I didn't sell my KArcher. Forgot its maximum pressure but it's the more powerful one.

Our local car wash usually normally have lower pressure pressure washers.

How about removing those stubborn underexposed emulsions? Made some wrong calculations on my yellow mesh and now, some streaks of blue emulsion won't come off.


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## RichardGreaves (Nov 7, 2006)

That's all I've got. It's rare for someone to tell me they think I was holding back; Now tell me the actual easier way to do it.


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## InkedApparel (Mar 18, 2009)

I will try the test Greaves...Ill let you know what I find.....
I was thinking it may be the ink...but wasnt sure if ink would do that...have to wait until the weekend...you know those pesky damn fulltime gigs we all have 

Inked


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## BroJames (Jul 8, 2008)

RichardGreaves said:


> That's all I've got. It's rare for someone to tell me they think I was holding back; Now tell me the actual easier way to do it.


If you are referring to my post, no, never meant anything like that. I use yellow mesh for my aluminum screens. They're not just yellow but are a little more expensive than mesh from other suppliers. I also have the meshes for my aluminum frames professionally stretched to the right tension. So, spent a little more for them.

I know, or understand, that exposure time for yellow meshes should be longer - about double the time for white meshes. So, using my halogen then which exposes screens for 5 minutes, I think I set my step type exposure calculator to cover exposure times starting from 7 minutes(maybe less). 

However, I also changed my method. Normally, I cover each part of the step test calculator after they are exposed for a certain period of time. Since, I have plans for a halide exposure unit with the light source at the bottom and glass on top, I decided to change the way I do the step test. Instead of covering each part as they receive the correct exposure time, I decided that for a table top unit, it is easier to cover the entire calculator and then pull the cover back. For example, if the lowest exposure time I want to test is 7 minute, I expose the first step test area for 7 minutes and then pull the cover to expose the second part after 30 minutes (for 30 min increment tests), etc. I believe this is the way it is more often done.

Frankly, I don't really know where I went wrong. But I think I miscalculated and started pulling the cover after 5 minutes. This is the first time I did the step test this way, plus I was in a hurry because I have to open shop in the morning. Maybe I should not have atempted to reclaim the screen but it was usually an easy process. However, some streaks of stubborn emulsion won't wash out. Having to continue the reclaiming the next morning (but only got time I believe 2 mornings after), I am now stuck with a frame with unreclaimable emulsion.

If it was a regular white mesh with lower mesh count, I would have just restretch a new screen. But the yellow mesh is more expensive plus the additional cost for professional restretching, I am hoping that there is still someway to reclaim it. Nothing was ever meant to suggest any holding back whatsover. Just desperately hoping that there is still a way to save my screen.

I have started looking for car wash with 2000psi pressure washer. The one I dropped by just this morning has no gauge and the owner was not around so they do not know.


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## TshirtGuru (Jul 9, 2008)

For really stubborn stencils I sometimes spray emulsion remover and haze remover ok each side without presoaking with water. I lay it down horizontally to allow the chemicals to soak for about 2-5 minutes. Rinse and repeat if needed. I also use a pressure washer.


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## InkedApparel (Mar 18, 2009)

I will be investing in a pressure washer tomorrow and will try soaking with emulsion remover and haze remover then hit it with the pressure washer......what psi is recommended for stensil removing...im thinking 1500 psi.....

Inked


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## BroJames (Jul 8, 2008)

TshirtGuru said:


> For really stubborn stencils I sometimes spray emulsion remover and haze remover ok each side without presoaking with water. I lay it down horizontally to allow the chemicals to soak for about 2-5 minutes. Rinse and repeat if needed. I also use a pressure washer.


The spray emulsion remover should be what we often referred to as reclaimer. Maybe soaking it for 5 minutes is worth a try.


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## batvans46 (Apr 24, 2010)

a buddy of mine told me that in a jam, carburetor cleaner works. its a solvent, plus it comes in a pressurized can. i tried it at one point and it helped a little to loosen up a stubborn emulsion and then i finished the job with the legit remover. i think i just got lucky; ive ran into a snag similar to BroJames now and it helps not one bit lol.


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## Blackwater (Feb 9, 2010)

i use a 3000 psi pressure washer to reclaim my screens. i don't need to use emulsion remover at all. the pressure washer will remove the emulsion by its self, but emulsion remover does make it take less time.


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## BroJames (Jul 8, 2008)

I think 2000psi will do.

Used to have a 150 bar pressure washer (2175 psi) but sold it before I started to print anything substantial. The most commonly sold here in hardware stores are between 100-120bar (1470-1740psi) although 150 bar washers are not becoming common in hardware stores (but cost 50-70% more). Just wondering if anyone has ever tried reclaiming using a 1500psi (100 bar) pressure washer and how much reclaiming it can do.


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## InkedApparel (Mar 18, 2009)

I use a 1600 psi pressure washer..it washes the emulsion off fine with little effort...takes about 1-1 1/2 minutes per screen.....but even the 1600 psi wont touch the waterbased screens I have ....I think it is because the waterbased emulsion was past the shelf life but I used it anyway....

Inked


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## RichardGreaves (Nov 7, 2006)

InkedApparel said:


> I use a 1600 psi pressure washer..it washes the emulsion off fine with little effort...takes about 1-1 1/2 minutes per screen.
> 
> ....but even the 1600 psi wont touch the waterbased screens I have
> 
> ....I think it is because the waterbased emulsion was past the shelf life but I used it anyway....


If the emulsion was past it's shelf life, it would not have cured/hardened/resisted water, it would have dissolved when developed.

Water resistant stencils don't absorb water well, and are harder to reclaim. If 1600psi doesn't work, it's not enough pressure to do the job.

Here is where the cross-links of completely exposed sensitizer can be broken with stencil remover.

The HUGE advantage of pre-mixed ready-to-use stencil remover (over concentrated mixes you add your own water to), is that there is also a *wetting agent* that can't be concentrated.

The wetting agent helps the water-based stencil remover penetrate into the water resistant stencil. If you're having good luck with concentrate mixes, GOOD, don't change, but have some RTU in case you have a difficult screen - or see if it works faster.

If stencil remover doesn't work, I'll bet your stencil is under exposed.


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## n.signia (Nov 21, 2007)

What emulsion are you using? (I looked but didn't see that you
Mentioned the specific brand, I could have missed it)


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## InkedApparel (Mar 18, 2009)

I am using cci dual cure swr emulsion.....I guess I could be under exposed , but I use 2 21 step wedge test strips on each end of the screens and always get a solid 7.....all my other screens come clean with little to no effort......this is baffeling....thanks for the help.

Inked


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## BroJames (Jul 8, 2008)

Greaves, some suppliers here sells lacquer thinners for reclaiming screens. They cost about 3x more than those hardware stuff and has more ingredients in them. Would you or anyone happen to have come across these?


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## RichardGreaves (Nov 7, 2006)

InkedApparel said:


> I am using cci dual cure swr emulsion.....I guess I could be under exposed , but I use 2 21 step wedge test strips on each end of the screens and always get a solid 7.....all my other screens come clean with little to no effort......this is baffeling....thanks for the help.


No. You have the best answer in the world to the exposure question - A solid step 7 on a Stouffer scale. 

Now you *know *you have to look elsewhere for the answer.

I suggest an experiment. To establish a test stencil, make a very small coating (3 inch by 6 inch?), on a screen and let it dry, then expose it to a solid step 7 and take it to your sink and reclaim it.

Don't get ink on it, just reclaim it.

This will give you a clue about whether or not your printing is effecting reclaim.


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## RichardGreaves (Nov 7, 2006)

*Lacquer thinners as stencil remover*



BroJames said:


> Greaves, some suppliers here sells lacquer thinners for reclaiming screens. They cost about 3x more than those hardware stuff and has more ingredients in them. Would you or anyone happen to have come across these?


Lacquer thinners might lock the CCI SWR-3 stencil that is designed to resist water-based & plastisol inks.


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## n.signia (Nov 21, 2007)

We had the same issue with a batch of dual cure CCI waterbased emulsion (purple) purchased from ryonet. We ended up loosing about 8 good screens, and reclaiming took hours rather than the minutes it took with our normal dual cure (pink) and we use a dip tank. The really tough ones were the ones we used plastisol ink on, itnwas most like the plastisol locked the emulsion in. I took itnupnwith ryonet and even sent them a video of a screen trying
To be reclaimed, their conclusion was it was a bad batch of emulsion (even though we just got it). It was our first time trying it and we will never have that in our shop again. We lost 8 screens to that crap, and hours and hours and HOURS of labor. Even the screens we "saved" were never the same again, tiny specs of emulsion here and there locked in permanently. My advise is throw it out, don't wast any more time on it, and contact your supplier. Definately don't coat anymore screens with it.


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## n.signia (Nov 21, 2007)

I should add, that everything else about this emulsion worked normal for us. It exposed normal, washed out fine, held it's stencil, which added to the weird factor. None the less its junk if you can't reclaim it.


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## InkedApparel (Mar 18, 2009)

n.signia said:


> We had the same issue with a batch of dual cure CCI waterbased emulsion (purple) purchased from ryonet. We ended up loosing about 8 good screens, and reclaiming took hours rather than the minutes it took with our normal dual cure (pink) and we use a dip tank. The really tough ones were the ones we used plastisol ink on, itnwas most like the plastisol locked the emulsion in. I took itnupnwith ryonet and even sent them a video of a screen trying
> To be reclaimed, their conclusion was it was a bad batch of emulsion (even though we just got it). It was our first time trying it and we will never have that in our shop again. We lost 8 screens to that crap, and hours and hours and HOURS of labor. Even the screens we "saved" were never the same again, tiny specs of emulsion here and there locked in permanently. My advise is throw it out, don't wast any more time on it, and contact your supplier. Definately don't coat anymore screens with it.


 
I have thrown the swr emulsion away..and will not use it again....I lost 6 screens...on a tight budget , this really hurts I cant afford to be throwing money away on screens all the time....I use the cci dual cure dxp for plastisol without any problems everyday.....I also have used the dual cure swr emulsion before without any issues..thats what was so baffeling to me...im in the process of switching brands now...just need to find one I like as much as the dxp....

Inked


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## RichardGreaves (Nov 7, 2006)

I am sorry to hear of both your troubles.

Diazo sensitized emulsion is so basic, I want you to be reassured that this is a very odd incident, and not any sort of a trend for CCI. 

Starting over with a different dual-cure - you might get the same results You will have to do some testing, but for water resistance, you need the diazo sensitizer.

The next villain could be a very strong solvent, but plastisol is like salad dressing. It can't harm any stencil.

I still think a test on an exposed, unused stencil after smearing some of your suspect plastisol on 'half' or a test section to look for the trouble maker is in order.


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## n.signia (Nov 21, 2007)

Hi Richard,

As an example, on a left chest screen for a manual press, the plastisol is only in 1 section of the screen, what I was seeing, was where there was no plastisol ever in contact with the screen, it reclaimed easily. Where the printing occured on the screen was where it was locked in, 40 minutes with 1550 psi a quarter inch from the screen and we were still left with a junked screen. I did not see the same issues when printing with waterbase. We print with plastisol 95% of the time.


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## RichardGreaves (Nov 7, 2006)

That's a good test. I promise the full support of Ulano & KIWO if you have the same problem with their dual-cure stencils.

646-807-8580 my personal cell

What solvent do you clean with?
What ink?


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## InkedApparel (Mar 18, 2009)

yes ...I plan on conducting a test....it really bugs me that I cannot figure out why this has happened....I dont want to lose anymore screens ......

Inked


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## BroJames (Jul 8, 2008)

Drue, maybe you should try using a 2000psi pressure washer. I would be very interested in knowing how it turns out at 2000psi.


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## n.signia (Nov 21, 2007)

Richard,

I believe the dip tank solution at the time of the issue was CCI brand tank solution. We have Wiliflex, IC, and union inks in the shop, but during that time frame most likely was IC inks we were using. 

Bro, I hear you, but my 1550 psi washer is way more than enough to reclaim my dual cure "pink", and like I said before the areas umtouched by the ink reclaimed easily. I would be surprised if 50psi would make the difference. Especially when we were spending hours on these screens trying to salvage them.


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## adivito (Aug 25, 2006)

n.signia said:


> Richard,
> 
> I believe the dip tank solution at the time of the issue was CCI brand tank solution. We have Wiliflex, IC, and union inks in the shop, but during that time frame most likely was IC inks we were using.
> 
> Bro, I hear you, but my 1550 psi washer is way more than enough to reclaim my dual cure "pink", and like I said before the areas umtouched by the ink reclaimed easily. I would be surprised if 50psi would make the difference. Especially when we were spending hours on these screens trying to salvage them.


I know this sounds crazy but try the bigger pressure washer, if I have a really tough screen I bust out my 2600 psi gas powered washer. It takes off everything (probably killing my tensions too)


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## beOomi (Mar 31, 2011)

Just to add a little bit of advice for the newbies reading this (because all the old hands and pros will already know). When using a pressure washer to reclaim screens, clean as much ink as possible off the screen beforehand. If you don't you may end up with ink-splattered clothes like mine. Doh! I've just come in from the garden where I made this mistake/learned this lesson.

I know I should've taken the time to clean the ink off first, but.... well, rookie mistake I guess.

My Karcher pressure washer did the job with very little effort. I'm sure it's not the most powerful but it managed to clear the emulsion off in 2-3 minutes per screen. The screens were only coated 2/3, which would've helped. The ink took a little more effort but did come off. The smudges on my trousers and tee are proof of this.

Cheers,

Pete.


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## adivito (Aug 25, 2006)

beOomi said:


> Just to add a little bit of advice for the newbies reading this (because all the old hands and pros will already know). When using a pressure washer to reclaim screens, clean as much ink as possible off the screen beforehand. If you don't you may end up with ink-splattered clothes like mine. Doh! I've just come in from the garden where I made this mistake/learned this lesson.
> 
> I know I should've taken the time to clean the ink off first, but.... well, rookie mistake I guess.
> 
> ...



Good update, didnt even enter my mind to mention it because I have certain clothes I wear when doing these things, now after enough times they look like techincolor dreamcoat.


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## beOomi (Mar 31, 2011)

adivito said:


> Good update, didnt even enter my mind to mention it because I have certain clothes I wear when doing these things, now after enough times they look like techincolor dreamcoat.


So do I for almost every other job, but today I got dressed for lazing around the house and then just got it into my head to go out and clean those screens.

My new saying is: "Make all your mistakes at the beginning of a venture while you still have ignorance as an excuse". 

That's copyrighted; Me. Today.


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## beOomi (Mar 31, 2011)

Sorry: my screens were 2/1 coating, so very light work for the washer.


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## SpringfieldTees (Dec 14, 2010)

I don't know how relevant this is because it seems you have giving up on this already, but I had the same problems. 

And after almost 2 years of drama, I figured out that it was the emulsion and the way it was marketed to me. The emulsion they were selling as a dual cure, waterproof emulsion (SRW-3) was actually a diazo emulsion made by CCI. I don't know why they were, and some still are, selling it as a dual cure, but it is definatly a straight Diazo emulsion. 

Not only that, but the emulsion that they were selling as a waterproof emulsion, is an emulsion that the manufacturer is sellng as an ULTRA waterproof emulsion. 

Anyway, I decided to teach myself how to screenprint 2 years ago. I never knew what emulsion was when I decided that I was going to do strictly waterbased printing. I got the emulsion and experienced the same problems you did. Turns out that the emulsion is super thick when compared regular emulsion. I would imagine that I was leaving 3 times the emulsion you would leave with regular emulsion. So when I would coat my screens with 2 front/1 back, with the thick side of your scoop coater, I was actually coating my screen with 10 coats of regular emulsion. This of course explains all your problems. 

It's just not possible to work with that emulsion without a power washer. And if you want to coat your screens 2/1, your going to need a heavy duty power washer (5,000psi). 

Once I figure this out, and got my hands on a $50 electric, power washer that I hook up in my bathtub. I now use 1 coat on the front of the screen, and burn it under a 500watt light about 10 inches (25cm) away. When it turns green, it is done It works great. I have to move the light around the edges a bit the last minute or so, I think the light source is too close, but it works fine for me. But even with this 1 thin coat that I put on the front of the screen, I'm still not able to reclaim my screens without using my power washer. 

I have never worked with any other emulsion, so I thought it was normal. But it turns out that the emulsion is being sold to you as a dual cure, water proof emulsion. In reality you were purchasing a Diazo, ULTRA waterproof emulsion. 


Anyway, hope I helped somebody.


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## ProTipKnit (Dec 22, 2017)

Okay guys i know this thread is very old but didn't wanna post another thread with the same topic. 
Im having the same problem and have literally tried everything in this thread. (other than bleach)
Went to local car wash and tried to pressure wash and that barley worked.(usually, a little elbow grease gets it all off no problem so i never have the need for pressure washer)
i soaked them in emulsion remover and water for over 24 hours.
Ive been through three scrubbing brushs lol.
im just at a loss.
2 of the screens are literally brand new so this is a huge bummer to me.
im trieing to find the issue so if i do end up ditching these screens and getting new ones, i'll know what not to do.
i did my normal routine.
the only thing that was off was the fact that the emulsion had what looked like mold in it.
it was white and sitting on the top.
there wasnt much... but i didnt think too much of it.
i honestly didnt wanna accept that it had mold in it, if that was even mold because of it being barley used...
also i let the screens sit around for a little bit with the emulsion on it so, my question would be does the amount of time you have the emulsion on screen effect how hard it will be to get off?


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## RichardGreaves (Nov 7, 2006)

ProTipKnit said:


> i soaked them in emulsion remover and water for over 24 hours.


Soaking a screen in stencil remover certainly is a way to make sure it gets everywhere, but 24 hours seems overkill. I assume you thought more time would help the stencil remover penetrate.

Although it takes longer for stencil remover to penetrate a water-resistant stencil, you should see it's effect in 5 minutes.

Under cure is the top reason for a frozen stencil. The best removal happens when the stencil is completely cured.

It's important to make sure the stencil remover doesn't dry on the mesh. When all the components are in a slurry of chemicals after application and scrubbing mixes them up - when they dry there is no way to remove them except with the razor blade.

The stencil can also freeze if you clean ink with a 'hot' or volatile solvent. The un-cured stencil (especially water-resistant stencils), doesn't have any protection and is fused to the mesh.



ProTipKnit said:


> the only thing that was off was the fact that the emulsion had what looked like mold in it.
> it was white and sitting on the top.
> there wasnt much... but i didnt think too much of it.
> i honestly didnt wanna accept that it had mold in it, if that was even mold because of it being barley used...


I doubt any organic product like mold would prevent your stencil from removal.



ProTipKnit said:


> also i let the screens sit around for a little bit with the emulsion on it so, my question would be does the amount of time you have the emulsion on screen effect how hard it will be to get off?


Do you mean the screens were coated or processed a little bit ago or you left the stencil remover on the mesh?


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## ProTipKnit (Dec 22, 2017)

So I tried the process one more time since i posted. 
to no avail.
i have ruined another screen and i am very frustrated to say the least...
im lost as of to where and how i go wrong, but i can't seem to figure a solution out that doesnt involve in an insane loss of money and time...
i feel screwed.


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## NoXid (Apr 4, 2011)

ProTipKnit said:


> So I tried the process one more time since i posted.
> to no avail.
> i have ruined another screen and i am very frustrated to say the least...
> im lost as of to where and how i go wrong, but i can't seem to figure a solution out that doesnt involve in an insane loss of money and time...
> i feel screwed.


Richard covered it well in Post 43.

More than likely, your screen locked up because the emulsion was not fully exposed in the first place. I ruined some screens early on due to this, most everyone does.

Don't go too heavy on the emulsion coat, as the thicker it is the more likely it won't dry all the way through or expose all the way through.

Make sure your screens are dry enough before exposing. You can get a hydrometer for around $10 at Home Depot. If you use a drying box/cabinet put it inside and see if the level gets below 50%. I use a little heat and a dehumidifier to get down to around 35% when drying screens.

After exposing and washing out the image, dry the screen again, then set it out in the sun for 5 or 10 minutes, or throw in the exposure unit for 4 or 5 times the length of a normal exposure. This is called Post Exposure, and ensures that the emulsion is fully exposed before you start exposing it to ink and cleaning chemicals. Once it is exposed to chemicals, any partially cured emulsion may lock onto the screen and never come off.

^ So that is the prevention end of the game. Figure out where your current process is going wrong and fix it.


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